Nebraska nuclear power plant problems

[Old Rocks]

Claims and counterclaims at the moment. Hope this is not for real.

Nebraska Nuclear Plant at Level 4 Emergency | Hawai`i News Daily

The Fort Calhoun, Nebraska, Nuclear power plant is going down fast due to massive flooding.

The Omaha Public Power District has declared a Notification of Unusual Event (NOUE).

The FAA has issued the following directive, shutting down airspace over the plant:

FDC 1/6523 ZMP FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS FORT CALHOUN NUCLEAR POWER PLANT BLAIR,NE EFFECTIVE IMMEDIATELY UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE. PURSUANT TO 14 CFR SECTION 91.137(A)(3) TEMPORARY FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS ARE IN EFFECT FOR FLOOD RELIEF EFFORTS WITHIN A 2 NAUTICAL MILE RADIUS OF 413113N/0960438W OR THE OMAHA /OVR/ VORTAC 316 DEGREE RADIAL AT 26.1 NAUTICAL MILES AT AND BELOW 3500 FEET MSL. NEBRASKA STATE PATROL, LT. FRANK PECK TELEPHONE 402-450-1867 IS IN CHARGE OF THE OPERATION. MINNEAPOLIS /ZMP/ ARTCC TELEPHONE 651-463-5580 IS THE FAA COORDINATION FACILITY.

 

[Mr. H.]

Not to worry- it's just the first NOUE.

Merry Chrishmush everbuddy.

 

[Samson]

I wonder if the Nebraska News Daily is reporting on Volcanic Activity in Hawaii?

 

[Zander]

This would have never happened if only we'd had a government mandate that forces everyone to use candles for lighting, horse and buggy for travel, and telegraphs instead of phones and computers....

 

[Old Rocks]

Flood Rumor Control - Omaha Public Power District

Flood Rumor Control

Following are responses to flood-related rumors that OPPD has heard about.

Rumor: Fort Calhoun Nuclear Station is at a Level 4 emergency or level 4 alert.

This terminology is not accurate, and is not how emergencies at nuclear power plants are classified.
Fort Calhoun Station (FCS) declared a Notification of Unusual Event (NOUE) on June 6.
A NOUE is the least-serious of four emergency classifications established by the Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
FCS declared a NOUE because the Missouri River was projected to reach 1,004 feet above mean sea level. (It reached that height on June 9.)
The FCS plant’s reactor has been in cold shut down for a planned refueling outage since April 9. It will remain in that condition until the river recedes.
The reactor and spent-fuel pool are in a normal, stable condition and are both protected; there has been no release of radioactivity and none is expected.
Rumor: A no-fly zone was set up around Fort Calhoun Nuclear Station because of a release of radiation, similar to what happened with the Fukushima reactors in Japan.

There has been no release of radioactivity at Fort Calhoun Station due to the flooding and none is expected.
The flight restrictions were set up by the FAA as a result of Missouri river flooding.
OPPD’s extensive, preplanned actions to protect the FCS reactor and spent-fuel pool from the floodwaters have been effective.
The reactor is housed in a watertight containment building, and is in a normal and safe “cold shutdown” condition, covered by more than 23 feet of purified reactor coolant water.
In addition, OPPD has installed Aqua Dams® and other berms around such vital equipment and buildings at the FCS site.

 

[flacaltenn]

Wow OldRocks!!

I'm impressed..

You shut down that nasty rumor yourself. I'd be po'ed about the embarassment I suffered at tthe hands of an unscrupulous "news" site like that.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

It always helps to have a bit more information.

Sometimes level four is extremely bad, sometimes it is trivia.

What we had was folks who didn't know what they were talking about trying to scare folks with with less than complete information.

 

[Old Rocks]

Well, the first site obviously did not like nuclear. And the second site seems to have understated the problem in my opinion.

You see, why on earth would they have to sandbag a nuke plant on a known flood plain? Think about it a moment. Why was there not a permanent barrier put in at the time of construction? After all, these floods occur about every 100 years. And they had one nearly this high in 1994. So why no permanent flood wall? The other point is putting vulneble electric gear at a level that a flood could actually damage it. Again, this is a known problem for the region. Poor engineering, to say the least.

 

[Mr. Jones]

Nebraska Nuclear Plant Faces Rising River - National - The Atlantic Wire

Seems there are plenty of rumors we should be leery of too.

Rumors

3 days ago, however, it was claimed that the Obama administration has ordered a news blackout over Fort Calhoun.

Alas, that report is the handiwork of the exotically named Sorcha Faal, the nom de plume of David Booth. Often claiming some exclusive anonymous Russian government/military source that cannot be verified and is not reported anywhere else, Faal is a notorious purveyor of faux news. S/he invents them out of whole cloth.

That doesn't mean there are no legitimate concerns though.

In 2010, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) conducted an inspection of Fort Calhoun Station (FCS) and found that the plant did not have adequate procedures to protect the intake structure and auxiliary building against external flooding events. Specifically, contrary to Technical Specification 5.8.1.a, the station failed to maintain procedures for combating a significant flood as recommended by Regulatory Guide 1.33, Appendix A, section 6.w, “Acts of Nature.”

Looking for information on Fort Calhoun, I found this disconcerting piece of news by ketv.com last April 1, 2011:
Fort Calhoun's Nuclear Plant Under Scrutiny - Omaha News Story - KETV Omaha

“Fort Calhoun’s nuclear power plant is one of three reactors across the country that federal regulators said they are most concerned about. Nuclear Regulatory Commission officials said Fort Calhoun’s reactor is operating safely, but it’s still on the shortlist because they want to make sure it’s prepared to handle major emergencies, like flooding. Last year, federal regulators questioned the station’s flood protection protocol. NRC officials said they felt the Omaha Public Power District should do more than sandbagging in the event of major flooding along the Missouri river.”

According to ketv.com, “OPPD officials said they have already made amends and added new flood gates.”

We can only hope that OPPD indeed had addressed the Nuclear Regulatory Commission’s concerns and did make those “amends” to Fort Calhoun’s flood protection protocol.
Missouri R. Levees Breached: Fort Calhoun Nuclear Plant Flooded! | Fellowship of the Minds

The situation at the nuke plants could worsen, but it depends on the water that will flow south from states like South Dakota and even states further north. Only 18" of water is needed to force the shutdown of the Cooper plant. So the situation is precarious, and it all depends on how much water comes their way from potential heavy rains from storms, the eventual melting of the winter snow fall in northern states, and if the levys and dams fail, all bets are off. Only fools, or overly apathetic morons would assume this situation is of no concern.

 

[martybegan]

Well, the first site obviously did not like nuclear. And the second site seems to have understated the problem in my opinion.

You see, why on earth would they have to sandbag a nuke plant on a known flood plain? Think about it a moment. Why was there not a permanent barrier put in at the time of construction? After all, these floods occur about every 100 years. And they had one nearly this high in 1994. So why no permanent flood wall? The other point is putting vulneble electric gear at a level that a flood could actually damage it. Again, this is a known problem for the region. Poor engineering, to say the least.

The second site is press releases from the company that runs the plants, and those statements can be verified by the Nuclear Regulatory Board.

They are sandbagging in CASE the nearby levee had a problem. They have another 8 feet to go before any levee is topped, but considering we havent invented "insta-sandbags" yet isnt it prudent for them to plan ahead? Isnt that what we want the nuclear industry to do? To be overly safe? Why should thier precuation be used against them?

Also the electrical fire had nothing to do with the flooding, and was fixed in 90 minutes. it would have taken 88 hours for the spent fuel pool to even start to boil.

 

[Old Rocks]

Marty, Marty, look at the video at this site. Does that look like sandbagging just in case? Looks to me like they have water at the sandbags right now. And remember, that there are several reservoirs upstream that are at capacity and remain so for at least a month.

Nebraska Nuclear Plant at Level 4 Emergency | Hawai`i News Daily

 

[martybegan]

Marty, Marty, look at the video at this site. Does that look like sandbagging just in case? Looks to me like they have water at the sandbags right now. And remember, that there are several reservoirs upstream that are at capacity and remain so for at least a month.

Nebraska Nuclear Plant at Level 4 Emergency | Hawai`i News Daily

This is a different plant than the one with the electrical fire, and the supposed no fly zone.

And while the roads look covered in water, the plant looks like it is humming along just fine.

 

[flacaltenn]

OldRocks:

I've got to retract my congratulations on pulling this thread, because I never imagined that you'd go RIGHT BACK to quoting such an unreliable source. (getting to know you. getting to know all about you.. getting to know you, getting to hope you like me... c"mon it's ---- Showtune time!)

Apparently, you have no common sense or outrage at being scammed so badly. Kinda fits with my observation over the years that lefties have absolutely no sense of self-preservation..

The REACTOR at the plant is IDLED for refueling. Means it's room temperature. The fuel rod pools are going absolutely nowhere even in a flood. If you're REALLLY REALLLY lucky -- the control room and out buildings will be so damaged that it will never be brought back on line.. BTW: Pacifica radio (my favorite West Coast commies) are STILL insisting the plant is at Level 4 on your last link. You can get your news from sources less reliable than Murdoch if you want. Just realize your liability for panicKing your other lefty lemming pals..

 

[Old Rocks]

Quite on the contrary, the fuel rod pool is the problem. The plant operators themselves stated that without power, in 88 hours the pool would boil dry. So what we have is a shut down nuclear reactor that is safe enough in a flood, but a pool that contains over 4 times as many spent but hot rods as it was designed for. With a number of dams upstream that would create havoc if one failed for any reason. Do you think that they would be able to control this if one of those dams were to let go?

The potential damage that a meltdown of the pool material could cause is great enough that the strongest of precautions should have been taken.

 

[Old Rocks]

Marty, Marty, look at the video at this site. Does that look like sandbagging just in case? Looks to me like they have water at the sandbags right now. And remember, that there are several reservoirs upstream that are at capacity and remain so for at least a month.

Nebraska Nuclear Plant at Level 4 Emergency | Hawai`i News Daily

This is a different plant than the one with the electrical fire, and the supposed no fly zone.

And while the roads look covered in water, the plant looks like it is humming along just fine.

Bullshit.

US: Nuclear plant surrounded by flood is safe - US news - Environment - msnbc.com

 

[Old Rocks]

This is what the worry is at present.

Possible Fort Peck Dam Failure Major Threat To Missouri Flooding | Plains Daily

BISMARCK, ND – “The dam structures on the upper Missouri River are in great shape. There are no significant issues at this time,” stated Mark Clark in an interview following this morning’s flood update briefing in Bismarck, reiterating that the dams are constantly monitored and annually inspected. The Army Corps of Engineer’s Natural Disaster Program Manager has been in Bismarck dealing with the Missouri River flooding issues.

But Bernard Shanks, an expert in land and resource management who has spent over four decades studying Missouri River management, questions whether or not that assessment is completely accurate. “I have followed this issue for 40 years, and I have never seen them more at-risk than they are today,” Shanks told KMOX radio listeners in St. Louis, Missouri yesterday.

In an article appearing Tuesday in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, Shanks stated his concerns about the ability of the Fort Peck Dam to withstand the increasing stress levels caused by record runoffs and precipitation over the course of the past year. Unlike the other 6 downstream dams, Fort Peck Dam is a “hydraulic-fill dam.” Shank wrote that this is “a flawed design that has suffered a well-known fate for this type of dam – liquefaction – in which saturated soil loses its stability. Hydraulic-fill dams are prone to almost instant collapse from stress.”

The risk associated with hydraulic-fill dams led California to outlaw them and require that all such dams be removed and rebuilt.

Current flooding exceeds the 500 year flood plain levels, with the snow pack still in the process of melting. The Army COE intends to continue raising release levels at the Garrison dam through June 18 up to 150,000 cfs, at which time they plan on holding the releases constant.

If the Fort Peck Dam were to fail under the pressure of heavy spring rains and the melting snowpack, which is forecast to hit the highest levels since 1898, far exceeding 1997 levels, Shanks warned that it could cause a domino effect failure in the downstream earthen dams, including the Garrison and Oahe dams, causing them to be overrun and cave under pressure.

 

[flacaltenn]

OldRocks:

Calm down before you expire man. If you want to make sure the fuel storage ponds are safe, you load up a barge or a truck caravan with aux generators/pumps and park it right up front. Big plug from boat(trucks) to building. Lord knows why there wasn't a mobile source of power to Fukashima in the 1st couple days BEFORE the explosions. But when your ships are now grounded 20 miles inland, perhaps that's asking too much. THen again, maybe it's asking too much for FEMA or DOE to think about this as well.

Sheeeezzz.. Deep breaths.. gets oxygen to your brain cell.

 

[martybegan]

Quite on the contrary, the fuel rod pool is the problem. The plant operators themselves stated that without power, in 88 hours the pool would boil dry. So what we have is a shut down nuclear reactor that is safe enough in a flood, but a pool that contains over 4 times as many spent but hot rods as it was designed for. With a number of dams upstream that would create havoc if one failed for any reason. Do you think that they would be able to control this if one of those dams were to let go?

The potential damage that a meltdown of the pool material could cause is great enough that the strongest of precautions should have been taken.

Couldnt they just bring in some generator mud pumps and use the flood water to keep the fuel rods cool?

Again, this type of flooding is more predictable, and easier to work around than a tsunami.

 

[martybegan]

Marty, Marty, look at the video at this site. Does that look like sandbagging just in case? Looks to me like they have water at the sandbags right now. And remember, that there are several reservoirs upstream that are at capacity and remain so for at least a month.

Nebraska Nuclear Plant at Level 4 Emergency | Hawai`i News Daily

This is a different plant than the one with the electrical fire, and the supposed no fly zone.

And while the roads look covered in water, the plant looks like it is humming along just fine.

Bullshit.

US: Nuclear plant surrounded by flood is safe - US news - Environment - msnbc.com

So, maybe its the same plant, but since it is turned off, there is no concern. Again, in the rare event the lost ALL 9 sources of power, you then have more than 3 days to bring in some mud pumps, and basically suck river water into the pools.

I understand concern, what I am trying to work against is the sensationalism, and the half truths said by some of the posters in these threads.

And if you want to resort to using foul language, you can go fuck a horse.