Liberals Hate Christians

[deaddude]

Do you consider setting standards for treatment of slaves to be approval of slavery?

Yes, unless the standard is free them immediatly. If you set standards for treating them then it is giving it aproval in a " If you do this, this, this, and this then having slaves is ok."

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Yes, unless the standard is free them immediatly. If you set standards for treating them then it is giving it aproval in a " If you do this, this, this, and this then having slaves is ok."

My only defense would be, "those were the times they were living in", but I admit, that's a bit weak. I'll give you this one.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Over 80% of liberals in this country are Christians.

And Ted Kennedy and John Kerry are Catholics.

 

[Abbey Normal]

Originally Posted by nakedemperor
Over 80% of liberals in this country are Christians.

RWA: CINO's Christians in name only.

And also the "C&E" Christians.

 

[Bonnie]

It doesnt matter whether I beleive it, Pale believes it and the guy on the soap box believes it, but in their zest to condemn libs to hell they missed a few passages.

Im not saying that the few that preach fire and brimstone are correct in their approach to conversion. I would never wish or desire Hell for any soul, I always hope for their salvation, as we are all in this together whether we care to admit that or not. But keep in mind just because everyone sins that doesn't mean that those who tout morality are wrong either. If we were to beleive that then no one's wisdom would be good enough.
All People make mistakes, some learn some don't, It's always been my opinion that those who have screwed up are the best ones to impart the wisdom of their errors. And I truly believe most who seem abrasive have the best intentions although they may not come across that way.
And as Eagle said nicely, those who do publicly denigrate the religious often use that extreme fire and brimstone mentality as a way of deflecting their true motives which is to remove all talk of morality from public discussion and invalidate Christians through mockery and exageration in an effort to make themselves feel better about their own moral shortcomings.

 

[deaddude]

Im not saying that the few that preach fire and brimstone are correct in their approach to conversion. I would never wish or desire Hell for any soul, I always hope for their salvation, as we are all in this together whether we care to admit that or not. But keep in mind just because everyone sins that doesn't mean that those who tout morality are wrong either. If we were to beleive that then no one's wisdom would be good enough.
All People make mistakes, some learn some don't, It's always been my opinion that those who have screwed up are the best ones to impart the wisdom of their errors. And I truly believe most who seem abrasive have the best intentions although they may not come across that way.
And as Eagle said nicely, those who do publicly denigrate the religious often use that extreme fire and brimstone mentality as a way of deflecting their true motives which is to remove all talk of morality from public discussion and invalidate Christians through mockery and exageration in an effort to make themselves feel better about their own moral shortcomings.

I agree, I do not believe that those who argue for moral action, or who tell others to live morally are wrong. I do think it is wrong for a person of any faith to condemn another person to hell, for God (if HE is out there) is the only one with the authority to make that decision. By doing so the person doing the condemning is placeing themself on the same level as God.

 

[Abbey Normal]

I agree, I do not believe that those who argue for moral action, or who tell others to live morally are wrong. I do think it is wrong for a person of any faith to condemn another person to hell, for God (if HE is out there) is the only one with the authority to make that decision. By doing so the person doing the condemning is placeing themself on the same level as God.

Do you also think it is wrong for someone to repeat Jesus' words that the only way to the Father (Heaven) is through Him? This is saying that without belief in Jesus Christ, you will go to Hell, but the judgment is from Jesus, not the person repeating His words to save another's soul. This is what most Evangelical Christians are doing.

 

[Nuc]

More than one religion claiming to be the only path to heaven

Plus

They say if you don't believe in their religion you go to hell

Equals

According to religion, all people are going to hell

 

[deaddude]

He says somthing like "I am the way. The only way to the Father is through me." No I have no problem with this. I would have a problem with, "Jesus said 'I am the way' you are an agnostic so youre going to hell and I am not because I am a christian."

"I am the way. The only way to the Father is through me." is kind of vague, it could mean exactly what you just posted, or it could mean sothing completely different, it is all in how you interpret it.

 

[Abbey Normal]

He says somthing like "I am the way. The only way to the Father is through me." No I have no problem with this. I would have a problem with, "Jesus said 'I am the way' you are an agnostic so youre going to hell and I am not because I am a christian."

"I am the way. The only way to the Father is through me." is kind of vague, it could mean exactly what you just posted, or it could mean sothing completely different, it is all in how you interpret it.

"I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me."

I don't think it is vague at all. The words "No one" make it pretty clear that you cannot be with the Father excpet through Jesus. To try to interpret that any other way is to twist the sentence.

As stated by someone else:

"Jesus made it very clear that a relationship with Him is the only way that someone will have eternal life in Heaven. No one comes to the Father except through Christ (John 14:6), but also, no one can come to Christ unless the Father has enabled him (John 6:65). There are not many ways to God. Just as there are not many names for the same God as many religions today insist. There is only one Christ - the only person ever, who lived, who died, and who was raised from the dead, never to die again! He is the only Man who has defeated death! Many people today are saying that there are various ways to get to Heaven, that Jesus is not the only way, but that contradicts the Bible."

And don't forget:
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life" (John 3:16).

And:
"Whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed from death to life" (John 5:24).

All are clear and consistent. If you do not believe, that is your choice, but the message cannot be called vague or inconsistent.

 

[deaddude]

"I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me."

I don't think it is vague at all. The words "No one" make it pretty clear that you cannot be with the Father excpet through Jesus. To try to interpret that any other way is to twist the sentence.

As stated by someone else:

"Jesus made it very clear that a relationship with Him is the only way that someone will have eternal life in Heaven. No one comes to the Father except through Christ (John 14:6), but also, no one can come to Christ unless the Father has enabled him (John 6:65). There are not many ways to God. Just as there are not many names for the same God as many religions today insist. There is only one Christ - the only person ever, who lived, who died, and who was raised from the dead, never to die again! He is the only Man who has defeated death! Many people today are saying that there are various ways to get to Heaven, that Jesus is not the only way, but that contradicts the Bible."

And don't forget:
"God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life" (John 3:16).

And:
"Whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed from death to life" (John 5:24).

All are clear and consistent. If you do not believe, that is your choice, but the message cannot be called vague or inconsistent.

Yes the no one is pretty clear, and I did not say the message was inconsistant, what I think is vague is the "through me."

How does one get through Jesus to God, by believing that He is The Son, by beleiveing and practicing his teachings, by asking forgiveness for sin? All of the above?

Are heaven and hell the only two alternatives? what about limbo? The Vestabule? Reincarnation? Purgatory? Styx? The Bardo? The Elysian feilds? Nifulheim?

As to the other passages, the general gyst of them is "blessed are they who can believe without seeing" which is all well and good, however none of them say "Damned are they who can't."

 

[Bonnie]

deaddude Are heaven and hell the only two alternatives? what about limbo? The Vestabule? Reincarnation? Purgatory? Styx? The Bardo? The Elysian feilds? Nifulheim?

I firmly believe in Purgatory. Limbo suggests that God just leaves his flock out there helpless which really doesn't mesh with him being a loving God or suffering and dying on the cross to leave us in limbo?
There are passages in the bible that tell one to deny God is not the way to heaven, as far as knowing him the best a person can do besides reading the bible, is to ask themselves if their lives would be happier, better, more peaceful/serene, less confusing if they were to live the way God teaches us to live. God could squish the Devil in a blink, he chooses not to because he gives us free will and hopes desperately that we will come to him of our own accord because we want to, because when we do embrace his teachings to best of our abilities we become happier people, grow to actually love him to the extent that sin looses some of it's appeal and therefore can do good for others, be a positive force in this world and earn paradise in the next. He puts it all out there for us and it's our responsibility to choose which way we go.

 

[007]

Yes the no one is pretty clear, and I did not say the message was inconsistant, what I think is vague is the "through me."

How does one get through Jesus to God, by believing that He is The Son, by beleiveing and practicing his teachings, by asking forgiveness for sin? All of the above?

Are heaven and hell the only two alternatives? what about limbo? The Vestabule? Reincarnation? Purgatory? Styx? The Bardo? The Elysian feilds? Nifulheim?

As to the other passages, the general gyst of them is "blessed are they who can believe without seeing" which is all well and good, however none of them say "Damned are they who can't."

Matthew 7:13

The Narrow and Wide Gates
13"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it.


John 14:6

6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

 

[Gunny]

As one poster so eloquently put it ..... God can multi-task. He can be all things to all people.

It is hard sometimes, IMO to differentiate between God's word, and the words of men speaking for God.

As a Christian, I believe salvation is through Christ.

I am however not so arrogant as to believe God has offered salvation only to my little church.

Much as it pains me, I would have to agree with nuk-yu-ler that Heaven would be sparsley populated and Hell would have an overflow line.

 

[007]

I am however not so arrogant as to believe God has offered salvation only to my little church.

Much as it pains me, I would have to agree with nuk-yu-ler that Heaven would be sparsley populated and Hell would have an overflow line.

Well... that's the way it will be Gunny...

Again...

Matthew 7:13

The Narrow and Wide Gates

13 Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it.

 

[Avatar4321]

More than one religion claiming to be the only path to heaven

Plus

They say if you don't believe in their religion you go to hell

Equals

According to religion, all people are going to hell

All people are going to hell. Our evil natures bring natural consequences and those consequences include the punishment of hell or spiritual death and our physical deaths.

That is why we needed a Savior. That is why Christ descended below all things and suffered for our sins, our pains and even suffered death. So He could lift us above all things. Through Him we can become new beings. Through Him human nature can be changed. Which is why it is only through Him that we can overcome death, both physical and spiritual.

You're problem is your lack of desire to truely know God. You look at religions and see confusion so rather than find out which teaches the truth concerning God you declare them all false and God a myth. Makes your life simplier since you don't have to put any effort into it. The sad thing is that there is an easy way through the confusion. "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God who giveth liberally and upbraideth not, and it shall be given unto him"

All religions are not created equal. All contain some truth, but only one contains it all. And that is Christianity in its pristine and pure state. Which also happens to be Judiasm in it's pure state. It's the same religion, the followers just don't realize it yet.

 

[Avatar4321]

As one poster so eloquently put it ..... God can multi-task. He can be all things to all people.

It is hard sometimes, IMO to differentiate between God's word, and the words of men speaking for God.

As a Christian, I believe salvation is through Christ.

I am however not so arrogant as to believe God has offered salvation only to my little church.

Much as it pains me, I would have to agree with nuk-yu-ler that Heaven would be sparsley populated and Hell would have an overflow line.

Is it arrogant to say that if God came down and said salvation is only offered to your little church and you simply tell others what God said? I'm asking this mostly for curosity sake.

I think that is why the Twelve so eagerly set out with their message of Christ at the meridian of time. Christ told them that He was the only way to Salvation. And though they were but a small group at the time, they loved others so much they went out and endured hardship, revilings, and preached to them the message of salvation.

I don't think Heaven is sparesly populated. but I am also afraid that Hell is full of alot more people than we sometimes want to admit. It's a pity. But ultimately it was their choice so there isnt much we can do for them now.

 

[Said1]

Interesting post, but while it is true that a lot of people (myself included) look askance at superstition and don't like being told what to do or what should be legal or illegal by people based upon their superstitions, this is not a "liberal" trait.

I was thinking something along those lines myself. The church, in setting rules and moral codes of behavior for it followers (stemming from the bible) represents authority. I have problems respecting authority, how about you?

 

[007]

I was thinking something along those lines myself. The church, in setting rules and moral codes of behavior for it followers (stemming from the bible) represents authority. I have problems respecting authority, how about you?

If you insist on pointing out your short comings... what can a person say?

You know something is wrong but you're going to do it anyway?

 

[Shattered]

If you insist on pointing out your short comings... what can a person say?

You know something is wrong but you're going to do it anyway?

Every single one of us is guilty of that multiple times in any given day of our lives.. Are you trying to say you're not?