McDermott omits 'God' from Pledge

[jimnyc]

Rep. Jim McDermott, Washington Democrat, yesterday did not say the words "under God" as he led the House in its daily recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance.

Rep. Pete Sessions, Texas Republican, accused Mr. McDermott of "embarrassing the House" and proving that "he and those like him stand more for the liberal left than they do for our friends and neighbors."

"The liberal wing of the Democrat Party launched yet another salvo today in its ongoing battle to drive a wedge between Americans and the values and ideals we hold dear," Mr. Sessions said in a statement last night.

The House has overwhelmingly approved two resolutions expressing outrage at the June 2002 decision by the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals that it is unconstitutional to have schoolchildren recite the Pledge in class because it includes the words "under God."

Mr. McDermott was one of seven Democrats who voted against a March 2003 House resolution — approved 400-7 — that condemned the 9th Circuit decision as inconsistent with the Supreme Court's interpretation of the First Amendment. The House passed a similar resolution, 416-2 in June 2002, immediately after the court's decision, and Mr. McDermott joined 10 Democrats in voting "present."

"Congressman McDermott already knew that he had a problem with the words 'under God,' based on two votes he cast. The question is why he put himself in the position of embarrassing the House in this way," Mr. Sessions said.

When asked about yesterday's Pledge incident, Mr. McDermott's spokesman, Mike DeCesare, said his boss "hesitated, unsure of what he should do because the words 'under God' are under court review." Mr. DeCesare confirmed that his boss did omit the words.

Read the rest here:
http://washingtontimes.com/national/20040427-105435-1862r.htm

 

[5stringJeff]

This guy is along the lines of Barbara Boxer, Dianne Feinstein, Sheila-Jackson Lee, etc. as the most outspoken leftist in the House. Absolute moron.

 

[Moi]

I see nothing wrong with him remaining silent rather than utter those words. Isn't it the entire argument of many that by requiring the pledge of allegience we aren't necessarily forcing the religious aspect because the speaker doesn't have to say those words? Isn't the issue of prayer in public schools also that those who don't believe in them can just stay silent?

He chose silence on those two words but he still pledged allegience...I think that's the more important part of the pledge.

You may fire those salvos at me now for I'm sure that mine is an unpopular opinion.

 

[KLSuddeth]

My opinion is that I believe God exists in everything, but then again, my opinion in full isnt a popular around here either Moi, being that I am Spiritual, not religious. INW, Im metaphysical.
(I bet more people will throw crap at me than at you now)
LOL

:cof:

 

[jimnyc]

I have no problem with him not wanting to say those words, but then he shouldn't be the one leading the house in the recitation.

 

[mattskramer]

Whether or not to have "under God" in the pledge is not a big issue for me though, to be fair, I think it should be removed. It is unfair to those who don't believe in monotheism. To say that they should just shut up is also unfair. If the pledge were to have "under Allah" or "under Satan" or "under the gods of the land sea and air", would it be right to have Christians remain silent when such is spoken?

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by mattskramer
If the pledge were to have "under Allah" or "under Satan" or "under the gods of the land sea and air", would it be right to have Christians remain silent when such is spoken?

If I should move to an Islamic country, would it be fair for me to ask them to remove references to Allah from anything similar to the pledge?

 

[KLSuddeth]

thats a damn good point Jim. And one that I am going to be thinking about for sure.

thanks!

 

[_dmp_]

Fuck being fair. (shrug).

It's getting so that Catholics will SUE Mormon Churchs for not allowing them to have catholic beliefs available, should they choose to go to church at a Mormon temple. Watch. That will happen.

McDermott is a piece of shit. As a person. That trator flew to Iraq pre-Liberation, to meet with Saddam and tell him how much he's loved, and being victimized.


Seriously. I'd not shed a tear if God sent Baghdad Jim a heart-attack. The world would be a better place by far.

 

[mattskramer]

Originally posted by jimnyc
If I should move to an Islamic country, would it be fair for me to ask them to remove references to Allah from anything similar to the pledge?

Your comment implies that this is a Christian nation. Please define "Christian Nation" in concrete terms? What about non-Christians? Are they to be removed? It is interesting to read what they do with non-Muslims in Islamic countries.

 

[_dmp_]

Originally posted by mattskramer
Your comment implies that this is a Christian nation. Please define "Christian Nation" in concrete terms? What about non-Christians? Are they to be removed? It is interesting to read what they do with non-Muslims in Islamic countries.

gawd - you can't be fucking serious...

I have a retarded cousin - his IQ is about 55. Even HE learned how this country was founded. Even HE knows the VAST majority of the population of this Country claims Christianity.

Geesh.

Don't be a turd-fucker.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by mattskramer
Your comment implies that this is a Christian nation. Please define "Christian Nation" in concrete terms? What about non-Christians? Are they to be removed? It is interesting to read what they do with non-Muslims in Islamic countries.

You're putting words in my mouth. I'm simply saying that if I went to a country in the Middle East, I think it would be unfair of me to ask them to remove references to Allah from any public readings. I understand thet they a religious nations while we aren't, but there was no implication on my part.

Furthermore, the term 'under God' DOES NOT imply anything about Christianity.

 

[Moi]

In this country, where we have a right to religious expression, I don't think it's fair to REMOVE the words from our vocabulary or prohibit their use. However, that use should be voluntary and contextual. We should not force others to say them. I do not want to live in a country where I have to add the word God to everything I do- I should be free to add/delete them as my beliefs dictate.

If someone doesn't believe in God, what's the difference in them saying the pledge minus those words (or inserting whatever higher power they worship)...they are still pledging allegience to this country. It's no different than someone swearing an oath without actually having to swear to God...or on a bible. the point is still across and you've not infringed on their belief that there is no god (or a different god/s).

I pledge allegience to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under [Allah/God/Jehovah/The Goddess Diana/imperial wizard/grand poobah/silence] indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

It still works!

 

[mattskramer]

Originally posted by dmp
gawd - you can't be fucking serious...

I have a retarded cousin - his IQ is about 55. Even HE learned how this country was founded. Even HE knows the VAST majority of the population of this Country claims Christianity.

Geesh.

Don't be a turd-fucker.

Don't make it personal. The founding fathers were not necessarily right. Slavery was condoned. The authority at that time had no problem with pushing the "natives" west. They did not allow women to vote. They had their biases. The vas majority may be Christian. Does that mean that "under God" is to remain in the pledge?

Answer my question. Define "Christian Nation". Does it mean that the majority of the nation's citizens are Christian? So what?

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by Moi
under [Allah/God/Jehovah/The Goddess Diana/imperial wizard/grand poobah/silence] indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

In my opinion, saying 'under God' would apply to all the terms you just stated.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by dmp


Don't be a turd-fucker. [/B]

This is funny.

What you guys don't realize is that for this battle, right now, we need to lay off the christian social stuff. It's a turn off to some who might otherwise vote for our guy.

I know I'm advocating downplaying our faith, maybe that is wrong. But our country will not stand with dems this lathered and obstreperous. We must get moderates and the simply undecided on board for now, and they don't like this anti gay, bible thumping stuff. That's the truth. We need to be a big tent party for now.


The guns and taxes party!

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Moi
In this country, where we have a right to religious expression, I don't think it's fair to REMOVE the words from our vocabulary or prohibit their use. However, that use should be voluntary and contextual. We should not force others to say them. I do not want to live in a country where I have to add the word God to everything I do- I should be free to add/delete them as my beliefs dictate.

If someone doesn't believe in God, what's the difference in them saying the pledge minus those words (or inserting whatever higher power they worship)...they are still pledging allegience to this country. It's no different than someone swearing an oath without actually having to swear to God...or on a bible. the point is still across and you've not infringed on their belief that there is no god (or a different god/s).

I pledge allegience to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under [Allah/God/Jehovah/The Goddess Diana/imperial wizard/grand poobah/silence] indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

It still works!

Not only this, but when your founding documents tell you that there shall be no religous test, and there shall be no law made in regard to religion, the reciting of anything referencing religion or a God is completely voluntary by law.

Any reference to the Creator is a spirit of the law. Any action based in referencing the Creator is an action dictated by LETTER of the law.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
This is funny.

What you guys don't realize is that for this battle, right now, we need to lay off the christian social stuff. It's a turn off to some who might otherwise vote for our guy.

I know I'm advocating downplaying our faith, maybe that is wrong. But our country will not stand with dems this lathered and obstreperous. We must get moderates and the simply undecided on board for now, and they don't like this anti gay, bible thumping stuff. That's the truth. We need to be a big tent party for now.


The guns and taxes party!

God doesn't appreciate compromise.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by NewGuy
God doesn't appreciate compromise.

I won't appreciate kerry winning and bringing our nation to ruin. You'd prefer kerry win over bush, wouldn't you? You're here to make the party look ugly. Complex m.o., but I'm onto you!

 

[OCA]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
This is funny.

What you guys don't realize is that for this battle, right now, we need to lay off the christian social stuff. It's a turn off to some who might otherwise vote for our guy.

I know I'm advocating downplaying our faith, maybe that is wrong. But our country will not stand with dems this lathered and obstreperous. We must get moderates and the simply undecided on board for now, and they don't like this anti gay, bible thumping stuff. That's the truth. We need to be a big tent party for now.


The guns and taxes party!

RWA I don't get you man, first you say no compromise at all and now on two of the biggest tenets of the Republican party you are saying we should stop talking about religion and gay rights. ?????