Liberal -vs- Conservative

[AVG-JOE]

I like to drink alcohol conservatively.

I like to be paid liberally for my liberally given labor.

I like to treat my credit cards conservatively.

I like to love my wife liberally.

I like to train my dogs conservatively that I am 'alpha'.

I like to play fetch with them liberally.

I try to eat conservatively.

I like to exercise liberally.

So... Am I liberal or am I conservative?

What I want to hear from my politicians is:

-"Do you 'get it' that many of us are tired of living under an unfair tax code?"

-"Do you 'get it' that looking at the mound of paperwork and cost involved in starting a business may cause many of us to say 'fuck it' and go to work for a Chinese corporation because the odds of loosing our pension to the Chinese CEO are a bit less than our loosing it to his American counterpart?"

-"Do you 'get it' that living under a government of the professional lobbyist and for the professional lobbyist has been benefitting only those that can afford a lobbyist?"

-"Do you 'get it' that not all of us can afford a lobbyist?" In grade school they told me my congressman was my lobbyist in Washington... has something changed?

-"Do you 'get it' that some of us would rather see our tax dollars go toward rebuilding, upgrading and expanding our infrastructure than continuing a war we never should have started?"

-Do you 'get it' that the war we never should have started has exhausted our military and left us unable to go after the bastards who did attack us and vulnerable to further attack?"

-"Do you 'get it' that we live under a legal code so complicated that only those who can afford attorneys and accountants have a chance to grow economically?"

-"Do you 'get it' that not all of want a lawyer and an accountant on staff, even if we can afford it?"

-Do you 'get it' that I am looking for a leader who will tax me fairly and invest those taxes in the infrastructure my kids will use to feed my grandkids?"

So... Am I a Liberal or am I a Conservative?

-Joe

 

[RetiredGySgt]

And you are going to vote for Obama? Man what koolaid did you drink?

Obama will raise taxes, Obama will drive business out of the Country. Obama is in the pocket of lobbyists just like every other politician. Obama will create even more socialist Government run programs paid for from YOUR paycheck via taxes. Obama will increase dependency on Big Brother and remove even more rights and privileges from the average American, all in the name of mediocrity.

 

[AVG-JOE]

And you are going to vote for Obama? Man what koolaid did you drink?

Obama will raise taxes, Obama will drive business out of the Country. Obama is in the pocket of lobbyists just like every other politician. Obama will create even more socialist Government run programs paid for from YOUR paycheck via taxes. Obama will increase dependency on Big Brother and remove even more rights and privileges from the average American, all in the name of mediocrity.

Yeah, I am going to vote for Obama. He is the first politician who talks of fundamental change in the way Washington does business. Honestly, in his speech he laid out a pretty good plan. If he is not full of shit or lying to us, America will be better off. If he is lying, loony or too weak to make the changes he speaks of we can revolt later. What is clear to me is that unless the lobbyists are reigned in soon and life and taxes in America made more fair, violence is sure to fill the gap between the 'haves' and the 'have-nots'.

-Joe

 

[AllieBaba]

He says what he expects people want to hear, but it has no basis in fact and none of what he proposes has any expectation of success. Not only that, he doesn't mean most of what he's saying. He'll say whatever he has to say to get into office (which isn't going to happen, anyway) and then he will do what he wants. He has no respect for the American people, he doesn't think your children deserve to have anything...he doesn't think anyone "deserves" anything, except a select handful...selected by himself and his cronies.

He wants to see you and your children poor, subjugated, and under the control of a government that cannot be questioned or challenged.

 

[busara]

He says what he expects people want to hear, but it has no basis in fact and none of what he proposes has any expectation of success. Not only that, he doesn't mean most of what he's saying. He'll say whatever he has to say to get into office (which isn't going to happen, anyway) and then he will do what he wants. He has no respect for the American people, he doesn't think your children deserve to have anything...he doesn't think anyone "deserves" anything, except a select handful...selected by himself and his cronies.

He wants to see you and your children poor, subjugated, and under the control of a government that cannot be questioned or challenged.

can you substantiate this?

 

[AVG-JOE]

He says what he expects people want to hear, but it has no basis in fact and none of what he proposes has any expectation of success. Not only that, he doesn't mean most of what he's saying. He'll say whatever he has to say to get into office (which isn't going to happen, anyway) and then he will do what he wants. He has no respect for the American people, he doesn't think your children deserve to have anything...he doesn't think anyone "deserves" anything, except a select handful...selected by himself and his cronies.

He wants to see you and your children poor, subjugated, and under the control of a government that cannot be questioned or challenged.

Dude, you're scaring me; when I close my eyes and read this, I see the face of G.W. Bush...

-Joe

 

[rayboyusmc]

Ali and retired, you are truly a pair. Obama says what people want to hear but McCain is honest and truthful. Please, at least pretend to be rational.

You are so full of the koolaid your eyes must be red.

After 8 years of total screw ups you still defend your little screw upper who has proved he is a screw up and damn Obama who hasn't even had a chance to screw up.

You are truly the true believers that politicians feast on and the lobbyists grow fat on.


McCain will continue the same as we have. Pity your grandchildren that you are damning to this condition.

 

[Silence]

He says what he expects people want to hear, but it has no basis in fact and none of what he proposes has any expectation of success. Not only that, he doesn't mean most of what he's saying. He'll say whatever he has to say to get into office (which isn't going to happen, anyway) and then he will do what he wants. He has no respect for the American people, he doesn't think your children deserve to have anything...he doesn't think anyone "deserves" anything, except a select handful...selected by himself and his cronies.

He wants to see you and your children poor, subjugated, and under the control of a government that cannot be questioned or challenged.

sorry, are you talking about Bush/McCain here?

Bush said there were WMD in Iraq to justify a war we had no business getting into. McCain voted for it and still supports it even in the face of unforseen cost and loss of millions of lives.

Bush inacted the Patriot Act so he could justify spying and investigating the American people (ie those who oppose him). He supports Guantanamo Bay even though not one actual terrorist has been detained there, McCain, a man who was tortured as a POW also sees nothing wrong with this facility remaining open.

For the first four years of his presidency if you dared speak out against Bush you were called unpatriotic and a traitor to your country. He used 9/11 to silence people's dissent and outrage. He still uses it as a weapon even though he ignored all the warning signs and helped air lift members of the Bin Laden family out of the country immediately following the attacks. He tried to hinder the 9/11 commissions investigation into the attacks. Remind me again how many attorney generals he fired for not doing what he wanted?

under this adminstration CIA operative names were leaked as political strategy for fuck sake!

and McCain offers us just more of the same.

The Maverick is no more. he's towing the party line right to the end.

 

[Bern80]

Yeah, I am going to vote for Obama. He is the first politician who talks of fundamental change in the way Washington does business. Honestly, in his speech he laid out a pretty good plan. If he is not full of shit or lying to us, America will be better off. If he is lying, loony or too weak to make the changes he speaks of we can revolt later. What is clear to me is that unless the lobbyists are reigned in soon and life and taxes in America made more fair, violence is sure to fill the gap between the 'haves' and the 'have-nots'.

-Joe

Every politician running for office talks about change, every last one of them. yes obama is too, but a lot of his 'changes' run counter to your original statements.

As far as the lobbyists are concerned what do you propose? You can't abolish lobbying. You can't disallow groups of people with like interests from haveing there voices heard.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Do a little research on the Corn made Ethanol Lobby and Obama, then get back to me on who is in the pocket of Lobbyists.

Obama comes from the most corrupt political machine in this country and you think he does not have debts to pay, is not in people's pocket?

 

[stivex]

Obama's change credibility went out the window with the pick Biden as his veep. Biden has been in the Senate longer than McCain! He is a trademark Washington insider. The change Obama wants is from Republican to Democrat. He is not saying anything differently than other Dems that ran before him. The only change is more government control in an effort to socialize more programs for people under the guise of taking care of the middle class and poor people.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Every politician running for office talks about change, every last one of them. yes obama is too, but a lot of his 'changes' run counter to your original statements.

How do you figure? Did you hear his speech?

"...As president, I will tap our natural gas reserves, invest in clean coal technology, and find ways to safely harness nuclear power. I'll help our auto companies re-tool, so that the fuel-efficient cars of the future are built right here in America."

How is this statement counter to a market economy?

"...America, now is not the time for small plans. Now is the time to finally meet our moral obligation to provide every child a world-class education, because it will take nothing less to compete in the global economy."

How is this statement not a good vision for spending our tax dollars?

Or this:

"...And we will keep our promise to every young American: If you commit to serving your community or our country, we will make sure you can afford a college education."

"...Now is the time to change our bankruptcy laws, so that your pensions are protected ahead of CEO bonuses, and the time to protect Social Security for future generations."

How does this idea not sound more fundamentally fair than bailing out corporations while their CEO's float gently to the country club on a golden parachute?

Shall I go on?

The only question that remains is how to pay for it...

Whether we are paying for Obamas vision or McCains corporate bail-outs, hand outs and war we are going to borrow it from our kids. Either way we are gambling with a visa card. If you like the way the table has played for the last 8 years, vote to keep playing - I vote we move to a new game. Even if it is wrong, it can't be any worse

As far as the lobbyists are concerned what do you propose? You can't abolish lobbying. You can't disallow groups of people with like interests from haveing there voices heard.

The People.

We, The People should never be denied the right to lobby our government.

It is the professional lobbyist who is a cancer on the American Experiment and must be removed.

-Joe

 

[AllieBaba]

Ali and retired, you are truly a pair. Obama says what people want to hear but McCain is honest and truthful. Please, at least pretend to be rational.

You are so full of the koolaid your eyes must be red.

After 8 years of total screw ups you still defend your little screw upper who has proved he is a screw up and damn Obama who hasn't even had a chance to screw up.

You are truly the true believers that politicians feast on and the lobbyists grow fat on.


McCain will continue the same as we have. Pity your grandchildren that you are damning to this condition.

Lol. Have we caught McCain in any lies? No, I don't think so. So he changed his stance on abortion, good for him. I've changed my stance on the death penalty, it happens.

Changing your attitude about something is not the same as lying, which is what Obama's famous for.

 

[AllieBaba]

Every politician running for office talks about change, every last one of them. yes obama is too, but a lot of his 'changes' run counter to your original statements.

As far as the lobbyists are concerned what do you propose? You can't abolish lobbying. You can't disallow groups of people with like interests from haveing there voices heard.

It's one thing to promise change. It's another to promise change, with absolutely no record of ever changing anything, with no record of ever attempting to change anything, and with no actual plan to change anything other than to make it "different".

Has Obama ever put forth an idea of his own that he didn't later recant?