Mccain: American's Won't Pick Lettuce for $50/hr

You know full well I was being sarcastic---people who hate government interference shouldn't expect any help from them. And I wanna go through these "poor" peoples homes and see what all they have wasted money on. The government doesn't have a monopoly on waste.
i would bet my bottom dollar, they have alot less waste than you would think, in their homes.....or in their driveways....

what i am saying is that the MIDDLE class- HARD WORKING PEOPLE that have paid their bills and their taxes their entire lives might actually need the gvt's help this winter....i have no problem with them getting the help, if they need it and can't make due on their wood, to heat their homes....money WELL SPENT by the gvt, in my book....verses a bridge to nowhere as an example, or verses bailing out a fannie mae or freddie mac or bear sterns or the waste in Iraq, or the giving away for FREE our leases of our land to the oil companies and on and on and on and on of their thoughtless, and wasteful spending of our money.

simple as that....

care
 
for the last time, they are not taking from others....they have MORE THAN CONTRIBUTED their fair share of gvt taxes and gotten nothing in return so far....they have given their taxes towards helping the poorest among us survive, and towards things that others in the State or feds thought were important...like bailing out Bear Sterns and fannie mae with their taxes....and giving a tax credit to a big corporation, corporate welfare so to say....

if they need to get something back, from all that they have given and contributed towards their society/gvt over their lives, they are NOT in any way, taking money from others....you are just being obtuse....

btw, you don't post on another board under the name of Dano or DanoDeMano do you? :)

you got me thinking and although i have never met anyone exactly like you, i did meet someone that seems close to you on another board over the years and i haven't seen him around for a while....just wondering if you are him?

Care

I am only DiamondDave wherever I post

Again... you paid taxes in the past for past government runnings... just like paying for bowling league last year does not mean you should get free service for it this year because you don't have the money available.... on top of the fact that NOBODY OWES YOU CRAP, not the government, not other individuals, NOBODY

And you will not see me advocating the corporate bail outs either... and you never have.. and you will continually see me as an advocate of an equal burden tax system with the elimination of a complicated system with loopholes.... but nice try
 
i would bet my bottom dollar, they have alot less waste than you would think, in their homes.....or in their driveways....

what i am saying is that the MIDDLE class- HARD WORKING PEOPLE that have paid their bills and their taxes their entire lives might actually need the gvt's help this winter....i have no problem with them getting the help, if they need it and can't make due on their wood, to heat their homes....money WELL SPENT by the gvt, in my book....verses a bridge to nowhere as an example, or verses bailing out a fannie mae or freddie mac or bear sterns or the waste in Iraq, or the giving away for FREE our leases of our land to the oil companies and on and on and on and on of their thoughtless, and wasteful spending of our money.

simple as that....

care

seriously---you think the government should pay them to live where they "can't afford it just because they want to be rugged individualists ?
 
Ok, I'm ready to ask...how many of you actually live in a place where illegal immigrants are a part of the work culture, and the area is agricultural (as opposed to living in NYC, where immigrants work in certain industries, but you don't exactly deal with them closely on a daily basis)?

I live in an area where we are dependent upon immigrant labor. It isn't because there aren't whites who aren't willing to do it. It's because there's more work than there are people looking for work.

And I've never heard of $50/hour picking lettuce, that's the stupidist thing I've ever heard in my life. Generally when you're handling raw produce in the field, you are paid by the crate, flat, whatever. It's all about how fast and efficiently you work. It is hard, hard, hard work and the days are long, and the season is short. You don't see as many whites doing it because they don't belong to a culture that moves according to the harvests of different areas....farm workers do. They move (and transportation is not a problem...they have their own, the companies will pick them up and take them home) from Mexico, up to the US and around the US harvesting at the same harvests every year. It's a lifestyle they will employ until they can find something better, then they settle down, either in Mexico or in the US. Our award-winning soccer coach started out as a migrant worker at 16. He met his wife traveling with members of his family around to the different camps...it turned out she was from the same village.

How many white people live that way? Are we lazy? Hell no, we just aren't that desperate to begin with. We don't typically send our kids out of the home at 16 to work in foreign countries for a pittance with no supervision.

I see people all the time who do work seasonal jobs who aren't immigrants...the ones who do this are typically lazier than the ones who don't because they only work a few months...then they collect unemployment, then they collect welfare/foodstamps.....then they go back to work for a few months. But they don't follow the work. Still, I don't think it's because we're lazy that we don't take these jobs. I still think it's just because we aren't desperate enough.

The children who are raised by immigrant farm workers are exposed to all sorts of hardships, illnesses and predation. It's a horrible, hard life. Nobody in their right mind would choose it unless they absolutely had to, to get out of a worse life.
 
seriously---you think the government should pay them to live where they "can't afford it just because they want to be rugged individualists ?
it's not like they can just pick up and move Dillo, get real! these people have mortgages on homes that they have to pay, and the realestate market is in the toilet, they can't sell....not everyone is as mobile as you are or they are not as mobile as you seem to think they are....or can be...sure, that's an easy thing to rattle off your tongue and Dave's tongue....while Dave used the gvt for his well being, which were MY TAXES, and benefited from them as he has stated before...but OF COURSE, people like him think they EARNED what they got off the government's tit....just typical bs.

i don't expect YOU to pay a penny for them, like i said, they have MORE THAN PAID FOR THE HELP THEMSELVES, out of their own taxes over the years.....

i don't even know if they will need help come this winter, but they could, and if they do, i would support helping them....over bear sterns, over fannie mae, and over freddie mac and over the Airlines and over the Energy companies.....or GE.....so if help is being given out, take care of OUR OWN PEOPLE, individuals first, with CRITICAL ISSUES, such as heat....

crud, our taxes help all of you when you have hurricanes or floods or fires, and building fences to keep the immigrants out, and droughts, and all that other crap, but good ole you, you as in the "general you" :), doesn't want to do a damn thing for those in the northif they get in to some crisis....well, kiss my grits....

care
 
Ok, I'm ready to ask...how many of you actually live in a place where illegal immigrants are a part of the work culture, and the area is agricultural (as opposed to living in NYC, where immigrants work in certain industries, but you don't exactly deal with them closely on a daily basis)?

I live in an area where we are dependent upon immigrant labor. It isn't because there aren't whites who aren't willing to do it. It's because there's more work than there are people looking for work.

And I've never heard of $50/hour picking lettuce, that's the stupidist thing I've ever heard in my life. Generally when you're handling raw produce in the field, you are paid by the crate, flat, whatever. It's all about how fast and efficiently you work. It is hard, hard, hard work and the days are long, and the season is short. You don't see as many whites doing it because they don't belong to a culture that moves according to the harvests of different areas....farm workers do. They move (and transportation is not a problem...they have their own, the companies will pick them up and take them home) from Mexico, up to the US and around the US harvesting at the same harvests every year. It's a lifestyle they will employ until they can find something better, then they settle down, either in Mexico or in the US. Our award-winning soccer coach started out as a migrant worker at 16. He met his wife traveling with members of his family around to the different camps...it turned out she was from the same village.

How many white people live that way? Are we lazy? Hell no, we just aren't that desperate to begin with. We don't typically send our kids out of the home at 16 to work in foreign countries for a pittance with no supervision.

I see people all the time who do work seasonal jobs who aren't immigrants...the ones who do this are typically lazier than the ones who don't because they only work a few months...then they collect unemployment, then they collect welfare/foodstamps.....then they go back to work for a few months. But they don't follow the work. Still, I don't think it's because we're lazy that we don't take these jobs. I still think it's just because we aren't desperate enough.

The children who are raised by immigrant farm workers are exposed to all sorts of hardships, illnesses and predation. It's a horrible, hard life. Nobody in their right mind would choose it unless they absolutely had to, to get out of a worse life.

good info to know allie, thanks....
 
Eventually either the obscenely wealthy of this nation help those in need or when those in need become too high a percentage of society they start helping themselves to wealth wherever and however they can.

Of course, society seriously breaks down when that happens too much, and then pretty much everyone is worse off, but explaining that obvious fact to militant libertopians is a waste of time.

They all seem to think they can defend themselves against a significant breakdown of civil society with their guns.

I suppose they imagine that everything else will work fine, that the stores will still be stocked, that it will be safe for people to go on as always, except that poor people will come to their houses to get what they need, much like Zombies, and these Atlases will just have to defend their homes from invasion.

Here's a clue, folks...gated communities aren't safe havens from real social disorder, they're merely soft targets.

Crime is nothing but anarchy on a small scale, folks.

Disenfrachise enough people and anarchy dominates society and nothing, absolutely nothing works right.

anyone who lives ina ghetto already understands that since they're already living that reality.
 
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So it is either give them something for nothing or crime ridden anarchy?


Horseshit

Basic human nature is a harsh mistress, isn't it, DD?

A fuctional Society benefits most everyone well enough that they can live or society stops being fuctional.

I'm sorry if this cost of civilization upsets you, of course, but there it is.
 
Basic human nature is a harsh mistress, isn't it, DD?

A fuctional Society benefits most everyone well enough that they can live or society stops being fuctional.

I'm sorry if this cost of civilization upsets you, of course, but there it is.

It does not mean you cave in to the bums...


A functional society has productive members all around... not a bunch of fearful ones who decide it is either handouts or get robbed and there is nothing else to be done...

You fight t he crime (something liberals hate) and bring back personal responsibility (something liberals hate)... work is the key
 
it's not like they can just pick up and move Dillo, get real! these people have mortgages on homes that they have to pay, and the realestate market is in the toilet, they can't sell....not everyone is as mobile as you are or they are not as mobile as you seem to think they are....or can be...sure, that's an easy thing to rattle off your tongue and Dave's tongue....while Dave used the gvt for his well being, which were MY TAXES, and benefited from them as he has stated before...but OF COURSE, people like him think they EARNED what they got off the government's tit....just typical bs.

i don't expect YOU to pay a penny for them, like i said, they have MORE THAN PAID FOR THE HELP THEMSELVES, out of their own taxes over the years.....

i don't even know if they will need help come this winter, but they could, and if they do, i would support helping them....over bear sterns, over fannie mae, and over freddie mac and over the Airlines and over the Energy companies.....or GE.....so if help is being given out, take care of OUR OWN PEOPLE, individuals first, with CRITICAL ISSUES, such as heat....

crud, our taxes help all of you when you have hurricanes or floods or fires, and building fences to keep the immigrants out, and droughts, and all that other crap, but good ole you, you as in the "general you" :), doesn't want to do a damn thing for those in the northif they get in to some crisis....well, kiss my grits....

care

FEMA: Federal Aid Programs For Maine Disaster Recovery
 
It does not mean you cave in to the bums...
Formerly productive members of society now unable to support themselves because the economy collapsed are not bums, dude, they're citizens


A functional society has productive members all around... not a bunch of fearful ones who decide it is either handouts or get robbed and there is nothing else to be done...

Yes, that is true. And that is what we should be striving to keep alive, too.

You fight t he crime (something liberals hate) and bring back personal responsibility (something liberals hate)... work is the key

Your belief system about people you presume to be liberals is somewhat confused, sport.

I cannot be held responsible for your biases, nor do I feel any need to address them in some kind of childish exchange of insults.
 
Business owners hell---illegals come to a town and hire themselves out to do what they can make money at. Common Americans turn a blind eye and pay for their labor because it's cheaper. In Austin you can find an illegal to do nearly every kind of job that involves manual labor that you can think of.



Agreed--If "middle class" America would like to jump in and take up the slack they are free to do so. But look out--they may have to actually do physical labor.

First of all it isn't an issue of the middle class being lazy or unable to do the work. It is the CEO's and owners of these corporations, you know the ones who have to sweat their asses off and make $8.00 an hour to tile a house in Phoenix, or make sure the drip system is working properly, that are the real victims here! :eusa_whistle:
 
It does not mean you cave in to the bums...


A functional society has productive members all around... not a bunch of fearful ones who decide it is either handouts or get robbed and there is nothing else to be done...

You fight t he crime (something liberals hate) and bring back personal responsibility (something liberals hate)... work is the key

Right, and Bush/McCain are the personal responsibility spokespeople! Bush couldn't even account for his "C" average in his Yale transcripts, what makes you think, what you post carry's any weight?:eusa_whistle:
 

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