More bitter/disgusting: December '04 liberals vs December '12 conservatives?

[CrusaderFrank]

If they lived in a country where the average income was $100, they's riot over someone making $105, oh and g5000 would blame it on "Conservatives"

 

[nodoginnafight]

"For we, the people, understand that our country cannot succeed when a shrinking few do very well and a growing many barely make it."

You now that's Socialism, right? He's openly embraced Socialism right there. Is demonization of success people an American principal, is that grounded in our Founding?

And for the deficit, the same guy who set out a radical Liberal Agenda and promised to cut the deficit in half 4 years ago, now refuses to pass a budget or act like an adult at all regarding the budget... promises to cut the deficit again. The checks in the mail, Rube

See - just keeps moving the goalposts when he is disproven.
There is no logic or reason to this dissent - just blind hatred.

You're as loony as any of the other Obamaroids on here. He openly embraced collectivism in his speech and you won't see it.

You claimed he didn't say something that he clearly did.
Caught in that lie, you just try to ignore it and try to conjure up some misdirection (which is yet another lie).

And refusing to ignore that fact makes me an "Obamaroid"????

When you find yourself in a hole .... stop digging dude.

btw - who have been the "hateful" and "bitter" posters who name-call and try to insult others?????

 

[yidnar]

The bitterness, nastiness and outright hatred of the far right...and even moderate right...since the November election has been unbelievable, but not that unexpected. They are acting as if the grocery store shelves are empty; As if the Super Bowl got canceled by executive order; As if we are gassing puppies; As if we have banned sunshine or something.

It aint that bad. It wasnt that bad under Bush. And it aint that bad under Obama.

The problem is the crazy partisans. They mostly dont live much life outside their little bubble of wakeup/home-to-work-to-home/bedtime, and the cable TV and talk radio that fills those (-) slash marks I used. They get the usual daily stresses that most people on Earth have: How to keep food, shelter, clothing on their family's slate in life. Historically, people have always wanted that.

Government has a role in society to simply provide a canvas for people to make what they make of their own lives. That cost a price: Taxes. But after that is paid, we can live a pretty damn awesome life, in a damn awesome country.

But when you really calm down and look at it all, its a pretty great deal. As long as we are paying $5 for a cup of coffee at Starbucks (rather than the $1 gas station alternative across the street) and spending $20 for a movie (rather than read a free book) then we cant bitch that much about life in America.



SO I ASK.........which group of bitter, unrealistic crybabies is the worst: 2004 Democrat/liberals, or 2012-present day GOP conservatives? Both are full of shit alarmists who need to take stock of how great they actually have it.

your leader is the cause of this division.

 

[nodoginnafight]

The bitterness, nastiness and outright hatred of the far right...and even moderate right...since the November election has been unbelievable, but not that unexpected. They are acting as if the grocery store shelves are empty; As if the Super Bowl got canceled by executive order; As if we are gassing puppies; As if we have banned sunshine or something.

It aint that bad. It wasnt that bad under Bush. And it aint that bad under Obama.

The problem is the crazy partisans. They mostly dont live much life outside their little bubble of wakeup/home-to-work-to-home/bedtime, and the cable TV and talk radio that fills those (-) slash marks I used. They get the usual daily stresses that most people on Earth have: How to keep food, shelter, clothing on their family's slate in life. Historically, people have always wanted that.

Government has a role in society to simply provide a canvas for people to make what they make of their own lives. That cost a price: Taxes. But after that is paid, we can live a pretty damn awesome life, in a damn awesome country.

But when you really calm down and look at it all, its a pretty great deal. As long as we are paying $5 for a cup of coffee at Starbucks (rather than the $1 gas station alternative across the street) and spending $20 for a movie (rather than read a free book) then we cant bitch that much about life in America.



SO I ASK.........which group of bitter, unrealistic crybabies is the worst: 2004 Democrat/liberals, or 2012-present day GOP conservatives? Both are full of shit alarmists who need to take stock of how great they actually have it.

your leader is the cause of this division.

"He turned me into an asshole because I hate him soooooo much."

Yeah, it was the Jews fault for provoking Hitler too, huh?

 

[jillian]

They started out that way.

I think they are born that way..
they are ugly when they lose and it seems they are more ugly when they win..not a gracious or humble bone in their body

more irony...

I've enjoyed watching people like frank and you run around crying about how Obama stole the election, about how he wasn't born here and should be kicked out.

Oh remember how up till the election you touted how he was going to be removed by Romney? How many times you ended your posts with how he must be voted out?

Oh i do and it was a laugh riot. Just like this current post you made.

you forgot the part where they run around saying disgusting things to and about us and then are shocked when we respond.

although to be fair, frank's grown on me.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Okay. Brace yourself. Here is the letter from Jefferson to Madison I promised. Jefferson spoke of the evils of the concentration of wealth he saw in France, and how it was imperative our own country legislatively ensured that never happened here.



Obama: "For we, the people, understand that our country cannot succeed when a shrinking few do very well and a growing many barely make it."

So, yes, that is grounded in our founding principles. Absolutely yes.

Yes, you are a sycophantic Obamaroid.

There is very little resemblance at all in the Forbes 400 today than 30, 20 or even 10 years ago.

You snorted the Obama KoolAid straight out of the can.

shouldn't you be blowing your Reagan blow up job?

There's no end to the bitter sting Progs feel when they think of Reagan freeing tens of million from the dehumanizing oppression of Soviet Communism. The fools had everything! A loving central government that provided all their needs-- gave them their weekly bread, and they tossed it aside for freedom. Fools!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtYdjbpBk6A]Reagan at Brandenburg Gate - "tear down this wall" - YouTube[/ame]

 

[CrusaderFrank]

more irony...

I've enjoyed watching people like frank and you run around crying about how Obama stole the election, about how he wasn't born here and should be kicked out.

Oh remember how up till the election you touted how he was going to be removed by Romney? How many times you ended your posts with how he must be voted out?

Oh i do and it was a laugh riot. Just like this current post you made.

you forgot the part where they run around saying disgusting things to and about us and then are shocked when we respond.

although to be fair, frank's grown on me.

like a genital wart..

The other day someone on here made the comment i think that These people are all about their guns and not infringing on being able to own said guns. Yet they want to complain about the government being tyrannical and they want to increase the military budget.


If you ever actually break these people arguments down, you notice how retarded they are, and you have to wonder why anyone ever takes them seriously.

^ Hysterical Rant

 

[nodoginnafight]

more irony...

I've enjoyed watching people like frank and you run around crying about how Obama stole the election, about how he wasn't born here and should be kicked out.

Oh remember how up till the election you touted how he was going to be removed by Romney? How many times you ended your posts with how he must be voted out?

Oh i do and it was a laugh riot. Just like this current post you made.

you forgot the part where they run around saying disgusting things to and about us and then are shocked when we respond.

although to be fair, frank's grown on me.

like a genital wart..

The other day someone on here made the comment i think that These people are all about their guns and not infringing on being able to own said guns. Yet they want to complain about the government being tyrannical and they want to increase the military budget.


If you ever actually break these people arguments down, you notice how retarded they are, and you have to wonder why anyone ever takes them seriously.

And yet there ARE those who can make a good, logical, foundational argument for conservatism. They are just in very short supply these days. If it contains more syllables than a bumper sticker and/or it doesn't include a vulgar insult, the base doesn't get it, so they abandon it.

Too bad.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

like a genital wart..

The other day someone on here made the comment i think that These people are all about their guns and not infringing on being able to own said guns. Yet they want to complain about the government being tyrannical and they want to increase the military budget.


If you ever actually break these people arguments down, you notice how retarded they are, and you have to wonder why anyone ever takes them seriously.

^ Hysterical Rant

Rant? its telling jillian a story about something i came across. You fucking moron. You can't even get even get this right.

The "Reagan Blow Up" Doll comment says all you need to know about who the hysterical ranters are

 

[nodoginnafight]

Yes, you are a sycophantic Obamaroid.

There is very little resemblance at all in the Forbes 400 today than 30, 20 or even 10 years ago.

You snorted the Obama KoolAid straight out of the can.

We can all try to achieve this lofty goal of "non-hysterical" "non-rant"

 

[g5000]

"For we, the people, understand that our country cannot succeed when a shrinking few do very well and a growing many barely make it."

You now that's Socialism, right? He's openly embraced Socialism right there. Is demonization of success people an American principal, is that grounded in our Founding?

Okay. Brace yourself. Here is the letter from Jefferson to Madison I promised. Jefferson spoke of the evils of the concentration of wealth he saw in France, and how it was imperative our own country legislatively ensured that never happened here.

As soon as I had got clear of the town I fell in with a poor woman walking at the same rate with myself and going the same course. Wishing to know the condition of the laboring poor I entered into conversation with her, which I began by enquiries for the path which would lead me into the mountain: and thence proceeded to enquiries into her vocation, condition and circumstances. She told me she was a day laborer at 8 sous or 4d. sterling the day: that she had two children to maintain, and to pay a rent of 30 livres for her house (which would consume the hire of 75 days), that often she could no employment and of course was without bread. As we had walked together near a mile and she had so far served me as a guide, I gave her, on parting, 24 sous. She burst into tears of a gratitude which I could perceive was unfeigned because she was unable to utter a word. She had probably never before received so great an aid. This little attendrissement, with the solitude of my walk, led me into a train of reflections on that unequal division of property which occasions the numberless instances of wretchedness which I had observed in this country and is to be observed all over Europe.

The property of this country is absolutely concentred in a very few hands, having revenues of from half a million of guineas a year downwards. These employ the flower of the country as servants, some of them having as many as 200 domestics, not laboring. They employ also a great number of manufacturers and tradesmen, and lastly the class of laboring husbandmen. But after all there comes the most numerous of all classes, that is, the poor who cannot find work. I asked myself what could be the reason so many should be permitted to beg who are willing to work, in a country where there is a very considerable proportion of uncultivated lands? These lands are undisturbed only for the sake of game. It should seem then that it must be because of the enormous wealth of the proprietors which places them above attention to the increase of their revenues by permitting these lands to be labored. I am conscious that an equal division of property is impracticable, but the consequences of this enormous inequality producing so much misery to the bulk of mankind, legislators cannot invent too many devices for subdividing property, only taking care to let their subdivisions go hand in hand with the natural affections of the human mind. The descent of property of every kind therefore to all the children, or to all the brothers and sisters, or other relations in equal degree, is a politic measure and a practicable one. Another means of silently lessening the inequality of property is to exempt all from taxation below a certain point, and to tax the higher portions or property in geometrical progression as they rise. Whenever there are in any country uncultivated lands and unemployed poor, it is clear that the laws of property have been so far extended as to violate natural right.

Obama: "For we, the people, understand that our country cannot succeed when a shrinking few do very well and a growing many barely make it."

So, yes, that is grounded in our founding principles. Absolutely yes.

Yes, you are a sycophantic Obamaroid.

There is very little resemblance at all in the Forbes 400 today than 30, 20 or even 10 years ago.

You snorted the Obama KoolAid straight out of the can.

You really do consume the bogus talking points with gusto, eh?

You have not been paying attention. Economic mobility has considerably slowed over the past several decades.

Former Senator Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania, a Republican candidate for president, warned this fall that movement “up into the middle income is actually greater, the mobility in Europe, than it is in America.” National Review, a conservative thought leader, wrote that “most Western European and English-speaking nations have higher rates of mobility.” Even Representative Paul D. Ryan, a Wisconsin Republican who argues that overall mobility remains high, recently wrote that “mobility from the very bottom up” is “where the United States lags behind.”

Even the Right bemoans our economic mobility is not what it used to be!

Addressing your Forbes 400 meme:

Despite frequent references to the United States as a classless society, about 62 percent of Americans (male and female) raised in the top fifth of incomes stay in the top two-fifths, according to research by the Economic Mobility Project of the Pew Charitable Trusts.

It seems your ignorance really is bliss. You are especially ignorant of our Founding Fathers' principles, which Obama precisely echoed in that part you called "Socialism".

 

[g5000]

For other ignoramuses who like to make claims about our Founding Fathers, a couple things.

First, they were not monolithic in their opinions.

Second, Thomas Jefferson, the darling of the UnConservatives and Libertarians, preached a progressive taxation system, with lower incomes being completely exempt from taxes. So remember that the next time you are bitching about the 47% who don't pay federal income taxes. This is the culmination of one of Jefferson's dreams.

Many UnConservatives also adore Thomas Paine for his Common Sense, but seem blissfully unaware of Agrarian Justice, in which Paine argues for estate taxes and property taxes to be used to establish a social security pension. Not only that, but he also argues that every person who reaches adulthood should be paid an income by the federal government!

I have already established the principle, namely, that the earth, in its natural uncultivated state was, and ever would have continued to be, the common property of the human race; that in that state, every person would have been born to property; and that the system of landed property, by its inseparable connection with cultivation, and with what is called civilized life, has absorbed the property of all those whom it dispossessed, without providing, as ought to have been done, an indemnification for that loss.

The fault, however, is not in the present possessors. No complaint is tended, or ought to be alleged against them, unless they adopt the crime by opposing justice. The fault is in the system, and it has stolen perceptibly upon the world, aided afterwards by the agrarian law of the sword. But the fault can be made to reform itself by successive generations; and without diminishing or deranging the property of any of present possessors, the operation of the fund can yet commence, and in full activity, the first year of its establishment, or soon after, as I shall show.

It is proposed that the payments, as already stated, be made to every person, rich or poor. It is best to make it so, to prevent invidious distinctions. It is also right it should be so, because it is in lieu of the natural inheritance, which, as a right, belongs to every man, over and above property he may have created, or inherited from those who did. Such persons as do not choose to receive it can throw it into the common fund.

Taking it then for granted that no person ought to be in a worse condition when born under what is called a state of civilization, than he would have been had he been born in a state of nature, and that civilization ought to have made, and ought still to make, provision for that purpose, it can only be done by subtracting from property a portion equal in value to the natural inheritance it has absorbed.

Remember that the next time you are waxing on about John Locke's principals which our Founders took to heart.

 

[Truthmatters]

The bitterness, nastiness and outright hatred of the far right...and even moderate right...since the November election has been unbelievable, but not that unexpected. They are acting as if the grocery store shelves are empty; As if the Super Bowl got canceled by executive order; As if we are gassing puppies; As if we have banned sunshine or something.

It aint that bad. It wasnt that bad under Bush. And it aint that bad under Obama.

The problem is the crazy partisans. They mostly dont live much life outside their little bubble of wakeup/home-to-work-to-home/bedtime, and the cable TV and talk radio that fills those (-) slash marks I used. They get the usual daily stresses that most people on Earth have: How to keep food, shelter, clothing on their family's slate in life. Historically, people have always wanted that.

Government has a role in society to simply provide a canvas for people to make what they make of their own lives. That cost a price: Taxes. But after that is paid, we can live a pretty damn awesome life, in a damn awesome country.

But when you really calm down and look at it all, its a pretty great deal. As long as we are paying $5 for a cup of coffee at Starbucks (rather than the $1 gas station alternative across the street) and spending $20 for a movie (rather than read a free book) then we cant bitch that much about life in America.



SO I ASK.........which group of bitter, unrealistic crybabies is the worst: 2004 Democrat/liberals, or 2012-present day GOP conservatives? Both are full of shit alarmists who need to take stock of how great they actually have it.

are you pretending Bush did NOT lie us into war?

 

[Dr.Traveler]

When you consider that liberals in Hollywood actually made a feel-good movie about killing President Bush, you have your answer.

That was BBC. And I wouldn't use the word feel good. It was pretty much a description of a nightmare scenario.

 

[Truthmatters]

Am I supposed to report this thread?

for what, truthiness?

or are you having trouble recognizing a thread that actually raises an interesting question?

Thanks. I just noticed the panic and outrage of the right these days resembles so closely the post-04 election outrage of the left. I remember the big newspaper article saying something like "Sorry World, We Tried", as if Bush being re-elected was gonna cause the Earth to implode.

The doom and gloom, panic, and rage of some on the right just reminded me of the nonsense of the far left in 2004.

Wanted to start a convo about it.

he crashed the world economy after that.

did you forget?

 

[aaronleland]

more irony...

I've enjoyed watching people like frank and you run around crying about how Obama stole the election, about how he wasn't born here and should be kicked out.

Oh remember how up till the election you touted how he was going to be removed by Romney? How many times you ended your posts with how he must be voted out?

Oh i do and it was a laugh riot. Just like this current post you made.

you forgot the part where they run around saying disgusting things to and about us and then are shocked when we respond.

although to be fair, frank's grown on me.

like a genital wart..

The other day someone on here made the comment i think that These people are all about their guns and not infringing on being able to own said guns. Yet they want to complain about the government being tyrannical and they want to increase the military budget.


If you ever actually break these people arguments down, you notice how retarded they are, and you have to wonder why anyone ever takes them seriously.

That may have been my comment in the "You might be a conservative if..." topic, but I'm almost afraid to repeat it since the entire topic was moved to the Flame Zone. That topic went on for a long time because the arguments of the far right are so numerous and ridiculous you would think only a child would believe them. As evidenced in this topic the far right's irrational hatred of Obama is so strong that no matter what argument you debunk they will deflect, move the goalposts, or outright lie and insult you to justify their hatred. They have really just gone insane with hate.

 

[Truthmatters]

The bitterness, nastiness and outright hatred of the far right...and even moderate right...since the November election has been unbelievable, but not that unexpected. They are acting as if the grocery store shelves are empty; As if the Super Bowl got canceled by executive order; As if we are gassing puppies; As if we have banned sunshine or something.

It aint that bad. It wasnt that bad under Bush. And it aint that bad under Obama.

The problem is the crazy partisans. They mostly dont live much life outside their little bubble of wakeup/home-to-work-to-home/bedtime, and the cable TV and talk radio that fills those (-) slash marks I used. They get the usual daily stresses that most people on Earth have: How to keep food, shelter, clothing on their family's slate in life. Historically, people have always wanted that.

Government has a role in society to simply provide a canvas for people to make what they make of their own lives. That cost a price: Taxes. But after that is paid, we can live a pretty damn awesome life, in a damn awesome country.

But when you really calm down and look at it all, its a pretty great deal. As long as we are paying $5 for a cup of coffee at Starbucks (rather than the $1 gas station alternative across the street) and spending $20 for a movie (rather than read a free book) then we cant bitch that much about life in America.



SO I ASK.........which group of bitter, unrealistic crybabies is the worst: 2004 Democrat/liberals, or 2012-present day GOP conservatives? Both are full of shit alarmists who need to take stock of how great they actually have it.

I personally think the far left were more insufferable in 2000 than in 2004.
But even then they didn't annoy me as much as the 2012 far right.

I like the thread. Good to be reminded of how good we got it.

Well, I haven't yet seen anything like Code Pink from the far right. They haven't interrupted official government meetings yet as badly as Code Pink. And that nonsense with the woman trying to handcuff Cheney...or Rumsfeld, whichever, nothing like that has happened on the right that I've seen so far.

So, if we are keeping score, Id say right now the far left element in 2004 was a bit more extreme and whacko, HOWEVER, I think the panic/rage element of the right in 2012 is more widespread. It doesnt quite have the intensity of the left's in 2004, but I think it is more widespread. Of course, one could say the lefts was more widespread in 2004, but the whacko element was more apparent and covered more, thus, giving it the image of being smaller but crazier than the right wing nuts today.

Interesting though. We'll see if something like Code Pink emerges from the right wing in the next 4 years. I dont think the Tea Party is the equivalent of Code Pink though.

screamimg "you lie" to a presdient who has not lied

 

[CrusaderFrank]

like a genital wart..

The other day someone on here made the comment i think that These people are all about their guns and not infringing on being able to own said guns. Yet they want to complain about the government being tyrannical and they want to increase the military budget.


If you ever actually break these people arguments down, you notice how retarded they are, and you have to wonder why anyone ever takes them seriously.

^ Hysterical Rant

Rant? its telling jillian a story about something i came across. You fucking moron. You can't even get even get this right.

Calling me a Genital wart is not a rant?

Hmmmkay

 

[Truthmatters]

carrying arround racist signs


calling for second anmendment remedies to NOT winning elections

 

[g5000]

Okay. Brace yourself. Here is the letter from Jefferson to Madison I promised. Jefferson spoke of the evils of the concentration of wealth he saw in France, and how it was imperative our own country legislatively ensured that never happened here.



Obama: "For we, the people, understand that our country cannot succeed when a shrinking few do very well and a growing many barely make it."

So, yes, that is grounded in our founding principles. Absolutely yes.

Yes, you are a sycophantic Obamaroid.

There is very little resemblance at all in the Forbes 400 today than 30, 20 or even 10 years ago.

You snorted the Obama KoolAid straight out of the can.

shouldn't you be blowing your Reagan blow up job?

The UnConservatives are trying to ignore the fact that several officials from the Reagan administration have disowned them.