limits

[Old Rocks]

A climate scientists view.

Climate Change: The Next Generation: Andrew Glikson: Planetary Boundaries (CO2 equivalent of 460 ppm has been surpassed

In my view an upper limit of 450 ppm CO2, proposed by a range of reports by government organizations, including the Garnaut Review [5] and the Australian Government White Paper [6], can not be sustained, for the following reasons:

A. The atmosphere has already transcended the CO2-equivalent (including the forcing of methane) level of 460 ppm.

B. A level of 450 ppm CO2 is a mere ~40 ppm below the upper boundary of ~500 ppm, which is the upper limit of stability of the Antarctic ice sheet, formed about 34 million years ago. In the Pliocene, 3 million years ago, a CO2 level of 400 ppm led to temperature rise of about 23 oC and sea level rise of 25+/-12 meters.

C. There is no evidence that the climate can be stabilized at such high level of greenhouse-induced forcing. Due to carbon cycle feedback loops and feedbacks related to ice melt/water interaction, CO2 level of 450 ppm may lead to yet higher greenhouse levels, high temperature levels and possible tipping points.

D. Not taken into account in many projections are looming emissions of methane, which are already taking place under atmospheric CO2 levels of 388 ppm, or CO2-e levels of 460 ppm.

 

[Oddball]

Looks like you picked the wrong week to post more meaningless statistics from crappy blogs.

 

[Old Rocks]

Dr. as in Phd in Climatology. And what credentials do your two movie makers have?

Climate Change: The Next Generation: Andrew Glikson: Planetary Boundaries (CO2 equivalent of 460 ppm has been surpassed

Dr. Andrew Glikson is a Earth and paleo-climate research scientist at Australian National University. He spends much of his free time invested in efforts to address climate change issues in a timely fashion and can be contacted at: [email protected].

 

[mdn2000]

old crock your a lousy cock sucking brain damaged asshole. why wont you post the report in your other thread, 100% alternative energy,

you call others dumb for not buying a magazine to see the article you cant even post despite your using the article as your source.

Every link I follow of OLD CROCK's is either a press report or proves old crock wrong,

Old Crock your own sources state you are wrong

how much you drink tonight you old crocked drunkard

 

[mdn2000]

old crock your a lousy cock sucking brain damaged asshole. why wont you post the report in your other thread, 100% alternative energy,

you call others dumb for not buying a magazine to see the article you cant even post despite your using the article as your source.

Every link I follow of OLD CROCK's is either a press report or proves old crock wrong,

Old Crock your own sources state you are wrong

how much you drink tonight you old crocked drunkard

CO2 does not store heat, CO2 does not emit heat, CO2 stores cold energy, yea thats right. CO2 stores coldness.

Dry ice is pure CO2, go buy some and conduct an experment.

CO2 is dry ice

Dry ice is CO2

watch the debate change after a cold winter or two

 

[Old Rocks]

old crock your a lousy cock sucking brain damaged asshole. why wont you post the report in your other thread, 100% alternative energy,

you call others dumb for not buying a magazine to see the article you cant even post despite your using the article as your source.

Every link I follow of OLD CROCK's is either a press report or proves old crock wrong,

Old Crock your own sources state you are wrong

how much you drink tonight you old crocked drunkard

CO2 does not store heat, CO2 does not emit heat, CO2 stores cold energy, yea thats right. CO2 stores coldness.

Dry ice is pure CO2, go buy some and conduct an experment.

CO2 is dry ice

Dry ice is CO2

watch the debate change after a cold winter or two

Drunk again.

 

[Mr. H.]

There's not a dry ice in the house.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Spamming all the same crap from the same crap site over and over again does not science make, and convinces no one of anything other than your obvious mission of flooding and just general crappery.

 

[KittenKoder]

Hell ... there's still less CO2 in the atmosphere than mold.

 

[Zander]

letting go of a debunked theory is hard. Globull Warming was a religion. A dead one. R.I.P.

 

[Sinatra]

letting go of a debunked theory is hard. Globull Warming was a religion. A dead one. R.I.P.

And good fuc-in riddance...

 

[Mr. H.]

Spamming all the same crap from the same crap site over and over again does not science make, and convinces no one of anything other than your obvious mission of flooding and just general crappery.

You talk like Yoda.

 

[mdn2000]

old crock your a lousy cock sucking brain damaged asshole. why wont you post the report in your other thread, 100% alternative energy,

you call others dumb for not buying a magazine to see the article you cant even post despite your using the article as your source.

Every link I follow of OLD CROCK's is either a press report or proves old crock wrong,

Old Crock your own sources state you are wrong

how much you drink tonight you old crocked drunkard

CO2 does not store heat, CO2 does not emit heat, CO2 stores cold energy, yea thats right. CO2 stores coldness.

Dry ice is pure CO2, go buy some and conduct an experment.

CO2 is dry ice

Dry ice is CO2

watch the debate change after a cold winter or two

Drunk again.

so were just going to exchange insults, I can do better than that but the mods will have to step in to save your ass.

Than again how about this, this is really whats got your granny panties stuck in your throat

I have worked in two steel mills. Both were fired with electricity. In fact, most melting of the primary source, ore or scrap, or any combination of those, are done in electric furnaces today.

http://www.stahlwerk-thueringen.de/files/File/2704_besu_engl.pdf

You know old crock, fuck off, its over and over with you, you post a source and do not read your own source, you worked in two all electric steel mills, bullshit. I was not going to look at this source but I knew you were nothing but a moron. Here I go again, I will qoute Old Crock's source, Old Crock's source describes the most modern steel plant in the world. Of course the first plant using this technology was built in the USA in Indiana by Nucor steel. No one else thought the "continous roll" process would work. Check out the book "American Steel".

Now to quote Old Crock's source, showing once again that Old Crock never reads his own sources which shows Old Crock has knows nothing about energy and even less about the fairy tale "green energy".

The smelting shop
The electric arc furnace is charged with two containers of recycled steel per cycle; the
furnace needs approx. 50 minutes to convert this material into 120 metric tons of
molten steel. The furnace works on the direct current electric arc furnace principle. An
electric arc is generated between a graphite electrode with a diameter of 750 mm and
the bottom of the furnace which functions as the anode. This energy, supplemented by
natural gas/oxygen burners, is used to smelt the scrap

Before rolling, the beam blanks - both our own as well as those from external suppliers
- are placed in a natural gas fired pusher furnace where they are heated to a temperature
of approximately 1,200 °C.

So there you have it, no iron smelting plant exists that uses only electricity, hence the fairy tale of green energy being sustainable in the future is pure fantasy.

Stupid ass, the steel is smelted with electricy, Doooodeeee....... said nothing at all about the reheat process that is done before the rolling.

The slabs are created using electricity, the slabs are later put into a reheat furnace to be heated to the correct rolling temperature for the rolling process.

 

[mdn2000]

old crock your a lousy cock sucking brain damaged asshole. why wont you post the report in your other thread, 100% alternative energy,

you call others dumb for not buying a magazine to see the article you cant even post despite your using the article as your source.

Every link I follow of OLD CROCK's is either a press report or proves old crock wrong,

Old Crock your own sources state you are wrong

how much you drink tonight you old crocked drunkard

CO2 does not store heat, CO2 does not emit heat, CO2 stores cold energy, yea thats right. CO2 stores coldness.

Dry ice is pure CO2, go buy some and conduct an experment.

CO2 is dry ice

Dry ice is CO2

watch the debate change after a cold winter or two

.

no wonder you got fired from two steel plants, you never figured out how they worked

what a dumb crock of shit old crock is

 

[mdn2000]

how about this lie of Old Crock's

Here is a link to one source showing that Old Crock posted an old article that is irrelevant.

http://www.osti.gov/geothermal/servlets/purl/895237-Vp8ett/895237.pdf

Not a pipe dream, either. Already being done successfully.

http://geoheat.oit.edu/bulletin/bull21-2/art1.pdf

On January 31, 1999, CalEnergy Operating Corp.
(CalEnergy) unveiled a $400 million expansion of their
geothermal power complex on the shores of the Salton Sea in
southern California’s Imperial Valley. The new construction
includes nearly 60 megawatts (MW) of new geothermal electrical
capacity, and a unique project to “mine” commercialgrade
zinc from geothermal brine produced for power
generation. CalEnergy is a subsidiary of Mid-American
Energy Holdings Co. (Des Moines, IA).
CalEnergy currently operates eight geothermal power
plants with a capacity of 288 net MW at the Salton Sea.
Construction underway for completion by late-July includes
Unit 5, a 49-MW facility that will utilize high-temperature
waste brine from four of the company’s existing power plants
to fuel the minerals recovery project and produce electricity.
In addition, a 10-MW turbine will be on-line by mid-March to
upgrade power production at CalEnergy’s Del Ranch and
Vulcan power plants. Construction companies heading up the
projects include Stone & Webster Engineering Corp. (Denver,
CO) and Kvaener U.S., Inc. (San Ramon, CA), which are
subcontracting work to local firms.
Funded entirely by CalEnergy, the $200-million
mineral recovery project will produce 30,000 metric tonnes of
99.99-percent pure zinc annually for Cominco Ltd. under a
contract signed last September.

The zinc recovery project was put online in 2002,
but was shut down in 2004 due to technical problems

In 2002, a zinc-extraction plant was completed in the
Imperial Valley of California. It used electricity from
geothermal power plants for the recovery of metal from
geothermal brines (Clutter, 2000). The $400-million zinc
project by MidAmerican Energy Holding Co. was supposed
to extract 30,000 tonnes of zinc annually. The wastewater
from eight power plants, having 600 ppm of zinc was
utilized. Unfortunately, the plant, which ran until 2004,
produced less than 50% of capacity and lost $69 million on
the project (GRC, 2004d). It is now shut down and being
dismantled due to poor economics and technical problems.
MidAmerican is now looking at silica extraction.

There are more problems with the unreliable Geothermal energy, imagine a geothermal power plant producing such a tiny amount of power having an uncontollable event. The uncontrollable event was the brine eating through a 48" pipe until it literally explodes spilling toxic brine all over the imperial valley's Asparagus fields.

On July 10, 2003, the Salton Sea IV Project’s 40 megawatt turbine went out of service due to an uncontrollable force event.
Such uncontrollable force event ended, and the Salton Sea IV Project’s turbine returned to service, on September 17, 2003.
Edison failed to recognize the uncontrollable force event and, as such, has not paid amounts otherwise due and owing under
the Salton Sea IV power purchase agreement totaling $2.5 million. Salton Sea Power Generation, L.P., with Fish Lake Power
LLC, owner of the Salton Sea IV Project, served notices of error on Edison for such unpaid amounts

So from a "win, win" to a multi-million dollar loss, Old Crock I must say if you prove anything its that Green Energy is too expensive.

Hey, check out the amount of time this power plant was down, Old Crock you did not calculate this time into your costs either. Looks to me that Geothermal is too expensive and unreliable.

Now how about how much energy and what types does it take to produce one ton of fiberglass.

 

[Oddball]

From the footnotes of that piece:

4. Contrary arguments, by a handful of climate change denialists, are unreferenced or derived by deceptive alteration of scientific data.

Ms. Pot, meet Mr. Kettle: Warmist conspiracy exposed | Herald Sun Andrew Bolt Blog

 

[concept]

as old rocks even commented in the other thread yet?

 

[Oddball]

None of the usual suspects have....That's why I (albeit briefly) stickied the thread, so they would have no excuse for missing it.

Talk about whistling past the graveyard.

 

[Old Rocks]

Since the e-mails were out of context, and possibly fakes, no reason to comment.

However, the Hadley group are not the only people that are studying the problem, NASA, NOAA, and RSS figures are close to those of Hadley.

So you have an international conspiracy, or just more nonsense.

 

[Oddball]

They're authentic and totally in context, Baghdad Bob.