You seriously think that the Obama Jobs Bill with half the spending on infrastructure that the original stimulus had is going to create "MILLIONS" of jobs? Are you really that naive? Come on...use your head for something beside a place to put a hat.
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Mr. President,Here Are The 'Shovel-Ready Jobs' You Promised But Never Delivered...
- Thread starter paulitician
- Start date
You seriously think that the Obama Jobs Bill with half the spending on infrastructure that the original stimulus had is going to create "MILLIONS" of jobs? Are you really that naive? Come on...use your head for something beside a place to put a hat.
tinydancer
Diamond Member
I'm mildly surprised the state's rights conservatives around here want the federal government to roll over the states on this one.
The only state that has had any problem with this is Nebraska and being a heavy duty conservationist myself I agreed with Nebraska's position that the pipeline should not and could not be placed across this giant aquifer.
And as far as I know this issue is being worked out between the company and the state.
I have a problem with emminent domain issues as well but I have no doubt that those issues can be worked out as well.
But there is no reason on the planet why this can't begin to be built and provide really needed jobs right now.
And as far as the oilsands being dirty oil, it's bullshit.
In a speech to the Canadian Club in Toronto on September 23, 2011, Joe Oliver, Canada's Minister of Natural Resources, sharply criticized opponents of oil sands development and the pipeline, arguing that:
* The total area that has been affected by surface mining represents only 0.1% of Canada's boreal forest.
* The oil sands account for about 0.1% of global greenhouse-gas emissions.
* Electricity plants powered by coal in the U.S. generate almost 40 times more greenhouse-gas emissions than Canada's oil sands (the coal-fired electricity plants in the State of Wisconsin alone produce the equivalent of the entire GHG emissions of the oil sands.
* California bitumen is more GHG-intensive than the oil sands.
- Oct 7, 2011
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- Thread starter
- #43
Who benefits from this project? Really benefit? Big money benefit, Billions of dollars in profits benefits?
You know and to hell with 20,000 jobs. Why not the infrastructure Obama bill with MILLIONS of good jobs. Oh yeah no profits for the BIG business. Deny them the money Mr. President.
You seriously think that the Obama Jobs Bill with half the spending on infrastructure that the original stimulus had is going to create "MILLIONS" of jobs? Are you really that naive? Come on...use your head for something beside a place to put a hat.
I know i shouldn't be but i'm still shocked to see someone advocating Government spending even more Tax Dollars we don't have. Their 'Stimulus' cost Taxpayers roughly $250,000 per job created. That is a monstrous net loss for Taxpayers. This pipeline is a private-sector venture. We have to go forward with it. So let's just hope & pray the President and Democrats come around and work out this deal.
- Oct 7, 2011
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- #44
Doesn't look like it's really about the jobs for this President and Democrats. That was all Bullshit. It's only about their party. Can't possibly allow the Republicans to get any credit for creating these jobs. So they're perfectly willing to piss all these jobs away. Shame on them.
Most don't even realize Canada is your number one, numero uno supplier of oil.
AND Saskatchewan has no intention of invading the US and no one from Newfoundland is angry at American Tourism and is plotting to blow up any major building in the US and you don't see us jumping up and down in our toques burning American flags.
We're too busy ice fishing.
The most offensive thing I think we have ever done is exported Celine Dion. For that I extend my humblest of apologies. Just keeeeeeeding.
lol! Great points. Yea it would also lessen our dependence on Middle Eastern oil. And that's a big deal for me. This deal should have already been done. It's just all about politics now.
That's the sad part. People really need jobs and as I said in my other post, 20,000 jobs is just the beginning because those 20,000 pipeline workers need supplies, need coffee and donuts, need pizzas delivered, need housing and the list goes on.
Equipment needs to be purchased and transported and truckers and rail lines have to get this equipment to the pipeline sites.
It's a win win and as far as I know not one dime is coming from the American taxpayer. This is strictly a private venture.
And I think that is exactly what Obama doesn't like. What is HIS agenda anyway?
- Oct 7, 2011
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- Thread starter
- #46
Now at least we know this President and Democrats are full of shit when they claim it's about the jobs. It's really just about their party.
Who benefits from this project? Really benefit? Big money benefit, Billions of dollars in profits benefits?
You know and to hell with 20,000 jobs. Why not the infrastructure Obama bill with MILLIONS of good jobs. Oh yeah no profits for the BIG business. Deny them the money Mr. President.
We have more than enough workers on the Government payroll already. Government jobs cost several $Billions over many years. The Taxpayers have to pay for it all. Their "Stimulus" cost the Taxpayers an average of $250,000 per job created. That's a huge net-loss in the end. We just don't have the Taxpayer cash to throw around anymore. Isn't $16 Trillion in Debt enough? So the Public-Sector route has been exhausted.
The Private-Sector will have to pick up the slack. And this pipeline does that. There will be many jobs available for a lengthy period of time. You can scoff at 20,000 jobs if you want to,but trust me when i tell you Americans need them. And your number is a very low estimate. I've seen numbers much higher. This is not a time to be picky. We need to get Americans working. This deal can and should be done.
Most don't even realize Canada is your number one, numero uno supplier of oil.
AND Saskatchewan has no intention of invading the US and no one from Newfoundland is angry at American Tourism and is plotting to blow up any major building in the US and you don't see us jumping up and down in our toques burning American flags.
We're too busy ice fishing.
The most offensive thing I think we have ever done is exported Celine Dion. For that I extend my humblest of apologies. Just keeeeeeeding.
Come on. I Like Celine and wish my voice sounded like hers. LOL
The pipeline is a no brainer.
The ball is in Reids Court and if it doesn't pass I guess we will all be able to see just how unserious these idiots are about job creation.
Can any Repub explain why we need a pipeline from Canada to the Gulf Of Mexico - perhaps to make it easier to ship oil to China where Big Oil can make even MORE Profits?
People the purpose of The Keystone XL Pipeline is to make it possible for CANADA to sell oil to CHINA through the gulf of Mexico.
No one has been able to answer the question - How are working class Americans BENEFITING from this massive infringement on our Country, The Keystone XL Pipeline ?
The ones that will PROFIT immensely are two Foreign Countries, Big Oil and OUR Politicians - hardworking American people SCROOGED - Again !!
DON'T LET THIS HAPPEN !!
You know if Republicans are for it, it'll benefit Corporations at the cost of the American working class !!
People the purpose of The Keystone XL Pipeline is to make it possible for CANADA to sell oil to CHINA through the gulf of Mexico.
No one has been able to answer the question - How are working class Americans BENEFITING from this massive infringement on our Country, The Keystone XL Pipeline ?
The ones that will PROFIT immensely are two Foreign Countries, Big Oil and OUR Politicians - hardworking American people SCROOGED - Again !!
DON'T LET THIS HAPPEN !!
You know if Republicans are for it, it'll benefit Corporations at the cost of the American working class !!
Facts About The Keystone XL Pipeline:
To keep the pipeline running, electricity pump stations along the 1,700-mile stretch would have to step up production. That could lead to more expensive electricity costs for locals.
Also, any accident at the 450-mile-wide Ogallala Aquifer could be disastrous.
Landowners would be uprooted to build the pipeline. It's one thing for the government to use eminent domain to build a street or railroad for public use. But it's another thing for a foreign company to be granted that right for a private business purpose.
If you're a landowner, you're immediately going to be impacted by the fact that bulldozers came through and took out your landwhere you live and work.
According to TransCanada, Canadian oil shippers could use the pipeline to add up to $4 billion to U.S. fuel costs.
A letter to the FTC earlier this year, seven Canadian oil producer have already shown signs of having colluded to raise prices on gasoline for American consumers.
Building the KXL pipeline would also mean that we would be helping our county's biggest global competitor -- China -- meet its energy import needs at the expense of our own. Sounds like a great deal for China, but not such a good deal for the United States.
Yes, building the pipeline would be good for oil producers, which is why they are paying for the commercials.
And it would be good for the Chinese government, which is why they are buying the Canadian oil companies.
But it's the State Department's job to decide if this pipeline is in the best interests of regular Americans who don't work for oil companies and American businesses that need oil to operate.
And, from their perspective, it's not such a good deal.
To keep the pipeline running, electricity pump stations along the 1,700-mile stretch would have to step up production. That could lead to more expensive electricity costs for locals.
Also, any accident at the 450-mile-wide Ogallala Aquifer could be disastrous.
Landowners would be uprooted to build the pipeline. It's one thing for the government to use eminent domain to build a street or railroad for public use. But it's another thing for a foreign company to be granted that right for a private business purpose.
If you're a landowner, you're immediately going to be impacted by the fact that bulldozers came through and took out your landwhere you live and work.
According to TransCanada, Canadian oil shippers could use the pipeline to add up to $4 billion to U.S. fuel costs.
A letter to the FTC earlier this year, seven Canadian oil producer have already shown signs of having colluded to raise prices on gasoline for American consumers.
Building the KXL pipeline would also mean that we would be helping our county's biggest global competitor -- China -- meet its energy import needs at the expense of our own. Sounds like a great deal for China, but not such a good deal for the United States.
Yes, building the pipeline would be good for oil producers, which is why they are paying for the commercials.
And it would be good for the Chinese government, which is why they are buying the Canadian oil companies.
But it's the State Department's job to decide if this pipeline is in the best interests of regular Americans who don't work for oil companies and American businesses that need oil to operate.
And, from their perspective, it's not such a good deal.
*****From researched information,... the Keystone XL Pipeline facts... are these:
1) Canada Has OIL they want to market and sell.
2) Canada Knows they can CHARGE MORE for their oil if sold to other countries.
3) CHINA NEEDS OIL and they even bought several OIL PROPORTIES in Canada.
These TWO countries NEED a method of exporting Canadian Oil and MOVE it to a place where it can be EXPORTED to China.
Answer to that problem - MAKE A PIPELINE FROM CANADA THRU AMERICA to the GULF OF MEXICO !!!
From there it'll go on OIL BARGES and bye bye Americans...hello Chinese!!
That only leaves TWO questions - who'll PAY for it and.... what do AMERICANS GET for this pipeline through OUR Country and OUR Environment?
a 'possible" 20,000 Jobs? That's "TRICKLE DOWN SCRAPS"!!!
Americans have had enough of that !!
The ones making the MONEY, here in the United States, WILL BE THE POLITICIANS BOUGHT AND OWNED AND PAID by Big Oil to pass this law.
Watch and take notice of who votes for this law and YOU WILL KNOW whom TO VOTE "OUT" next election for protecting their "OWN INTERESTS" instead of COUNTRY AND PEOPLE !!
1) Canada Has OIL they want to market and sell.
2) Canada Knows they can CHARGE MORE for their oil if sold to other countries.
3) CHINA NEEDS OIL and they even bought several OIL PROPORTIES in Canada.
These TWO countries NEED a method of exporting Canadian Oil and MOVE it to a place where it can be EXPORTED to China.
Answer to that problem - MAKE A PIPELINE FROM CANADA THRU AMERICA to the GULF OF MEXICO !!!
From there it'll go on OIL BARGES and bye bye Americans...hello Chinese!!
That only leaves TWO questions - who'll PAY for it and.... what do AMERICANS GET for this pipeline through OUR Country and OUR Environment?
a 'possible" 20,000 Jobs? That's "TRICKLE DOWN SCRAPS"!!!
Americans have had enough of that !!
The ones making the MONEY, here in the United States, WILL BE THE POLITICIANS BOUGHT AND OWNED AND PAID by Big Oil to pass this law.
Watch and take notice of who votes for this law and YOU WILL KNOW whom TO VOTE "OUT" next election for protecting their "OWN INTERESTS" instead of COUNTRY AND PEOPLE !!
- Oct 7, 2011
- 38,401
- 4,162
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- Thread starter
- #51
Facts About The Keystone XL Pipeline:
To keep the pipeline running, electricity pump stations along the 1,700-mile stretch would have to step up production. That could lead to more expensive electricity costs for locals.
Also, any accident at the 450-mile-wide Ogallala Aquifer could be disastrous.
Landowners would be uprooted to build the pipeline. It's one thing for the government to use eminent domain to build a street or railroad for public use. But it's another thing for a foreign company to be granted that right for a private business purpose.
If you're a landowner, you're immediately going to be impacted by the fact that bulldozers came through and took out your landwhere you live and work.
According to TransCanada, Canadian oil shippers could use the pipeline to add up to $4 billion to U.S. fuel costs.
A letter to the FTC earlier this year, seven Canadian oil producer have already shown signs of having colluded to raise prices on gasoline for American consumers.
Building the KXL pipeline would also mean that we would be helping our county's biggest global competitor -- China -- meet its energy import needs at the expense of our own. Sounds like a great deal for China, but not such a good deal for the United States.
Yes, building the pipeline would be good for oil producers, which is why they are paying for the commercials.
And it would be good for the Chinese government, which is why they are buying the Canadian oil companies.
But it's the State Department's job to decide if this pipeline is in the best interests of regular Americans who don't work for oil companies and American businesses that need oil to operate.
And, from their perspective, it's not such a good deal.
Why do you hate good-paying jobs for Americans? So what if Canada makes some money? We'll make some money too and many American workers will have good-paying jobs for a lengthy period of time. And we'll lessen our oil dependence on other foreign nations who hate us. All created jobs cannot be Government jobs. The Taxpayers just can't afford that anymore. The Private-Sector has to now pick up the slack. These really are the 'Shovel-Ready Jobs' this President promised. So why take these jobs away from Americans? It's time for this President and Democrats to quit playing political games and get this deal done. The People need these jobs.
Are you Repukes kidding me?Oh my gosh! Why in the world would Obama block this pipeline and the jobs? It makes no sense! he's a fucking job killer! Surely.....every one of those 20,00o people and the union thugs who support them will become ardent Obama supporters after they are forced to take government handouts and become dependent on the liberals to keep the handouts coming! It is all a great conspiracy!
If the Prez were to say to Americans... "guess what... we're gonna let Canada and China build a massive toxic tar sand oil pipeline straight through the middle of our country and if you landowners don't agree, we'll evoke Eminent Domain and take your land.... and those locals affected, will have to pay higher energy costs to keep this thing running....
oh and if and when it leaks, you're pretty much screwed"...
The GOP would be clamoring for his head on a silver platter and the electorate would be up in arms over this!!
But those gullible and zombified by right wing media don't even question this massive trampling on our country for, to and from CHINA !!
Gas prices: Keystone XL will increase gas prices for Americans—Especially Farmers
Jobs: TransCanada’s jobs projections are vastly inflated.
A rupture in the Keystone XL pipeline could cause a BP style oil spill in America’s heartland, over the source of fresh drinking water for 2 million people. NASA’s top climate scientist says that fully developing the tar sands in Canada would mean “essentially game over” for the climate.
Keystone XL is the fuse to North America’s biggest carbon bomb.
Jobs: TransCanada’s jobs projections are vastly inflated.
A rupture in the Keystone XL pipeline could cause a BP style oil spill in America’s heartland, over the source of fresh drinking water for 2 million people. NASA’s top climate scientist says that fully developing the tar sands in Canada would mean “essentially game over” for the climate.
Keystone XL is the fuse to North America’s biggest carbon bomb.
Facts About The Keystone XL Pipeline:
To keep the pipeline running, electricity pump stations along the 1,700-mile stretch would have to step up production. That could lead to more expensive electricity costs for locals.
Also, any accident at the 450-mile-wide Ogallala Aquifer could be disastrous.
Landowners would be uprooted to build the pipeline. It's one thing for the government to use eminent domain to build a street or railroad for public use. But it's another thing for a foreign company to be granted that right for a private business purpose.
If you're a landowner, you're immediately going to be impacted by the fact that bulldozers came through and took out your landwhere you live and work.
According to TransCanada, Canadian oil shippers could use the pipeline to add up to $4 billion to U.S. fuel costs.
A letter to the FTC earlier this year, seven Canadian oil producer have already shown signs of having colluded to raise prices on gasoline for American consumers.
Building the KXL pipeline would also mean that we would be helping our county's biggest global competitor -- China -- meet its energy import needs at the expense of our own. Sounds like a great deal for China, but not such a good deal for the United States.
Yes, building the pipeline would be good for oil producers, which is why they are paying for the commercials.
And it would be good for the Chinese government, which is why they are buying the Canadian oil companies.
But it's the State Department's job to decide if this pipeline is in the best interests of regular Americans who don't work for oil companies and American businesses that need oil to operate.
And, from their perspective, it's not such a good deal.
The pipeline won't be going through the aquifer though.
And how about links to these "facts"?
- Oct 7, 2011
- 38,401
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- 1,130
- Thread starter
- #55
Are you Repukes kidding me?Oh my gosh! Why in the world would Obama block this pipeline and the jobs? It makes no sense! he's a fucking job killer! Surely.....every one of those 20,00o people and the union thugs who support them will become ardent Obama supporters after they are forced to take government handouts and become dependent on the liberals to keep the handouts coming! It is all a great conspiracy!
If the Prez were to say to Americans... "guess what... we're gonna let Canada and China build a massive toxic tar sand oil pipeline straight through the middle of our country and if you landowners don't agree, we'll evoke Eminent Domain and take your land.... and those locals affected, will have to pay higher energy costs to keep this thing running....
oh and if and when it leaks, you're pretty much screwed"...
The GOP would be clamoring for his head on a silver platter and the electorate would be up in arms over this!!
But those gullible and zombified by right wing media don't even question this massive trampling on our country for, to and from CHINA !!
You've only regurgitated a whole lot of one-sided biased propaganda. So you haven't swayed anyone. The fact is this pipeline will create thousands & thousands of good-paying American Jobs. Who cares if Canada turns a profit? We will too. And it sure beats pissing away more $Billions on depending on oil from foreign nations who hate us. If this pipeline even lessens that dependence just a little,it will be a huge success. If this President and Democrats really care about jobs,they'll work this deal out. I guess we'll see though.
TransCanadas jobs projections are vastly inflated.Are you Repukes kidding me?Oh my gosh! Why in the world would Obama block this pipeline and the jobs? It makes no sense! he's a fucking job killer! Surely.....every one of those 20,00o people and the union thugs who support them will become ardent Obama supporters after they are forced to take government handouts and become dependent on the liberals to keep the handouts coming! It is all a great conspiracy!
If the Prez were to say to Americans... "guess what... we're gonna let Canada and China build a massive toxic tar sand oil pipeline straight through the middle of our country and if you landowners don't agree, we'll evoke Eminent Domain and take your land.... and those locals affected, will have to pay higher energy costs to keep this thing running....
oh and if and when it leaks, you're pretty much screwed"...
The GOP would be clamoring for his head on a silver platter and the electorate would be up in arms over this!!
But those gullible and zombified by right wing media don't even question this massive trampling on our country for, to and from CHINA !!
You've only regurgitated a whole lot of one-sided biased propaganda. So you haven't swayed anyone. The fact is this pipeline will create thousands & thousands of good-paying American Jobs. Who cares if Canada turns a profit? We will too. And it sure beats pissing away more $Billions on depending on oil from foreign nations who hate us. If this pipeline even lessens that dependence just a little,it will be a huge success. If this President and Democrats really care about jobs,they'll work this deal out. I guess we'll see though.
In 2008, TransCanadas Presidential Permit application for Keystone XL to the State Department indicated a peak workforce of approximately 3,500 to 4,200 construction personnel to build the pipeline.
Jobs estimates above those listed in its application draw from a 2011 report commissioned by TransCanada that estimates 20,000 person-years of employment based on a non-public forecast model using undisclosed inputs provided by TransCanada.
According to TransCanadas own data, just 11% of the construction jobs on the Keystone I pipeline in South Dakota were filled by South Dakotansmost of them for temporary, low-paying manual labor.
Amalgamated Transit Union (ATU) and the Transport Workers Union (TWU) both oppose the pipeline. Their August 2011 statement: We need jobs, but not ones based on increasing our reliance on Tar Sands oil. There is no shortage of water and sewage pipelines that need to be fixed or replaced, bridges and tunnels that are in need of emergency repair, transportation infrastructure that needs to be renewed and developed. Many jobs could also be created in energy conservation, upgrading the grid, maintaining and expanding public transportationjobs that can help us reduce air pollution, greenhouse gas emissions, and improve energy efficiency.
More Information:
Transcanadas Exaggerated Jobs Claims for KeystoneXL National Wildlife Federation
tarsandsaction.org/spread-the-word/key-facts-keystone-xl/
Don't see no "facts" there. Just opinion. And since the pipeline is being rerouted it isn't even current.
Here are some real facts.
Amaya Tune, a spokeswoman for the A.F.L.-C.I.O., said the labor federation had not taken a position on the pipeline legislation. But some of its affiliates — including the building and construction trades department of the A.F.L.-C.I.O., the Laborers’ International Union of North America and the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers — strongly support the pipeline.
In a recent advertisement, they said: “America’s trade unionists are the safest, best-trained and most environmentally responsible workers in the world. They can do the job right, and that’s why we back the Keystone XL pipeline 100 percent.”
At a public hearing last week, David Barnett, a spokesman for the plumbers and pipefitters union, told Congress that the pipeline could “generate a tremendous number of well-paying jobs” for construction workers, who have experienced extraordinarily high levels of unemployment in the past few years.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/10/us/politics/pipeline-project-tacked-onto-gop-tax-relief-bill.html
Amaya Tune, a spokeswoman for the A.F.L.-C.I.O., said the labor federation had not taken a position on the pipeline legislation. But some of its affiliates — including the building and construction trades department of the A.F.L.-C.I.O., the Laborers’ International Union of North America and the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers — strongly support the pipeline.
In a recent advertisement, they said: “America’s trade unionists are the safest, best-trained and most environmentally responsible workers in the world. They can do the job right, and that’s why we back the Keystone XL pipeline 100 percent.”
At a public hearing last week, David Barnett, a spokesman for the plumbers and pipefitters union, told Congress that the pipeline could “generate a tremendous number of well-paying jobs” for construction workers, who have experienced extraordinarily high levels of unemployment in the past few years.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/10/us/politics/pipeline-project-tacked-onto-gop-tax-relief-bill.html
- Oct 7, 2011
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- Thread starter
- #60
tarsandsaction.org/spread-the-word/key-facts-keystone-xl/
Don't see no "facts" there. Just opinion. And since the pipeline is being rerouted it isn't even current.
Just propaganda. The Democrats are holding these jobs up just for politics. They can't possibly allow the Republicans to get any credit for creating these jobs. They would rather piss them all away than let that happen. It's not about pleasing their far Left 'Global Warming' base like some have suggested either. This President routinely screws them over. He knows they're pretty ignorant and have no one else to support. He just laughs at them at this point. So it's not about that. It's about 'Party before Country.' That's all it is.
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