McDonald Shooting: Justifiable ? Or Not ?

[JQPublic1]

I agree. The military is trained that way as are most LEO's. Problem is no one knows this and see his actions as over the top.

The standard law-enforcement firearms training regimen holds that you fire until your adversary is clearly disabled and no longer a threat. McDonald was down and disabled after the first two shots. There was no reason for any further shots. If there was any reason to believe McDonald was still a threat those cops could have taken cover behind their cars rather than openly expose themselves to it.

What vanDyke did is unprecedented, even in rogue police behavior. His action seems to be a psychotic loss of self-control.

Bullshit!
There is NO training that makes any LEO responsible for assessing whether the threat has been disabled or not. Once the LEO pulls the finger he/she is trained to neutralize the threat by firing at center mass.

"Gee it looks like this threat is 'disabled' because I've shot him in the foot so he can't run away so I'll stop shooting".
You'd be fucking dead in a week using your form of wrong-headed' logic.

If you are a cop in a city where such death by cop is routine, your life expectancy will decrease considerably...At some point targeted people will start arming themselves legally or illegally and resort to urban guerrilla warfare against the police.. That isn't too much different than the steps Americans took after the Boston Massacre.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

You think for one second that the CPD actually considers Van Dyke guilty of murder ? No. Not hardly. I'll bet there's not 1 single cop on the police force who thinks that. The police brass are following orders politically handed down from the mayor's office to charge the cop. Their MO here to avoid rioting. Period.

No. Murder 1 is not the proper and supportable charge in this example and it's sure to be reduced before vanDyke goes to trial -- or a Not Guilty could follow. I'm expecting his lawyer to enter some sort of mental deficiency plea or the prosecutor to reduce Murder 1 to Manslaughter 1, which would go forward.

Re: the riot potential; that will increase as time passes and is predicated on one thing -- whether or not vanDyke is convicted and sentenced. If he is acquitted there will be riots, not only in Chicago but in every city in the U.S. with a substantial Black population. There will be a rash of police assassinations -- affecting many good cops who are too intelligent, too sensible and too sane to do what vanDyke did. And that is what pisses me off! That is why it makes no sense to defend the actions of a loose cannon like vanDyke.

How many innocent cops will be sniped because of his stupidly wrongful action? And you know as well as I do what he did was wrong.

 

[JoeB131]

You seem to be missing an IMPORTANT ingredient in this whole thing, Mike. I'm not trying to belittle you in any way. I just meant to point out that the cop wasn't charged with murder because he did that. He was charged to keep the Chicago rioters at bay. Simple as that. Same as Baltimore, Ferguson, N. Charleston, SC, and all over the country. This country has been politically succumbing to the rioting mobs, and their leaders Obama, Sharpton, Jackson,Crump, et al.

You think for one second that the CPD actually considers Van Dyke guilty of murder ? No. Not hardly. I'll bet there's not 1 single cop on the police force who thinks that. The police brass are following orders politically handed down from the mayor's office to charge the cop. Their MO here to avoid rioting. Period.

The thing is, his fellow cops aren't going to be the ones judging him.

A judge is. A judge who will hve just watched McCarthy get fired and Alvarez voted out of office over this.

So your boy is going to prison. Muh-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!

 

[protectionist]

The thing is, his fellow cops aren't going to be the ones judging him.
A judge is. A judge who will hve just watched McCarthy get fired and Alvarez voted out of office over this.
So your boy is going to prison. Muh-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!

So you're happy with INJUSTICE against the guys who put their lives on the line, protecting us, and fighting against criminals and jihadists ? Hmmmm. How long is YOUR rap sheet ?

 

[JoeB131]

So you're happy with INJUSTICE against the guys who put their lives on the line, protecting us, and fighting against criminals and jihadists ? Hmmmm. How long is YOUR rap sheet ?

I think it involves all of maybe 10 moving violations over 30 years... but that isn't the point, guy.

This isn't an "injustice". This thug cop shot wasn't protecting us against a "criminal" or a "jihadist'. He shot a stoned kid 16 times, 14 of those when he was on the ground and helpless.

He needs to go to jail.

He needs to be made an example of for all the other guys who think that a badge and a gun gives them the right to push the rest of us around.

Because, Frankly, guys like this undermine the work of the good cops who are trying to do the right thing.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

Because, Frankly, guys like this undermine the work of the good cops who are trying to do the right thing.

Anything that any cop does that attracts public attention becomes an example which will influence the conduct of many other cops. Simply stated, publicized behavior sets examples, either good or bad.

Those cops (and delusional authoritarian civilians) who are doing their best to convince themselves and others that what Patrolman vanDyke did was right and proper are advising cops with receptive mindsets to do the same -- to behave like Cossacks rather than taxpayer funded civilian police officers whose actions are regulated specifically to avoid exactly what vanDyke has done.

Those who seem convinced that vanDyke's claim of self-defense will serve to acquit him are conditioned by the ease with which such methodical deceptions in the past could not be challenged because of absence of contradictory evidence. These individuals either are sufficiently delusional to ignore the existence of the video evidence in this case or they are sufficiently audacious as to claim it supports their methodical deception.

The bottom line is if vanDyke is acquitted the eventual effect will be an assumed standard of police conduct which assuredly will result in ordinary people being shot to death by cops for nothing more than indignant behavior during traffic stops. Because, believe it, there are cops who are quite capable of doing exactly that.