Majority Leader Eric Cantor touts strategy to grow economy

[Wry Catcher]

After more than a trillion dollars in government stimulus having had a minimal effect, rdean STILL thinks government is the answer.

The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act provided jobs, fewer people lost their homes and stimulated their local economies.

Recovery.gov - Tracking the Money

Most of the projects will provide long term benefits. Rebuilding an infrastructure ignored by advocates of 'conservative principals' was and remains a stupid idea motivated by selfish greed and callous disregard for future generations.
If PC had her way, Golden Gate Park, Central Park and open space in the cities between SF and NY wouldn't exist, instead soviet style tenaments would be there providing housing for the 'middle class', non-unionized labor supporting by there labor both the poorest of the poor and the richest of the rich.

AHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Recovery.gov is an Obama Propaganda site. They are just making up crap.

Of course. I was fooled. Each time I cross the Bay Bridge, see the fourth bore being drilled in Contra Costa County or dozens of other projects under construction by private sector contractors and private sector employees I'm only seeing propaganda.
You're blinded by your partisanship and pretty fucking stupid to suggest this a a propaganda site.
Anyone who looks at the link can see projects in their community. Well, all but the willfully ignorant and the stupid - ignorant because they cannot think for themselves.

 

[Mad Scientist]

You are on the Republicans side.

Wrong. I'm a T.E.A Partier.

War with "Libya"? That's ridiculous.

You didn't get the memo did ya'? Obama declared a National State Of Emergency over Libya on the 25th:
Obama declares national state of emergency over Libya | The Cable
Why just Libya and not all the OTHER middle east nations in the midst of revolution? Have thought of asking those kinds of questions?

Republicans blocked a bill that would entice companies to bring jobs back to this country.

Do you even read your own links? :

The latest jobs bill from Senate Democrats - a plan to punish firms that ship jobs overseas - failed to clear a key procedural hurdle Tuesday after even some Democrats complained that the measure would hamper the ability of U.S. companies to compete in foreign markets.
Four Democrats and Sen. Joseph I. Lieberman (I-Conn.) voted with a united Republican caucus to block the bill.

Just as a reminder; The Democrats control the Senate these days.

The Health Care bill will never be as good as it can be with Republicans blocking it.

It already passed the house and senate. Remember? Back when the Dems controlled both? The Republicans are trying to DEFUND it. Get your fags straight.

As far as our trading partners, they work through the Chamber of Commerce, the group that contributes more than 90% to Republicans, to make sure they can continue to swindle the middle class.

Bullshit! Our trading partners are working with and through the laws presented in the agreements they signed. Happily too as they're in their favor. The biggest swindlers are the Goldman Sachs types who, not coincidentally, are now working for Obama in increasing numbers. (Obama's Chief of Staff being just the latest)

Ron Paul? I could never vote for someone who believes evolution is a lie.

Why not? You voted for Obama right? He says he's a Christian right? The Bible says evolution is a lie.
Romans 1:25
"“They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.”

See? You already voted for someone who believes evolution is a lie.

 

[Annie]

The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act provided jobs, fewer people lost their homes and stimulated their local economies.

Recovery.gov - Tracking the Money

Most of the projects will provide long term benefits. Rebuilding an infrastructure ignored by advocates of 'conservative principals' was and remains a stupid idea motivated by selfish greed and callous disregard for future generations.
If PC had her way, Golden Gate Park, Central Park and open space in the cities between SF and NY wouldn't exist, instead soviet style tenaments would be there providing housing for the 'middle class', non-unionized labor supporting by there labor both the poorest of the poor and the richest of the rich.

AHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Recovery.gov is an Obama Propaganda site. They are just making up crap.

Of course. I was fooled. Each time I cross the Bay Bridge, see the fourth bore being drilled in Contra Costa County or dozens of other projects under construction by private sector contractors and private sector employees I'm only seeing propaganda.
You're blinded by your partisanship and pretty fucking stupid to suggest this a a propaganda site.
Anyone who looks at the link can see projects in their community. Well, all but the willfully ignorant and the stupid - ignorant because they cannot think for themselves.

Rep. Issa: Stimulus website is 'propaganda' - The Hill's Hillicon Valley

...Rep. Issa: Stimulus website is 'propaganda'
By Gautham Nagesh - 08/17/10 12:46 PM ET

Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) on Monday accused the White House of using the stimulus tracking website Recovery.gov to disseminate propaganda.

Issa released a 37-page report documenting alleged misconduct by the Obama administration in several of its new-media projects. The report documents several instances in which government agencies allegedly promoted administration policies using federal resources.

Issa called on the Government Accountability Office (GAO) to investigate the allegations and determine if the administration violated federal law by using taxpayers' dollars for political purposes.

Specifically, the report points to websites it claims contain false or misleading information, such as Recovery.gov and HealthReform.gov, as well as to a conference call during which a White House staff member urged artists and entertainers to support President Obama's agenda.

Rather than serve as a tool for strong oversight and transparency, "Recovery.gov became a taxpayer-funded tool to promote false and misleading propaganda to support the Democrat-backed stimulus," the report states. "The manifest inaccuracies in the data the White House used to justify its economic policies constitutes the dissemination of false propaganda by the federal government."...

Obviously at the time, the charges went no where.

Now however, more looks at that transparency:

Recovery.gov Not Very Transparent - Slashdot

"CNN is reporting that the page recovery.gov is not as transparent as it claims to be. The examples pointed out are: 1. The user is greeted by a large pie chart that show the breakdown of money spent by 2 categories, state government distributions and local government distributions. 2. Finding projects involves a complicated search, information on projects is not actually hosted on recovery.gov 3. The format of the information available is of poor quality (the article specifically mentions a PDF document that was created from a scanned sideways copy of roadwork projects from New York state). Given that this site was meant to make the spending of the new stimulus money more transparent to the citizens of the Unites States of America it seems oddly opaque. CNN does seem to praise the ability for government agencies to be able to exchange HTML based information between systems, which for government I would call a massive accomplishment. I tried to find information for my state and searched for Minnesota. I got 4 matches, 2 of which were generic ones: one was the Minnesota state certification that is required for a state to receive funds and one that lays out public transportation spending for all states of which Minnesota gets $94,093,115."

Propaganda is right. Links at site.

 

[editec]

Republicans would do away with funding for 150 programs including flood prevention ($30 million), multifamily rural housing rehab ($25 million), cops hiring ($298 million), endangered species conservation ($83 million), re-integration of ex-offenders ($108.5 million), family planning ($317.5 million), math and science partnerships ($180.5 million), Teach for America ($18 million), Reading is Fundamental ($24.8 million) and national infrastructure investments ($600 million).

Cantor touts strategy to grow economy

Eric Cantor - one of the Republican "Young Guns".

I want to make sure I understand this list:

Defund:

Flood prevention
housing rehab for the rural poor
cops
endangered species protection
re-integration of criminals into society
Family Planning
math and science
teaching
reading
National Infrastructure investment

This is the plan? This will "grow the economy"?

Am I the only one who has a problem with this "plan"?

Tally up all the savings.

How much does it really save?

About a week's worth of the costs in Afghanistan.

 

[Wry Catcher]

AHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Recovery.gov is an Obama Propaganda site. They are just making up crap.

Of course. I was fooled. Each time I cross the Bay Bridge, see the fourth bore being drilled in Contra Costa County or dozens of other projects under construction by private sector contractors and private sector employees I'm only seeing propaganda.
You're blinded by your partisanship and pretty fucking stupid to suggest this a a propaganda site.
Anyone who looks at the link can see projects in their community. Well, all but the willfully ignorant and the stupid - ignorant because they cannot think for themselves.

Rep. Issa: Stimulus website is 'propaganda' - The Hill's Hillicon Valley

...Rep. Issa: Stimulus website is 'propaganda'
By Gautham Nagesh - 08/17/10 12:46 PM ET

Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) on Monday accused the White House of using the stimulus tracking website Recovery.gov to disseminate propaganda.

Issa released a 37-page report documenting alleged misconduct by the Obama administration in several of its new-media projects. The report documents several instances in which government agencies allegedly promoted administration policies using federal resources.

Issa called on the Government Accountability Office (GAO) to investigate the allegations and determine if the administration violated federal law by using taxpayers' dollars for political purposes.

Specifically, the report points to websites it claims contain false or misleading information, such as Recovery.gov and HealthReform.gov, as well as to a conference call during which a White House staff member urged artists and entertainers to support President Obama's agenda.

Rather than serve as a tool for strong oversight and transparency, "Recovery.gov became a taxpayer-funded tool to promote false and misleading propaganda to support the Democrat-backed stimulus," the report states. "The manifest inaccuracies in the data the White House used to justify its economic policies constitutes the dissemination of false propaganda by the federal government."...

Obviously at the time, the charges went no where.

Now however, more looks at that transparency:

Recovery.gov Not Very Transparent - Slashdot

"CNN is reporting that the page recovery.gov is not as transparent as it claims to be. The examples pointed out are: 1. The user is greeted by a large pie chart that show the breakdown of money spent by 2 categories, state government distributions and local government distributions. 2. Finding projects involves a complicated search, information on projects is not actually hosted on recovery.gov 3. The format of the information available is of poor quality (the article specifically mentions a PDF document that was created from a scanned sideways copy of roadwork projects from New York state). Given that this site was meant to make the spending of the new stimulus money more transparent to the citizens of the Unites States of America it seems oddly opaque. CNN does seem to praise the ability for government agencies to be able to exchange HTML based information between systems, which for government I would call a massive accomplishment. I tried to find information for my state and searched for Minnesota. I got 4 matches, 2 of which were generic ones: one was the Minnesota state certification that is required for a state to receive funds and one that lays out public transportation spending for all states of which Minnesota gets $94,093,115."

Propaganda is right. Links at site.

Correct. I have been fooled by the construction, the huge crane in the bay east of Treasure Island, the detours, the pickup trucks and all those guys in jeans and boots - they must be figments of my imagination.
As I suggested, the willfully ignorant and the stupid believe what they want. It's your right.

 

[Wry Catcher]

See the photos of the Bay Bridge, before, then and now. Proof that another conservative commandment is utter bull shit. The government can and does create wealth.

http://www.google.com/images?q=Bay+...rLZOCsQO9rYTGAw&ved=0CB4QsAQ&biw=1004&bih=414

 

[Rozman]

The right wing is missing the point. You can cut all you want, but if the economy isn't growing, and it won't as long as the entire nation's wealth is concentrated in the hands of just 1%, the cuts will never be enough. The economy has to grow.

Cutting support for education is simply carving away at the nation's future. Growing corn and cotton won't be enough.

Putting the issues under the right authority would do a lot to clear the federal deficit. The states or local governments are more responsive to the people, if they don't have the largesse of the Fed as an alternative and master.

It's more than just "placing the blame". It's about competing ideologies.

One ideology wants growth and education and research and job creation and new technology.

The other ideology wants tax cuts for the wealthy, and spending - but only on the military, and to slash funding for, not only education, but also slash funding for: rebuilding the infrastructure, researching new technology, and they want to destroy unions and remove regulations for clean air and clean water so corporations can squeeze every cent they can out of the country.

This is one of those few cases where there really is two sharply defined ideologies which translates into opposing choices.

You can cut spending all you want, but if the economy isn't growing, it will never be enough.

Where has all the spending on education gotten us so far?

Everyone knows that the education system in this country is failing.We trail many countries at many levels.The left's answer to fix it is the same answer the left has to fix anything.

SPEND MORE.....

Sorry but enough is enough.Until we get our shit together we now spend less.
Obama spent $ 228,000 of stimulus money for each job created.Where has that gotten us.

 

[Mad Scientist]

See the photos of the Bay Bridge, before, then and now. Proof that another conservative commandment is utter bull shit. The government can and does create wealth.

Bay Bridge construction photo - Google Search

Right. Because no private company has ever built a bridge.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Putting the issues under the right authority would do a lot to clear the federal deficit. The states or local governments are more responsive to the people, if they don't have the largesse of the Fed as an alternative and master.

It's more than just "placing the blame". It's about competing ideologies.

One ideology wants growth and education and research and job creation and new technology.

The other ideology wants tax cuts for the wealthy, and spending - but only on the military, and to slash funding for, not only education, but also slash funding for: rebuilding the infrastructure, researching new technology, and they want to destroy unions and remove regulations for clean air and clean water so corporations can squeeze every cent they can out of the country.

This is one of those few cases where there really is two sharply defined ideologies which translates into opposing choices.

You can cut spending all you want, but if the economy isn't growing, it will never be enough.

Where has all the spending on education gotten us so far?

Everyone knows that the education system in this country is failing.We trail many countries at many levels.The left's answer to fix it is the same answer the left has to fix anything.

SPEND MORE.....

Sorry but enough is enough.Until we get our shit together we now spend less.
Obama spent $ 228,000 of stimulus money for each job created.Where has that gotten us.

How much was spent to build the transcontinental railroad? What did that get us? How much wealth was created when in the middle of the Great Depression the Golden Gate and SF-Oakland Bay Bridges were constructed?
Did the stimulus money safe some workers from losing their home to foreclosure? How much equity did that save their neighbors when fewer homes were abandoned? How much of the money earned by workers working went into the local economy? How many jobs were saved when the sandwhich shop had customers?

 

[Rozman]

See the photos of the Bay Bridge, before, then and now. Proof that another conservative commandment is utter bull shit. The government can and does create wealth.

Bay Bridge construction photo - Google Search

Right. Because no private company has ever built a bridge.

Fine you want government as the answer I don't.i cringe every time our government gets involved....in anything.

 

[Annie]

It's more than just "placing the blame". It's about competing ideologies.

One ideology wants growth and education and research and job creation and new technology.

The other ideology wants tax cuts for the wealthy, and spending - but only on the military, and to slash funding for, not only education, but also slash funding for: rebuilding the infrastructure, researching new technology, and they want to destroy unions and remove regulations for clean air and clean water so corporations can squeeze every cent they can out of the country.

This is one of those few cases where there really is two sharply defined ideologies which translates into opposing choices.

You can cut spending all you want, but if the economy isn't growing, it will never be enough.

Where has all the spending on education gotten us so far?

Everyone knows that the education system in this country is failing.We trail many countries at many levels.The left's answer to fix it is the same answer the left has to fix anything.

SPEND MORE.....

Sorry but enough is enough.Until we get our shit together we now spend less.
Obama spent $ 228,000 of stimulus money for each job created.Where has that gotten us.

How much was spent to build the transcontinental railroad? What did that get us? How much wealth was created when in the middle of the Great Depression the Golden Gate and SF-Oakland Bay Bridges were constructed?
Did the stimulus money safe some workers from losing their home to foreclosure? How much equity did that save their neighbors when fewer homes were abandoned? How much of the money earned by workers working went into the local economy? How many jobs were saved when the sandwhich shop had customers?

Lots of money and blood was spent on the Transcontinental Railroad. Well it was transcontinental and the elites in business and government wanted expansion. Railroads were the most efficient way of getting troops out to control the Natives who'd been pushed West.

Bridges, roads, railroads today need to be addressed by private or states. I wouldn't have a problem with Federal making money available to states in the form of bonds for infrastructure, but then again when states are healthy they don't have problems selling their own. Not like in the 1800's, when most were just open land.

As for the sandwich shop, you proposing federal subsidies?

 

[Mad Scientist]

See the photos of the Bay Bridge, before, then and now. Proof that another conservative commandment is utter bull shit. The government can and does create wealth.

Bay Bridge construction photo - Google Search

Right. Because no private company has ever built a bridge.

Fine you want government as the answer I don't.i cringe every time our government gets involved....in anything.

I think you misunderstand. Wry Catcher claims that "Government creates wealth" but as every sane person knows, governments only confiscate and destroy wealth (as well as freedoms).

Yes, government is doing certain things. But my argument has been and always will be, that some person or private industry somewhere can do it better.

 

[Annie]

Right. Because no private company has ever built a bridge.

Fine you want government as the answer I don't.i cringe every time our government gets involved....in anything.

I think you misunderstand. Wry Catcher claims that "Government creates wealth" but as every sane person knows, governments only confiscate and destroy wealth (as well as freedoms).

Yes, government is doing certain things. But my argument has been and always will be, that some person or private industry somewhere can do it better.

I'm with you to a large extent. The federal government should be responsible for our borders, protecting us from invasions. They should carry on diplomacy and encourage trade amongst friendly nations. They should protect our interests here and abroad. They should facilitate communications between citizens and the world. It used to be US Post Office, now it's making sure the internet stays free. It doesn't mean placing ornery restrictions on it. They should encourage commerce by transportation support between the states, whether by air, roads, rails or water. There is a place for commerce clause, it just doesn't mean what some want it to mean. They should regulate banking and industries that fail to protect workers or consumers. Of course mining comes quickly to mind, but so should instances like Enron, companies buying tainted products supplied by China and foisting them off on the public, etc.

What the Fed should not be doing is funding the building of fountains in suburbs and calling that stimulus. They shouldn't pretend to stimulate the economy at all, when all they are doing is confiscating wealth. They shouldn't be mandating thousands of unfunded, unnecessary laws on the states and municipalities. They should stay out of our bodies, our schools, and our marriages or relationships.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Where has all the spending on education gotten us so far?

Everyone knows that the education system in this country is failing.We trail many countries at many levels.The left's answer to fix it is the same answer the left has to fix anything.

SPEND MORE.....

Sorry but enough is enough.Until we get our shit together we now spend less.
Obama spent $ 228,000 of stimulus money for each job created.Where has that gotten us.

How much was spent to build the transcontinental railroad? What did that get us? How much wealth was created when in the middle of the Great Depression the Golden Gate and SF-Oakland Bay Bridges were constructed?
Did the stimulus money safe some workers from losing their home to foreclosure? How much equity did that save their neighbors when fewer homes were abandoned? How much of the money earned by workers working went into the local economy? How many jobs were saved when the sandwhich shop had customers?

Lots of money and blood was spent on the Transcontinental Railroad. Well it was transcontinental and the elites in business and government wanted expansion. Railroads were the most efficient way of getting troops out to control the Natives who'd been pushed West.

Bridges, roads, railroads today need to be addressed by private or states. I wouldn't have a problem with Federal making money available to states in the form of bonds for infrastructure, but then again when states are healthy they don't have problems selling their own. Not like in the 1800's, when most were just open land.

As for the sandwich shop, you proposing federal subsidies?

You miss the point. People who have jobs, have money. People who have money spend money. Sandwhich shops cater to people who have money and want a sandwhich. Where in this example is the federal government?

Are you familiar with the problems under the Articles of Confederation? Private roads, bridges and ferries, some only hundreds of yards apart, made travel a nightmare. Can you deny the transcontinental RR created wealth for individuals, communities and new industries?

 

[Dot Com]

It's more than just "placing the blame". It's about competing ideologies.

One ideology wants growth and education and research and job creation and new technology.

The other ideology wants tax cuts for the wealthy, and spending - but only on the military, and to slash funding for, not only education, but also slash funding for: rebuilding the infrastructure, researching new technology, and they want to destroy unions and remove regulations for clean air and clean water so corporations can squeeze every cent they can out of the country.

This is one of those few cases where there really is two sharply defined ideologies which translates into opposing choices.

You can cut spending all you want, but if the economy isn't growing, it will never be enough.

Where has all the spending on education gotten us so far?

Everyone knows that the education system in this country is failing.We trail many countries at many levels.The left's answer to fix it is the same answer the left has to fix anything.

SPEND MORE.....

Sorry but enough is enough.Until we get our shit together we now spend less.
Obama spent $ 228,000 of stimulus money for each job created.Where has that gotten us.

How much was spent to build the transcontinental railroad? What did that get us? How much wealth was created when in the middle of the Great Depression the Golden Gate and SF-Oakland Bay Bridges were constructed?
Did the stimulus money safe some workers from losing their home to foreclosure? How much equity did that save their neighbors when fewer homes were abandoned? How much of the money earned by workers working went into the local economy? How many jobs were saved when the sandwhich shop had customers?

Good points. There are ancillary benefits that get overlooked

 

[Annie]

How much was spent to build the transcontinental railroad? What did that get us? How much wealth was created when in the middle of the Great Depression the Golden Gate and SF-Oakland Bay Bridges were constructed?
Did the stimulus money safe some workers from losing their home to foreclosure? How much equity did that save their neighbors when fewer homes were abandoned? How much of the money earned by workers working went into the local economy? How many jobs were saved when the sandwhich shop had customers?

Lots of money and blood was spent on the Transcontinental Railroad. Well it was transcontinental and the elites in business and government wanted expansion. Railroads were the most efficient way of getting troops out to control the Natives who'd been pushed West.

Bridges, roads, railroads today need to be addressed by private or states. I wouldn't have a problem with Federal making money available to states in the form of bonds for infrastructure, but then again when states are healthy they don't have problems selling their own. Not like in the 1800's, when most were just open land.

As for the sandwich shop, you proposing federal subsidies?

You miss the point. People who have jobs, have money. People who have money spend money. Sandwhich shops cater to people who have money and want a sandwhich. Where in this example is the federal government?

Are you familiar with the problems under the Articles of Confederation? Private roads, bridges and ferries, some only hundreds of yards apart, made travel a nightmare. Can you deny the transcontinental RR created wealth for individuals, communities and new industries?

Very familiar, which is why I'm for a strong, but not overbearing Federal Government. The Constitution definitely addressed the problems of interstate commerce and the ability of the government to tax.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Fine you want government as the answer I don't.i cringe every time our government gets involved....in anything.

I think you misunderstand. Wry Catcher claims that "Government creates wealth" but as every sane person knows, governments only confiscate and destroy wealth (as well as freedoms).

Yes, government is doing certain things. But my argument has been and always will be, that some person or private industry somewhere can do it better.

I'm with you to a large extent. The federal government should be responsible for our borders, protecting us from invasions. They should carry on diplomacy and encourage trade amongst friendly nations. They should protect our interests here and abroad. They should facilitate communications between citizens and the world. It used to be US Post Office, now it's making sure the internet stays free. It doesn't mean placing ornery restrictions on it. They should encourage commerce by transportation support between the states, whether by air, roads, rails or water. There is a place for commerce clause, it just doesn't mean what some want it to mean. They should regulate banking and industries that fail to protect workers or consumers. Of course mining comes quickly to mind, but so should instances like Enron, companies buying tainted products supplied by China and foisting them off on the public, etc.

What the Fed should not be doing is funding the building of fountains in suburbs and calling that stimulus. They shouldn't pretend to stimulate the economy at all, when all they are doing is confiscating wealth. They shouldn't be mandating thousands of unfunded, unnecessary laws on the states and municipalities. They should stay out of our bodies, our schools, and our marriages or relationships.

You 'speak' in cliches framed by an ideology devoid of any pragmatic consideration. It's the sign of the tea party mentality, simple solutions to complex problems, problems never fully defined or understood.

 

[Annie]

I think you misunderstand. Wry Catcher claims that "Government creates wealth" but as every sane person knows, governments only confiscate and destroy wealth (as well as freedoms).

Yes, government is doing certain things. But my argument has been and always will be, that some person or private industry somewhere can do it better.

I'm with you to a large extent. The federal government should be responsible for our borders, protecting us from invasions. They should carry on diplomacy and encourage trade amongst friendly nations. They should protect our interests here and abroad. They should facilitate communications between citizens and the world. It used to be US Post Office, now it's making sure the internet stays free. It doesn't mean placing ornery restrictions on it. They should encourage commerce by transportation support between the states, whether by air, roads, rails or water. There is a place for commerce clause, it just doesn't mean what some want it to mean. They should regulate banking and industries that fail to protect workers or consumers. Of course mining comes quickly to mind, but so should instances like Enron, companies buying tainted products supplied by China and foisting them off on the public, etc.

What the Fed should not be doing is funding the building of fountains in suburbs and calling that stimulus. They shouldn't pretend to stimulate the economy at all, when all they are doing is confiscating wealth. They shouldn't be mandating thousands of unfunded, unnecessary laws on the states and municipalities. They should stay out of our bodies, our schools, and our marriages or relationships.

You 'speak' in cliches framed by an ideology devoid of any pragmatic consideration. It's the sign of the tea party mentality, simple solutions to complex problems, problems never fully defined or understood.

Still have to fall back on name calling when your argument fails, I understand. Still it's better than the crude words that had become so very common as of late.

 

[Wry Catcher]

I'm with you to a large extent. The federal government should be responsible for our borders, protecting us from invasions. They should carry on diplomacy and encourage trade amongst friendly nations. They should protect our interests here and abroad. They should facilitate communications between citizens and the world. It used to be US Post Office, now it's making sure the internet stays free. It doesn't mean placing ornery restrictions on it. They should encourage commerce by transportation support between the states, whether by air, roads, rails or water. There is a place for commerce clause, it just doesn't mean what some want it to mean. They should regulate banking and industries that fail to protect workers or consumers. Of course mining comes quickly to mind, but so should instances like Enron, companies buying tainted products supplied by China and foisting them off on the public, etc.

What the Fed should not be doing is funding the building of fountains in suburbs and calling that stimulus. They shouldn't pretend to stimulate the economy at all, when all they are doing is confiscating wealth. They shouldn't be mandating thousands of unfunded, unnecessary laws on the states and municipalities. They should stay out of our bodies, our schools, and our marriages or relationships.

You 'speak' in cliches framed by an ideology devoid of any pragmatic consideration. It's the sign of the tea party mentality, simple solutions to complex problems, problems never fully defined or understood.

Still have to fall back on name calling when your argument fails, I understand. Still it's better than the crude words that had become so very common as of late.

Name calling? Not at all, my comment was an observation based on the comments by MS. I read cliches all the time, cliches which present a conclusion without any evidence of proof. I'm a pragmatist, I understrand the government has a role and the private sector has a role, both in problem creation and problem solution.

by the way, my post was directed at Mad Scientist, who wrote:

"I think you misunderstand. Wry Catcher claims that "Government creates wealth" but as every sane person knows, governments only confiscate and destroy wealth (as well as freedoms)."

"Yes, government is doing certain things. But my argument has been and always will be, that some person or private industry somewhere can do it better."

 

[Annie]

You 'speak' in cliches framed by an ideology devoid of any pragmatic consideration. It's the sign of the tea party mentality, simple solutions to complex problems, problems never fully defined or understood.

Still have to fall back on name calling when your argument fails, I understand. Still it's better than the crude words that had become so very common as of late.

Name calling? Not at all, my comment was an observation based on the comments by MS. I read cliches all the time, cliches which present a conclusion without any evidence of proof. I'm a pragmatist, I understrand the government has a role and the private sector has a role, both in problem creation and problem solution.

My dear, you've written nothing but cliches, followed by some examples you thought bolstered them. When that failed, you fall back on name calling and logical fallacies. It's what you do.