Many Recipients of Government Funds Don't Know they Receive Government Funds

[Toro]

I'd argue that tax breaks aren't government benefits, but there is certainly enough on this list to show that a significant number of recipients of government funds don't know they receive government funds.

"Keep your government hands off my Medicare," said a citizen attending a town hall meeting in Simpsonville, S.C., in 2009. Many Americans like him -- who benefit from federal largesse but don't realize it -- favor deep cuts to government programs.

Cornell Chronicle: Recipients of federal aid say they're not

We are definitely seeing that here in Florida, where current Governor Rick Scott is polling at all time lows of 29%. Yet Scott is doing exactly what he said he'd do and nothing more.

 

[Neotrotsky]

I'd argue that tax breaks aren't government benefits, but there is certainly enough on this list to show that a significant number of recipients of government funds don't know they receive government funds.

"Keep your government hands off my Medicare," said a citizen attending a town hall meeting in Simpsonville, S.C., in 2009. Many Americans like him -- who benefit from federal largesse but don't realize it -- favor deep cuts to government programs.

Cornell Chronicle: Recipients of federal aid say they're not

We are definitely seeing that here in Florida, where current Governor Rick Scott is polling at all time lows of 29%. Yet Scott is doing exactly what he said he'd do and nothing more.

Just a note

If tax credits are fully refundable, past the point of zero and still refundable, then yes

If tax credits take tax liability to zero but not lower and not refundable- then no


Did you know that even the Earned Income Credit has a limit.
The IRS will compute against your payroll taxes (SS, Medicare) and can not be more than those totals.

In effect, the worse the Gov't can do then is have a zero cash flow with an individual on their taxes.

 

[Ravi]

That's pretty funny.

But how are tax breaks not government bennies? People that own their homes can pay less in taxes than people that don't.

 

[Neotrotsky]

That's pretty funny.

But how are tax breaks not government bennies? People that own their homes can pay less in taxes than people that don't.

Unless one assumes that all money belongs to the gov't,

Keeping more of your OWN money from the gov't that you earned on your own is not a subsidy.

Getting money from the gov't that was never earned by you is a true subsidy

 

[Zona]

Hello....Mr. Bachmann. See its not his fault..he didnt know and neither did his wife.

 

[Ravi]

That's pretty funny.

But how are tax breaks not government bennies? People that own their homes can pay less in taxes than people that don't.

Unless one assumes that all money belongs to the gov't,

Keeping more of your OWN money from the gov't that you earned on your own is not a subsidy.

Getting money from the gov't that was never earned by you is a true subsidy

So a renter's money belongs to the government but a homeowner's money doesn't?

 

[Neotrotsky]

Hello....Mr. Bachmann. See its not his fault..he didnt know and neither did his wife.

Not following

But hey- more power to you

 

[Ravi]

I mean, seriously, getting a mortgage deduction is also a type of government subsidized housing.

 

[Ravi]

Oh wait, it's on the chart, my bad.

 

[Neotrotsky]

That's pretty funny.

But how are tax breaks not government bennies? People that own their homes can pay less in taxes than people that don't.

Unless one assumes that all money belongs to the gov't,

Keeping more of your OWN money from the gov't that you earned on your own is not a subsidy.

Getting money from the gov't that was never earned by you is a true subsidy

So a renter's money belongs to the government but a homeowner's money doesn't?

Sorry, I am not following your logic

Again unless you assume all money belongs to the gov't, they are not giving you more money with a tax break

100,000/year max limit
tax 1,000

tax break 500-
99,500 income- not above original max
No subsidy- you are only getting your own money back
-----------------

Same 100,000/yr max
tax 1000

fully refundable tax break of 1500

New max income above limit- 100,500
Getting back MORE than your money- subsidy

 

[Susan45]

I'd argue that tax breaks aren't government benefits, but there is certainly enough on this list to show that a significant number of recipients of government funds don't know they receive government funds.

"Keep your government hands off my Medicare," said a citizen attending a town hall meeting in Simpsonville, S.C., in 2009. Many Americans like him -- who benefit from federal largesse but don't realize it -- favor deep cuts to government programs.

Cornell Chronicle: Recipients of federal aid say they're not

We are definitely seeing that here in Florida, where current Governor Rick Scott is polling at all time lows of 29%. Yet Scott is doing exactly what he said he'd do and nothing more.

Very interesting. And something that I learned today has given me much room for thought. I was reading about Warren Buffet and what companies he plans on buying next. This is what I read.

Billionaire super-rich Barack Obama fundraiser Warren Buffett went on Bloomberg TV today and named three companies he's thinking of buying: Archer Daniels Midland, Exelon, and General Dynamics.

All three are companies that depend on Big Government for their profits.

General Dynamics is the No. four government contractor for FY 2011.

Buffett Placing Big Bets on Big Government - Warren Buffett - Fox Nation

And then I got to thinking. If the funds get cut off to these contractors a lot of people will lose and there probably some that aren't even aware they exist because of a government program. Say you work for a company that makes screws for some equipment that GD builds. GD goes out of business and of course your company probably does too. You might even think you are not going to be hurt but I can see this really hurting people.

I just can't help but think that most people haven't really thought this through.

 

[Intense]

I'd argue that tax breaks aren't government benefits, but there is certainly enough on this list to show that a significant number of recipients of government funds don't know they receive government funds.

"Keep your government hands off my Medicare," said a citizen attending a town hall meeting in Simpsonville, S.C., in 2009. Many Americans like him -- who benefit from federal largesse but don't realize it -- favor deep cuts to government programs.

Cornell Chronicle: Recipients of federal aid say they're not

We are definitely seeing that here in Florida, where current Governor Rick Scott is polling at all time lows of 29%. Yet Scott is doing exactly what he said he'd do and nothing more.

Just a note

If tax credits are fully refundable, past the point of zero and still refundable, then yes

If tax credits take tax liability to zero but not lower and not refundable- then no


Did you know that even the Earned Income Credit has a limit.
The IRS will compute against your payroll taxes (SS, Medicare) and can not be more than those totals.

In effect, the worse the Gov't can do then is have a zero cash flow with an individual on their taxes.

You are talking Income Taxes which are a small portion of the Total. The Government is generally involved in every stage of Service, Production, Distribution, and even point of Sale in one way or another. A phone bill or utility bill will show you that.

 

[Neotrotsky]

I mean, seriously, getting a mortgage deduction is also a type of government subsidized housing.

It is on the chart

Actually no. With a interest mortgage deduction, one can afford the payment on their own earnings and they are getting a reduction in tax to gov't.

In a program like say Section 8, Belmont etc, the person can not afford the payment at all and could never live there on their own income. The gov't gives them money beyond their earnings - a subsidy

Take away the interest deduction, the person can still live there
Take away the subsidy, the person can not because it is beyond their means at that point in time.

 

[Trajan]

I'd argue that tax breaks aren't government benefits, but there is certainly enough on this list to show that a significant number of recipients of government funds don't know they receive government funds.

"Keep your government hands off my Medicare," said a citizen attending a town hall meeting in Simpsonville, S.C., in 2009. Many Americans like him -- who benefit from federal largesse but don't realize it -- favor deep cuts to government programs.

Cornell Chronicle: Recipients of federal aid say they're not

We are definitely seeing that here in Florida, where current Governor Rick Scott is polling at all time lows of 29%. Yet Scott is doing exactly what he said he'd do and nothing more.

they need that book from whats his face that advertises what gov. money they can get, then they can read it, and discover they get half the shit in it already

 

[Oddball]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19v5Kjmc8FI]‪The Obama Stash of Stimulus Cash -- Dolla Dolla Bills, Y'all!!‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[dblack]

That's pretty funny.

But how are tax breaks not government bennies? People that own their homes can pay less in taxes than people that don't.

Unless one assumes that all money belongs to the gov't,

Keeping more of your OWN money from the gov't that you earned on your own is not a subsidy.

Getting money from the gov't that was never earned by you is a true subsidy

That's not really the issue. The issue is unequal taxation. That's no different that wealth redistribution.

 

[Neotrotsky]

I'd argue that tax breaks aren't government benefits, but there is certainly enough on this list to show that a significant number of recipients of government funds don't know they receive government funds.



Cornell Chronicle: Recipients of federal aid say they're not

We are definitely seeing that here in Florida, where current Governor Rick Scott is polling at all time lows of 29%. Yet Scott is doing exactly what he said he'd do and nothing more.

Just a note

If tax credits are fully refundable, past the point of zero and still refundable, then yes

If tax credits take tax liability to zero but not lower and not refundable- then no


Did you know that even the Earned Income Credit has a limit.
The IRS will compute against your payroll taxes (SS, Medicare) and can not be more than those totals.

In effect, the worse the Gov't can do then is have a zero cash flow with an individual on their taxes.

You are talking Income Taxes which are a small portion of the Total. The Government is generally involved in every stage of Service, Production, Distribution, and even point of Sale in one way or another. A phone bill or utility bill will show you that.

If your point is there are a lot more taxes out there- I agree

I was only addressing the article which appears to be poorly trying to "equate" in some manner welfare to tax credits and how tax credits do not necessarily represent an increase to one's total earned income.

 

[Neotrotsky]

That's pretty funny.

But how are tax breaks not government bennies? People that own their homes can pay less in taxes than people that don't.

Unless one assumes that all money belongs to the gov't,

Keeping more of your OWN money from the gov't that you earned on your own is not a subsidy.

Getting money from the gov't that was never earned by you is a true subsidy

That's not really the issue. The issue is unequal taxation. That's no different that wealth redistribution.

Unequal taxation indeed. Something like the top the Top 10 Percent of Earners Paid 70 Percent of Federal Income Taxes


I would agree that wealth distribution requires some form of taxation.
However, tax breaks allow one to keep more of their wealth that they earned; it is not wealth being redistributed TO them. It is their wealth NOT being redistributed by the gov't

 

[dblack]

[Unequal taxation indeed. Something like the top the Top 10 Percent of Earners Paid 70 Percent of Federal Income Taxes

Yep. It's not fair.

I would agree that wealth distribution requires some form of taxation.
However, tax breaks allow one to keep more of their wealth that they earned; it is not wealth being redistributed TO them. It is their wealth NOT being redistributed by the gov't

They allow some people to keep more of their wealth, but only those who jump the the right hoops. That's the issue.

It all boils down to the same thing. The state applies the law differently to different people. It is an affront to equal protection. Taxes should be about generate revenue for the government we need - not social engineering.

 

[Neotrotsky]

[Unequal taxation indeed. Something like the top the Top 10 Percent of Earners Paid 70 Percent of Federal Income Taxes

Yep. It's not fair.

I would agree that wealth distribution requires some form of taxation.
However, tax breaks allow one to keep more of their wealth that they earned; it is not wealth being redistributed TO them. It is their wealth NOT being redistributed by the gov't

They allow some people to keep more of their wealth. That's the issue.

It all boils down to the same thing. The state applies the law differently to different people. It is an affront to equal protection. Taxes should be about generate revenue for the government we need - not social engineering.

I hear you

Anything would be better than what we have now
Our current system requires too much political input

Something like Flat Tax or possible even a Negative Income Tax