Most importantly we need to create jobs, increasing taxes helps attain that how?

[Mr. Shaman]

The only thing you taught me with that mindless bloviating is that I need to open my ignore list and add you to it....goodbye

See what I mean folks?? Cons are clueless and dumb fucks who chose to remain that way. It isn't acknowledgement or comprehension of issues we are dealing with here, it is a refusal to recognize facts due to being cowards of responsibility. Yes, indeed, put me on your "Ignore the Truth" list you cowardly asshole. Pretty soon you will be down to sucking your own cock instead of mine.............

On the contrary you idiot. I made a topic about taxes and you go on an unrelated I'm smarter than thou rant. So Fuck you

 

[Mr. Shaman]

As far as corporations sitting on money your right. But why? Could it be the fear of the massive regulations? Could it be fear that obamas policies are going to have negative impacts on the economy as a whole?

I'll give you one example of jobs lost because of fear.... I am willing and able to buy another company truck. It's about a 50k investment. I have the money but am scared to death to spend it because I don't feel confident that I will have enough work through the next year to justify the investment.

Now do you consider me one of those evil and greedy business men?

I find it interesting you talk about fear of regulation, then use an example that is a demand-side problem. Basically, you confirmed what I've been saying for a while, which is that businesses are not expanding due to low sales and not due to fear of regulations.

I believe both of those factors are tied together at the hip so to speak so were both right. Having said that I currently have the demand upon me but I fear I won't in the future.

 

[Nic_Driver]

Increasing taxes doesn't create jobs other than government jobs which do nothing for the economy, lowering taxes allows businesses to create jobs. we need to cut spending not raise taxes.

MikeFrank,

That mistake is a consequence of believing the propaganda put forth by Beck, Hannity, Limbaugh, et al. The fact is raising taxes on the rich is precisely how FDR was able to lift America out of the Great Depression and put it on the road to prosperity.

More specifically it was done by implementing a number of public works projects which put millions of Americans to work and gave rise to many productive new manufacturing and service industries. The effect was referred to as "priming the pump." It led to the most prosperous three decades in our history. And increasing taxes on the rich didn't make them poor -- it simply made them less rich. They still could afford the best of everything and lead lives of opulent leisure.

So when you hear the right-wing propagandists spewing their deceptive nonsense, keep in mind that every one of them is a multi-millionaire and is being paid very well to lie to you.

MikeK, we can also look at the track record of tax cuts and job creation to see that it is a failed policy.

If tax breaks create jobs, where are all the jobs?

 

[Mr. Shaman]

I believe both of those factors are tied together at the hip so to speak so were both right.

Actually, no. Unless you can point out a policy Obama has implemented or will soon that will negatively effect demand for your company.

Hidden within the healthcare bill was a regulation that required every transaction over 600 dollars to be followed with a report detailing the transaction.

If you can't point-out....

WHICH One

.....that makes you a fuckin' liar.

You're on-the-clock.....

<tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick><tick>...

​

 

[Wiseacre]

Kinda monopolizing the thread Shaman? I appreciate your right to post your views, but geez, this is ridiculous. Get a grip dude.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

I believe both of those factors are tied together at the hip so to speak so were both right.

Actually, no. Unless you can point out a policy Obama has implemented or will soon that will negatively effect demand for your company.

I already explained it to you. Seems you opted to ignore the logic of my explanation.
So one last time...

Business plans include two things

1) present revenue
2) anticipated future costs

why?

Becuase it is todays revenue that will fund the future costs.

Now...what do we have today?

Lower revenue and talk of an increase in costs (healthcare, cap and trade, oil pirce increases)

"No GUARANTEES I'll succeed??!!!!"
​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Please explain to me how raising taxes is going to help create jobs.

Easing taxes and regulations can help to create jobs which in turn will broaden the tax base which will increase revenue.

So again explain the path from raising taxes to jobs for me please.

One very positive way is the way both FDR and Eisenhower did it, which is by creating necessary make-work projects, such as the CCC (Civilian Construction Corps - per FDR), by infrastructure repair and expansion and by highway construction (Eisenhower). These projects created millions of jobs, which fostered and expanded many vibrant industries and in turn generated income tax revenue from the newly employed workers.

Sorry, but......much like Education.....there are no obvious short-term-profits, available, thru such ventures.

What kind o' 'Merican ARE you??????

​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

&#9632;Treasury Department figures show that actual corporate income tax revenues fell to $132 billion in 2003, down 36 percent from $207 billion in 2000.
&#9632;As a result of these low levels, corporate revenues in 2003 represented only 1.2 percent of the Gross Domestic Product (the basic measure of the size of the economy), the lowest level since 1983, the year in which corporate receipts plummeted to levels last seen in the 1930s.
&#9632;Corporate revenues represented only 7.4 percent of all federal tax receipts in 2003. With the exception of 1983, this represents the lowest level on record (these data go back to 1934).

The Decline of Corporate Income Tax Revenues &mdash; Center on Budget and Policy Priorities


Notice that taxes for corporations have steadily declined and yet they have not produced the jobs that the republicans claim that lower taxes will create.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

We have the lowest taxes in 60 years at least and it's not creating jobs.

Now explain how cutting government spending will help create jobs. Explain how cutting, for example, the number of defense contracts the Pentagon spends billions on,

to private businesses in the US,

will create more, instead of fewer, jobs at those businesses.

There is NO job creating path to fiscal responsibility, getting rid of the deficit, balancing the budget, paying down the debt.

None. Period. Austerity hurts. Period. Stop pretending it doesn't.

thats the whole point.
One issue has nothig to do with another.

The debt is one problem
Unemployment is another.

So our goal should be to solve one without having a negative affect on the other.....IF WE CAN.

And that is what the debate should be about.

The real solutions are politically toxic.

DECEMBER 2, 2010

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq1zpHF0J04]YouTube - &#x202a;Sen Bernie Sanders Amazing Speech DEC 02 2010 .flv&#x202c;&rlm;[/ame]​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Too bad all those shovel ready jobs we were told about weren't really shovel ready. It's just like everything else, all concept and no management.

It's been said many times, we don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem. We also have a recession problem, the economy is stagnating and Obama's policies are suffocating any chance of real growth.

Yeah....right.....the high-roller$ need more tax-cuts.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Too bad all those shovel ready jobs we were told about weren't really shovel ready. It's just like everything else, all concept and no management.

It's been said many times, we don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem. We also have a recession problem, the economy is stagnating and Obama's policies are suffocating any chance of real growth. Great, we get 3% growth in GDP then down below 2%, that ain't no way to convince people to take a chance on a new business or expand an existing one. Ever increasing regulations, higher HC and energy costs, executive branch agencies like the EPA and NLRB enacting policies that kill jobs, and a president that badmouths business from day 1.

You know what'll happen when you raise taxes on the rich? The dems will try to spend it on some redistribution program that won't work. They don't care about debt reduction and reducing the deficits, never have and never will. For them it's all about social democracy, an ever bigger government and safety net that gets them more votes in the next election. To be fair, the GOP went down that road with Bush43, and there are still some repubs in congress who would gladly return to those days. But I'm thinking their days are numbered, and the GOP is not going to repeat the mistakes made earlier in this decade. At least I hope not.

We have a revenue problem.

Clinton left Bush with a balanced budget.

Bush cut taxes and raised spending on two useless wars.

We need to repeal the Bush tax cuts and stop the military occupations.

Clinton did not.. he ran a deficit EVERY year he was in office. He left a $5.8 trillion deficit.

That's what Porky Limbaugh said, huh??

​

 

[Neotrotsky]

Truth is hard for the Left


Gasoline Taxes Per Gallon Are Almost 7 Times ExxonMobil's Profit: 48 cents vs. 7 cents for QI

CBO: Obamacare = at least $109 Billion in Deficit Spending Over 10 Years; UPDATE: Former CBO Director: Obamacare Deficit will be $562 Billion over 10 years

 

[Neotrotsky]

 

[Neotrotsky]

The Left has nothing to offer except poor attemps at class warfare; of course, no one is buying it
Believe me, if they could use the "race card" on this, they would. But then the Left is so desperate, they may try yet.

Charles Krauthammer

He himself, as we just heard, said you can&#8217;t reduce the deficit to the levels we need without raising revenues. Then he talks about the [tax break for] corporate jets, which he mentioned not once but six times.

I did the math on this. If you collect the corporate jet tax every year for the next 5,000 years, you will cover one year of the debt that Obama has run up. One year.

To put it another way, if you started collecting that tax at the time of John the Baptist and you collected it every year &#8212; first in shekels and now in dollars &#8212; you wouldn&#8217;t be halfway to covering one year of the amount of debt that Obama has run up.

As for the other one, he mentions again and again, the oil depreciation tax break &#8212; if you collect that one for 700 years, you won&#8217;t cover a year of Obama deficits.

And then here&#8217;s my favorite. I worked it out in the car on the way here. If you collect the corporate jets and the oil tax together &#8212; get all the bad guys and the fat cats at once &#8212; and you collect it for 100 years, it covers the amount of debt Obama added&#8230; in February!

And he pretends that he&#8217;s the serious adult at the table.​

As you can see the Left and Papa Obama's "math skills" are very poor.

It is not like the Left can run on Papa Obama's record
What give us 4 more years of this .....

By almost any measure you can name, the U.S. economy has gotten much worse since Papa Obama became president.
Of course it is pretty obvious by now that Papa Obama and the Left are completely clueless when it comes to free market economics.

 

[ABikerSailor]

If we'd get rid of the tax loopholes and tax cuts for the uber wealthy and corporations, then we could use that revenue to fix bridges and roads. Wanna talk job creation that would actually make a difference? There it is.

Besides............most of us poor schmucks pay anywhere from 28 to 32 percent of our income in taxes. Wanna know what the corporations paid? 21 percent all the way down to 7 percent.

Wanna tell me how that is fair to the average American?

 

[Nic_Driver]

The Left has nothing to offer except poor attemps at class warfare; of course, no one is buying it
Believe me, if they could use the "race card" on this, they would. But then the Left is so desperate, they may try yet.

Charles Krauthammer

He himself, as we just heard, said you can’t reduce the deficit to the levels we need without raising revenues. Then he talks about the [tax break for] corporate jets, which he mentioned not once but six times.

I did the math on this. If you collect the corporate jet tax every year for the next 5,000 years, you will cover one year of the debt that Obama has run up. One year.

To put it another way, if you started collecting that tax at the time of John the Baptist and you collected it every year — first in shekels and now in dollars — you wouldn’t be halfway to covering one year of the amount of debt that Obama has run up.

As for the other one, he mentions again and again, the oil depreciation tax break — if you collect that one for 700 years, you won’t cover a year of Obama deficits.

And then here’s my favorite. I worked it out in the car on the way here. If you collect the corporate jets and the oil tax together — get all the bad guys and the fat cats at once — and you collect it for 100 years, it covers the amount of debt Obama added… in February!

And he pretends that he’s the serious adult at the table.​

As you can see the Left and Papa Obama's "math skills" are very poor.

It is not like the Left can run on Papa Obama's record
What give us 4 more years of this .....

By almost any measure you can name, the U.S. economy has gotten much worse since Papa Obama became president.
Of course it is pretty obvious by now that Papa Obama and the Left are completely clueless when it comes to free market economics.

I love it when the right tries to use "class warfare" as a deterrent argument.


Which class is winning and who started attacking whom first?


It's time the middle class started to defend themselves against the GOP attack.

 

[Neotrotsky]

The Left has nothing to offer except poor attemps at class warfare; of course, no one is buying it
Believe me, if they could use the "race card" on this, they would. But then the Left is so desperate, they may try yet.

Charles Krauthammer

He himself, as we just heard, said you can’t reduce the deficit to the levels we need without raising revenues. Then he talks about the [tax break for] corporate jets, which he mentioned not once but six times.

I did the math on this. If you collect the corporate jet tax every year for the next 5,000 years, you will cover one year of the debt that Obama has run up. One year.

To put it another way, if you started collecting that tax at the time of John the Baptist and you collected it every year — first in shekels and now in dollars — you wouldn’t be halfway to covering one year of the amount of debt that Obama has run up.

As for the other one, he mentions again and again, the oil depreciation tax break — if you collect that one for 700 years, you won’t cover a year of Obama deficits.

And then here’s my favorite. I worked it out in the car on the way here. If you collect the corporate jets and the oil tax together — get all the bad guys and the fat cats at once — and you collect it for 100 years, it covers the amount of debt Obama added… in February!

And he pretends that he’s the serious adult at the table.​

As you can see the Left and Papa Obama's "math skills" are very poor.

It is not like the Left can run on Papa Obama's record
What give us 4 more years of this .....

By almost any measure you can name, the U.S. economy has gotten much worse since Papa Obama became president.
Of course it is pretty obvious by now that Papa Obama and the Left are completely clueless when it comes to free market economics.

I love it when the right tries to use "class warfare" as a deterrent argument.


Which class is winning and who started attacking whom first?


It's time the middle class started to defend themselves against the GOP attack.

Yes of course

seeing the success of Papa Obama's policies the middle class should be very happy


Jobs Picture Gets Even Worse as Rate Swells to 9.2%

I guess some people are just not appreciative ....

 

[Neotrotsky]

If we'd get rid of the tax loopholes and tax cuts for the uber wealthy and corporations, then we could use that revenue to fix bridges and roads. Wanna talk job creation that would actually make a difference? There it is.

Besides............most of us poor schmucks pay anywhere from 28 to 32 percent of our income in taxes. Wanna know what the corporations paid? 21 percent all the way down to 7 percent.

Wanna tell me how that is fair to the average American?

You could take all the money from people making over 250,000/year, it would not help.

Perhaps, we need a new way to get money from the Chinese instead of borrowing

 

[Jarhead]

If we'd get rid of the tax loopholes and tax cuts for the uber wealthy and corporations, then we could use that revenue to fix bridges and roads. Wanna talk job creation that would actually make a difference? There it is.

Besides............most of us poor schmucks pay anywhere from 28 to 32 percent of our income in taxes. Wanna know what the corporations paid? 21 percent all the way down to 7 percent.

Wanna tell me how that is fair to the average American?

you make it sound like the owners pay that 7 to 21 percent.

They pay tax on their income just like the rest of us.

Whatever is left over is not theirs....it goes back into the company...and if anyone takes it out, it is taxed as income just like anyone else.

Maybe becuase you are a poor schmuck, you have no idea what it is like to own a business...

But when you do own a business, the taxable money is NOT YOURS you freaking moron.

 

[ABikerSailor]

If we'd get rid of the tax loopholes and tax cuts for the uber wealthy and corporations, then we could use that revenue to fix bridges and roads. Wanna talk job creation that would actually make a difference? There it is.

Besides............most of us poor schmucks pay anywhere from 28 to 32 percent of our income in taxes. Wanna know what the corporations paid? 21 percent all the way down to 7 percent.

Wanna tell me how that is fair to the average American?

you make it sound like the owners pay that 7 to 21 percent.

They pay tax on their income just like the rest of us.

Whatever is left over is not theirs....it goes back into the company...and if anyone takes it out, it is taxed as income just like anyone else.

Maybe becuase you are a poor schmuck, you have no idea what it is like to own a business...

But when you do own a business, the taxable money is NOT YOURS you freaking moron.

Hey stupid........I stated that some of the uber wealthy were paying less as well. Not at the rate of corporations, but according to stats, they're paying around 20 to 25 percent, which is STILL 10 to 5 percent LESS than me.

See.........I don't make enough money for the loopholes.