No need to salute those who are already burning in Hell

[Gunny]

This thread seems to be destined to the taunting area or even the thrash can...

But I was totally serious when I said that any manifestation of gratitute for the service of military men and women in Vietnam shows a total disregard for the human suffering imposed by the US foreign policy decisions on the people of Vietnam.

A disregard that borders on psycopathy.

Psychoblues and jillian should be ashamed of themselves.

Except for the fact that your reasons for disrespecting them are based on a lie, you mean?

Your willful disregard for the facts and actual history doesn't border on psychopathy but it gets ass deep into stupidity.

 

[José]

It doesn't take an Einstein to realise that the Vietnam War (together with the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan) is an extremely emotional subject for me.

People who are following my rants here can barely recognise the author of historic and groundbreaking threads like:

"On the future of nationalism"

and

"Female sexuality according to José"

I'm gonna do a favour for the whole board and myself and refrain from talking about this particular conflict from now on.

 

[Gunny]

It doesn't take an Einstein to realise that the Vietnam War (together with the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan) is an extremely emotional subject for me.

People who are following my rants here can barely recognise the author of historic and groundbreaking threads like:

"On the future of nationalism"

and

"Female sexuality according to José"

I'm gonna do a favour for the whole board and myself and refrain from talking about this particular conflict from now on.

Obviously, it's an emotional topic for you because your beliefs as far as what you have posted are based on nothing but.

Seems rather odd as intelligent as you are claiming to be that you have completely ignored the facts that refute your belief.

 

[MasterChief]

Why take this mental midget seriously? This guy is a complete idiot and only wants to get all the vets pissed off. He is a pathetic excuse for a human being. Ignore him. But if he ever shows up at any memorial in our home town and starts to unzip his drawers, quickly beat the crap out of him and buy him a one way ticket to Cuba.

 

[82Marine89]

How about cutting his balls off and feeding them to him?

It's guys like Jose that make me yearn for retroactive abortions.

 

[MasterChief]

How about cutting his balls off and feeding them to him?

Heck, no. To cut those things off means you've to touch him "down there" and who knows what kind of STDs this guy has got. Just judging from his posts you can see he's insane and we all know that syphilis causes insanity. If I touch his privates, it will be with a boot.

 

[José]

Originally posted by MasterChief
Heck, no. To cut those things off means you've to touch him "down there" and who knows what kind of STDs this guy has got. Just judging from his posts you can see he's insane and we all know that syphilis causes insanity. If I touch his privates, it will be with a boot.

What kind of monsters are you, cocksuckers from hell?

Those faggots participated in the destruction of a whole country that never harmed America and you criticize me for wanting to urinate on their monuments and graves?

Well, I take my words back then.

I WOULD LIKE TO URINATE IN THEIR MOUTHS WHILE THEY WERE AGONIZING IN THE JUNGLES OF VIETNAM!!

Is that better for you?

And this would still be too little for what those butchers did to the vietnamese people.

GET OUT OF HERE, BUNCH OF PATRIOTIC CLOWNS FROM HELL!!

LEAVE THIS BOARD AND JOIN THE FIRST CIRCUS YOU FIND!!

 

[Annie]

What kind of monsters are you, cocksuckers from hell?

Those faggots participated in the destruction of a whole country that never harmed America and you criticize me for wanting to urinate on their monuments and graves?

Well, I take my words back then.

I WOULD LIKE TO URINATE IN THEIR MOUTHS WHILE THEY WERE AGONIZING IN THE JUNGLES OF VIETNAM!!

Is that better for you?

And this would still be too little for what those butchers did to the vietnamese people.

GET OUT OF HERE, BUNCH OF PATRIOTIC CLOWNS FROM HELL!!

LEAVE THIS BOARD AND JOIN THE FIRST CIRCUS YOU FIND!!

Actually what I've turned to bold red is against the law in Illinois.

 

[Gunny]

What kind of monsters are you, cocksuckers from hell?

Those faggots participated in the destruction of a whole country that never harmed America and you criticize me for wanting to urinate on their monuments and graves?

Well, I take my words back then.

I WOULD LIKE TO URINATE IN THEIR MOUTHS WHILE THEY WERE AGONIZING IN THE JUNGLES OF VIETNAM!!

Is that better for you?

And this would still be too little for what those butchers did to the vietnamese people.

GET OUT OF HERE, BUNCH OF PATRIOTIC CLOWNS FROM HELL!!

LEAVE THIS BOARD AND JOIN THE FIRST CIRCUS YOU FIND!!

Is this where I remind you once again that your screwy stance is based on NO facts? Where do we get to the part where you actually educate yourself to the topic you are flapping your gums on instead of spouting stupid lies?

And dude, go right the fuck ahead and try to piss in MY old man's mouth ....

 

[José]

Originally posted by GunnyL
Is this where I remind you once again that your screwy stance is based on NO facts? Where do we get to the part where you actually educate yourself to the topic you are flapping your gums on instead of spouting stupid lies?

And dude, go right the fuck ahead and try to piss in MY old man's mouth ....

Gunny,

All the things I said are a reaction against the lack of mercy for the suffering of the vietnamese people I see in America.

Let me describe a scenario in which I WOULD NO LONGER WANT TO DESECRATE THE MONUMENTS AND GRAVES OF AMERICAN SOLDIERS WHO FOUGHT IN INDOCHINA:

The american president during an official visit to Vietnam, makes a public speech in downtown Hanoi or Saigon (don’t like the new name), and in front of hundreds of thousands of spectators, falls on his knees, starts to cry and begs the vietnamese people to forgive America.

After this speech I believe another event would be appropriate.

A private meeting between the american president and a symbolic number of widows and orphans of the Vietnam War where they would be allowed to spit in his face, pull his hair, slap him in the face and kick him.

This flagelation of the supreme representative of America would be a very appropriate way to express regret for the destruction of Vietnam. And despite the first impression, this move would not humiliate the US. On the contrary, the whole world would be moved seeing the great superpower recognising its historical mistake and saying sorry.

People, feel free to love or hate my proposal but one thing you can be sure of:

After seeing this events happening in Vietnam I wouldn’t want to urinate on monuments and graves of american soldiers who fought in that conflict.

I won’t say I will ever be able to respect the american soldiers who fought in that criminal war because I would be lying.

But if I saw America asking Vietnam for forgiveness I surely wouldn’t feel the dire need to disrespect their memory I feel now.

 

[82Marine89]

Gunny,

All the things I said are a reaction against the lack of mercy for the suffering of the vietnamese people I see in America.

Let me describe a scenario in which I WOULD NO LONGER WANT TO DESECRATE THE MONUMENTS AND GRAVES OF AMERICAN SOLDIERS WHO FOUGHT IN INDOCHINA:

The american president during an official visit to Vietnam, makes a public speech in downtown Hanoi or Saigon (don’t like the new name), and in front of hundreds of thousands of spectators, falls on his knees, starts to cry and begs the vietnamese people to forgive America.

After this speech I believe another event would be appropriate.

A private meeting between the american president and a symbolic number of widows and orphans of the vietnamese war where they would be allowed to spit in his face, pull his hair, slap him in the face and kick him.

This flagelation of the supreme representative of America would be a very appropriate way to express regret for the destruction of Vietnam.

People, feel free to love or hate my proposal but one thing you can be sure of:

After seeing this events happening in Vietnam I wouldn’t want to urinate on monuments and graves of american soldiers who fought in that conflict.

I won’t say I will ever be able to respect the american soldiers who fought in that criminal war because I would be lying.

But if I saw America asking Vietnam for forgiveness I surely wouldn’t feel the dire need to disrespect their memory I feel now.

It's a shame that two democrats, Kennedy and Johnson, got us into that quagmire and it took a pubbie, Nixon, to get us out.

 

[Gunny]

Gunny,

All the things I said are a reaction against the lack of mercy for the suffering of the vietnamese people I see in America.

Let me describe a scenario in which I WOULD NO LONGER WANT TO DESECRATE THE MONUMENTS AND GRAVES OF AMERICAN SOLDIERS WHO FOUGHT IN INDOCHINA:

The american president during an official visit to Vietnam, makes a public speech in downtown Hanoi or Saigon (don’t like the new name), and in front of hundreds of thousands of spectators, falls on his knees, starts to cry and begs the vietnamese people to forgive America.

After this speech I believe another event would be appropriate.

A private meeting between the american president and a symbolic number of widows and orphans of the Vietnam War where they would be allowed to spit in his face, pull his hair, slap him in the face and kick him.

This flagelation of the supreme representative of America would be a very appropriate way to express regret for the destruction of Vietnam. And despite the first impression, this move would not humiliate the US. On the contrary, the whole world would be moved seeing the great superpower recognising its historical mistake and saying sorry.

People, feel free to love or hate my proposal but one thing you can be sure of:

After seeing this events happening in Vietnam I wouldn’t want to urinate on monuments and graves of american soldiers who fought in that conflict.

I won’t say I will ever be able to respect the american soldiers who fought in that criminal war because I would be lying.

But if I saw America asking Vietnam for forgiveness I surely wouldn’t feel the dire need to disrespect their memory I feel now.

And again, I will point on that your opinion is based on a complete distortion of facts, or the complete fabrication of them.

How old are you? I can't imagine that you were even born yet much less old enough to comprehend based on your version of events. I really can't even imagine where you would learn such bullshit. Is Hanoi Jane your mother?

The US supported a legitmate government of a legitimate Nation in a war against Communist aggression. Not a damned thing illegal about that.

 

[Gurdari]

"The Taliban was harboring Osama bin Laden and refused to turn him over. Justification enough to take them out. So, your insinuation that the invasion was unjustified is bullshit. Need a clue? There's a big fucking hole in the ground for you in NYC."


I think the Taliban was ready to give him up, for prosecution, to a neutral Islamic state. Not exactly harboring OBL... they did ask for some evidence (big mistake). I suppose if I wanted to get OBL, I might have said "Sure, here's the evidence - let's have that trial." Then swooped in and grabbed him from the trial, flew him to some spot away from prying eyes and taken him to some small room with one chair... or proceeded with the trial. But that's if I wanted to get him. If I didn't, I would bomb a rough approximation of where he might be and then try to sort through the rubble and chaos for a guy who looks like a lotta other guys.

 

[Gunny]

"The Taliban was harboring Osama bin Laden and refused to turn him over. Justification enough to take them out. So, your insinuation that the invasion was unjustified is bullshit. Need a clue? There's a big fucking hole in the ground for you in NYC."


I think the Taliban was ready to give him up, for prosecution, to a neutral Islamic state. Not exactly harboring OBL... they did ask for some evidence (big mistake). I suppose if I wanted to get OBL, I might have said "Sure, here's the evidence - let's have that trial." Then swooped in and grabbed him from the trial, flew him to some spot away from prying eyes and taken him to some small room with one chair... or proceeded with the trial. But that's if I wanted to get him. If I didn't, I would bomb a rough approximation of where he might be and then try to sort through the rubble and chaos for a guy who looks like a lotta other guys.

I wrote it. The Taliban refused to turn OBL over the US. By his own admission, OBL orchestrated 9/11. Not much more evidence required than that.

 

[Gurdari]

I wrote it. The Taliban refused to turn OBL over the US. By his own admission, OBL orchestrated 9/11. Not much more evidence required than that.

Sorry I do not believe that - they did not refuse. They asked for evidence (which in a normal society is reasonable) OBL also denied having to do with 9/11 in the first place (what kind of terrorist doesn't want credit for something like that?) then he, I suppose, changed his mind(?) and confessed to the attack. Fishy. here's some stuff - I'll get more later:

ZDF television quoted Kabir Mohabbat, an Afghan-American businessman, as saying he tried to broker a deal between the Americans and the purist Islamic Taliban rulers of Afghanistan, who were sheltering bin Laden.

He quoted Taliban foreign minister Mullah Wakil Ahmed Mutawakil as saying: "You can have him whenever the Americans are ready. Name us a country and we will extradite him".

A German member of the European Parliament, Elmar Brok, confirmed that he had helped Mr Mohabbat in 1999 to establish initial contact with the Americans.

"I was told [by Mohabbat] that the Taliban had certain ideas about handing over bin Laden, not to the United States but to a third country or to the Court of Justice in The Hague," Mr Brok said.

"The message was: 'There is willingness to talk about handing over bin Laden', and the aim of the Taliban was clearly to win the recognition of the American Government and the lifting of the boycott," he said, referring to the international isolation of the Taliban.

Mr Brok said he was not in a position to judge how credible the offer was but he passed it to the US ambassador to Germany, John Kornblum.

 

[Gurdari]

Here's another quote:

The Taliban have said they have no intention of handing over bin Laden to the United States unless Washington provides convincing evidence against him.

source: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...an-warns-pakistan-over-us-support-751946.html


there's more out there, but basically they did what the US, or any other nation would do when asked to extradite someone - show me the evidence.

(obviously do not bring this argument up around Haitians/Panamanians/Cubans/etc who do not get to extradite their terror suspects from the US)

 

[Gunny]

Sorry I do not believe that - they did not refuse. They asked for evidence (which in a normal society is reasonable) OBL also denied having to do with 9/11 in the first place (what kind of terrorist doesn't want credit for something like that?) then he, I suppose, changed his mind(?) and confessed to the attack. Fishy. here's some stuff - I'll get more later:

ZDF television quoted Kabir Mohabbat, an Afghan-American businessman, as saying he tried to broker a deal between the Americans and the purist Islamic Taliban rulers of Afghanistan, who were sheltering bin Laden.

He quoted Taliban foreign minister Mullah Wakil Ahmed Mutawakil as saying: "You can have him whenever the Americans are ready. Name us a country and we will extradite him".

A German member of the European Parliament, Elmar Brok, confirmed that he had helped Mr Mohabbat in 1999 to establish initial contact with the Americans.

"I was told [by Mohabbat] that the Taliban had certain ideas about handing over bin Laden, not to the United States but to a third country or to the Court of Justice in The Hague," Mr Brok said.

"The message was: 'There is willingness to talk about handing over bin Laden', and the aim of the Taliban was clearly to win the recognition of the American Government and the lifting of the boycott," he said, referring to the international isolation of the Taliban.

Mr Brok said he was not in a position to judge how credible the offer was but he passed it to the US ambassador to Germany, John Kornblum.

You don't believe it. You instead choose to believe something else, then turn right around and use a quote that supports my statement.

"I was told [by Mohabbat] that the Taliban had certain ideas about handing over bin Laden, not to the United States ..."

That the US was not interested in negotiating with the Taliban at the time is irrelevant. The fact that the Taliban refused to turn bin Laden over when the US demanded IS.

 

[José]

Gurdari

Interesting place you chose to debate OBL =Afghanistan... a thread about the Vietnam War!

But since you brought the subject up, let me use it in the context of the Vietnam War to show the logical inconsistency of so many members of the board.

It is a widely known fact that the main grievance Mohamed Atta had with the US is their support for Israel.

So, in one of the biggest ironies of History, it is undeniable that these individuals are helping foster democracy in Palestine with their terrorists attacks, even though they are the worst kind of islamic theocrats (Wahabists, Salafists etc...).

With each new attack, the world becomes more and more aware of the utter disfunctionality of the jewish racial dictatorship.

So why not support terrorists attacks against the US as a way to raise international awareness of the need to dismantle the jewish supremacist state?

Rationalizations of acts of aggression work both ways, people:

If it is OK for America to interfere in the vietnamese civil war to protect democracy in South Vietnam, destroying the country in the process, it is also OK for America to be on the receiving end of violence if the long term result is a democratic Palestine.

Do you think the destruction of the whole country was justified to preserve a free democratic society in South Vietnam?

If so what are you waiting for?

Let’s start supporting the bombing of America as a way to advance the cause of democracy in Palestine.

This kind of aberrant logical inconsistencies is the main reason I created the expression super patriotic american clown:

An individual who has one set of rules of conduct for the US and another for the rest of the world.

Absolute respect for US sovereignty and internal affairs and the law of the jungle ruling the rest of the world.

And the worst of all is that these individuals are not aware of their clownish condition and some of them decide to come into message boards and debate international politics and the result is something between tragic and pathetic.

I’d like to see a free, open society in Vietnam and Palestine but I don’t use my ideological orientation to rationalize the destruction of that asian country or the bombing of America.

 

[José]

Originally posted by Gurdari
I think the Taliban was ready to give him up, for prosecution, to a neutral Islamic state. Not exactly harboring OBL... they did ask for some evidence (big mistake). I suppose if I wanted to get OBL, I might have said "Sure, here's the evidence - let's have that trial." Then swooped in and grabbed him from the trial, flew him to some spot away from prying eyes and taken him to some small room with one chair... or proceeded with the trial. But that's if I wanted to get him. If I didn't, I would bomb a rough approximation of where he might be and then try to sort through the rubble and chaos for a guy who looks like a lotta other guys.

What kind of parallel universe do you live in, Gurdari?

This is the second time we discuss your absurd stance on this issue, bro.

The Afghanistan War was one of the most legitimate casus belli in the history of humanity.

You have the posters who are always trying to justify all kinds of naked aggressions against countries America had/have laughable casus belli like Vietnam, Iraq and Iran and at the other extreme, you have Gurdari who seems to believe America has no right to react militarily under any circunstance no matter how solid the casus belli for war really is.

You need to wake up to the fact that you are the mirror image of the super patriotic american clowns who “contribute” to this message board, Gurdari!!

 

[Dr Grump]

I have to agree re Afghanistan. it was of the few times in recent history the US have done what is morally right with little or no benefit to themselves...