Making evil corporations pay up

Discussion in 'Politics' started by EdwardBaiamonte, Jan 23, 2012.

  1. EdwardBaiamonte
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    EdwardBaiamonte Gold Member

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    By far the most intelligent thing is to eliminate business taxes altogether since they are passed on anyway to consumers in the form of higher prices. GE, for example, has 1000 tax professionals shifting business all around the globe not because it makes them more efficient but because it saves taxes. It makes them very very inefficient and less competitive to waste time and resources that way.

    What it does do though is pander to the 100% pure ignorance of liberal voters who think corporate taxes make evil corporations pay up when really it is they who are paying up in higher prices!!
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2012
  2. kyzr
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    kyzr Gold Member

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    I hope the countries that they move businesses to nationalizes those outsourced businesses, and then GE will see paying a few bucks in taxes is well worth it.
     
  3. EdwardBaiamonte
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    EdwardBaiamonte Gold Member

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    of course as a liberal you cant possibly understand. Whatever they pay it will be passed on consumers in higher prices. A tax is a cost just like a cost for raw materials. The customer pays!! Got it???
     
  4. Valox
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    Valox Senior Member

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    There is no consensus in the literature about the corporate tax incidence, and therefore claiming that corporate taxes strictly fall on the consumer is a misnomer. If anything, the literature points to depressed wages. Therefore, the worker bears the burden of the tax, rather than the consumer or shareholder.

    Of course you are going to spew some nonsense that I don't understand. In fact, anyone who disagrees with you probably doesn't understand, right?
     
  5. EdwardBaiamonte
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    EdwardBaiamonte Gold Member

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    Corporations are tax collectors not tax payers. We don't worry about who pays for the cost of metal and glass in a new car because we know the customers pay it. We know we can't make evil corporations pay up by increasing their costs. We know a corporation exists only to the extend it can pass its costs on to customers. An auto company pays for glass metal and taxes with the same money!!

    If indeed some of the tax cost comes out of wages rather than prices the result is still the same. Costs go up and competitiveness goes down. So lets end the tax and let people see the true cost of liberal idiotic government.
     
  6. Valox
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    Valox Senior Member

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    If you want to keep believing that the consumer solely bears the corporate tax, then so be it. However, a plethora of evidence shows otherwise.

    Me thinks, you don't want have a conversation about this, but rather just rant. So, rant away.
     
  7. EdwardBaiamonte
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    EdwardBaiamonte Gold Member

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    Walter Williams: There's an entire subject area in economics, known as tax incidence, that investigates who bears the burden of a tax. It turns out that the burden of a tax is not necessarily borne by the party or entity upon whom it is levied. For example, if a sales tax is levied on a cigarette retailer, the retailer does not bear the full burden of the tax. Part of it will be shifted forward to customers in the form of higher product prices. The exact amount of the shifting depends upon market supply and demand conditions.

    What about raising taxes on corporations as a means to get them to pay their "rightful share of government"? If a tax is levied on a corporation and if it is to survive, it will have one of several responses or some combination thereof. One response is to raise the price of its product, so customers share part of the burden. Another response is to lower dividends, so shareholders share a part of the burden. And a considerable portion of reduced dividend burden falls on ordinary non-rich people. According to the Tax Foundation, 19 percent of federal tax returns report dividend income but 42 percent of taxpayers older than 65 report dividend income. Therefore, it is people, not some legal fiction called a corporation, who bear the burden of the tax. Because corporations have these responses to the imposition of a tax, they are merely government tax collectors.

    The largest burden of corporate taxes is borne by workers. We discover that by asking a simple question, such as: Which workers on a road construction project earn the higher pay, those employed moving dirt with shovels and wheelbarrows or those doing the same atop giant earthmovers? You'd guess the guys operating the earthmovers, but why? It's not because they're unionized or because construction contractors have a fondness for earthmover operators. It's because those workers have more capital (tools) to work with and are thereby more productive. Higher productivity translates into higher wages.

    Tax policies that raise the cost of capital formation — such as capital gains taxes, low depreciation allowances and corporate taxes — reduce capital formation. As a result, workers have less capital, lower productivity and lower wage growth. In 1980, Joseph Stiglitz, now a Nobel laureate, said that workers share the highest corporate tax burden in the form of lower wages. A number of economic studies, including that of the Congressional Budget Office, show that workers bear anywhere from 45 to 75 percent of the corporate tax burden. Adding to the burden is the fact that capital has the kind of mobility that labor doesn't. Corporate capital can flee to other countries easily, but workers cannot.

    Politicians and leftist elite get away with corporate tax demagoguery because economists haven't done well in making our subject understandable to ordinary people, not to mention that we have derelict news media people with little understanding.
     
  8. Valox
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    Valox Senior Member

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    Thank you for proving what I originally said - if anyone bears the burden of corporate taxes, it is the worker, not the consumer.
     
  9. EdwardBaiamonte
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    EdwardBaiamonte Gold Member

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    its so very nice of liberals to impose that tax on workers isn't it? Many workers are liberals who are sure they are making the evil corporations pay up!!!
     
  10. kyzr
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    kyzr Gold Member

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    I'm no liberal. You misunderstand the difference between outsourcing to save "taxes" (and labor) and risk management. When GE moves factories to China, as an example, there is a risk that China (example) could nationalize those factories. The choice is pay US taxes, or risk losing those factories. Got it?? Kill the golden goose and it all turns to shit. Got it??
     

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