Memo From Reality Based Community

[ABikerSailor]

Frankly, biker in regards to terrorists who have chosen to blow up people and to prolong a war to the point where we simply, without ever having lost a battle get tired and go home I don't give a crap What dictionary.com says. The first step in reforming ass holes is to give them a reason to quit being assholes if that requires jacking up there heads bit or causing the poor darlings a bit of stress what sane person gives a damn?

How fucking stupid are you dude? What part of Bin Laden WAS NOT IN IRAQ do you NOT get?

The Taliban WAS NOT in Iraq until after idiot boy Bush Jr. took out Saddam, which resulted in the Taliban spreading over the globe, with the jumping off and training point being Iraq.

Bush Jr. is a terrorist also......can we strap his dumb country redneck ass on a waterboard too? I mean.....it's just saran wrap and a bucket of water, right? It doesn't cause any long term damage......

Besides.....with your confused Rambo attitude, I kinda think you've never been in the military.

Sad really......the ones that have never been in war are generally the ones that wanna jump in, guns blazing, and they have no idea what they are saying.

 

[garyd]

11 months in Viet Nam asshat. People who needlessly prolong wars as Obama is about to do and as the Taliban and Al qeada have done deserve to freaking die. I used to teach history.

Without 9/11 Saddam is still in power in Iraq and we are still essentially at war with him as we were the day GWBush took office.

 

[ABikerSailor]

11 months in Viet Nam asshat. People who needlessly prolong wars as Obama is about to do and as the Taliban and Al qeada have done deserve to freaking die. I used to teach history.

Without 9/11 Saddam is still in power in Iraq and we are still essentially at war with him as we were the day GWBush took office.

Oh.....so you were too much of a pussy to do a full hitch.

20 year vet motherfucker.

And....Obama WANTS THE TROOPS HOME. Your idiot candidate McInsane was the one that said he wanted to stay there 100 years.

Teach history eh? Apparently you've not kept up on current events douchebag.

I bet your students are twice as smart as you, and you're probably teaching 3rd grade.

BTW.....how's your dating pool "Teach"? I bet you're one of those types that was happy to see that teachers can now date students if they're over 18.

 

[garyd]

I didn't ask to leave dick head My whole damn unit left the country. And thanks for the leftist talking points ie bullshit I also spent seven months in Freaking Germany we still have troops there and in Korea. And we will likely still have a few troops in Iraq when Obama leaves office. I think all those damn bugs bouncing off your head as bike on down the highway have addled your freaking brain.

I quit teaching thirty years ago right after I found out I had to take a twelve dollar cut in take home pay to quit going to school and start teaching it. And the thought of eventually having to kill some idiot kid who pulled a dull pocket knife on me on the play ground because he thought he could scare me and didn't and had to try anyway didn't exactly make my day.

 

[Jon]

Not that I support waterboarding, but if someone was going to drop a nuke or blow up a building with thousands of people in it and we caught the guy who knew the details, I'm all for whatever it takes to get that motherfucker to talk.

 

[eots]

more Americans die annually from peanut allergies,, than they do from terrorism

 

[Truthmatters]

Wired 14.01: Don't Even Think About Lying

Torture is unreliable.

Torture was done by the Bush admin to produce "evidence" of what they wanted the intell to say.

Look at this link and realize we have much better ways of getting truth form people.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Before someone starts saying if something is one thing or the other, it helps to know the definition first.......



torture definition | Dictionary.com

Basically, it's torture. It causes extreme anguish in the mind, as one of the results of it is that it places people in a mental state where they experience extreme terror by simulating drowning, which can (and usually does) result in PTSD.

What? Now are you going to tell me that those who came back from Iraq WITH NO PHYSICAL WOUNDS, who are suffering from PTSD aren't really hurt mentally?

Get a clue.

So you claim water boarding is torture because it causes exteme mental anguish which you imagine "usually" results in PTSD, but by that definition if the interrogators were able to cause the prisoner extreme anguish by lying to him about being betrayed by his confederates or by means of lies about the danger his family is in, etc., then that would qualify as torture and US courts have held that the police may lie to suspects in that manner. So if you are relying on the extreme anguish definition of torture then arguably US courts have determined by implication water boarding is legal.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Not that I support waterboarding, but if someone was going to drop a nuke or blow up a building with thousands of people in it and we caught the guy who knew the details, I'm all for whatever it takes to get that motherfucker to talk.

And of course every thinking person would approve of using water boarding or even some forms of physical torture if it was the only way to save thousands of American lives and none of those who are ranting against it now would want to be held responsible the loss of those lives because he/she valued the mental equilibrium of a terrorist more than he/she valued those American lives. In fact, the US has used water boarding on only three terrorists and only when our intelligence services believed we were under an imminent threat of attacks of just such a magnitude and then only after receiving authorization from the highest levels of government. It would have been politically and morally irresponsible to have done anything else.

 

[Chris]

Waterboarding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Classification as torture
Waterboarding is considered to be torture by a wide range of authorities, including legal experts,[4][5][30] politicians, war veterans,[6][7] intelligence officials,[31] military judges,[9] and human rights organizations.[10][11] David Miliband, the United Kingdom Foreign Secretary described it as torture on July 19, 2008, and stated "the UK unreservedly condemns the use of torture."[32] Arguments have been put forward that it might not be torture in all cases, or that they are uncertain.[33][34][35][36] The U.S. State Department has recognized that other techniques that involve submersion of the head of the subject during interrogation would qualify as torture.[37]

The United Nations' Report of the Committee Against Torture: Thirty-fifth Session of November 2006, stated that state parties should rescind any interrogation techniques, such as waterboarding, that constitutes torture or cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment or punishment.[38]

 

[ABikerSailor]

I didn't ask to leave dick head My whole damn unit left the country. And thanks for the leftist talking points ie bullshit I also spent seven months in Freaking Germany we still have troops there and in Korea. And we will likely still have a few troops in Iraq when Obama leaves office. I think all those damn bugs bouncing off your head as bike on down the highway have addled your freaking brain.

I quit teaching thirty years ago right after I found out I had to take a twelve dollar cut in take home pay to quit going to school and start teaching it. And the thought of eventually having to kill some idiot kid who pulled a dull pocket knife on me on the play ground because he thought he could scare me and didn't and had to try anyway didn't exactly make my day.

Gotcha......understand 5 x 5 dude......

Not only did you leave with your unit, it also sounds like you became a REMF.

And.....based on your teaching prowess, you're a quitter as well.

 

[ABikerSailor]

So you claim water boarding is torture because it causes exteme mental anguish which you imagine "usually" results in PTSD, but by that definition if the interrogators were able to cause the prisoner extreme anguish by lying to him about being betrayed by his confederates or by means of lies about the danger his family is in, etc., then that would qualify as torture and US courts have held that the police may lie to suspects in that manner. So if you are relying on the extreme anguish definition of torture then arguably US courts have determined by implication water boarding is legal.

Really? Ever been in a war zone? I have. And.....if you had bothered to pay attention to something other than FAUX News, you'd see that the Marines are doing something different in Iraq........

They started helping and teaching, as well as seeing where the problems were so they could fix them. Bout 2 years ago, there was a story on CNN about a Marine who would walk around with his pockets full of candy and dinar and shekels. He would hand them out to the kids, as well as give money to the adults, and just be on his way. Later, he'd come back, and they would give him all sorts of good intel.

He called what he was doing "passing out paper bullets".

Nope......sorry......people tend to lie more and tell you what you want to hear if you torture them.

Tell me......if push came to shove, and YOU were on the waterboard, what would you do? Lie and tell them what they wanted so they would quit, or would you tell the truth.

I'm guessing you'd choose the former. Torture only makes people wanna resist more.

 

[Red Dawn]

Just what aspect of water boarding makes it torture? Water boarding produces no physical pain or damage; it aims to produce an intense anxiety reaction in the prisoner. So is it torture because it induces anxiety? Is it torture because it requires the prisoner be restrained?

dude, you're making republicans look like morally corrupt assholes.


If american soldiers or citizens were held by foreign powers and were water boarded, forced to wear women's underwear on their heads, and forced to crawl on the ground and bark like dogs, you wouldn't be outraged? What the fuck is wrong with you republicans?

 

[KittenKoder]

dude, you're making republicans look like morally corrupt assholes.


If american soldiers or citizens were held by foreign powers and were water boarded, forced to wear women's underwear on their heads, and forced to crawl on the ground and bark like dogs, you wouldn't be outraged? What the fuck is wrong with you republicans?

This points to a flaw on both sides actually. Reps only care about themselves while Dems want everyone to care about everyone, which is impossible.

 

[Red Dawn]

This points to a flaw on both sides actually. Reps only care about themselves while Dems want everyone to care about everyone, which is impossible.

Torturing people and making them wear women's underwear on their head demains my country, makes my country a rouge nation, and puts american toldiers in potentially more jeapardy if we lose the moral high ground.

In short, it demeans us. That's what I care about.

I don't give a shit about Abu Al Zaraqawi, or whatever.

 

[Missourian]

dude, you're making republicans look like morally corrupt assholes.


If american soldiers or citizens were held by foreign powers and were water boarded, forced to wear women's underwear on their heads, and forced to crawl on the ground and bark like dogs, you wouldn't be outraged? What the fuck is wrong with you republicans?

You mean as opposed to seeing American soldiers bodies dragged through the streets and citizens beheaded.

 

[KittenKoder]

You mean as opposed to seeing American soldiers bodies dragged through the streets and citizens beheaded.

Actually, beheading is the most humane and least painful way to execute someone. Now if they were instead stabbing them in the stomach and letting them die that way I would actually be a little more outraged. We kill those who break our laws, why would others not be allowed to?

 

[ABikerSailor]

Somebody pos rep KK for that please.......

Sorry dear.....ya won the Heisman again from me.

 

[Red Dawn]

You mean as opposed to seeing American soldiers bodies dragged through the streets and citizens beheaded.

t

WEAK

The "at least 'we're not AS bad as al qaeda" is a phony and childish argument to make.

the most respected republicans with military experience - Powell, McCain, Hage - agree with me.

You know more about it than Colin Powell and John McCain? I think not.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Really? Ever been in a war zone? I have. And.....if you had bothered to pay attention to something other than FAUX News, you'd see that the Marines are doing something different in Iraq........

They started helping and teaching, as well as seeing where the problems were so they could fix them. Bout 2 years ago, there was a story on CNN about a Marine who would walk around with his pockets full of candy and dinar and shekels. He would hand them out to the kids, as well as give money to the adults, and just be on his way. Later, he'd come back, and they would give him all sorts of good intel.

He called what he was doing "passing out paper bullets".

Nope......sorry......people tend to lie more and tell you what you want to hear if you torture them.

Tell me......if push came to shove, and YOU were on the waterboard, what would you do? Lie and tell them what they wanted so they would quit, or would you tell the truth.

I'm guessing you'd choose the former. Torture only makes people wanna resist more.

Your post is unresponsive and your conclusions are only speculations without any basis in fact or logic. People lie for all kinds of reasons and under all kinds of conditions and intelligence analysts understand that without confirmation, no piece of intel is to be trusted whether it is elicited by water boarding, physical torture or by treats.