Medical-pot users fuming over ATF’s gun-sale ban

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

 

[KeiserC]

Taz, interested if you've gleaned any insight on this issue (especially of late).

A close corollary to 'MM use' ('Rec. M use') There's a current post on this in 'Legal' addressing 'rec. use' and already owned firearms & their use...

I'm sure many of us would value your insight on this emerging issue, that hasn't really been addressed by state legislators, if you care to comment.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

 

[KeiserC]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

Care to opine on 'legal recreational use' / possession of your current firearms? My state of VT and others are leaving us 'hanging' on this aspect.

 

[Tijn Von Ingersleben]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

What's wrong with this? It's the law.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/usao-ut/legacy/2013/06/03/guncard.pdf

 

[KeiserC]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

What's wrong with this? It's the law.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/usao-ut/legacy/2013/06/03/guncard.pdf

The incongruity / disparity, if you will, comes in when the Fed. & State contradict one another... what is the 'real life' end result going to be?

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

Care to opine on 'legal recreational use' / possession of your current firearms? My state of VT and others are leaving us 'hanging' on this aspect.

In my county they've decided not to charge you unless you're in possession of more than 4 ounces.
This is in Texas mind you.
I'm on the fence on legalization. As someone who smokes occasionally I personally dont have a problem. I took care of business and retired early.
But then you have those who let it destroy their lives,which is why I never smoke when there is a job at hand.

As far as making it illegal to own guns if you use medical weed?
Total BS.

 

[KeiserC]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

Care to opine on 'legal recreational use' / possession of your current firearms? My state of VT and others are leaving us 'hanging' on this aspect.

In my county they've decided not to charge you unless you're in possession of more than 4 ounces.
This is in Texas mind you.
I'm on the fence on legalization. As someone who smokes occasionally I personally dont have a problem. I took care of business and retired early.
But then you have those who let it destroy their lives,which is why I never smoke when there is a job at hand.

As far as making it illegal to own guns if you use medical weed?
Total BS.

LOL... I have often been envious of 'your country'...

 

[TNHarley]

ATF is unconstitutional
The drug war is unconstitutional
Right to guns is constitutional
They are just fucked on all points

 

[KeiserC]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

Care to opine on 'legal recreational use' / possession of your current firearms? My state of VT and others are leaving us 'hanging' on this aspect.

In my county they've decided not to charge you unless you're in possession of more than 4 ounces.
This is in Texas mind you.
I'm on the fence on legalization. As someone who smokes occasionally I personally dont have a problem. I took care of business and retired early.
But then you have those who let it destroy their lives,which is why I never smoke when there is a job at hand.

As far as making it illegal to own guns if you use medical weed?
Total BS.

Again, what will be the strict interpretation for those states that are legalizing rec. use? They really don't spell anything out for those who are existing firearm enthusiasts/owners

 

[theDoctorisIn]

When I was in California, I had a medical marijuana referral, and I also legally owned a number of guns.

I'd heard that if you registered with the state (which you could do, and get the official "pot card"), they would reject any firearm licences - but it wasn't really an issue, because I never got the card. I'd just bring the recommendation, along with my ID to the dispensary.

 

[Tijn Von Ingersleben]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

What's wrong with this? It's the law.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/usao-ut/legacy/2013/06/03/guncard.pdf

The incongruity / disparity, if you will, comes in when the Fed. & State contradict one another... what is the 'real life' end result going to be?

Federal laws trumps state law. The only thing stopping the feds from coming in and enforcing the laws of the nation are their willingness to do it. Obama did not have the will nor the interest. Apparently the Trump admin does. If the states want to remove marijuana from the controlled substance list then do it federally.

 

[KeiserC]

When I was in California, I had a medical marijuana referral, and I also legally owned a number of guns.

I'd heard that if you registered with the state (which you could do, and get the official "pot card"), they would reject any firearm licences - but it wasn't really an issue, because I never got the card. I'd just bring the recommendation, along with my ID to the dispensary.

I would submit that if the 'respective' entities were in communication (like an investigation) this would not be the case...

 

[theDoctorisIn]

When I was in California, I had a medical marijuana referral, and I also legally owned a number of guns.

I'd heard that if you registered with the state (which you could do, and get the official "pot card"), they would reject any firearm licences - but it wasn't really an issue, because I never got the card. I'd just bring the recommendation, along with my ID to the dispensary.

I would submit that if the 'respective' entities were in communication (like an investigation) this would not be the case...

Well, that's the thing. In California, the only "entities" that were aware of my doctor's recommendation for weed were the doctor, me, and the dispensaries that I would show it to.

 

[KeiserC]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

What's wrong with this? It's the law.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/usao-ut/legacy/2013/06/03/guncard.pdf

The incongruity / disparity, if you will, comes in when the Fed. & State contradict one another... what is the 'real life' end result going to be?

Federal laws trumps state law. The only thing stopping the feds from coming in and enforcing the laws of the nation are their willingness to do it. Obama did not have the will nor the interest. Apparently the Trump admin does. If the states want to remove marijuana from the controlled substance list then do it federally.

Legally yes, what will it come to on a 'State' level minus the Feds?

 

[KeiserC]

When I was in California, I had a medical marijuana referral, and I also legally owned a number of guns.

I'd heard that if you registered with the state (which you could do, and get the official "pot card"), they would reject any firearm licences - but it wasn't really an issue, because I never got the card. I'd just bring the recommendation, along with my ID to the dispensary.

I would submit that if the 'respective' entities were in communication (like an investigation) this would not be the case...

Well, that's the thing. In California, the only "entities" that were aware of my doctor's recommendation for weed were the doctor, me, and the dispensaries that I would show it to.

What about the entities that would be involved on the NICS level? FBI, ATF, at least.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

Care to opine on 'legal recreational use' / possession of your current firearms? My state of VT and others are leaving us 'hanging' on this aspect.

In my county they've decided not to charge you unless you're in possession of more than 4 ounces.
This is in Texas mind you.
I'm on the fence on legalization. As someone who smokes occasionally I personally dont have a problem. I took care of business and retired early.
But then you have those who let it destroy their lives,which is why I never smoke when there is a job at hand.

As far as making it illegal to own guns if you use medical weed?
Total BS.

LOL... I have often been envious of 'your country'...

No...that's just my "county"

 

[theDoctorisIn]

When I was in California, I had a medical marijuana referral, and I also legally owned a number of guns.

I'd heard that if you registered with the state (which you could do, and get the official "pot card"), they would reject any firearm licences - but it wasn't really an issue, because I never got the card. I'd just bring the recommendation, along with my ID to the dispensary.

I would submit that if the 'respective' entities were in communication (like an investigation) this would not be the case...

Well, that's the thing. In California, the only "entities" that were aware of my doctor's recommendation for weed were the doctor, me, and the dispensaries that I would show it to.

What about the entities that would be involved on the NICS level? FBI, ATF, at least.

What about them?

How would they know about my doctor's recommendation?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

Nonsense.

The OP is just as wrong today as he was in 2011.

The courts have consistently held that designating marijuana users as prohibited persons is perfectly Constitutional, in no manner violating the Second Amendment.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Apparently, the ATF is only interested in letting you have guns if you're the one selling the drugs, not the one buying.

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The Washington Times

There is no argument here. This is a gross violation of our Constitutional right to bear arms. This is a backdoor attempt by this administration to implement gun control and another reason why we need to disband the ATF. It is another federal agency put in place to encroach on the liberties of every American.

I'd say it's more about weed control.
The carrot and the stick approach if you will.

Care to opine on 'legal recreational use' / possession of your current firearms? My state of VT and others are leaving us 'hanging' on this aspect.

In my county they've decided not to charge you unless you're in possession of more than 4 ounces.
This is in Texas mind you.
I'm on the fence on legalization. As someone who smokes occasionally I personally dont have a problem. I took care of business and retired early.
But then you have those who let it destroy their lives,which is why I never smoke when there is a job at hand.

As far as making it illegal to own guns if you use medical weed?
Total BS.

Again, what will be the strict interpretation for those states that are legalizing rec. use? They really don't spell anything out for those who are existing firearm enthusiasts/owners

I dont know if those who use recreationally in a legal weed state are on a list,while those who use it medicinally most certainly are.
If it were me I'd continue buying black market thus avoiding the legality issues.

Personally I find the legalization aspect as a way to make a more compliant voter base by playing on people's weaknesses.