Nice of ya to catch up with the rest of us!

[DamnYankee]

Poll: Americans worried about size of federal deficit
Americans are growing concerned about the deficit and the government’s intervention into the private sector, according to the latest NBC News/Wall Street Journal.
Poll: Public increasingly concerned about deficit - White House- msnbc.com

Is Obama's honeymoon over?
javascript:vPlayer('31415299','11e72da2-3947-4d6a-a620-125df02db6d3')

 

[pete]

Its starting to ware off ... and now he owns it!!

 

[MaggieMae]

It's true that many hopefuls, like me, are becoming more and more concerned about the potential deficit. This is the perfect opportunity for Republicans to improve upon their 26% approval rating (shown here), the lowest in history, and finally come up with an alternative solution to the economic woes instead of announcing position papers that include no numbers.

http://s.wsj.net/public/resources/documents/WSJ-NBC_Poll090617.pdf

 

[Xenophon]

Perhaps President Douchebag can book a Conan shot, it worked with leno once...

 

[MaggieMae]

At least part of the reason Bush continues to be blamed for the economic mess, as shown in this graphic, is because under his watch the public lost $5 trillion in retirement savings, credit card companies were allowed to loaded up traps for the consumer, and no one was paying any attention to the PEOPLE it affected until it was too late.

 

[toomuchtime_]

At least part of the reason Bush continues to be blamed for the economic mess, as shown in this graphic, is because under his watch the public lost $5 trillion in retirement savings, credit card companies were allowed to loaded up traps for the consumer, and no one was paying any attention to the PEOPLE it affected until it was too late.

As the chart shows, most Americans don't blame Bush for the current deficit, and clearly they are correct. Obama created most of the current deficit by voting for TARP without understanding what it was and by jamming the stimulus through Congress. Without these two blunders, the deficit would be much, much lower.

But even if we try to excuse these two blunders by saying that although he managed to project a calm and assured demeanor, being as inexperienced as he was, he panicked when he created nearly $1.5 trillion in new debt without understanding what he was doing, but the reckless abandon with which he is now proposing to create additional trillions of dollars of new debt for purely political reasons should not be excused by any Americans regardless of party affiliation. Take, for example, the Kennedy-Dodd health insurance bill that for a $1 trillion dollars does not provide universal health care but that does offer subsidies to families of four earning $110,000 while kicking the uninsured poor to the curb. The purpose of this bill is obviously to win middle class votes for the Dems in 2010 and 2012 and not to help the uninsured.

 

[jillian]

Perhaps President Douchebag can book a Conan shot, it worked with leno once...

nah...bush is out of office

 

[editec]

I personally am looking forward to hyper-inflation.

I only wish I was much much more deeply in debt to really get the full benefits of it.

Perhaps I'll go back to college just to crank up a tad more debt so that when the dollar isn't worth a continental I'll actually enjoy paying back those debts.

Word to the wise folks...inflation isn't always a bad thing if you're ready for it.

 

[Oddball]

Perhaps President Douchebag can book a Conan shot, it worked with leno once...

Mebby he could even tell a joke about having a threeway with Mary Cheney!!

 

[Xenophon]

Perhaps President Douchebag can book a Conan shot, it worked with leno once...

nah...bush is out of office

Bush was not President Douchebag, he was president Chimpola.

He did try to go on Conan too, but it seems he didn't understand which Conan to go on..

 

[Harry Dresden]

Perhaps President Douchebag can book a Conan shot, it worked with leno once...

nah...bush is out of office

Bush was not President Douchebag, he was president Chimpola.

He did try to go on Conan too, but it seems he didn't understand which Conan to go on..

hey....Conan looks like the Gov. of California....just sayin...

 

[Xenophon]

Crom!

 

[Article 15]

At least part of the reason Bush continues to be blamed for the economic mess, as shown in this graphic, is because under his watch the public lost $5 trillion in retirement savings, credit card companies were allowed to loaded up traps for the consumer, and no one was paying any attention to the PEOPLE it affected until it was too late.

As the chart shows, most Americans don't blame Bush for the current deficit, and clearly they are correct. Obama created most of the current deficit by voting for TARP without understanding what it was and by jamming the stimulus through Congress. Without these two blunders, the deficit would be much, much lower.

But even if we try to excuse these two blunders by saying that although he managed to project a calm and assured demeanor, being as inexperienced as he was, he panicked when he created nearly $1.5 trillion in new debt without understanding what he was doing, but the reckless abandon with which he is now proposing to create additional trillions of dollars of new debt for purely political reasons should not be excused by any Americans regardless of party affiliation. Take, for example, the Kennedy-Dodd health insurance bill that for a $1 trillion dollars does not provide universal health care but that does offer subsidies to families of four earning $110,000 while kicking the uninsured poor to the curb. The purpose of this bill is obviously to win middle class votes for the Dems in 2010 and 2012 and not to help the uninsured.

Are we reading the same chart? When it asks "who is most responsible for the budget deficit" it looks to me like people blame Bush by a 2-1 margin over the next closest group on the list and they blame him nearly 8-1 over Obama. And lol @ trying to put TARP on Obama's shoulders? Really?

Dude ... everything went to hell and this shit storm started under George W. Bush. Remind me again who was in charge (and had been for 7+ years) when the market crashed and nearly collapsed? Obama may not be doing an A+ job trying to fix the mess but make no mistake that we are where we are because of the Bush Administration.

 

[toomuchtime_]

At least part of the reason Bush continues to be blamed for the economic mess, as shown in this graphic, is because under his watch the public lost $5 trillion in retirement savings, credit card companies were allowed to loaded up traps for the consumer, and no one was paying any attention to the PEOPLE it affected until it was too late.

As the chart shows, most Americans don't blame Bush for the current deficit, and clearly they are correct. Obama created most of the current deficit by voting for TARP without understanding what it was and by jamming the stimulus through Congress. Without these two blunders, the deficit would be much, much lower.

But even if we try to excuse these two blunders by saying that although he managed to project a calm and assured demeanor, being as inexperienced as he was, he panicked when he created nearly $1.5 trillion in new debt without understanding what he was doing, but the reckless abandon with which he is now proposing to create additional trillions of dollars of new debt for purely political reasons should not be excused by any Americans regardless of party affiliation. Take, for example, the Kennedy-Dodd health insurance bill that for a $1 trillion dollars does not provide universal health care but that does offer subsidies to families of four earning $110,000 while kicking the uninsured poor to the curb. The purpose of this bill is obviously to win middle class votes for the Dems in 2010 and 2012 and not to help the uninsured.

Are we reading the same chart? When it asks "who is most responsible for the budget deficit" it looks to me like people blame Bush by a 2-1 margin over the next closest group on the list and they blame him nearly 8-1 over Obama. And lol @ trying to put TARP on Obama's shoulders? Really?

Dude ... everything went to hell and this shit storm started under George W. Bush. Remind me again who was in charge (and had been for 7+ years) when the market crashed and nearly collapsed? Obama may not be doing an A+ job trying to fix the mess but make no mistake that we are where we are because of the Bush Administration.

The chart clearly shows the majority of Americans do not hold Bush responsible for the deficit, and if many Americans are still reluctant to hold Obama responsible for his actions until he gains a little more experience, that changes nothing. It was never possible for TARP to do what its supporters claimed it would, buy up the so called toxic assets, and many pointed this out at the time, and as the Dem candidate for president, arguably the leader of the Democratic Party, Obama's support for TARP was critical to its passage through Congress where the Dems held a clear majority in the House. Had Obama opposed TARP, it is highly unlikely it would have passed, so there is no way Obama can escape responsibility for the passage of this ill considered bill and the enormous deficit it has produced.

You might be able to argue that Obama does not bear sole responsibility for TARP but not that he bears no responsibility for TARP. Of course, Obama does bear sole responsibility for the deficit produced by the stimulus bill and taken together these two bills account for about $1.5 trillion of the estimated $1.8 trillion to $2 trillion deficit, so when Obama whines that he has inherited the deficit from Bush, he is clearly lying. It is time for all Americans to stop coddling Obama and to stop making excuses for him and to start holding him responsible for his own actions

 

[Article 15]

As the chart shows, most Americans don't blame Bush for the current deficit, and clearly they are correct. Obama created most of the current deficit by voting for TARP without understanding what it was and by jamming the stimulus through Congress. Without these two blunders, the deficit would be much, much lower.

But even if we try to excuse these two blunders by saying that although he managed to project a calm and assured demeanor, being as inexperienced as he was, he panicked when he created nearly $1.5 trillion in new debt without understanding what he was doing, but the reckless abandon with which he is now proposing to create additional trillions of dollars of new debt for purely political reasons should not be excused by any Americans regardless of party affiliation. Take, for example, the Kennedy-Dodd health insurance bill that for a $1 trillion dollars does not provide universal health care but that does offer subsidies to families of four earning $110,000 while kicking the uninsured poor to the curb. The purpose of this bill is obviously to win middle class votes for the Dems in 2010 and 2012 and not to help the uninsured.

Are we reading the same chart? When it asks "who is most responsible for the budget deficit" it looks to me like people blame Bush by a 2-1 margin over the next closest group on the list and they blame him nearly 8-1 over Obama. And lol @ trying to put TARP on Obama's shoulders? Really?

Dude ... everything went to hell and this shit storm started under George W. Bush. Remind me again who was in charge (and had been for 7+ years) when the market crashed and nearly collapsed? Obama may not be doing an A+ job trying to fix the mess but make no mistake that we are where we are because of the Bush Administration.

The chart clearly shows the majority of Americans do not hold Bush responsible for the deficit, and if many Americans are still reluctant to hold Obama responsible for his actions until he gains a little more experience, that changes nothing. It was never possible for TARP to do what its supporters claimed it would, buy up the so called toxic assets, and many pointed this out at the time, and as the Dem candidate for president, arguably the leader of the Democratic Party, Obama's support for TARP was critical to its passage through Congress where the Dems held a clear majority in the House. Had Obama opposed TARP, it is highly unlikely it would have passed, so there is no way Obama can escape responsibility for the passage of this ill considered bill and the enormous deficit it has produced.

You might be able to argue that Obama does not bear sole responsibility for TARP but not that he bears no responsibility for TARP. Of course, Obama does bear sole responsibility for the deficit produced by the stimulus bill and taken together these two bills account for about $1.5 trillion of the estimated $1.8 trillion to $2 trillion deficit, so when Obama whines that he has inherited the deficit from Bush, he is clearly lying. It is time for all Americans to stop coddling Obama and to stop making excuses for him and to start holding him responsible for his own actions

Yes, if you want to get technical then according to that chart a majority of Americans do not blame Bush for the deficit BUT it's more than a tad dishonest to just leave it at that without acknowledging that he wins the plurality hands down. It isn't even close.

Sure Obama shares some of the blame for TARP he did have one vote but to somehow insinuate that he owns TARP is ridiculous. TARP came from the Bush administration and I remind you that had the economy not gone tits up then TARP wouldn't have even happened. You are right that Obama has increased the deficit but you are incorrect to say that he's lying about inheriting a deficit. He did. The facts are that he inherited a deficit from Bush and that the Bush administration doubled the national debt.

But yes I agree that it's time that Americans start holding Obama's feet to the fire about the economy. I mean, it went to complete hell under Bush's 8 year watch and right now he is who we got to somehow fix the epic fail that was the Bush economy.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

Interesting question. Blaming 0bama for TARP is a not honest. He was a participant, and he even put a spoke in the wheel of the thing, but TARP is 100% Bush.

That said, the stimulus is all 0bama, and it has proven as stimulating as Jabba the Hut in a burqua. It would be better if 0bama just manned up and took control of the situation.

This perpetual "It is all Bush's fault" gets us no where. I do think we should keep on with the "lessons Learned" from the Bush administration. We had six years of good growth & low unemployment. Lower taxes and reasonable spending does keep things going well. Spending out of control and High taxes don't do any good for anybody.

 

[MaggieMae]

At least part of the reason Bush continues to be blamed for the economic mess, as shown in this graphic, is because under his watch the public lost $5 trillion in retirement savings, credit card companies were allowed to loaded up traps for the consumer, and no one was paying any attention to the PEOPLE it affected until it was too late.

As the chart shows, most Americans don't blame Bush for the current deficit, and clearly they are correct. Huh? The chart clearly shows those polled blame Bush, by 46%. Obama created most of the current deficit by voting for TARP without understanding what it was and by jamming the stimulus through Congress. Without these two blunders, the deficit would be much, much lower.

But even if we try to excuse these two blunders by saying that although he managed to project a calm and assured demeanor, being as inexperienced as he was, he panicked when he created nearly $1.5 trillion in new debt without understanding what he was doing, but the reckless abandon with which he is now proposing to create additional trillions of dollars of new debt for purely political reasons should not be excused by any Americans regardless of party affiliation. Take, for example, the Kennedy-Dodd health insurance bill that for a $1 trillion dollars does not provide universal health care but that does offer subsidies to families of four earning $110,000 while kicking the uninsured poor to the curb. The purpose of this bill is obviously to win middle class votes for the Dems in 2010 and 2012 and not to help the uninsured.

Most of your other points are assumptions. There is NO health bill, yet. There is NO energy bill, yet. There is NO education bill, yet. The next few months will be crucial in deciding where and what and how much to eliminate in order to reduce the size of the deficit. So until that happens, it's fruitless to keep on trying to scare everyone to death with numbers plucked from every wild scenario every naysayer in the business comes up with confident that THEY know what WILL happen. Because they don't.

 

[MaggieMae]

As the chart shows, most Americans don't blame Bush for the current deficit, and clearly they are correct. Obama created most of the current deficit by voting for TARP without understanding what it was and by jamming the stimulus through Congress. Without these two blunders, the deficit would be much, much lower.

But even if we try to excuse these two blunders by saying that although he managed to project a calm and assured demeanor, being as inexperienced as he was, he panicked when he created nearly $1.5 trillion in new debt without understanding what he was doing, but the reckless abandon with which he is now proposing to create additional trillions of dollars of new debt for purely political reasons should not be excused by any Americans regardless of party affiliation. Take, for example, the Kennedy-Dodd health insurance bill that for a $1 trillion dollars does not provide universal health care but that does offer subsidies to families of four earning $110,000 while kicking the uninsured poor to the curb. The purpose of this bill is obviously to win middle class votes for the Dems in 2010 and 2012 and not to help the uninsured.

Are we reading the same chart? When it asks "who is most responsible for the budget deficit" it looks to me like people blame Bush by a 2-1 margin over the next closest group on the list and they blame him nearly 8-1 over Obama. And lol @ trying to put TARP on Obama's shoulders? Really?

Dude ... everything went to hell and this shit storm started under George W. Bush. Remind me again who was in charge (and had been for 7+ years) when the market crashed and nearly collapsed? Obama may not be doing an A+ job trying to fix the mess but make no mistake that we are where we are because of the Bush Administration.

The chart clearly shows the majority of Americans do not hold Bush responsible for the deficit, and if many Americans are still reluctant to hold Obama responsible for his actions until he gains a little more experience, that changes nothing. It was never possible for TARP to do what its supporters claimed it would, buy up the so called toxic assets, and many pointed this out at the time, and as the Dem candidate for president, arguably the leader of the Democratic Party, Obama's support for TARP was critical to its passage through Congress where the Dems held a clear majority in the House. Had Obama opposed TARP, it is highly unlikely it would have passed, so there is no way Obama can escape responsibility for the passage of this ill considered bill and the enormous deficit it has produced.

You might be able to argue that Obama does not bear sole responsibility for TARP but not that he bears no responsibility for TARP. Of course, Obama does bear sole responsibility for the deficit produced by the stimulus bill and taken together these two bills account for about $1.5 trillion of the estimated $1.8 trillion to $2 trillion deficit, so when Obama whines that he has inherited the deficit from Bush, he is clearly lying. It is time for all Americans to stop coddling Obama and to stop making excuses for him and to start holding him responsible for his own actions

My sympathies if you have dyslexia or some other reading disability.

As for TARP, once again, the $700 billion were LOANS, $68.3 billion of which (or around one quarter of the IOU) has collectively been repaid by American Express, Bank of New York Mellon, the BB&T Corporation, Capital One Financial, Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan Chase, the State Street Corporation and US Bancorp. Also, 22 small community banks have returned $1.9 billion in government money.

The stimulus money DID add to the deficit, but again, depending strictly on your POLITICS, that investment also was seen as necessary to jump start the economy.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Are we reading the same chart? When it asks "who is most responsible for the budget deficit" it looks to me like people blame Bush by a 2-1 margin over the next closest group on the list and they blame him nearly 8-1 over Obama. And lol @ trying to put TARP on Obama's shoulders? Really?

Dude ... everything went to hell and this shit storm started under George W. Bush. Remind me again who was in charge (and had been for 7+ years) when the market crashed and nearly collapsed? Obama may not be doing an A+ job trying to fix the mess but make no mistake that we are where we are because of the Bush Administration.

The chart clearly shows the majority of Americans do not hold Bush responsible for the deficit, and if many Americans are still reluctant to hold Obama responsible for his actions until he gains a little more experience, that changes nothing. It was never possible for TARP to do what its supporters claimed it would, buy up the so called toxic assets, and many pointed this out at the time, and as the Dem candidate for president, arguably the leader of the Democratic Party, Obama's support for TARP was critical to its passage through Congress where the Dems held a clear majority in the House. Had Obama opposed TARP, it is highly unlikely it would have passed, so there is no way Obama can escape responsibility for the passage of this ill considered bill and the enormous deficit it has produced.

You might be able to argue that Obama does not bear sole responsibility for TARP but not that he bears no responsibility for TARP. Of course, Obama does bear sole responsibility for the deficit produced by the stimulus bill and taken together these two bills account for about $1.5 trillion of the estimated $1.8 trillion to $2 trillion deficit, so when Obama whines that he has inherited the deficit from Bush, he is clearly lying. It is time for all Americans to stop coddling Obama and to stop making excuses for him and to start holding him responsible for his own actions

My sympathies if you have dyslexia or some other reading disability.

As for TARP, once again, the $700 billion were LOANS, $68.3 billion of which (or around one quarter of the IOU) has collectively been repaid by American Express, Bank of New York Mellon, the BB&T Corporation, Capital One Financial, Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan Chase, the State Street Corporation and US Bancorp. Also, 22 small community banks have returned $1.9 billion in government money.

The stimulus money DID add to the deficit, but again, depending strictly on your POLITICS, that investment also was seen as necessary to jump start the economy.

You seem confused. The subject I was addressing was who was responsible for the enormous deficit, not whether it was worthwhile. Since you did not take issue with my argument that Obama was mostly responsible for it, I assume you agree with it.

You also appear to be misinformed. Most of the money that went to these corporations was for stock purchases, not loans, and as the money is paid back, none of it will go to reduce the debt incurred to fund TARP but will be spent on current projects, so not only will the deficit be much larger this year because of TARP, but our debt will be $700 billion larger for many, many years to come.

Again, since you responded to my argument that Obama is responsible for the enormous deficit by saying you think the deficit is a good thing, I assume you agree that Obama is responsible for it.

 

[MaggieMae]

The chart clearly shows the majority of Americans do not hold Bush responsible for the deficit, and if many Americans are still reluctant to hold Obama responsible for his actions until he gains a little more experience, that changes nothing. It was never possible for TARP to do what its supporters claimed it would, buy up the so called toxic assets, and many pointed this out at the time, and as the Dem candidate for president, arguably the leader of the Democratic Party, Obama's support for TARP was critical to its passage through Congress where the Dems held a clear majority in the House. Had Obama opposed TARP, it is highly unlikely it would have passed, so there is no way Obama can escape responsibility for the passage of this ill considered bill and the enormous deficit it has produced.

You might be able to argue that Obama does not bear sole responsibility for TARP but not that he bears no responsibility for TARP. Of course, Obama does bear sole responsibility for the deficit produced by the stimulus bill and taken together these two bills account for about $1.5 trillion of the estimated $1.8 trillion to $2 trillion deficit, so when Obama whines that he has inherited the deficit from Bush, he is clearly lying. It is time for all Americans to stop coddling Obama and to stop making excuses for him and to start holding him responsible for his own actions

My sympathies if you have dyslexia or some other reading disability.

As for TARP, once again, the $700 billion were LOANS, $68.3 billion of which (or around one quarter of the IOU) has collectively been repaid by American Express, Bank of New York Mellon, the BB&T Corporation, Capital One Financial, Goldman Sachs, JPMorgan Chase, the State Street Corporation and US Bancorp. Also, 22 small community banks have returned $1.9 billion in government money.

The stimulus money DID add to the deficit, but again, depending strictly on your POLITICS, that investment also was seen as necessary to jump start the economy.

You seem confused. The subject I was addressing was who was responsible for the enormous deficit, not whether it was worthwhile. Since you did not take issue with my argument that Obama was mostly responsible for it, I assume you agree with it.

You also appear to be misinformed. Most of the money that went to these corporations was for stock purchases, not loans, and as the money is paid back, none of it will go to reduce the debt incurred to fund TARP but will be spent on current projects, so not only will the deficit be much larger this year because of TARP, but our debt will be $700 billion larger for many, many years to come.

Again, since you responded to my argument that Obama is responsible for the enormous deficit by saying you think the deficit is a good thing, I assume you agree that Obama is responsible for it.

Where did I say the deficit is a good thing? That's why I think you have a comprehension problem, my friend.

Bush never included the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq in the annual budget, which exploded his deficit to $1.2 trillion (not including the ongoing care our wounded veterans will need far into the future). Add to this, the interest needed to cover the money for those wars, and the $1.2 trillion is realistically even higher.

Until the economy rights itself, which will not happen until the financial markets are running as properly leveraged institutions, the money repaid into TARP will stay there. For simplicity sake, call it an escrow fund.

What happens to returned TARP money? - By Christopher Beam - Slate Magazine