Listen to your young republicans

[sealybobo]

What a bunch of hogwash.

What the GOP has to say:

"The bottom line is this: We're going through a tough time," Bush said to the crowded press briefing room full of television cameras. "But our economy has continued growing, consumers are spending, businesses are investing, exports continue increasing, and American productivity remains strong. We can have confidence in the long-term foundation of our economy, and I believe we will come through this challenge stronger than ever before."

Reality:

The nation's economy has been struggling for months, with some analysts citing a faltering housing market, rising gas and food prices and collapsing banks as evidence that the country has fallen into a recession. The national average for gas prices has been over $4 for seven consecutive weeks. IndyMac, a bank with $32 billion in assets, collapsed this month, becoming the fourth-largest financial institution ever to fail. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson stepped in to propose a rescue plan for government-sponsored mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. And the Federal Reserve has cut interest rates 3.25 percentage points since mid-September, down to the current level of 2 percent, with the Labor Department reporting recently that inflation had risen to its highest levels since 1981.

 

[Charles_Main]

Don't you think American truckers making so much are why the GOP wants to let Mexican truckers in? They don't have the same safety standards and they don't cost as much.

Don't you think me wanting to make what I make is why my company is outsourcing to India?

Don't you think American toy maker employees are why they want to go to China?

Don't you think American Computer Programmers is why they want more Visa's for indian computer guru's?

ETC

lol many American truckers make no where near as much as some Union factory workers. You can side step the issue all you want Bobo.

Are unions a good and needed thing? of course.

Can they at times get out of hand and jeopardize the ability of industries to remain competitive? Hells yes.

The world is not the perfect black and white world you seem to see it as Bobo. American manufacturing jobs are fleeing this country. There are many reasons for it, and High labor costs are one of them, to deny that is to deny reality.

 

[sealybobo]

lol many American truckers make no where near as much as some Union factory workers. You can side step the issue all you want Bobo.

Are unions a good and needed thing? of course.

Can they at times get out of hand and jeopardize the ability of industries to remain competitive? Hells yes.

The world is not the perfect black and white world you seem to see it as Bobo. American manufacturing jobs are fleeing this country. There are many reasons for it, and High labor costs are one of them, to deny that is to deny reality.

No American truckers don't make as much as factory workers, but they make more than MEXICAN truckers, so that's next. And why not? Gotta lower them labor costs, right?

 

[Charles_Main]

No American truckers don't make as much as factory workers, but they make more than MEXICAN truckers, so that's next. And why not? Gotta lower them labor costs, right?

Nope, not what I said at all, but with you everything is all or nothing. You are either totally for something or totally against it. Which of course is not at all how the real world works. Balance is always the key my friend, but once again all you keep proving is debate with you is pointless. You will always hear only what you want to hear, and not what is actually said.

Just as I said about Free markets, that you need to a balance between free markets and reasonable regulations of those markets, I feel the same way about free trade. You need a proper balance between free trade, and protection of American industries.

I am not for letting Mexican truckers in to lower wages as you imply, but there is nothing new about you implying people have said things they never said. It seems to be your automatic response when you do not want to address the perfectly valid points someone makes. I mean do you deny we are losing our good jobs left and right? Do you deny that labor costs are part of the reason? Balance bobo Balance. I know it is a hard concept to get but do keep trying.

Or you could just Imply I said something I did not, and call me a liar, I know that is a lot easier than actually having a debate with someone.

Do have a good day would you

 

[sealybobo]

Nope, not what I said at all, but with you everything is all or nothing. You are either totally for something or totally against it. Which of course is not at all how the real world works. Balance is always the key my friend, but once again all you keep proving is debate with you is pointless. You will always hear only what you want to hear, and not what is actually said.

Just as I said about Free markets, that you need to a balance between free markets and reasonable regulations of those markets, I feel the same way about free trade. You need a proper balance between free trade, and protection of American industries.

I am not for letting Mexican truckers in to lower wages as you imply, but there is nothing new about you implying people have said things they never said. It seems to be your automatic response when you do not want to address the perfectly valid points someone makes. I mean do you deny we are losing our good jobs left and right? Do you deny that labor costs are part of the reason? Balance bobo Balance. I know it is a hard concept to get but do keep trying.

Or you could just Imply I said something I did not, and call me a liar, I know that is a lot easier than actually having a debate with someone.

Do have a good day would you

You missed my point entirely. Sure if you want to outsource microwaves and copiers, fine. But you said labor costs are why we are manufacturing overseas. Correct? Well labor costs will be the reason they start letting Mexican truckers in next. That was my only point Charles. Aren't you the trucker guy? Or is that someone else? Just trying to make a point. Car manufacturers were/are vital to our economy.

 

[Charles_Main]

You missed my point entirely. Sure if you want to outsource microwaves and copiers, fine. But you said labor costs are why we are manufacturing overseas. Correct? Well labor costs will be the reason they start letting Mexican truckers in next. That was my only point Charles. Aren't you the trucker guy? Or is that someone else? Just trying to make a point. Car manufacturers were/are vital to our economy.

I said high wages, and retired worker costs, are part of the reason Jobs are going over seas, However Isn't it your party that pushed NAFTA and other free trade agreements, which are the very reason it is so much easier for the companies to send the jobs over seas, and the very reason they can even think about bringing in Mexican truckers? isn't also the Democrats who work for the Unions, Unions like the UAW which have sought to benefit their members at the detriment of the very industries that employ their members? yes I know Republicans are guilty on free trade as well, but I think NAFTA is a huge job sucker, and that was the Dems little baby was it not?

isn't it Liberals who are always telling us we must learn to live with the Global economy that we must engage the world through free trade?

NAFTA was Clinton's baby Bobo, you do know that right. Despite the fact that Hillary tried to claim she at least was against it.

Oh and you do not have to tell me car manufacturers are important to our economy, I am well aware of that, it is just that I think it is mostly Democrat policies which have destroyed the Car companies. Well that and their own inability to look ahead to what was to come.

 

[sealybobo]

clnton signed nafta and the degegulation acts that the gop congress passes. it was conservatives that bought up all the media and corporate america that sent jobs out of the usa. and it was the 2000 to 2006 gop that gave tax breaks to companies that did leave, instead of taxing them to keep them here, or at least don't give them more breaks.

 

[JimH52]

The Republicans have been wrong on every issue except welfare.

No wonder people have turned their backs on them.

History will record the perfect storm that was approaching as gw bush was elected. Reagon's trickle down theory did not work yet the GOP continues to call him a God. bush on the other hand was just a rich spoiled kid who gained office by trashing his GOP rival. The system and time were against the GOP.

The reality IS Reagon and bush have been the biggest spender over the budget in US history. These are the conservatives. The middle is slowly beginning to realize the GOP has not helped them.

The perfect storm will culminate this year when the GOP will lose the WH and the Dems will gain a super majority. But alas, all it not lost for the Dems are still the Dems. The GOP will be great and powerful again not because of anything they will do but because the Dems will become drunk with power, as they always do.

Where are we in this? Why we are where we always are...we are screwed.

 

[editec]

FYI

source

In 2002, full-time wage and salary workers who were union members had median usual weekly earnings of $740, compared with a median of $587 for wage and salary workers who were not represented by unions.

FYI part II

Source

Usual Weekly Earnings Summary

Technical information: (202) 691-6378 USDL 08-0976 Current Population Survey(CPS) For release: 10:00 A.M. (EDT)Media contact: (202) 691-5902 Thursday, July 17, 2008

USUAL WEEKLY EARNINGS OF WAGE AND SALARY WORKERS: SECOND QUARTER 2008

Median weekly earnings of the nation’s 107.1 million full-time wage and salary workers were $719 in the second quarter of 2008, the Bureau of Labor Statistics of the U.S. Department of Labor reported today.

This was 4.2 per-cent higher than a year earlier, compared with a gain of 4.4 percent in the Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) over the same period.

Data on usual earnings are collected as part of the Current Population Survey, a nationwide sample survey of households in which respondents are asked, among other things, how much each wage and salary worker usually earns. (See the Technical Note.)

Highlights from the second-quarter data are: --Women who usually worked full time had median earnings of $634 per week, or 79.3 percent of the $800 median for men.

The female-to-male earnings ratios were higher among blacks (92.4 percent) and Hispanics (86.8 percent) than among whites (78.4 percent) or Asians (76.0 percent). (See table 1.)

--Median earnings for black men working at full-time jobs were $615 per week, 74.4 percent of the median for white men ($827). The difference was less among women, as black women’s median earnings ($568) were 87.7 percent of those for their white counterparts ($648).

Overall, median earnings of Hispanics who worked full time ($537) were lower than those of blacks ($591), whites ($738), and Asians ($855). (See table 1.) --Among men, those age 45 to 54 and 55 to 64 had the highest median weekly earnings, $935 and $946, respectively. Among women, weekly earnings were highest for those age 55 to 64 ($716). (See table 2.) --

Among the major occupational groups, persons employed full time in managerial, professional, and related occupations had the highest median weekly earnings-- $1,243 for men and $884 for women.

Persons employed in service jobs earned the least. (See table 3.) --Full-time workers age 25 years and over without a high school diploma had med- ian weekly earnings of $449, compared with $620 for high school graduates (no college) and $1,105 for those holding at least a bachelor’s degree.

Among college graduates with advanced degrees (professional or master’s degree and above), the highest 10 percent of male workers made $3,235 or more per week, compared with $2,070 or more for their female counterparts. (See table 4.)

Remember now, these are the MEDIAN wages reproted based on a survey.

But they at least give up some idea of what the state of the economy is for many of us.

The median salary is (I think many of us will agree) NOT A REAL LIVING WAGE in 2008 America.

Depending on what you think a REAL LIVING wage is, what that really means is that something less than 50% of us are making a REAL living wage.

Consider ALSO that these are the wages of people reporting that they have FULL TIME JOBS.

Something that fewer and fewer of us can seem to manage.

I think what this is probably showing us is that fewer than 75% of the work force in America is making anything like even a LOWER MIDDLE CLASS wage, folks.

I live in one of the les expensive places in America to live.

If you're making less than 50K you're not making enough to pay the bills and save for your future.

Not unless you started out with money to begin with, I mean.

 

[Charles_Main]

clnton signed nafta and the degegulation acts that the gop congress passes. it was conservatives that bought up all the media and corporate america that sent jobs out of the usa. and it was the 2000 to 2006 gop that gave tax breaks to companies that did leave, instead of taxing them to keep them here, or at least don't give them more breaks.

BS NAFTA was clintons baby.

However you are right that Both parties hold some blame for the fleeing of you our jobs, but you are dead wrong on Clinton. He pushed NAFTA like it was going to save us all, and Save Mexico. He also increased taxes on the very business who Jobs are fleeing.


You can try and say it was the Republicans, and only them, all you want. It will not make it true bud.