Lib cop killer lovers win again: Mumia not to be executed

[driveby]

No question about that.

I am ignorant of the facts in the Jamal case. But I believe keeping him alive on Death Row for all these years was intentional psychological torture.

I try to imagine what it must be like but I can't.

Moonbats worry about the psychological torture of the piece of shit murderer, the rest of us worry more about the psychological torture of the victim's wife and family......

And liberals believe the state shouldn't have the power to kill people except in self-defense.

I disagree, but my convictions aren't that strong when it comes to this issue, i'm ok with the piece of shit spending the rest of his life in jail. As far as fag Mike's "pychological torture" nonsense, fuck Jamal, i feel for the victim's family, not that piece of shit.....

 

[MikeK]

Personally I think life behind bars is far worse than being put to death.

No question about that.

I am ignorant of the facts in the Jamal case. But I believe keeping him alive on Death Row for all these years was intentional psychological torture.

I try to imagine what it must be like but I can't.

Moonbats worry about the psychological torture of the piece of shit murderer, the rest of us worry more about the psychological torture of the victim's wife and family......

"Whoever would make his own liberty secure must guard even his most despised countryman from oppression by government, for if he ignores this sacred duty he thus establishes a precedent which someday will surely reach to himself." (Thomas Paine)


What government can do to one it can do to another. You, for example.

If Jamal is found guilty of killing someone either kill him or sentence him to life in prison. But the criminal justice system tacitly takes the position that killing a cop is somehow a more egregious crime than killing an ordinary citizen. Thus the oppressive torture.

I'm not "worried" about it. I disagree with it. And, as articulated by Thomas Paine, for good reason.

 

[Ravi]

Moonbats worry about the psychological torture of the piece of shit murderer, the rest of us worry more about the psychological torture of the victim's wife and family......

And liberals believe the state shouldn't have the power to kill people except in self-defense.

I disagree, but my convictions aren't that strong when it comes to this issue, i'm ok with the piece of shit spending the rest of his life in jail. As far as fag Mike's "pychological torture" nonsense, fuck Jamal, i feel for the victim's family, not that piece of shit.....

I didn't read the whole thread, but I don't care about the "pychological torture" I only am not okay with giving the government the power of life or death.

 

[William Joyce]

I only am not okay with giving the government the power of life or death.

I don't recall you protesting the death penalty for the killer of James Byrd... but I'm sure you'll toss up a link to set me straight. There were several threads on the topic.

 

[Dr Grump]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

How the Fed reacted is a red herring....

 

[Liability]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

How the Fed reacted is a red herring....

Incorrect.

I agree that Koresh was primarily culpable.

But there was plenty of blame to go around.

 

[MikeK]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

[...]

It's the end of the story for you because you are ignorant of the beginning and the middle.

Is it possible you are one of the three or four Americans who don't know BATF could have arrested Koresh on the street or on the road on just about any day of the week? And that could have been done quickly and quietly by two competent agents. So there was absolutely no good reason for that raid, which was code-named "Showtime" and was intended purely for publicity purposes but backfired.

So go here and educate yourself: Assault on Waco

 

[Ravi]

I only am not okay with giving the government the power of life or death.

I don't recall you protesting the death penalty for the killer of James Byrd... but I'm sure you'll toss up a link to set me straight. There were several threads on the topic.

The difference being that this guy was proud of himself for what he did and no one doubted at all that he was guilty.

I still don't think he should have been executed, though.

Read the thread.

 

[jillian]

A sane society eliminates is convicted maniacal murderers...

Hopefully this guy gets shanked in general pop

really, dd? then why isn't there another civilized society that uses the death penalty?

 

[George Costanza]

Opposition to the death penalty does not imply sympathy for the criminal nor condonation of the crime committed.

 

[Dr Grump]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

[...]

It's the end of the story for you because you are ignorant of the beginning and the middle.

Is it possible you are one of the three or four Americans who don't know BATF could have arrested Koresh on the street or on the road on just about any day of the week? And that could have been done quickly and quietly by two competent agents. So there was absolutely no good reason for that raid, which was code-named "Showtime" and was intended purely for publicity purposes but backfired.

So go here and educate yourself: Assault on Waco

I've done this story to death with its conspiracy theories etc. At the end of the day, if Koresh had nothing to hide, gave up to the ATF and gotten it all sorted without any bloodshed. If it turned out the ATF over reacted, or acted illegally, then he could have sued their butts and made some dosh.

Instead he decided a bloodbath was the way to go. He was a narcisstic egomanic with a god complex. Completely his fault...end of story...

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

"Another penalty proceeding would open the case to the repetition of the state appeals process and an unknowable number of years of federal review again, even if we were successful," the district attorney said.

Abu-Jamal was originally sentenced to death. His murder conviction was upheld through years of appeals. But in 2008, a federal appeals court ordered a new sentencing hearing on the grounds that the instructions given to the jury were potentially misleading.

After the U.S. Supreme Court declined to weigh in two months ago, prosecutors were forced to decide whether to pursue the death penalty again or accept a life sentence without parole.

What does any of this have to do with ‘liberals’? Prosecutors decline to pursue the death penalty in many cases for many reasons having nothing to do with ‘liberals.’

In this case a possible error with regard to sentencing.

 

[konradv]

Stupid bullshit ^ mindlessly false post.

I'm amazed how hypocritical so many are that they'd be willing to pull the switch on a guy that killed one cop, but give a pass to those who killed four!!!

Too bad they didn't kill them all. And those raiders weren't "cops" in the accepted sense of the word. They were armed goons conducting an illegal invasion of privacy -- and they got what their hand called for.

Too bad 21 innocent kids had to pay the ultimate price for their tyrannical bullshit.

Yeah, try that line of reasoning when cops come to the door with a search warrant! They were cops in EVERY sense of the word. Remarkably restrained cops, at that. If something similar had happened in my town, the cops would have probably have stormed the place on the spot before any brass even got there. You're totally in this for the poltical aspect, because on the legal side you don't have a leg to stand on.

 

[konradv]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

How the Fed reacted is a red herring....

Incorrect.

I agree that Koresh was primarily culpable.

But there was plenty of blame to go around.

What blame? They gave the BDs plenty of time to give up and NO ONE has suggested that it was the Feds that spread gasoline around the compound. They WANTED to commit suicide by cop. The whole question of whether or not the Feds introduced the spark that igniited the fire is irrelevant. The spark could just as easily come from the BDs guns. THEY set the stage, you can't blame the other actors.

 

[LAfrique]

DA dropping death penalty against Mumia Abu-Jamal

Novasteve, I do not think that this is a win-lose situation. I think it is possible the prosecutors finally saw something that made them changed their minds. If I were defense for Mumia Abu Jamal, I would file for disclosure, seeing prosecutors in this case would not freely reveal anything that might free "arrogant" Mumia Abu Jamal.

 

[Chewsters]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

How the Fed reacted is a red herring....

Incorrect.

I agree that Koresh was primarily culpable.

But there was plenty of blame to go around.

I agree. My issue was it didn't need to be done the way Reno et.al. did it. Koresh could have been taken into custody much more expeditiously by nabbing him the next time he left the compound to go into town (which he did do). Instead the Feds thought they'd make a "really big shew" out of surrounding the compound. Koresh is responsible for what when on there, but the Feds are responsible for the way things were done in the first place.

 

[MikeK]

I'm amazed how hypocritical so many are that they'd be willing to pull the switch on a guy that killed one cop, but give a pass to those who killed four!!!

Too bad they didn't kill them all. And those raiders weren't "cops" in the accepted sense of the word. They were armed goons conducting an illegal invasion of privacy -- and they got what their hand called for.

Too bad 21 innocent kids had to pay the ultimate price for their tyrannical bullshit.

Yeah, try that line of reasoning when cops come to the door with a search warrant! They were cops in EVERY sense of the word. Remarkably restrained cops, at that. If something similar had happened in my town, the cops would have probably have stormed the place on the spot before any brass even got there. You're totally in this for the poltical aspect, because on the legal side you don't have a leg to stand on.

What happened at Waco, from the very beginning to its utterly insane conclusion, is a textbook example of authoritarian psychopathology on a massive scale. It was a shameful exercise of federal oppression the essential point of which was, submit or die! And anyone who cannot or will not understand that is amenable to tyranny and does not deserve to live under the protection of the U.S. Constitution.

Something you and all who think like you need to understand is everything the Nazis did in Hitler's Germany was legal within the perverse framework of laws put in place by the Third Reich. And you should know that I am concerned with neither the legal nor the political aspect of the colossal crime perpetrated at Waco by our government but with the moral aspect of it, which you and those who agree with you are clearly incapable of either comprehending or acknowledging.

Your perversely authoritarian rationale completely ignores the most significant and important element of the tragedy which is the protracted suffering and hideous deaths of 21 innocent children, including little tots as young as two years. Both the BATF and the FBI/HRT were fully aware those children were in that building and they continued to behave like Nazi Storm Troopers in the Warsaw Ghetto.

Considering the fact that neither David Koresh nor any of the Branch Davidians had done anything felonious or harmful to anyone there is no excuse for what the government agents did nor any way to justify it. But you will try to blame Koresh whom the FBI/HRT supervisors, themselves, believed to be insane. There was no question the FBI/HRT knew the Branch Davidians who refused to come out were fanatical and potentially suicidal, yet they paid absolutely no attention to the safety of those children who essentially were hostages.

The simple and obvious fact of the matter is the federal agents clearly placed the authoritarian commitment to imposing their will at any cost above the fate of those children. And that, alone, was the only real and significant crime in the Waco story.

 

[Dr Grump]

Too bad they didn't kill them all. And those raiders weren't "cops" in the accepted sense of the word. They were armed goons conducting an illegal invasion of privacy -- and they got what their hand called for.

Too bad 21 innocent kids had to pay the ultimate price for their tyrannical bullshit.

Yeah, try that line of reasoning when cops come to the door with a search warrant! They were cops in EVERY sense of the word. Remarkably restrained cops, at that. If something similar had happened in my town, the cops would have probably have stormed the place on the spot before any brass even got there. You're totally in this for the poltical aspect, because on the legal side you don't have a leg to stand on.

What happened at Waco, from the very beginning to its utterly insane conclusion, is a textbook example of authoritarian psychopathology on a massive scale. It was a shameful exercise of federal oppression the essential point of which was, submit or die! And anyone who cannot or will not understand that is amenable to tyranny and does not deserve to live under the protection of the U.S. Constitution.

Something you and all who think like you need to understand is everything the Nazis did in Hitler's Germany was legal within the perverse framework of laws put in place by the Third Reich. And you should know that I am concerned with neither the legal nor the political aspect of the colossal crime perpetrated at Waco by our government but with the moral aspect of it, which you and those who agree with you are clearly incapable of either comprehending or acknowledging.

Your perversely authoritarian rationale completely ignores the most significant and important element of the tragedy which is the protracted suffering and hideous deaths of 21 innocent children, including little tots as young as two years. Both the BATF and the FBI/HRT were fully aware those children were in that building and they continued to behave like Nazi Storm Troopers in the Warsaw Ghetto.

Considering the fact that neither David Koresh nor any of the Branch Davidians had done anything felonious or harmful to anyone there is no excuse for what the government agents did nor any way to justify it. But you will try to blame Koresh whom the FBI/HRT supervisors, themselves, believed to be insane. There was no question the FBI/HRT knew the Branch Davidians who refused to come out were fanatical and potentially suicidal, yet they paid absolutely no attention to the safety of those children who essentially were hostages.

The simple and obvious fact of the matter is the federal agents clearly placed the authoritarian commitment to imposing their will at any cost above the fate of those children. And that, alone, was the only real and significant crime in the Waco story.

I've never read such a load of crap on the subject in all my life..although there are some I have read that come pretty close...

Koresh had plenty of time to give himself up and decided to take on the govt. End of story...

You're more interested if the constitution was thrown out the window as opposed to the practicality of the situation.

Down here we have the same problem with the anti-police/authority liberitarians when people die in car chases. The headlines always make sure it was caused by a police chasing an offender who kills themselves, their passengers or innocent bystanders. To me it is ALWAYS the offenders fault. If you want to give them leeway, then throw the law book out the window. If you want to go and live in a lawless socity head off to Somalia or PD of Congo....That's the kinds of society you have when you ignore laws.

I don't think the FBI/ATF did a damn thing wrong. Koresh is responsible for every single death. Period.......

 

[FA_Q2]

Yeah, try that line of reasoning when cops come to the door with a search warrant! They were cops in EVERY sense of the word. Remarkably restrained cops, at that. If something similar had happened in my town, the cops would have probably have stormed the place on the spot before any brass even got there. You're totally in this for the poltical aspect, because on the legal side you don't have a leg to stand on.

What happened at Waco, from the very beginning to its utterly insane conclusion, is a textbook example of authoritarian psychopathology on a massive scale. It was a shameful exercise of federal oppression the essential point of which was, submit or die! And anyone who cannot or will not understand that is amenable to tyranny and does not deserve to live under the protection of the U.S. Constitution.

Something you and all who think like you need to understand is everything the Nazis did in Hitler's Germany was legal within the perverse framework of laws put in place by the Third Reich. And you should know that I am concerned with neither the legal nor the political aspect of the colossal crime perpetrated at Waco by our government but with the moral aspect of it, which you and those who agree with you are clearly incapable of either comprehending or acknowledging.

Your perversely authoritarian rationale completely ignores the most significant and important element of the tragedy which is the protracted suffering and hideous deaths of 21 innocent children, including little tots as young as two years. Both the BATF and the FBI/HRT were fully aware those children were in that building and they continued to behave like Nazi Storm Troopers in the Warsaw Ghetto.

Considering the fact that neither David Koresh nor any of the Branch Davidians had done anything felonious or harmful to anyone there is no excuse for what the government agents did nor any way to justify it. But you will try to blame Koresh whom the FBI/HRT supervisors, themselves, believed to be insane. There was no question the FBI/HRT knew the Branch Davidians who refused to come out were fanatical and potentially suicidal, yet they paid absolutely no attention to the safety of those children who essentially were hostages.

The simple and obvious fact of the matter is the federal agents clearly placed the authoritarian commitment to imposing their will at any cost above the fate of those children. And that, alone, was the only real and significant crime in the Waco story.

I've never read such a load of crap on the subject in all my life..although there are some I have read that come pretty close...

Koresh had plenty of time to give himself up and decided to take on the govt. End of story...

You're more interested if the constitution was thrown out the window as opposed to the practicality of the situation.

Down here we have the same problem with the anti-police/authority liberitarians when people die in car chases. The headlines always make sure it was caused by a police chasing an offender who kills themselves, their passengers or innocent bystanders. To me it is ALWAYS the offenders fault. If you want to give them leeway, then throw the law book out the window. If you want to go and live in a lawless socity head off to Somalia or PD of Congo....That's the kinds of society you have when you ignore laws.

I don't think the FBI/ATF did a damn thing wrong. Koresh is responsible for every single death. Period.......

Your damn right he is and he damn well should be. What the fuck is the law for if it is thrown out on a whim....

 

[konradv]

The only person responsible for Waco was Koresh...end of story.

How the Fed reacted is a red herring....

Incorrect.

I agree that Koresh was primarily culpable.

But there was plenty of blame to go around.

I agree. My issue was it didn't need to be done the way Reno et.al. did it. Koresh could have been taken into custody much more expeditiously by nabbing him the next time he left the compound to go into town (which he did do). Instead the Feds thought they'd make a "really big shew" out of surrounding the compound. Koresh is responsible for what when on there, but the Feds are responsible for the way things were done in the first place.

Before you start having "issues", you should realize after all these years, they didn't have an arrest warrant, they had a search warrant!!!