Minnesota looks dirty.

[WillowTree]

All I will say is this about the Minn. race for Senate. as in previous elections, that date back to recent times both Republican winners and Democratic winners this is a sad commentary on what the sacred right to vote has come down too. For over 200 plus years this nation has fought on battle fields far and wide, bleed the waters and the ground red with American blood to protect that right. Here in this nation, people of color, women, and the poor at one time or the other have suffered for that hard won right. The right to walk into a voting booth and as an American citizen express your voice and lend it to the long line in this great democracy. Those that attempt to steal it no matter that party label dishonor ALL those that came before them to win that right. More so they dishonor you and I now and all the future generations of Americans that come after us and stand on our shoulders as we stand on the shoulders of those that came before us. To steal that right and then walk into the great chambers of our Govt. and accept that as the will of the American people is to tell all those that bleed for that right, protested in snow and clod and rain, were denied that right bcause of the color of their skin or what sex they happen to be or how much money they have they weere meaningless. So in closing when these things happen consider who the people are that accept these stolen votes and step into the offices as a result, they are dishonorable people and disrespect themselves and more so disrespect us all. so therefor you and I have no need to respect them or the words that they happen to utter.

that's exactly what has happened.. exactly,, so I have no president to honor.. sad very sad.

 

[Lycurgus]

that's exactly what has happened.. exactly,, so I have no president to honor.. sad very sad.

DITTO

 

[Caligirl]

Which is how Gore and Kerry voters felt after the last two presidential elections were stolen!

It is true, there IS more that unites us than divides us!

(Do you really feel that the presidential election was stolen??? The results were 53/47, this means Obama had to steal 6% of the electorate..... You can't be serious!)

 

[Annie]

Which is how Gore and Kerry voters felt after the last two presidential elections were stolen!

It is true, there IS more that unites us than divides us!

(Do you really feel that the presidential election was stolen??? The results were 53/47, this means Obama had to steal 6% of the electorate..... You can't be serious!)

Jumping in here. Don't think Obama 'stole' the election, as you pointed out, whatever the attempts by ACORN and others, the results were definitive. However, same with 2004. As for 2000, while not ideal by any stretch of the imagination, the system worked, many didn't like the results. After the fact, as others have pointed out, it did appear that Bush also won the popular vote, if the NYTimes, PBS, and USA Today are to be believed.

The 'liberals' should have given up the whining long ago, but they did not. I'd say the conservatives will be ill served to copy that behavior.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

that's exactly what has happened.. exactly,, so I have no president to honor.. sad very sad.

Obama did not steal the election. If it is discovered he illegally collected funds he should not have we may have a conversation. But just as the claim Bush stole the election is untrue, so is the one that Obama stole this one. Making such a claim is retarded.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

You're kidding me right? How about this list for you since you are obviously seriously lacking in history knowledge -

St. Bartholomew's Day massacre, the entire Protestant Reformation, the Native Americans, the Crusades(what a fucking joke, the Christians really thought that area was their's, HILARIOUS), the African Slaves who numerous kings/queens with the Vatican's support said that the African's were meant for slavery, the Berlin Conference of 1885 which was also done with the Vatican's support, and MANY more. Lets not even get into the polygamy and molestation.

The fact that you made me waste my time writing this is irritating cause it means that you are so wrapped into your religion that you can't even see the truth!

Golly... now you had stated; and quite overtly, that Christianity had murdered more people than disease... you were thus challenged to cite in example instances of historical fact which would support this... and you've now come to fail in that effort.

For starters, “The Crusades” was a war... thus murder is not applicable; Slavery was not a function of Christianity... despite many professed Christians having participated. It's worth noting that history is replete with examples of Christians BEING ENSLAVED... The Native Americans suffered from the expansion of Western Civilization; they were savage, ignorant people that murdered tens of thousands of Westerners violated their treaty obligations, etc... Asserting that Christians slaughtered American Indians is absurd.

Your argument fails, as failure was the only potential outcome of the assertion on which it was undeniably founded.

Murder is 100% antithetical to the Christian Faith... as such there is no means by which murder can exist within any Christian effort.

Beyond that, the estimated deaths of that which you've listed could never climb beyond a few million... but let’s get CRAZY and lend the deaths attributed to that which you've listed at ten million, which cannot be historical sustained... that would be less than 7-1/2% of the 150 MILLION MURDERS which are INCONTESTABLY A DIRECT RESULT OF LEFTIST GOVERNANCE of the 20th Century. This excludes both the World Wars which resulted from leftism and the half dozen other major regional conflicts and the DOZENS of minor inter and inner-state wars resulting from leftism... which easily resulted in AT LEAST ANOTHER 100 million DEATHS.

There is nothing on earth which stems from humanity that has MURDERED MORE INNOCENT HUMAN BEING THAN THE LEFTIST IDEOLOGY...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

With regard to whether or not Hussein stole the election... there is no evidence, but then, there is no investigation.

I'd say that the left is up to their collective @$$ in election fraud... they're liars, thieves and nothing less than the personification of evil.

But the GOP will not challenge it. Even in Minnesota where the mathematical odds of probability make it a mathematical certainty that election fraud is taking place, the GOP will not challenge it.

It's going to come down to a violent revolution, WHICH THE LEFT WILL START and they can't start it soon enough as far as I'm concerned...

 

[rayboyusmc]

Pogo, you are either a ranting lunatic or just like to rite like one.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Pogo, you are either a ranting lunatic or just like to rite like one.

Could be... but you'll always be a flaccid little wanna-be-pogue; a poser who's limited to drive-by-spewings of absolutely no intellectual measure.

 

[bigdaddygtr]

Murder is 100% antithetical to the Christian Faith... as such there is no means by which murder can exist within any Christian effort.


Wow, that is either the most nieve or the dumbest statement I've ever read or heard. There is no point talking to someone like you

 

[Old Rocks]

Coleman-Franken Minnesota Recount Update
So, this Minnesota Senate race is turning into one of the marquee recount fights of modern politics, second only to the 2000 Florida presidential race one, but much more clean.

We’re nearing the end of the first recount phase, and Coleman’s lead has actually expanded to 238 votes, with two caveats that render that meaningless: 1. Nobody seems to know exactly what that lead is. That number is according to the Secretary of State’s office, but that actually might not be the most reliable source for a number of reasons.

2. The lead right now is as much a function of ballot challenges—and Coleman is challenging a lot more—than actual votes gained. Nate Silver, among others, have suggested that, as such, the lead is enormously artificial, more a PR thing (”we won the recount&#8221 in preparation for the rulings on the contested ballots, where Franken will undoubtedly gain significant ground and may well take the lead. But an effective PR thing; the Coleman people can claim they won the election, they won the first recount, and it was only “election officials” who turned it to Franken. Which is disingenuous to say the least, but that’s how the game is played.

In any case, Franken’s camp still maintains it’s down to double digits. They claim Coleman leads by 84, however that is on the assumption that all Coleman challenges will be rejected. Most probably will be, but not all. So the real lead may be somewhere in the 125-150 range.

As the recount winds down, presently at issue is what to do with more than 12,000 rejected absentee ballots. The Coleman campaign says, basically, “burn them; they were rejected.” The Franken campaign demands they be sifted through and challenged as well, and very likely, if that were done, Franken would win (even if 95% of them were indeed rejected, that 5% may well be enough, and most figure Franken has an edge (though no idea who significant) on absentee ballots). Today, the Minnesota Canvassing Board sided with Coleman, although in so doing they bent over backwards to indicate that they were not necessarily the final word on the subject.

Franken has two outs. Nate Silver (sorry for the extensive quote, Nate!):

The first is that the Canvassing Board will reconvene next week to consider a proposal to have county officials sort through their absentee ballots to determine which absentee ballots appeared to have no valid reason for rejection — a so-called “fifth pile” of ballots, as there are four valid criteria in Minnesota for rejecting absentees. The Canvassing Board could then rule that ballots in the fifth pile be counted. The Franken campaign seems inclined to let this process play out for now; in the meantime, at least one county (Itasca) appears as though it may re-evaluate the rejected absentee ballots on its own, without awaiting instructions from the state.

The second mechanism would be to do the good, old-fashioned American thing and sue. It is quite likely that the Franken campaign will sue if the Canvassing Board does not mandate that the “fifth pile” ballots be counted; the reporters at The Uptake think such a lawsuit would have a fair chance of prevailing.

The St. Paul Pioneer press reports that about 12,000 absentee ballots were rejected statewide. Undoubtedly, the vast majority of these were rejected for valid reasons, but reviews of such ballots in counties like Ramsey (St. Paul) have revealed that material numbers were rejected due to human error, and Minnesota’s Secretary of State, Mark Ritchie, has estimated that between 500 and 1,000 absentees were rejected improperly.

The behavior of both the Coleman and Franken campaigns would suggest that Franken stands to gain if these absentee ballots are reconsidered, but the extent of the potential gain is hard to determine. In late October, a Public Policy Polling survey showed Al Franken with an 8-point lead over Norm Coleman among persons who had already voted, although that survey slightly overestimated Franken’s support overall. Most likely, Franken would stand to add a vote for somewhere between 1 in every 10 improperly rejected absentee ballots, and 1 in every 20. Given this range and the estimate of improperly rejected absentees provided by Ritchie, that would suggest that Franken campaign stands to gain a net of somewhere between 25 and 100 votes if these ballots are in fact counted by the state.

The Minnesota recount has so far been a model of fairness and attempting to precision. That said, this is going to come down to dirty boxing on every single ballot. Franken, for his part, seems disinclined to make the Al Gore mistake of respecting the process too much, and is going to be leaning on the system just as much as Coleman promises too. However, unlike Florida (where, I believe, more people showed up that day to vote for Gore than to vote for Bush), it’s unclear that Franken actually has more votes and just has to win. It really is pretty much dead even, to a ballot, and the margin is going to solely be a function of ballot challenges. I.e. there is no objective “count” here; how this race comes will solely be a function of subjectivity. MN officials feeling like they want to close this thing up, Coleman could justifiably win by 250. MN officials feeling like they want to be generous and liberal in terms of how they judge things, Franken could justifiably win by 100. If you’re a betting man, the truth probably comes somewhere in the middle—-that “Coleman by 84″ish margin that the Franken camp sees. But this is not a race to be betting on.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Murder is 100% antithetical to the Christian Faith... as such there is no means by which murder can exist within any Christian effort.

Wow, that is either the most nieve or the dumbest statement I've ever read or heard. There is no point talking to someone like you

Yeah... I expect you're right, in that given you're a leftist, you're quite incapable of reason...

As usual friends, what we have here is a leftist which is eager to confuse Christians with Christ.

What's hysterical is how this imbecile is anxious to point to Christianity as a beacon of atrocity, where Christianity stands at the very foundation of human rights while professing leftism, which is the uncontested leader in the purveyance of human suffering and the single greatest murderer of human beings in the history of the species, with no close second.

But hey... that's idiocy for ya.

Let's not forget that this idiot is the one that stated as FACT that Christianity had resulted in the killing of more people than any other entity on earth and when challenged to post supporting evidence was able to only spew a littany of efforts which were not connected to Christianity, but which were merely the efforts by individuals which were through their efforts violating the tenets of Christianity as they sought to establish their own personal power; which however, when the killing is summed, could not even make it into the top 100...

 

[Silence]

LOL! 59 Dem Senators?

if it's true that the election has been corrupted it's nothing to celebrate even if it is your side that is benefiting. You'd be really pissed off if it benefited the republicans so it's pretty hypocritical for you to say it's okay just because it's in favor of the Democrat.

Elections should be untainted. It's the will of the people that should prevail.

 

[Agnapostate]

I'm not wading through this whole mess, but just to clarify, everyone does realize that all votes found didn't go to Franken, (a considerable amount went to Coleman), the story of votes found in a car trunk was a hoax, and it would have been a far more statistically improbable result had the votes not been found, correct?

 

[Agnapostate]

And here's more:

The Associated Press: Al Franken gets boosts in Minnesota Senate recount

ST. PAUL, Minn. (AP) — Democrat Al Franken won a pair of victories Friday before the state board overseeing the Senate recount, including a decision that as many as 1,500 incorrectly rejected absentee ballots should be included.

The board also opted to recommend use of election night results in a Franken-leaning Minneapolis precinct where 133 ballots went missing, a decision that could have cost him 46 votes if it had gone the other way.

"It was a great day for democracy," Franken attorney Marc Elias said after a hearing that drew protesters urging use of rejected absentee votes.

Franken had fought especially hard to include the absentees as he tries to overtake Republican Sen. Norm Coleman in the drawn-out recount.

Coleman's campaign lawyers said they would go to court over the absentee ballot ruling.

With all precincts recounted, Coleman has a 188-vote edge over Franken — down slightly from his 215-vote lead entering the recount.

But there's a long way to go. That margin doesn't include the absentees. Nor does it include any of the 6,655 ballot challenges the two campaigns filed during the recount. Both sides have withdrawn hundreds — including 750 Friday by Franken — but the state Canvassing Board will tackle some 3,450 starting Tuesday.

The board's decision on improperly rejected absentees doesn't guarantee they will be opened and counted because it doesn't have the power to order counties to do so. Most counties have gone forward with a voluntary sorting, though others have balked.

But Secretary of State Mark Ritchie said he's not worried about getting counties aboard.

"They are sobered, and they would like to correct those errors," he said.

Coleman's campaign planned to file a petition with the state Supreme Court as soon as Friday to seek uniform rules for dealing with the absentee ballots, arguing that leaving the task to counties would create inconsistencies.

Coleman lawyer Tony Trimble said the campaign is asking counties to hold off any action involving the ballots until the court weighs in.

Elias, Franken's attorney, called the move desperate and cynical.

"The cold reality of where they stand in this count is upon them, and they are desperate to do something to keep these ballots from being counted," he said.

At least 638 absentee ballots are known to have been rejected for something other than the four legal reasons for disqualification. That's based on an assessment of about half of Minnesota's counties by the secretary of state's office. State officials estimate the total could top 1,500.

It's not known which candidate stands to benefit most from those ballots.

"It would be unjust and disrespectful to those voters not to count those votes," said Judge Edward Cleary, one of four who sit with Ritchie on the board.

About 30 demonstrators gathered outside the Capitol hearing room to urge Canvassing Board members to count the absentee ballots. They held handmade signs saying "Let the people's votes count" and "Count every vote." Some wore "Count every vote" stickers.

The board acted after receiving a legal opinion from the office of Minnesota Attorney General Lori Swanson, a Democrat, that the ballots should be counted.

"There is no doubt that voters who have complied with all legal requirements, but whose ballots were improperly rejected, should have their vote counted," it read.

The opinion laid out several options for getting the ballots into the count, some involving court action and others through administrative means. It says that the campaigns are free to seek court orders to compel counties to take part.

The board voted unanimously to rely on tapes from a ballot counting machine rather than results from the manual recount in a precinct in the University of Minnesota area in Minneapolis. Coleman's campaign had argued against using anything but the recount figures.

A packet of ballots from the precinct couldn't be found after an exhaustive search of the city's elections warehouse. Consequently, the recount showed 133 fewer votes than the number of people who signed in on Election Day or who voted absentee.

Because Franken decisively won the precinct, he stood to lose the most votes if the board went with the recount tally over the machine tapes.

 

[Xenophon]

They should have a run off election, this is not going to end well no matter who wins.

 

[Agnapostate]

They should, and if they had a runoff election, Franken would likely win. During the election, a third party candidate, Dean Barkley, diverted a large number of votes from Franken. In addition, evidence of Coleman's possible corruption was not as well known as it is now.

 

[Caligirl]

I like the idea of a runoff.

 

[DiveCon]

I like the idea of a runoff.

yeah, but with 2 different candidates
those two BOTH suck