New York Times: $15 an Hour is Meant to Drive Fast Food Out of Business

[OnePercenter]

So what should we do now and forever? Never ever raise the minimum wage and just have a planned underclass of people that we pay with our taxes, to survive poverty? 88% of the people making minimum wage are adults, not children...and they are in these jobs, because there are not enough good or even slightly better jobs to go around....the adults in these jobs are obviously better workers than the teens looking for a job, and this is why businesses have hired the adults over the teenagers THEY ONCE did hire... and then we have illegal and legal immigrants as well flooding the same entry level jobs....

Do we just sit back and let the government make it easier to move jobs overseas and give the tax breaks to do such, allow trade treaties that are one sided in favor of the other country, and now let gvt just open the borders to as many immigrant workers as possible which Rubio and our dear resident Rabbi support, without giving this lower echelon of workers no way out of the poverty they dwell in...for the business's profits, and via the government's doings for decades that have eroded american jobs for American citizens? Or, DO WE SAY FINE, lets increase the "earned income credit" with our tax dollars to help them out? Or increase food stamp money to help them out? Holding the minimum wage down and increasing temporary work visas for foreigners is not the answer imo. If a foreigner wants to come and live here and wants to be a citizen, then I am fine with such because they WANT to be here and WANT to be Americans...but to let immigrants come in here just to work on HB1 visas and for them to send or to bring those dollars back home to their own country, does not help the USA...other than giving a "gift horse" to employers who can keep the minimum wage below what it should be with the flood/increased supply of workers that are willing to take anything..... any job at all, just to have a job, even if their skills ARE much higher than minimum wage pays....

It's a mess out there, a spiral downwards on worker pay, which will eventually hit the middle class more than it has already....

Once set, minimum wage should be indexed to inflation, and be done with it....

then everyone's pay will eventually be raised, in comparison to the minimum in all higher paying jobs surrounding the minimum...they will have to go up with inflation as well... and give no breaks for paying any immigrant less than the minimum wage....and jail the ones that do....

OMG! You totally glossed over the fact that the franchise is closing because their food sucks.

 

[BULLDOG]

Oh robots are horribly expensive to run. But $15/hr is just the face value cost. When you add in the taxes, the health care mandates, the unemployment insurance that's mandatory, and on and on and on, the wage is way way higher. Suddenly, a kiosk is cheaper. Automated fry cookers and burger flippers. Tons of cash. But eventually you drive up costs enough, and it becomes economical.

That is correct. The true cost of labor is significantly higher than just the hourly amount paid to the employee, and automated systems don't take sick days or show up with a bad attitude.

Nobody wants to be served by robots...but would prefer happy employees who care about their jobs. What do you RW a-holes have about a happy, stable country...

Really? When was the last time you drove a car built by human hands? The truth is that robots do a better job than humans, and are already doing a buttload of manual labor that humans used to do. See all those self checkout lines at the super market? Got somebody to pump your gas for you lately?

Your last two examples are not exactly good ones. The only thing replaced in either is a low paid worker, it is still humans pumping the gas and check out the items.

In both cases a machine has replaced the humans. The post responded to was arguing that people want humans to serve them, not machines. In these cases, people interact with machines, not people.

You don't really think the increase of automation has anything to do with minimum wage do ?you?

 

[Care4all]

So what should we do now and forever? Never ever raise the minimum wage and just have a planned underclass of people that we pay with our taxes, to survive poverty? 88% of the people making minimum wage are adults, not children...and they are in these jobs, because there are not enough good or even slightly better jobs to go around....the adults in these jobs are obviously better workers than the teens looking for a job, and this is why businesses have hired the adults over the teenagers THEY ONCE did hire... and then we have illegal and legal immigrants as well flooding the same entry level jobs....

Do we just sit back and let the government make it easier to move jobs overseas and give the tax breaks to do such, allow trade treaties that are one sided in favor of the other country, and now let gvt just open the borders to as many immigrant workers as possible which Rubio and our dear resident Rabbi support, without giving this lower echelon of workers no way out of the poverty they dwell in...for the business's profits, and via the government's doings for decades that have eroded american jobs for American citizens? Or, DO WE SAY FINE, lets increase the "earned income credit" with our tax dollars to help them out? Or increase food stamp money to help them out? Holding the minimum wage down and increasing temporary work visas for foreigners is not the answer imo. If a foreigner wants to come and live here and wants to be a citizen, then I am fine with such because they WANT to be here and WANT to be Americans...but to let immigrants come in here just to work on HB1 visas and for them to send or to bring those dollars back home to their own country, does not help the USA...other than giving a "gift horse" to employers who can keep the minimum wage below what it should be with the flood/increased supply of workers that are willing to take anything..... any job at all, just to have a job, even if their skills ARE much higher than minimum wage pays....

It's a mess out there, a spiral downwards on worker pay, which will eventually hit the middle class more than it has already....

Once set, minimum wage should be indexed to inflation, and be done with it....

then everyone's pay will eventually be raised, in comparison to the minimum in all higher paying jobs surrounding the minimum...they will have to go up with inflation as well... and give no breaks for paying any immigrant less than the minimum wage....and jail the ones that do....

OMG! You totally glossed over the fact that the franchise is closing because their food sucks.

Nope...I've just ignored the op's theory that this has been planned to drive the fast food industry out of business because it just is ridiculous to me.

I have been going back and forth between this thread, the thread on Minimum Wage and how Increased Sales are not considered in the equation by many that protectionist started, and the thread started on Rubio supporting hb1 visa immigraton by Freewill, I believe? Anyway...I probably should have posted my thoughts on Protectionist's thread....my bad!

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

Considering what we know about the left, this theory sounds more plausible than the left's claim that it wants minimum wage workers to earn a "living wage."

New York Times 15 an Hour is Meant to Drive Fast Food Out of Business Red Statements​

As noted by the New York Post , the New York Times has let it slip that the real goal of the $15 dollar an hour wage is to drive cheap fast food restaurants out of business. And as they said:

“The restaurant industry . . . will not go down without a fight.”

But, I thought that all the businesses affected by the minimum wage were just greedy and could easily afford the wages they should have been paying all along? I guess that wasn’t true. That certainly wasn’t the case for Z Pizza in Seattle. Z Pizza employed 11 employees, who were convinced their lives would be better since they would now be making the astronomical sum of $15 an hour. The owner, Ritu Shah Burnham, tried everything. She laid off workers, cut hours and even quit paying herself a salary, but in the end, she was forced to close her doors. You see, while most businesses her size had six years before paying the $15, she had only two because she owns a franchise. She got nailed on Obamacare for the same reason.

Liberals in their infinite wisdom (cough cough) they decided that a small franchisee should be lumped together with all the the franchisees and company owned restaurants. To me, this is further proof that the goal is to destroy them. I mean, what difference is there between a franchise restaurant owner with 11 employees and any other pizza joint with 11 employees? This is Michelle Obama’s lunches for adults. The same liberals who demand the right to choose to kill innocent babies, is unwilling to give you the right to decide what to eat. ​

Load of crap


Anyone who has ever worked in fast food knows that half the employees pull 90% of the weight even though both halves get paid shit. All a fast food place needs to do is fire the worst half and hire folks more like the better half and there you go - difference made up.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

A number of McDonald's have already installed Kiosks where customers can submit their orders. That eliminates the need for 3-4 employees at the front counter. The next thing will be machines to make burgers.

Soooo.... you're saying MW won't actually affect McDonald's much at all in the long run of it.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

Yep, it's a government plot intended to wean people off fast food.

Do the math. You will pay the minimum wage hike in the food you purchase. People won't pay that much for fast food and maybe not even restaurant food. It's hard enough to make a go of a restaurant.

Its funny how right wingers are always yelling at people to be more responsible and save more money but when it comes down to it you folks really want everyone to waste their dollars on eating out, don't you?

 

[paulitician]

Well, the fat greedy old White Republicans are boasting about thems robots taking over. According to them, fast food businesses are gonna thrive once that happens. Shy why all their hissy fits about workers making $15? They should be rejoicing. Yay! The robots are coming! The robots are coming! Now those damn poor untouchables will get theirs!!

I swear, fat greedy white Republicans are the dumbest hateful tards on earth. What are they rejoicing about? More Americans being poor and unemployed is gonna effect them bigtime. Their taxes will have to be raised often and significantly, to pay for all those needing Government assistance just to survive. Better off paying em a decent wage. Because ironically, the enormous costs of more poor and unemployed, are gonna effect the fat greedy white Republicans the most. Should have just paid the workers a survivable wage when they had the chance.

 

[danielpalos]

So what should we do now and forever? Never ever raise the minimum wage and just have a planned underclass of people that we pay with our taxes, to survive poverty? 88% of the people making minimum wage are adults, not children...and they are in these jobs, because there are not enough good or even slightly better jobs to go around....the adults in these jobs are obviously better workers than the teens looking for a job, and this is why businesses have hired the adults over the teenagers THEY ONCE did hire... and then we have illegal and legal immigrants as well flooding the same entry level jobs....

Do we just sit back and let the government make it easier to move jobs overseas and give the tax breaks to do such, allow trade treaties that are one sided in favor of the other country, and now let gvt just open the borders to as many immigrant workers as possible which Rubio and our dear resident Rabbi support, without giving this lower echelon of workers no way out of the poverty they dwell in...for the business's profits, and via the government's doings for decades that have eroded american jobs for American citizens? Or, DO WE SAY FINE, lets increase the "earned income credit" with our tax dollars to help them out? Or increase food stamp money to help them out? Holding the minimum wage down and increasing temporary work visas for foreigners is not the answer imo. If a foreigner wants to come and live here and wants to be a citizen, then I am fine with such because they WANT to be here and WANT to be Americans...but to let immigrants come in here just to work on HB1 visas and for them to send or to bring those dollars back home to their own country, does not help the USA...other than giving a "gift horse" to employers who can keep the minimum wage below what it should be with the flood/increased supply of workers that are willing to take anything..... any job at all, just to have a job, even if their skills ARE much higher than minimum wage pays....

It's a mess out there, a spiral downwards on worker pay, which will eventually hit the middle class more than it has already....

Once set, minimum wage should be indexed to inflation, and be done with it....

then everyone's pay will eventually be raised, in comparison to the minimum in all higher paying jobs surrounding the minimum...they will have to go up with inflation as well... and give no breaks for paying any immigrant less than the minimum wage....and jail the ones that do....

I believe we should not be infidel, protestant, nor renegade to the moral goodness of bearing True witness to our own laws regarding the concept of employment at will; and, unemployment compensation that clears our poverty guidelines on an at-will basis in our at-will employment States.

 

[paulitician]

I'll never understand why angry white Republican dudes especially, are so angry. I mean, they haven't had it nearly as bad as other non-white Americans have. I guess it's all fear for them. They truly fear their pot o' gold is gonna disappear if a poor struggling McDonalds worker gets $15.

Their anger and greed is so sad. Who cares if a McDonalds worker gets $15? Fat greedy white Republicans especially, will be fine. So they can stop with all the hissy fits. They'll get to keep their pot o' gold.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

More Americans being poor and unemployed is gonna effect them bigtime.

They actually enjoy other people's poverty. It feeds their superiority complexes.

Their taxes will have to be raised often and significantly, to pay for all those needing Government assistance just to survive.

That will never happen. What will inevitably happen is the same thing that always happens once the divide between the wealthy and the poor becomes too large - the poor will take personal responsibility for their own survival by picking up pitch forks and hanging the wealthy by their necks from trees. Then a "revolution" will ensue and EVERYONE will be left worse off (but the wealthy will lose the most!)

 

[paulitician]

More Americans being poor and unemployed is gonna effect them bigtime.

They actually enjoy other people's poverty. It feeds their superiority complexes.

Their taxes will have to be raised often and significantly, to pay for all those needing Government assistance just to survive.

That will never happen. What will inevitably happen is the same thing that always happens once the divide between the wealthy and the poor becomes too large - the poor will take personal responsibility for their own survival by picking up pitch forks and hanging the wealthy from trees. Then a "revolution" will ensue and EVERYONE will be left worse off (but the wealthy will lose the most!)

I hear ya. Seems inevitable. More poor and unemployed Americans may come back to bite fat greedy white Republicans, in more ways than one.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Considering that place was an up scale joint in Seattle, those waitteress got screwed over, they were probably making $200 ~$400 plus a day in tips, working three or 4 days a week a thousand bucks. Now working three days after taxes what $300 bucks?

Also note since my 1st wife was a waitress most all under report their tips to the IRS. Now they Will get it taken by the employeer, but I am sure the old regulars Will still tip them and ones from out of town.

Tough to do that now, since most people pay with credit/debit cards.

 

[Jarlaxle]

More Americans being poor and unemployed is gonna effect them bigtime.

They actually enjoy other people's poverty. It feeds their superiority complexes.

Their taxes will have to be raised often and significantly, to pay for all those needing Government assistance just to survive.

That will never happen. What will inevitably happen is the same thing that always happens once the divide between the wealthy and the poor becomes too large - the poor will take personal responsibility for their own survival by picking up pitch forks and hanging the wealthy from trees. Then a "revolution" will ensue and EVERYONE will be left worse off (but the wealthy will lose the most!)

I hear ya. Seems inevitable. More poor and unemployed Americans may come back to bite fat greedy white Republicans, in more ways than one.

Have we no machine guns? Have we no flamethrowers?

 

[Wyatt earp]

Considering that place was an up scale joint in Seattle, those waitteress got screwed over, they were probably making $200 ~$400 plus a day in tips, working three or 4 days a week a thousand bucks. Now working three days after taxes what $300 bucks?

Also note since my 1st wife was a waitress most all under report their tips to the IRS. Now they Will get it taken by the employeer, but I am sure the old regulars Will still tip them and ones from out of town.

Tough to do that now, since most people pay with credit/debit cards.

I guess, expensive resteraunts and bars I leave the tip on my credit card, but cheap ones will normally leave cash on the table, so she remembers me when I come back.

 

[hadit]

That is correct. The true cost of labor is significantly higher than just the hourly amount paid to the employee, and automated systems don't take sick days or show up with a bad attitude.

Nobody wants to be served by robots...but would prefer happy employees who care about their jobs. What do you RW a-holes have about a happy, stable country...

Really? When was the last time you drove a car built by human hands? The truth is that robots do a better job than humans, and are already doing a buttload of manual labor that humans used to do. See all those self checkout lines at the super market? Got somebody to pump your gas for you lately?

Your last two examples are not exactly good ones. The only thing replaced in either is a low paid worker, it is still humans pumping the gas and check out the items.

In both cases a machine has replaced the humans. The post responded to was arguing that people want humans to serve them, not machines. In these cases, people interact with machines, not people.

You don't really think the increase of automation has anything to do with minimum wage do ?you?

The MW played a role. By increasing the cost of human labor, it hastened the advance of automation.

 

[OnePercenter]

The MW played a role. By increasing the cost of human labor, it hastened the advance of automation.

Bull Shit! Thirty years ago people said when planes could fly themselves we'd not need pilots. Guess what, planes can take-off, turn at intersections, find the airport and land by themselves and we still have Pilots.

The truth is we have hit a road block in terms of automation. Until someone can teach a machine to think, we'll be forever stuck.

 

[hadit]

The MW played a role. By increasing the cost of human labor, it hastened the advance of automation.

Bull Shit! Thirty years ago people said when planes could fly themselves we'd not need pilots. Guess what, planes can take-off, turn at intersections, find the airport and land by themselves and we still have Pilots.

Of course, and pilots won't be eliminated in the foreseeable future because there are just too many things that can go wrong in the air. Notice, however, the advent of driverless cars. It won't be terribly long before cab and bus driver will be more jobs eliminated by automation.

The truth is we have hit a road block in terms of automation. Until someone can teach a machine to think, we'll be forever stuck.

You will always need a human to take control if a machine fails in life critical situations, but a single human controlling a machine can replace many humans doing the work the machine does.

 

[Freewill]

The MW played a role. By increasing the cost of human labor, it hastened the advance of automation.

Bull Shit! Thirty years ago people said when planes could fly themselves we'd not need pilots. Guess what, planes can take-off, turn at intersections, find the airport and land by themselves and we still have Pilots.

The truth is we have hit a road block in terms of automation. Until someone can teach a machine to think, we'll be forever stuck.

The pilots could jump out of the planes and the planes would land safely. I think the only reason there are still pilots is not because they have to be but because people want them to be.

 

[hadit]

The MW played a role. By increasing the cost of human labor, it hastened the advance of automation.

Bull Shit! Thirty years ago people said when planes could fly themselves we'd not need pilots. Guess what, planes can take-off, turn at intersections, find the airport and land by themselves and we still have Pilots.

The truth is we have hit a road block in terms of automation. Until someone can teach a machine to think, we'll be forever stuck.

The pilots could jump out of the planes and the planes would land safely. I think the only reason there are still pilots is not because they have to be but because people want them to be.

The plane can land itself safely MOST of the time. We still need pilots because things still break down and unexpected things still happen. Airplane automation is not yet capable of handling everything that can happen during a flight.

 

[hadit]

More Americans being poor and unemployed is gonna effect them bigtime.

They actually enjoy other people's poverty. It feeds their superiority complexes.

Their taxes will have to be raised often and significantly, to pay for all those needing Government assistance just to survive.

That will never happen. What will inevitably happen is the same thing that always happens once the divide between the wealthy and the poor becomes too large - the poor will take personal responsibility for their own survival by picking up pitch forks and hanging the wealthy from trees. Then a "revolution" will ensue and EVERYONE will be left worse off (but the wealthy will lose the most!)

I hear ya. Seems inevitable. More poor and unemployed Americans may come back to bite fat greedy white Republicans, in more ways than one.

You seem to be missing about half of reality. Check the make up of the democrats in Washington. Amazingly enough, you'll find a bunch of, you guessed it, fat greedy white democrats who whine and wail about taxes being too low while they pay an army of attorneys to keep their tax burden as low as possible, and in many cases, simply don't pay taxes they owe.