No American state has the right to secede no matter how many petitioners sign.

[lobato1]

After these past 2012 elections my fellow Texan Fox News’ “Romney +300 Landslide” crowd ran around in a daze, spewing once again that our state had a “God Given Right to Secede” & >>100,000 fellow Texans signed petitions demanding secession. (My Reference: Texas Secession Petition Surpasses 100,000 Signatures ).

Let’s not forget what my secessionist Texas Governor Rick Perry in a fit of rage said back in 2009 & I quote verbatim:

When we came into the nation in 1845, we were a Republic, we were a stand-alone nation,

“And one of the deals was, we can leave anytime we want.

So we’re kind of thinking about that again.”
​

My Reference: Rick Perry Wants Texas to Secede from the United States | Rowdy Pulpit

Other References: 2009 "Rick Perry" secession "So we?re kind of thinking about that again" -obama - Yahoo! Search Results

BTW:
My secessionist Governor Rick Perry made a 2nd 180 degree turn in 2012 & became a Super American Patriot a 2nd time when he decided to run for US Prez & now opposes the secession he previously advocated. Perhaps this is the reason he is not running for reelection because undoubtedly Texas GOP governor candidates will have to pay lip service to those >>100,000 Texan secessionist & that would destroy Perry’s chances at a 2nd run for the presidency.
​

​

Having been born in Texas & try as hard as I could, I have yet to see one single document giving us Texans the right to secede under the reasoning that we were the only republic that had asked for statehood under the provision of seceding if we so desired down the road .

Looking at our Texas history & “In spite of Texan historians re-witting our Texas history avowing, that neither Houston or Lamar & much less Jones favored annexation” it’s hard to imagine with actual historical facts that any of our three Republic of Texas presidents Sam Houston, Mirabeau Lamar & much less Anson Jones (Lorenzo de Zavala was a provisional interim president), all ardent supporters of annexation banging at Washington DC for 10 long years would have put any conditions to join the American Union.

In fact, when Texas insurrected against our government & joined the Confederacy, the then Texas Governor Sam Houston refused to sign the statement of secession handed to him to sign by the Texas legislature & was lucky to get out alive with Texans trying to lynch the Father of our Texas independence.

As for the last Texas president, Anson Jones “The Architect of Annexation,” it’s hard to understand why he came to Texas in the 1st place, specifically & to the point, he took part of every Texas commission Mirabeau Lamar sent to Washington DC to beg for admission & once he succeeded in his presidency in making us a state, Anson ran for every Congressional & Senatorial seat just to be in Washington but when he finally lost an election Anson quickly committed suicide a couple of months later.

My Reference: - Google Search
​

Best Regards
Lobato1

 

[hjmick]

For whatever reason, I knew all of this already, but thanks.

Maybe I learned it at Cynthia Ann Parker Elementary School (10626 Atwell Dr., Houston), or perhaps it's just one of those things I picked up along they way...

But...

While there is no provision in the Texas Constitution, the old one or the current one, that reserves the right of secession, but it does state that "Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States..." and not to the President or the Congress of the United States.

Both the original and the current Texas Constitutions state that political power is inherent in the people and "the people have the right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

But yeah, nothing about secession...

In point of fact, in 1866 Texas renounced their right to secede...

...an Ordinance adopted by a former Convention of the people of Texas on the 1st day of February, A.D. 1861, entitled "An Ordinance to Dissolve the Union between the State of Texas and the other States, united under the compact styled 'Constitution of the United States of America,'" be and the same is hereby declared null and void; and the right heretofore claimed by the State of Texas to secede from the Union, is hereby distinctly renounced. Passed 15th March, 1866.

And their "right" to divide the state into four states is nothing special, other states can do the same... Well, maybe not four... Imagine Rhode Island dividing itself into four states...

As you might be able to tell, this is not the first time I have had a discussion on this topic...

 

[PaulS1950]

Perhaps if you would look at the constitution of Texas you would find mention of its sovereignty:

ARTICLE I.
Bill of Rights.

That the general, great and essential principles of liberty and free government may be recognized and established, we declare:

SECTION 1. Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States; and the maintenance of our free institutions and the perpetuity of the Union depend upon the preservation of the right of local self-government unimpaired to all the States.

From the 1876 (latest constitution and the one accepted by the congress of the united states)
That is obvious and in plain english.. "Texas is a free and independent state..."

Maybe english isn't your first language?

 

[hjmick]

Perhaps if you would look at the constitution of Texas you would find mention of its sovereignty:

ARTICLE I.
Bill of Rights.

That the general, great and essential principles of liberty and free government may be recognized and established, we declare:

SECTION 1. Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States; and the maintenance of our free institutions and the perpetuity of the Union depend upon the preservation of the right of local self-government unimpaired to all the States.

From the 1876 (latest constitution and the one accepted by the congress of the united states)
That is obvious and in plain english.. "Texas is a free and independent state..."

Maybe english isn't your first language?

Didn't read my post, did you?

 

[Missourian]

I thought Democrats were pro-choice.

If that choice is to kill a baby, choice rules.

It's our state...we own the land, we live here.

If our CHOICE is to break our ties with the union, shouldn't you be PRO-CHOICE.

Why would you want to keep a state against the will of it's citizens?

 

[PaulS1950]

The 1866 constitution was never accepted by the US congress and it is nullified by the 1876 document which was accepted.

I was responding to Loboto1.

Texas is a free and independent state that adheres to the US constitution as long as their freedoms are maintained and it is recognized that the preservation of the union depends on the preservation of the right of local self-governance is unimpaired to all the states.

Since the federal government does not allow self governance of all the states (or any of them) then texas has the right to secede. (so do the other 49 states) because the tenth amendment provides that power to them and not to the federal government.

 

[lobato1]

Let’s remember that the original Thirteen Colonies confederated themselves on what was known as: “Articles of Confederation & Perpetual Union,” this was an agreement among these 13 founding states that established the United States of America as a confederation of sovereign states & served as it's first constitution

However, it was the South fearing being abandoned by the North & most notoriously led by the Virginians George Washington & Thomas Jefferson that insisted & carried the day on an “Indissoluble Federation of States.”

My Reference on the “Perpetual Union,” : http://search.yahoo.com/search?n=10...on" "thirteen colonies" "perpetual union"&vs=



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​

Consequently all “Territories Purchased” by these original Thirteen Colonies & subsequently given the privilege of becoming a part of these federated states have no right to secede & this includes Texas that knew the conditions of an “Indissoluble Federation of States.” when Texas asked for admission into the American Union.

Best Regards

Lobato1

 

[Katzndogz]

It isn't only a matter of right. Sometimes it's a matter of power.

After all, you do have a right to drive your car, but when someone puts a gun to your head and takes your keys, you are walking and they are driving your car.

As they say, might makes right.

 

[lobato1]

“Indissoluble Federation of States.” when Texas asked for admission into the American Union.

My Reference: http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean...er-how-many-petitioners-sign-post7668823.html

​

​

Best Regards

Lobato1

For whatever reason, I knew all of this already, but thanks.

Maybe I learned it at Cynthia Ann Parker Elementary School (10626 Atwell Dr., Houston), or perhaps it's just one of those things I picked up along they way...

But...

While there is no provision in the Texas Constitution, the old one or the current one, that reserves the right of secession, but it does state that "Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States..." and not to the President or the Congress of the United States.

Both the original and the current Texas Constitutions state that political power is inherent in the people and "the people have the right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

But yeah, nothing about secession...

In point of fact, in 1866 Texas renounced their right to secede...

...an Ordinance adopted by a former Convention of the people of Texas on the 1st day of February, A.D. 1861, entitled "An Ordinance to Dissolve the Union between the State of Texas and the other States, united under the compact styled 'Constitution of the United States of America,'" be and the same is hereby declared null and void; and the right heretofore claimed by the State of Texas to secede from the Union, is hereby distinctly renounced. Passed 15th March, 1866.

And their "right" to divide the state into four states is nothing special, other states can do the same... Well, maybe not four... Imagine Rhode Island dividing itself into four states...

As you might be able to tell, this is not the first time I have had a discussion on this topic...

 

[lobato1]

Texas knew & accepted the conditions of an “Indissoluble Federation of States.” when Texas asked for admission into the American Union.

My Reference: http://www.usmessageboard.com/clean...er-how-many-petitioners-sign-post7668823.html
[​

​

Best Regards

Lobato1

Perhaps if you would look at the constitution of Texas you would find mention of its sovereignty:

ARTICLE I.
Bill of Rights.

That the general, great and essential principles of liberty and free government may be recognized and established, we declare:

SECTION 1. Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States; and the maintenance of our free institutions and the perpetuity of the Union depend upon the preservation of the right of local self-government unimpaired to all the States.

From the 1876 (latest constitution and the one accepted by the congress of the united states)
That is obvious and in plain english.. "Texas is a free and independent state..."

Maybe english isn't your first language?

 

[lobato1]

& obviously you are unaware of the diversity of liberal thought.

Best Regards

Lobato1

I thought Democrats were pro-choice.

If that choice is to kill a baby, choice rules.

It's our state...we own the land, we live here.

If our CHOICE is to break our ties with the union, shouldn't you be PRO-CHOICE.

Why would you want to keep a state against the will of it's citizens?

 

[lobato1]

Try again.

Best Regards

Lobato1

It isn't only a matter of right. Sometimes it's a matter of power.

After all, you do have a right to drive your car, but when someone puts a gun to your head and takes your keys, you are walking and they are driving your car.

As they say, might makes right.

 

[lobato1]

& best regards

Lobato1

The 1866 constitution was never accepted by the US congress and it is nullified by the 1876 document which was accepted.

I was responding to Loboto1.

Texas is a free and independent state that adheres to the US constitution as long as their freedoms are maintained and it is recognized that the preservation of the union depends on the preservation of the right of local self-governance is unimpaired to all the states.

Since the federal government does not allow self governance of all the states (or any of them) then texas has the right to secede. (so do the other 49 states) because the tenth amendment provides that power to them and not to the federal government.

 

[hjmick]

Okay... I see we have a minimalist here...





I'm done...

 

[TheOldSchool]

Breaking this country has already been tried before. Hopefully someone will always step up to save it.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

& obviously you are unaware of the diversity of liberal thought.

Best Regards

Lobato1

There is no such thing as "liberal" thought.

Best Regards

Dont Taz Me Bro

 

[Katzndogz]

The difference between what's happening now and what happened in the civil war is that we are no longer one people. During the civil war we still shared basically the same values, pretty much worshipped the same, spoke the same language. The divisions today go all the way to bedrock. Emotionally, the divorce has already happened. The divergent sides are both sick of one another.

Anyone looking at present day America rationally can see it falling apart. We aren't divided on an issue like slavery, or on northern predatory practices on landowners. We are divided on each and every issue without any point of agreement or compromise.

I doubt we will eake out ten more years.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

A State can petition the US Congress to leave the Union. It can not unilaterally do so.

 

[lobato1]

Allow me to educate you:

You can start form here:

My Reference: Liberalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

​

You can thank me now for educating you.

Best Regards

Lobato1

& obviously you are unaware of the diversity of liberal thought.

Best Regards

Lobato1

There is no such thing as "liberal" thought.

Best Regards

Dont Taz Me Bro

 

[lobato1]

How so.


Best Regards

Lobato1

Okay... I see we have a minimalist here...





I'm done...