Moving beyond "fair"...

Discussion in 'Politics' started by VaYank5150, Nov 14, 2012.

  1. VaYank5150
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    VaYank5150 Gold Member

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    I have always been against offering a path to citizenship for illegal aliens. However, since the mid Bush years, we (US Government) have been trying to build a fence between the US and Mexico and we apparently are too inept to even accomplish that.

    This being said, while I still believe it is unfair to all those who have attempted to follow our rules to gain citizenship, if we truly do have +/- 12 million illegals working in this country, would we be better off getting them legalized and paying income taxes? Assuming at least SOME of the people employing illegals are also dodging payroll taxes, the possible revenue stream could be incredible and oh by the way, we could use the money.

    I am not sure how to feel on this issue anymore. Does our current debt and the need to decrease it outweigh what is "right" and/or "fair"?
     
  2. VaYank5150
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    VaYank5150 Gold Member

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    No opinions?
     
  3. jwoodie
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    jwoodie Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Fairness does not need to be compromised in order to address this problem. Under current law, persons who have entered the US illegally must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for a visa. Because this is an impractical option for these people, many of whom have lived in the U.S. for decades and have U.S. born children, an equivalent alternative should be established: Instead of returning to their home countries, these people should be given the option of proving self-support, without eligibility for public social services, for the same 10 years before being granted permanent visas.
     
  4. VaYank5150
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    VaYank5150 Gold Member

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    So....we have to wait 10 more years before they start paying income tax?
     
  5. martybegan
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    martybegan Gold Member

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    No they get to pay income taxes, but they cannot go on the dole for 10 years. If they need support, they can get it in thier own country.
     
  6. VaYank5150
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    VaYank5150 Gold Member

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    And would this plan ensure they paid taxes, at least as much as the IRS can force an actual US citizen to pay taxes? Will this fix the problem of employers paying them under the table since they are undocumented?
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2012
  7. AmyNation
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    AmyNation Road Warrior Supporting Member

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    I read a study that suggested that we have more illegals here on expired VISAs then we do from crossing the border illegally.

    We needed to be realistic about illegals. "self deportation" is not realistic. I would be for offering a path to citizenship to those already here, if it was actually coupled with immigration reform, including

    secure borders
    deporting people whose visas have expired
    granting more work visas to employers who need them
    reforming the way we process visa/citizenship applications because as it stands now, it can take years and you usually have to have a nice size bank account.
     
  8. jwoodie
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    jwoodie Gold Member Supporting Member

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    They would would have to pay FIT and SS taxes and would have to establish 40 qualifying quarters of SS earnings WITHOUT accruing any SS benefits from these quarters.

    Also, they would be required to register for temporary visas; those who didn't would be deported and return after deportation would be made a felony.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2012
  9. martybegan
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    martybegan Gold Member

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    Yes they register, and they get a form of limited work visa, with the limit being they have to be working.

    They work, they stay, no work? bye bye.

    Another path I would allow would be service. You spend 5 years in a public work corps. doing whatever we can think up of. At the end you get your green card, a stipend, you hopefully speak english fluently, and you have a useable skill.
     
  10. nodoginnafight
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    nodoginnafight No Party Affiliation

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    My immigration plan is based purely on pragmatism.
    They are here.
    They are not going anywhere.
    We need the money.

    So I propose that we offer - for a limited time - that those who would like to become U.S. Citizens agree to pay a fine. No number set yet - but my position is that it shouldn't be so high that they just stay underground. I'm in favor of the fine because NOT to invoke at least some penalty is a slap in the face to those who made the sacrifices necessary to do it the right way.

    As long as they are paying down the fine, they can have a work visa. When the fine is paid off - they can apply for citizenship.

    We use the money collected from the fines to secure our borders against terrorist infiltration and to make sure we don't find ourselves in this same boat in 30 years.

    Just MHO
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2012

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