Murder At The Carwash

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First the story, then Victor Davis Hanson's analysis...

1. A woman found slain at a Hanford car wash this week was killed randomly when a 17-year-old gang member happened to see her while taking a walk, Hanford police said Thursday. Denise McVay was washing her car — something she did several times a week — early Tuesday morning before work. The teen was wandering the streets after leaving a party when he saw McVay at the Royal Car Wash on Garner Avenue at about 5 a.m. and decided to kill her, police said.

2. The teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night” and McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said. “It was a purely random act.” The teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat....the teen was covered with blood ...went with him to Visalia Mall, where the teen used McVay’s money to buy clean clothes...The teen, whose name was not released because of his age,... Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Hanson:
3. ...confused American society. First, note the discrepancy between the employed Ms. McVay — washing her car in the early morning hours on her way to work, apparently intent on having a clean automobile when she arrived — and the unidentified youth who, we are told at first, was “taking a walk,” later expanded into “wandering the streets after leaving a party.” How did we go so nonchalantly in a mere two paragraphs from “taking a walk” to “wandering the streets after leaving a party”?

4. Note, furthermore, that our society has no compunction about letting the world know the identity of Ms. Denise McVay, who was horribly murdered and left dead on the pavement of a car wash. But it is worried that we might learn the name of the “17-year-old gang member,” also known as an anonymous “teen.”

5. In the transition from a shame culture to a guilt culture, America has become a confused society that values the sensitivities of the felonious living far more than respect for the law-abiding dead.

6. Unfortunately, the story only becomes more depressing. We next read that the anonymous teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night,” and, unfortunately, Ms. McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” So a Capt. Parker Sever goes on to characterize the fact that “the teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat” as “a purely random act.”

7. The law-enforcement officer, who no doubt means well, nonetheless describes a productive worker, striving to clean her car, as “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” ... Ms. McVay, in fact, was in the right place at the right time, and she should have had every expectation that that she could go to the car wash before work without worry that a murderous gang-banger would slit her throat.

8. What sort of abjectly amoral society have we become...Snapshot of a Sick Society - Victor Davis Hanson - National Review Online


If only this story had had a happy ending, along the lines of:

"Denise McVay, age 49, was washing her car at 5am, when she had occassion to put to use the training she had with her legally licensed .380 ACP, putting to an end the murderous rampage of an unnamed teen."

Amen.
 
First the story, then Victor Davis Hanson's analysis...

1. A woman found slain at a Hanford car wash this week was killed randomly when a 17-year-old gang member happened to see her while taking a walk, Hanford police said Thursday. Denise McVay was washing her car — something she did several times a week — early Tuesday morning before work. The teen was wandering the streets after leaving a party when he saw McVay at the Royal Car Wash on Garner Avenue at about 5 a.m. and decided to kill her, police said.

2. The teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night” and McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said. “It was a purely random act.” The teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat....the teen was covered with blood ...went with him to Visalia Mall, where the teen used McVay’s money to buy clean clothes...The teen, whose name was not released because of his age,... Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Hanson:
3. ...confused American society. First, note the discrepancy between the employed Ms. McVay — washing her car in the early morning hours on her way to work, apparently intent on having a clean automobile when she arrived — and the unidentified youth who, we are told at first, was “taking a walk,” later expanded into “wandering the streets after leaving a party.” How did we go so nonchalantly in a mere two paragraphs from “taking a walk” to “wandering the streets after leaving a party”?

4. Note, furthermore, that our society has no compunction about letting the world know the identity of Ms. Denise McVay, who was horribly murdered and left dead on the pavement of a car wash. But it is worried that we might learn the name of the “17-year-old gang member,” also known as an anonymous “teen.”

5. In the transition from a shame culture to a guilt culture, America has become a confused society that values the sensitivities of the felonious living far more than respect for the law-abiding dead.

6. Unfortunately, the story only becomes more depressing. We next read that the anonymous teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night,” and, unfortunately, Ms. McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” So a Capt. Parker Sever goes on to characterize the fact that “the teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat” as “a purely random act.”

7. The law-enforcement officer, who no doubt means well, nonetheless describes a productive worker, striving to clean her car, as “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” ... Ms. McVay, in fact, was in the right place at the right time, and she should have had every expectation that that she could go to the car wash before work without worry that a murderous gang-banger would slit her throat.

8. What sort of abjectly amoral society have we become...Snapshot of a Sick Society - Victor Davis Hanson - National Review Online


If only this story had had a happy ending, along the lines of:

"Denise McVay, age 49, was washing her car at 5am, when she had occassion to put to use the training she had with her legally licensed .380 ACP, putting to an end the murderous rampage of an unnamed teen."

Amen.

I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.

Police call slaying of Hanford woman a random act
Posted at 6:04 p.m. on Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?
 
First the story, then Victor Davis Hanson's analysis...

1. A woman found slain at a Hanford car wash this week was killed randomly when a 17-year-old gang member happened to see her while taking a walk, Hanford police said Thursday. Denise McVay was washing her car — something she did several times a week — early Tuesday morning before work. The teen was wandering the streets after leaving a party when he saw McVay at the Royal Car Wash on Garner Avenue at about 5 a.m. and decided to kill her, police said.

2. The teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night” and McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said. “It was a purely random act.” The teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat....the teen was covered with blood ...went with him to Visalia Mall, where the teen used McVay’s money to buy clean clothes...The teen, whose name was not released because of his age,... Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Hanson:
3. ...confused American society. First, note the discrepancy between the employed Ms. McVay — washing her car in the early morning hours on her way to work, apparently intent on having a clean automobile when she arrived — and the unidentified youth who, we are told at first, was “taking a walk,” later expanded into “wandering the streets after leaving a party.” How did we go so nonchalantly in a mere two paragraphs from “taking a walk” to “wandering the streets after leaving a party”?

4. Note, furthermore, that our society has no compunction about letting the world know the identity of Ms. Denise McVay, who was horribly murdered and left dead on the pavement of a car wash. But it is worried that we might learn the name of the “17-year-old gang member,” also known as an anonymous “teen.”

5. In the transition from a shame culture to a guilt culture, America has become a confused society that values the sensitivities of the felonious living far more than respect for the law-abiding dead.

6. Unfortunately, the story only becomes more depressing. We next read that the anonymous teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night,” and, unfortunately, Ms. McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” So a Capt. Parker Sever goes on to characterize the fact that “the teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat” as “a purely random act.”

7. The law-enforcement officer, who no doubt means well, nonetheless describes a productive worker, striving to clean her car, as “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” ... Ms. McVay, in fact, was in the right place at the right time, and she should have had every expectation that that she could go to the car wash before work without worry that a murderous gang-banger would slit her throat.

8. What sort of abjectly amoral society have we become...Snapshot of a Sick Society - Victor Davis Hanson - National Review Online


If only this story had had a happy ending, along the lines of:

"Denise McVay, age 49, was washing her car at 5am, when she had occassion to put to use the training she had with her legally licensed .380 ACP, putting to an end the murderous rampage of an unnamed teen."

Amen.

I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.

Police call slaying of Hanford woman a random act
Posted at 6:04 p.m. on Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?

Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?
 
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If only the criminal had read Victor Davis Hanson, he would probably have decided crime didn't make any sense and instead would have joined Victor in a right wing think tank propagandizing on how society was deteriorating, making big bucks doing so, and while his writing wouldn't stop any crime, or have any positive effect on society, he could have felt good about himself and thus move through life never ever seeing it or wondering why. If only.....
 
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If only the criminal had read Victor Davis Hanson, he would probably have decided crime didn't make any sense and instead would have joined Victor in a right wing think tank propagandizing on how society was deteriorating, making big bucks doing so, and while his writing wouldn't stop any crime, or have any positive effect on society, he could have felt good about himself and thus move through life never ever seeing it or wondering why. If only.....

So you forgive the 17 year old, but vilify Mr. Hanson?

Give me 30 seconds alone with him. I'll turn him into a productive member of society. His remains will fertilize crops.
 
If the perp was white and the victim was black the story would be about a hate crime but since it doesn't mention race we can console ourselves with the fact that no hatred was involved.
 
First the story, then Victor Davis Hanson's analysis...

1. A woman found slain at a Hanford car wash this week was killed randomly when a 17-year-old gang member happened to see her while taking a walk, Hanford police said Thursday. Denise McVay was washing her car — something she did several times a week — early Tuesday morning before work. The teen was wandering the streets after leaving a party when he saw McVay at the Royal Car Wash on Garner Avenue at about 5 a.m. and decided to kill her, police said.

2. The teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night” and McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said. “It was a purely random act.” The teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat....the teen was covered with blood ...went with him to Visalia Mall, where the teen used McVay’s money to buy clean clothes...The teen, whose name was not released because of his age,... Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Hanson:
3. ...confused American society. First, note the discrepancy between the employed Ms. McVay — washing her car in the early morning hours on her way to work, apparently intent on having a clean automobile when she arrived — and the unidentified youth who, we are told at first, was “taking a walk,” later expanded into “wandering the streets after leaving a party.” How did we go so nonchalantly in a mere two paragraphs from “taking a walk” to “wandering the streets after leaving a party”?

4. Note, furthermore, that our society has no compunction about letting the world know the identity of Ms. Denise McVay, who was horribly murdered and left dead on the pavement of a car wash. But it is worried that we might learn the name of the “17-year-old gang member,” also known as an anonymous “teen.”

5. In the transition from a shame culture to a guilt culture, America has become a confused society that values the sensitivities of the felonious living far more than respect for the law-abiding dead.

6. Unfortunately, the story only becomes more depressing. We next read that the anonymous teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night,” and, unfortunately, Ms. McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” So a Capt. Parker Sever goes on to characterize the fact that “the teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat” as “a purely random act.”

7. The law-enforcement officer, who no doubt means well, nonetheless describes a productive worker, striving to clean her car, as “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” ... Ms. McVay, in fact, was in the right place at the right time, and she should have had every expectation that that she could go to the car wash before work without worry that a murderous gang-banger would slit her throat.

8. What sort of abjectly amoral society have we become...Snapshot of a Sick Society - Victor Davis Hanson - National Review Online


If only this story had had a happy ending, along the lines of:

"Denise McVay, age 49, was washing her car at 5am, when she had occassion to put to use the training she had with her legally licensed .380 ACP, putting to an end the murderous rampage of an unnamed teen."

Amen.

I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.

Police call slaying of Hanford woman a random act
Posted at 6:04 p.m. on Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?

Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?

I didn't see any point in commenting on it. The fact is, every time something violent happens in the country happens, certain people use that as an excuse to make some silly argument that we arm every citizen.

An argument that is completely absurd. A weapon is a tool. It's useless in the hands of a person that has no knowledge or desire to use it. I, for one, don't want to carry a weapon. I have no illusions or fantasies about being a gunslinger. I've been on the pragmatic end of that and know the reality of the matter. I also know that many people see a gun as a security blanket and aren't psychologically prepared to pull the trigger. These people are at high risk for being shot with their own weapon.

As for your idea. It stinks. You would have every citizen on a plane breaching the hull of an aircraft with poorly aimed shots at any perceived threat? What about the passenger that decides to go ballistic for no apparent reason? Why do you think Sky Marshal's train so hard? So they hit what they shoot at.

Bad idea. Go sit in the corner.
 
If only the criminal had read Victor Davis Hanson, he would probably have decided crime didn't make any sense and instead would have joined Victor in a right wing think tank propagandizing on how society was deteriorating, making big bucks doing so, and while his writing wouldn't stop any crime, or have any positive effect on society, he could have felt good about himself and thus move through life never ever seeing it or wondering why. If only.....




At least the prick wouldn't have murdered an innocent woman. Something you seem to be OK with. Why am I not surprised.
 
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Video:
Jose Saldana pleads not guilty in Hanford car wash murder | abc30.com
 
I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.



Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?

Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?

I didn't see any point in commenting on it. The fact is, every time something violent happens in the country happens, certain people use that as an excuse to make some silly argument that we arm every citizen.

An argument that is completely absurd. A weapon is a tool. It's useless in the hands of a person that has no knowledge or desire to use it. I, for one, don't want to carry a weapon. I have no illusions or fantasies about being a gunslinger. I've been on the pragmatic end of that and know the reality of the matter. I also know that many people see a gun as a security blanket and aren't psychologically prepared to pull the trigger. These people are at high risk for being shot with their own weapon.

As for your idea. It stinks. You would have every citizen on a plane breaching the hull of an aircraft with poorly aimed shots at any perceived threat? What about the passenger that decides to go ballistic for no apparent reason? Why do you think Sky Marshal's train so hard? So they hit what they shoot at.

Bad idea. Go sit in the corner.





Why do you think burglars don't target just any old house? Why do robbers go after particular targets all the time? Yep you guessed it. The fear that an armed citizen will kill them precludes their depradations on most targets. Here's a test for you. I suggest you place a sign in your window stating that you hate guns and don't have any. How long do you think it will be before you have a wonderful person invite themselves into your home?

You see dear person. You reap the benefit of bad guys not knowing who has weapons so they are selective in who they attack. If a bad person knew that everyone was armed on a plane (other then former felons and mental cases and of course those who truly did not want to carry a weapon or who were incapable, the odds are that nothing would happen as the second the perp tried something somebody would kill him.

For all their vaunted training Sky marshals havn't stopped a single incident I can recall. It has been the aircrew and passengers doing the stopping.
 
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I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.



Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?

Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?

I didn't see any point in commenting on it. The fact is, every time something violent happens in the country happens, certain people use that as an excuse to make some silly argument that we arm every citizen.

An argument that is completely absurd. A weapon is a tool. It's useless in the hands of a person that has no knowledge or desire to use it. I, for one, don't want to carry a weapon. I have no illusions or fantasies about being a gunslinger. I've been on the pragmatic end of that and know the reality of the matter. I also know that many people see a gun as a security blanket and aren't psychologically prepared to pull the trigger. These people are at high risk for being shot with their own weapon.

As for your idea. It stinks. You would have every citizen on a plane breaching the hull of an aircraft with poorly aimed shots at any perceived threat? What about the passenger that decides to go ballistic for no apparent reason? Why do you think Sky Marshal's train so hard? So they hit what they shoot at.

Bad idea. Go sit in the corner.

"...certain people use that as an excuse to make some silly argument that we arm every citizen."


1. Possibly you have some passing knowledge of the 2nd amendment?
No?
"...a well regulated militia...."

George Mason, Father of the Bill of Rights:"I ask, Who are the militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers." (Jonathan Elliot, The Debates of the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution, [NY: Burt Franklin,1888] p.425-6)

Welcome to the United States of America.

2. Gun Ownership Mandatory In Kennesaw, Georgia
Crime Rate Plummets

by Chuck Baldwin

The New American magazine reminds us that March 25th marked the 16th anniversary of Kennesaw, Georgia's ordinance requiring heads of households (with certain exceptions) to keep at least one firearm in their homes.

The city's population grew from around 5,000 in 1980 to 13,000 by 1996 (latest available estimate). Yet there have been only three murders: two with knives (1984 and 1987) and one with a firearm (1997). After the law went into effect in 1982, crime against persons plummeted 74 percent compared to 1981, and fell another 45 percent in 1983 compared to 1982.

And it has stayed impressively low. In addition to nearly non-existent homicide (murders have averaged a mere 0.19 per year), the annual number of armed robberies, residential burglaries, commercial burglaries, and rapes have averaged, respectively, 1.69, 31.63, 19.75, and 2.00 through 1998.

With all the attention that has been heaped upon the lawful possession of firearms lately, you would think that a city that requires gun ownership would be the center of a media feeding frenzy. It isn't. The fact is I can't remember a major media outlet even mentioning Kennesaw. Can you?

The reason is obvious. Kennesaw proves that the presence of firearms actually improves safety and security. This is not the message that the media want us to hear. They want us to believe that guns are evil and are the cause of violence.
Gun Ownership Mandatory In Kennesaw, Georgia --- Crime Rate Plummets


I warmed up the seat in the corner for you....make yourself at home.
 
I took hansons article as an allegory. it seems to me that 'aversion' behavior modification works, we employ it far more than we probably realize. It appears to me that when you remove or allay responsibility, you usually get less of it.
 
First the story, then Victor Davis Hanson's analysis...

1. A woman found slain at a Hanford car wash this week was killed randomly when a 17-year-old gang member happened to see her while taking a walk, Hanford police said Thursday. Denise McVay was washing her car — something she did several times a week — early Tuesday morning before work. The teen was wandering the streets after leaving a party when he saw McVay at the Royal Car Wash on Garner Avenue at about 5 a.m. and decided to kill her, police said.

2. The teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night” and McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said. “It was a purely random act.” The teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat....the teen was covered with blood ...went with him to Visalia Mall, where the teen used McVay’s money to buy clean clothes...The teen, whose name was not released because of his age,... Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Hanson:
3. ...confused American society. First, note the discrepancy between the employed Ms. McVay — washing her car in the early morning hours on her way to work, apparently intent on having a clean automobile when she arrived — and the unidentified youth who, we are told at first, was “taking a walk,” later expanded into “wandering the streets after leaving a party.” How did we go so nonchalantly in a mere two paragraphs from “taking a walk” to “wandering the streets after leaving a party”?

4. Note, furthermore, that our society has no compunction about letting the world know the identity of Ms. Denise McVay, who was horribly murdered and left dead on the pavement of a car wash. But it is worried that we might learn the name of the “17-year-old gang member,” also known as an anonymous “teen.”

5. In the transition from a shame culture to a guilt culture, America has become a confused society that values the sensitivities of the felonious living far more than respect for the law-abiding dead.

6. Unfortunately, the story only becomes more depressing. We next read that the anonymous teen “simply wanted to kill somebody that night,” and, unfortunately, Ms. McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” So a Capt. Parker Sever goes on to characterize the fact that “the teen stabbed McVay several times and slit her throat” as “a purely random act.”

7. The law-enforcement officer, who no doubt means well, nonetheless describes a productive worker, striving to clean her car, as “in the wrong place at the wrong time.” ... Ms. McVay, in fact, was in the right place at the right time, and she should have had every expectation that that she could go to the car wash before work without worry that a murderous gang-banger would slit her throat.

8. What sort of abjectly amoral society have we become...Snapshot of a Sick Society - Victor Davis Hanson - National Review Online


If only this story had had a happy ending, along the lines of:

"Denise McVay, age 49, was washing her car at 5am, when she had occassion to put to use the training she had with her legally licensed .380 ACP, putting to an end the murderous rampage of an unnamed teen."

Amen.

I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.

Police call slaying of Hanford woman a random act
Posted at 6:04 p.m. on Thursday, July 28, 2011
By Paula Lloyd / The Fresno Bee

Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?

Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?

even for you, this is spectacularly stupid.

kudos
 
I agree this murder was horrible and senseless and most likely perpetrated by a sociopath who deserves to be locked away.

I find Hanson's analysis to be a bizarre reach.

First, I don't really find it necessary to wax on about why this sociopath was on the streets when he was. I doubt it was a deliberate editorial decision.

Secondly, McVay was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Nowhere in the Bee's documentation of the matter is she blamed for that. It's just one of those things people say when something horrible happen to try and mentally deal with the randomness and senselessness of such a thing. The sad fact in this case is that, if not McVay, it would have been someone else. The monster was apparently on a murderous rampage.

Finally, as for not releasing the name:

Hanson quotes the original article from the Fresno Bee from July 28th.



Loyd had no problem with naming the suspect, Jose Saldana, the next day after an arrest had been made.

Services set for slain Hanford woman – Fresno Bee | The Fresno News

Hilariously, Hanson's article is from yesterday. So he's whining that Loyd didn't name the suspect in the original article when before an arrest had been made but fails to mention that she named the suspect the next day? Is he just sloppy or dishonest?

I find the story sad.

I find Hanson's need to pimp it to cry about what he really wants to harp on, his perceived decline of our morals to be truly sick. As sick as he claims the rest of us are.

He's (laughably) part of the problem he whines about?

Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?

even for you, this is spectacularly stupid.

kudos

I've always suspected that a modicum of intelligence is required to have a sense of humor...
...I appreciate your validating that suspicion.
 
If the perp was white and the victim was black the story would be about a hate crime but since it doesn't mention race we can console ourselves with the fact that no hatred was involved.

Leave it to you to bring race into this issue, even though it has nothing to do with the original topic.

If you are going to be a douche bag, be a predictable douche bag, I suppose.
 
Well you didn't agree to my addendum....

So....can I assume that you won't subscribe to my idea to cut the TSA out of airport security: hand out guns to all passengers when they get on the plane, and collect 'em when they leave....

Oh, yeah...and you get double sky-miles if you pop one of the bad guys.....
good idea?

even for you, this is spectacularly stupid.

kudos

I've always suspected that a modicum of intelligence is required to have a sense of humor...
...I appreciate your validating that suspicion.

I guess I was thrown off by the set up where an innocent woman was butchered.

That was humor?

Work on it.
 
Anyone who knows how Hispanics feel about whites, knows this was not random.
 
McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said

Those words, that sentiment, is not just meaningless. It's intentionally meaningless. PoliticalChic nailed it in the OP and I think there is a not so subtle blaming of the victim going on, as though she were "struck by fate". As if she were hit by a meteor and not another human being.

She was the one in the right place at the right time. Good Lord to Capt. Sever: Where the fuck do you go when your car is dirty? Dairy Queen? The murderer was in the wrong place (planet Earth) at the wrong time (ever). He may as well have said "shit happens".

What a destructive and idiotic mentality.


/rant
 
McVay, 49, was “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” Capt. Parker Sever said

Those words, that sentiment, is not just meaningless. It's intentionally meaningless. PoliticalChic nailed it in the OP and I think there is a not so subtle blaming of the victim going on, as though she were "struck by fate". As if she were hit by a meteor and not another human being.

She was the one in the right place at the right time. Good Lord to Capt. Sever: Where the fuck do you go when your car is dirty? Dairy Queen? The murderer was in the wrong place (planet Earth) at the wrong time (ever). He may as well have said "shit happens".

What a destructive and idiotic mentality.


/rant

"...a not so subtle blaming of the victim going on, as though she were "struck by fate". As if she were hit by a meteor and not another human being."

President Eisenhower once, famously, said: "public opinion wins wars."

I believe that you have identified the nexus or Eisenhower's reference, and the deleterious effects that Hollywood (read 'Liberals') have had on society's attitude about crime...

In the 1949 seminal film, "Knock On Any Door," starring Humphrey Bogart and John Derek, a young (handsome) perp kills a police officer, and his lawyer (Bogart) has the jury wringing their hands over the terrible childhood of the perp.

It is worth seeing, and draw you own conclusions re: the view that society should make excuses for killers, and ignore the hole that they leave in the lives of those associated with the victim.
 
even for you, this is spectacularly stupid.

kudos

I've always suspected that a modicum of intelligence is required to have a sense of humor...
...I appreciate your validating that suspicion.

I guess I was thrown off by the set up where an innocent woman was butchered.

That was humor?

Work on it.

So...you pretty much bought the idea that I wanted to give guns out to all air passengers?

Just a question, the answer to which might verify my perceptions...how many times have you fallen for Lucy's football trick?
 
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