NKorea threatens US; world anticipates missile

[xotoxi]

If North Korea was to attack the US, or even attack one of our allies in the region, we would fight back.

Just like if Iraq had attacked us or our allies, it would have been appropriate for us to go in.

 

[Tech_Esq]

If North Korea was to attack the US, or even attack one of our allies in the region, we would fight back.

Just like if Iraq had attacked us or our allies, it would have been appropriate for us to go in.

But X, that's the easy question. The harder scenarios are like what Pete and I talk about above. If they shoot a missile in the direction of Hawaii, did they "attack" us? Does it actually have to hit Hawaii? If we shoot it down, but it maybe would have hit Hawaii, does that count?

 

[Kent.Neidhold]

But X, that's the easy question. The harder scenarios are like what Pete and I talk about above. If they shoot a missile in the direction of Hawaii, did they "attack" us? Does it actually have to hit Hawaii? If we shoot it down, but it maybe would have hit Hawaii, does that count?[/QUOTE]
You pose a very interesting point and I've been chewing on it all day. I think you have to develope some sort of threshold and stearnly warn NK, if you test and you cross this line we have cause enough to shoot it down. With a premtive warning NK can't claim its an act of war no less then we can. Is this an act of war? I dont think so. I think it gives us and the rest of our allies the ability to step up the rheteric though.
Is the end game for NK really to develope a nuclear arsenal or to flex their muscle and try to persuade their way into power?

 

[amrchaos]

What is East Asia's fascination with Hawii?? It is a couple of islands in the middle of the Pacific.

Why not take Pot Shots at Australia or the Aluetian Isles??

 

[Tech_Esq]

What is East Asia's fascination with Hawii?? It is a couple of islands in the middle of the Pacific.

Why not take Pot Shots at Australia or the Aluetian Isles??

Who would know if they blew up Kiska?

 

[Tech_Esq]

But X, that's the easy question. The harder scenarios are like what Pete and I talk about above. If they shoot a missile in the direction of Hawaii, did they "attack" us? Does it actually have to hit Hawaii? If we shoot it down, but it maybe would have hit Hawaii, does that count?

You pose a very interesting point and I've been chewing on it all day. I think you have to develope some sort of threshold and stearnly warn NK, if you test and you cross this line we have cause enough to shoot it down. With a premtive warning NK can't claim its an act of war no less then we can. Is this an act of war? I dont think so. I think it gives us and the rest of our allies the ability to step up the rheteric though.
Is the end game for NK really to develope a nuclear arsenal or to flex their muscle and try to persuade their way into power?

Well, Obama did say that if NK attacked SK, the US would defend it with all means including nuclear weapons. So, maybe he would make such a statement with regard to the US as well.

I'm not sure I agree with you that it wouldn't be an attack if we successfully shot down an inbound missile. What if we missed and it hit Hawaii? What if we missed and it hit a commercial freighter and sank it with 50 lives lost? Act of War or not?

 

[Kent.Neidhold]

But X, that's the easy question. The harder scenarios are like what Pete and I talk about above. If they shoot a missile in the direction of Hawaii, did they "attack" us? Does it actually have to hit Hawaii? If we shoot it down, but it maybe would have hit Hawaii, does that count?

Well, Obama did say that if NK attacked SK, the US would defend it with all means including nuclear weapons. So, maybe he would make such a statement with regard to the US as well.

I'm not sure I agree with you that it wouldn't be an attack if we successfully shot down an inbound missile. What if we missed and it hit Hawaii? What if we missed and it hit a commercial freighter and sank it with 50 lives lost? Act of War or not?

I dont see how it can be considered and act of war if we are defending or boards and allies. I can definately see how NK would react in such a mannor and cry holy hell. But to asnwer the question, no its not an act of war because our intent ins't such.
If say, we sat off the coast and started mowing down NK ships then yes, but this is hardly the case. This is some nut bag lobbing misiles our way and us doing everything in our power to shoot them down before they reach American soil. I would love nothing more then to make their presidential palace into a glass box but it's not going to happen on the grounds of a "missile test".
Would you consider it an act of war?

 

[Tech_Esq]

Well, Obama did say that if NK attacked SK, the US would defend it with all means including nuclear weapons. So, maybe he would make such a statement with regard to the US as well.

I'm not sure I agree with you that it wouldn't be an attack if we successfully shot down an inbound missile. What if we missed and it hit Hawaii? What if we missed and it hit a commercial freighter and sank it with 50 lives lost? Act of War or not?

I dont see how it can be considered and act of war if we are defending or boards and allies. I can definately see how NK would react in such a mannor and cry holy hell. But to asnwer the question, no its not an act of war because our intent ins't such.
If say, we sat off the coast and started mowing down NK ships then yes, but this is hardly the case. This is some nut bag lobbing misiles our way and us doing everything in our power to shoot them down before they reach American soil. I would love nothing more then to make their presidential palace into a glass box but it's not going to happen on the grounds of a "missile test".
Would you consider it an act of war?

I'll answer my own questions:

- A shoot down of a missile down range and apparently going to strike the US: I would have a special session of the UN called, publicly present all the telemetry data to show that the missile would have hit Hawaii or within US territorial waters. I would call this an unprovoked act of war against the US by the NKs. I would then warn NK that because of their successful atomic tests, the US has no choice but to assume its missiles have nuclear warheads. Therefore, any further attack against the US with these weapons will be met with an in kind response. We will remove, with nuclear weapons, the capacity of the NKs to wage offensive war. (I assume we have information on where to strike to do this).

- If we missed and the missile struck: Obviously an act of war. Provided it was unarmed or conventionally armed, I would violate their airspace and remove their air force if it came up to play. Then the ball is in their court. If they want to continue, it's their option. We would not have too much choice but to go nuclear in Korea. We don't have the troops to face them conventionally.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

What is East Asia's fascination with Hawii?? It is a couple of islands in the middle of the Pacific.

Why not take Pot Shots at Australia or the Aluetian Isles??

If you don't know the importance of Hawaii, you're an idiot.

 

[cbi0090]

NK's missiles aren't capable of going far enough to threaten us and we have the ability to shoot them down if they try. The real threat is not their nuclear capability but the thousands upon thousands of conventional missiles they have aimed at South Korea. There is no way to intercept them all and they can reach nearly every corner of the country. South Korea would be shredded and this is why we are in the fix we are in. We can threaten all we want but they know we aren't going to be ones responsible for pushing them over the edge and destroying an ally. All they have to do is act like they are on the edge all the time and and capable of doing something so evil.
It would help if China and Russia would chime in and give assurance they they would participate in their total destruction should they launch but they just enjoy watching us squirm to much and making us out to be the bad guys.
You can bet we've got enough nuclear subs surrounding NK to essential turn them to dust but it would be at the price of SK. They've got a gun to SK's heads and they insist we arbitrate.