Massacre / Gun Control summary

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Wolfstrike, Oct 4, 2017.

  1. Bootney Lee Farnsworth
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    Bootney Lee Farnsworth VIP Member

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    War tests the resolve of everyone. No doubt. You are making a great point.

    War is about mind control. You don't have to kill all of your enemies. You just have to kill enough of them to make those remaining give up. War is also not about who is right, but who is left (as in. who is left standing).

    But, I don't want to deviate from the entire point of this discussion. To say that we should not have better guns, or that we should have no guns, based solely on the presumption that we could never hope to defend ourselves against the U.S. Military is, in my opinion, not only fallacious, but supports the reverse position. If our military is so powerful that it is impossible to overthrow a tyrannical government, we need better guns, not more restrictions and fewer options.
     
  2. John Shaw
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    John Shaw Senior Member

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    I don't think it's impossible to overthrow a tyrannical government. I just question whether it's possible through force. Which is all automatic weapons really provide; brute force.

    I would never advocate for banning guns. I just question whether we need guns that a sixty+ year old man can use to kill 58 people in around 10 minutes, and injure hundreds more.

    Besides, wouldn't fully-auto probably be worse against the military than semi-auto? You would need precision, and I don't think fully-auto is known for its precision, though I'm far from a firearms expert.
     
  3. Bootney Lee Farnsworth
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    Bootney Lee Farnsworth VIP Member

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    Well, the military, which is controlled by a government that could become tyrannical in a hear beat, has them. Those guns are effective in carrying out the work for which they were designed.

    The focus should not be on the tools he employed, but on the reason why this 64 yo man felt compelled to plan out this massacre the way he did, when he apparently had plenty to live for.
     
  4. John Shaw
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    John Shaw Senior Member

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    Mostly agree. The lack of a motive is probably the most infuriating thing about it all.

    I'm pretty sure M4s, which I believe the military still uses, can switch from fully-auto to semi-auto, and the vast majority of the time they use semi-auto anyway because it's easier to control. They use fully-auto for clearing buildings where accuracy isn't as important as firepower. They also use fully-automatic shotguns. Though this is just stuff I remember my friend telling me when he was in the military. Hopefully I'm not misrepresenting him.

    The root cause of the issue isn't really about guns; it's something way deeper and more complex. But as I've repeated several times now, I'm not sure why we need weapons that are mostly just good for mowing down people in tight spaces.
     
  5. Bootney Lee Farnsworth
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    Bootney Lee Farnsworth VIP Member

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    Fair enough. Why can't the lefties be satisfied with the status quo? Automatic weapons are currently legal to own, but are highly regulated, hard to get, and even harder/more expensive to maintain under current law. Leave it alone, and we won't feel compelled to push back. :dunno:
     
  6. John Shaw
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    John Shaw Senior Member

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    It's just a hard topic with no clear solution. I personally don't see the purpose of bump stocks. You don't need them to hunt. They likely wouldn't do you much good even in such an extreme scenario that we've been discussing. As far as I know, they're mostly just good for fucking around and for slaughtering large numbers of people in a scenario that the military wouldn't let you catch them in anyway (like a large crowd of unassuming and unaware concert-goers). The solution isn't solely in banning bump stocks or powerful weapons, particularly as the previous record-holder just used a semi-auto AR15. But I don't see the harm in it, as long as you don't start pushing for more, like banning ordinary weapons that actually have a purpose.
     
  7. HappyJoy
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    HappyJoy Gold Member

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    You really did miss the point, but that's OK.
     
  8. Bootney Lee Farnsworth
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    Bootney Lee Farnsworth VIP Member

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    And that, my friend, is the real issue. The left wants a total ban on all firearms. They will never say that now because it is very unpopular, but that is the ultimate goal. You can't give them an inch. They are not trustworthy. They will keep chipping away at it until it's gone. So, while a ban on bumpers is probably a good idea, I do not support it for the sole reason that the left does not deserve it. They are lying shits who will keep pushing for more. They will not leave well-enough alone. So....

    Fuck all you fucking commies. We are getting motherfucking machine guns. Fuck off.
    :dunno:
     
  9. Bootney Lee Farnsworth
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    Bootney Lee Farnsworth VIP Member

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    Yeah, but so did you...many times.
     
  10. HappyJoy
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    HappyJoy Gold Member

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    Next time, bring a point with you.
     

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