Let's Be Honest About Outsourcing

[JoeB131]

LOL

It's too fucking hard for Liberals to buy American, he says.

When they don't tell you where it was made, yeah.

 

[SniperFire]

LOL

It's too fucking hard for Liberals to buy American, he says.

When they don't tell you where it was made, yeah.

For 10 years, Walmart had a 'buy local, buy America' program where they would put the domestic manufacturers labels all around the store, and at point of purchase, they would highlight the products especially made in the State.

For example, in Ohio you would have on endcap a plasticware display they would feature Rubbermaid products right next to the imports.

Guess what the greedy, selfish liberals all purchased?


LOL

 

[kyzr]

1. Quality is directly related to training and QA/QC programs. If someone isn't performing they need to be replaced. In today's market, bad quality is the surest way to lose your jobs.

Not really. There's always a balancing act between quality and cost. Trust me, I do this for a living. About half my day is chasing down quality issues because we picked the lowest bidder.

2. Your rationale' fits union shops as well as open shops. Poor management is always a problem. Thats when Corporate overwatch becomes necessary, and bad managers need to be replaced.

Um, yeah. I've seen companies close up branches before they fired bad managers. Usually, I've seen cases where everyone else gets fired before they give a bad manager a golden parachute to leave. Because usually, the guys at corporate are as big of douchebags as he is.

All a union does is level the playing field and makes sure the worker gets a fair shake.

3. Not to bust your bubble, but most products, cars, airplanes, appliances, etc, don't have tariffs. When I get on a plane, if it says its made in Germany (my last ride) I don't care. If the Boeing plant in NC was opened, there would be more planes made in the US. Since that plant didn't open orders were lost, and jobs were lost. Blame the DC whores for their stupid tax policies. I want to make money with my investments, since Medicare will be bankrupt, SS will be bankrupt, and Obamacare will cause many hospitals to close.

And the moon will turn to sackclothe, etc.

Funny, the thing is, Germany is a lot further along in the path Obama wants to take, and they are doing fine... now why is that? It was Boeing's attempt to break its union that was the problem, not anything people in Washington did other than make them keep their promises.

1. I'm not a fan of low-bid as much as best-bid. Then again we have to deal with minority set-asides, and those quality issues.
2. Unions don't level the playing field, they make us work uphill all the time.
3. We can agree to disagree on Boeing. Watch what happens if Mitt wins in November as far as keeping promises.

 

[JoeB131]

LOL

It's too fucking hard for Liberals to buy American, he says.

When they don't tell you where it was made, yeah.

For 10 years, Walmart had a 'buy local, buy America' program where they would put the domestic manufacturers labels all around the store, and at point of purchase, they would highlight the products especially made in the State.

For example, in Ohio you would have on endcap a plasticware display they would feature Rubbermaid products right next to the imports.

Guess what the greedy, selfish liberals all purchased?


LOL

Ummmm, isn't Ohio usually a Red State? Not sure what your point is here, do you know who bought what and where.

I don't think it's a matter of "liberals" or "conservatives". I think it's a matter of when you are making minimum wage at Staples instead of a good paying job at AmPad (because Mitt Romney downsized it), you try to save your pennies...

Now, yeah, on a macro level, this is pretty bad. And it contributes to the problem.

But the real problem is policy. No other country has CEO's who make eight figure salaries. No other country fails to protect its own industries and manufacturing from imports the way we do.

 

[Sallow]

Poor Rottie, realizing that people are getting wise to Outsourcing as a bad idea.

Of course it's a bad idea and always has been.

We have trade deficits of 500 billion dollars a year- every year. Our GDP would be 5 Trillion dollars stronger if we kept those jobs in the US.

But a few rich douchebags like Mitt Romney make a fortune, and that's good by you.

That's basically it in a nutshell.

Obama's proposed changing the tax code to penalize companies that outsource.

Romney gave those companies their seed money.

And Republicans are running him for President.

 

[SniperFire]

When they don't tell you where it was made, yeah.

For 10 years, Walmart had a 'buy local, buy America' program where they would put the domestic manufacturers labels all around the store, and at point of purchase, they would highlight the products especially made in the State.

For example, in Ohio you would have on endcap a plasticware display they would feature Rubbermaid products right next to the imports.

Guess what the greedy, selfish liberals all purchased?


LOL

Ummmm, isn't Ohio usually a Red State? Not sure what your point is here, do you know who bought what and where.

I don't think it's a matter of "liberals" or "conservatives". I think it's a matter of when you are making minimum wage at Staples instead of a good paying job at AmPad (because Mitt Romney downsized it), you try to save your pennies...

Now, yeah, on a macro level, this is pretty bad. And it contributes to the problem.

But the real problem is policy. No other country has CEO's who make eight figure salaries. No other country fails to protect its own industries and manufacturing from imports the way we do.

I KNOW, moron. I had a job at the time helping our top consumer brand companies try and figure out ways to compete with low-cost producer importers.

But guess what? In most all of the cases, the consumer shrugged off the understand that if they bought a plastic container made by their neighbor in Wooster, Ohio, they might save his job at Rubbermaid.

The consumer went for the cheap slave-labor stuff instead.

Personally, I don't blame the consumer as consumerism drives efficiencies and has raised everyones standard of living.

But I blame you ignorant, whiney fucks for crying about outsourcing when you haven't a CLUE as to why it is done - and that you are as guilty as anyone.

 

[P@triot]

Poor Rottie, realizing that people are getting wise to Outsourcing as a bad idea.

Of course it's a bad idea and always has been.

We have trade deficits of 500 billion dollars a year- every year. Our GDP would be 5 Trillion dollars stronger if we kept those jobs in the US.

But a few rich douchebags like Mitt Romney make a fortune, and that's good by you.

Both parties and all of Wall Street outsourced jobs. I put a lot of the blame on unions. If you are on a Board and the vote comes where to put the new plant, where do you vote? How about Boeing and NC for example? Its a $1-billion mistake thanks to the current admin.

No, you see, the mistake is that Boeing really thinks it's a wonderful idea to have planes assembled by Billy-Bob and Cleetus working for non-union wages in South Carolina, when they get back from the Ham Festival.

Now, I don't know about you, but when I'm up in the air thousands of feet above the ground, in a tube made of metal powered by a highly volatile liquid fuel flying at hundreds of miles an hour, I want the guys who put it together to be well-compensated and happy with their jobs. I want him to be a life-long career professional who underwent years of training and apprenticeship.

I want the guys flying it to be well compensated and happy with their jobs.

I want the guys maintaining it to be well-compensated and happy with their jobs.

I don't give a fuck if the guy investing in the company are getting their money's worth. That's really not a priority for me at that point.

But in your world, the important thing is that that last group of guys make obscene amounts of money instead of a fair amount of money, and hey. let's make more planes at Billy-Bob's and Cleetus's plane factory...

Spoken like a true Communist asshole who wants to take from those who work hard, because he is too lazy to work hard himself.

Question douche-bag.... if the workers you speak of are sooo "unahppy" with their jobs, then why don't they go find a job they are happy with? Exactly.

You are where you are in life (at the very bottom) because you're an asshole. It's not because of the wealthy. It's not because of the successful. It's because you are an asshole. You're an envious jerk. You're lazy. You're greedy. You're selfish. And worst of all, you are really stupid. And you can get the fuck out of this great nation any time you'd like and go live in your little communist utopia in Cuba. Because what you live for - redistribution of wealth will NEVER happpen here in the U.S. In fact, thanks to the American people waking up and starting some wonderful organization, unions are being shattered, the Tea Party is sending Constitutional representatives to Washington, and We The People are turning the nation around from the failures created by the redistributive communist dicks like you.

 

[P@triot]

I KNOW, moron. I had a job at the time helping our top consumer brand companies try and figure out ways to compete with low-cost producer importers.

But guess what? In most all of the cases, the consumer shrugged off the understand that if they bought a plastic container made by their neighbor in Wooster, Ohio, they might save his job at Rubbermaid.

The consumer went for the cheap slave-labor stuff instead.

Personally, I don't blame the consumer as consumerism drives efficiencies and has raised everyones standard of living.

But I blame you ignorant, whiney fucks for crying about outsourcing when you haven't a CLUE as to why it is done - and that you are as guilty as anyone.

And this is a glaring example of why SniperFire is one of the brightest individuals on USMB and why JoeB. is one of the dumbest.

Under JoeB.'s ideology, you end up with Russia (no one tries, there is no motiviation to make an effort, and it all ends up collapsing). However, when you let consumers drive the Free Market, and force companies to compete for those consumers, you get better products built at a better price.

But people like JoeB. don't want to compete - they want everything handed to them so they can sit at home smoking marijuana.

 

[Ernie S.]

When they don't tell you where it was made, yeah.

For 10 years, Walmart had a 'buy local, buy America' program where they would put the domestic manufacturers labels all around the store, and at point of purchase, they would highlight the products especially made in the State.

For example, in Ohio you would have on endcap a plasticware display they would feature Rubbermaid products right next to the imports.

Guess what the greedy, selfish liberals all purchased?


LOL

Ummmm, isn't Ohio usually a Red State? Not sure what your point is here, do you know who bought what and where.

I don't think it's a matter of "liberals" or "conservatives". I think it's a matter of when you are making minimum wage at Staples instead of a good paying job at AmPad (because Mitt Romney downsized it), you try to save your pennies...

Now, yeah, on a macro level, this is pretty bad. And it contributes to the problem.

But the real problem is policy. No other country has CEO's who make eight figure salaries. No other country fails to protect its own industries and manufacturing from imports the way we do.

Blatant lie!
Carlos Ghosn, chief executive of Nissan Motor Co was paid a salary and bonus of 987 million yen ($12.5 million) for the past fiscal year, a package that makes him Japan's highest-paid executive.
I'm sure a competent search would reveal more.
And just why is an executive's salary any business of yours? Should your fry cook position an Burger King pay the same as Alexandre Behring

 

[JoeB131]

Spoken like a true Communist asshole who wants to take from those who work hard, because he is too lazy to work hard himself.

Question douche-bag.... if the workers you speak of are sooo "unahppy" with their jobs, then why don't they go find a job they are happy with? Exactly.

You are where you are in life (at the very bottom) because you're an asshole. It's not because of the wealthy. It's not because of the successful. It's because you are an asshole. You're an envious jerk. You're lazy. You're greedy. You're selfish. And worst of all, you are really stupid. And you can get the fuck out of this great nation any time you'd like and go live in your little communist utopia in Cuba. Because what you live for - redistribution of wealth will NEVER happpen here in the U.S. In fact, thanks to the American people waking up and starting some wonderful organization, unions are being shattered, the Tea Party is sending Constitutional representatives to Washington, and We The People are turning the nation around from the failures created by the redistributive communist dicks like you.

Guy, I work very hard, unlike my boss who leaves at 3 PM each day... So, no it was never a matter of who is working hard, it's a matter of who slices up the pie. You guys live in fear that before you get to be the one slicing the pie, someone might make a rule making sure it is always sliced up fairly.

So really, when you whine about "envy", it's because you want to be one of those guys. I don't. I'm just happy with a process that's fair.

And your days are numbered. Demographics will wipe out the "Angry White Guy" demagraphic. But we should probably expedite the process.

I say we should make you all get services from people paid minimum wage or less.

So when you get food poisoning or paratenitus or the plane you're riding in crashes because Billy-Bob was making minimum wage when he re=atttached that engine, you'll really have no one to blame but yourself.

Me, I'll fly on the plane where the guy who built it and flew it was getting his fair share.

 

[JoeB131]

[



Blatant lie!
Carlos Ghosn, chief executive of Nissan Motor Co was paid a salary and bonus of 987 million yen ($12.5 million) for the past fiscal year, a package that makes him Japan's highest-paid executive.
I'm sure a competent search would reveal more.
And just why is an executive's salary any business of yours? Should your fry cook position an Burger King pay the same as Alexandre Behring

So the highest paid guy in Japan wouldn't even be a mid-manager in America...

Isn't that the point I was trying to make?

Frankly, I doubt your Redneck ass is making seven figures, so I'm not sure why you are so concerned about protecting those who do.

Oh, Carlos Ghosn doesn't sound like a Japanese name to me... and he isn't.

 

[kiwiman127]

Both candidates in the presidential race have been accusing the other of "outsourcing." It's one of those words that is loaded with negative meaning, implying that the perpetrator is un-American. But does America have an outsourcing problem?

What is popularly referred to as "outsourcing" is the practice of offshoring business functions, including building facilities and employing workers in other countries. Liberals often argue that "sending jobs overseas" is harming America's economy.

They are missing two important truths: The reality of jobs in America, and the ways to bring even more jobs to the home front.

Jobs in America

• The U.S. actually leads the world in manufacturing. Yes, you read that correctly. We produce 21 percent of global manufactured products, while China comes after at 15 percent. According ot the National Association of Manufacturers, "manufacturing supports an estimated*17 million jobs in the U.S.—about one in six private sector jobs."

• Big manufacturers are building new plants here. BMW is adding 300 new jobs to its South Carolina plant this year, and Airbus recently announced it will employ 1,000 at a new plant in Alabama. (Both South Carolina and Alabama are right-to-work states, meaning that workers aren't forced to join unions.)

• Multinational corporations still employ more Americans. U.S.-based multinational corporations employ 22.9 million Americans—more than twice as many people as they employ in China, Mexico, and all other countries combined.

• There is no "giant sucking sound" of jobs and money fleeing the United States. According to the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis, the total value of foreign investment in the United States exceeds the value of U.S. investments in other countries by more than $4 trillion. Foreign-owned multinational corporations employ 5.5 million people in the United States.

• "Insourced" businesses are a tremendous boon for the U.S. economy. "Insourced" jobs—jobs brought to America by foreign-based companies—account for nearly 5 percent of private-sector employment. These businesses buy more than $1.8 trillion in*goods and services*from local suppliers and small businesses in the areas where they locate?

How to Boost American Jobs Even More

With an 8.2 percent unemployment rate, America still needs more jobs. There are many steps policymakers could take that would make locating—or relocating—in the U.S. more attractive to businesses.

A quick look at the Index of Economic Freedom, produced by The Heritage Foundation and The Wall Street Journal, reveals America's competitive disadvantages.

Hong Kong, ranked No. 1 in the Index, has an economy that has been growing at 7 percent. That's astounding. In contrast, U.S. GDP growth in the first quarter of 2012 was a paltry 1.9 percent.

There are several reasons why Hong Kong is No. 1 and America is No. 10. Hong Kong's top corporate tax rate is only 16.5 percent, compared to the U.S. rate of 35 percent. Hong Kong's trade regime is one of the world's most competitive and efficient, with a zero tariff rate. And its regulatory environment is "highly supportive of business efficiency."

Meanwhile, in the U.S., runaway regulations growing by the day make doing business vastly more expensive and difficult. The government is holding back the economy through regulation and its nonstop deficit spending, as Heritage's Bryan Riley explains:
Excessive federal spending and the resulting budget deficit continue to be a problem. Foreign investors spent more than $400 billion on U.S. Treasury securities in 2011. This is another way to say that the government borrowed more than $400 billion from foreign investors. Those dollars could have been invested otherwise in the private sector of the U.S. economy or spent on U.S. exports.

While concern about outsourcing is misplaced, there are many ways the U.S. could attract even more jobs than it already does. Increasing our own economic freedom would spur growth in the economy, bringing greater prosperity and new enterprises to our shores.

Morning Bell: Let's Be Honest About Outsourcing

Outsourcing is just plain bad.

Offshoring (or Offshore Outsourcing)
and Job Loss Among U.S. Workers
http://assets.opencrs.com/rpts/RL32292_20110121.pdf

An overview, offshoring of jobs actually started in the 1980's and ballooned 2003-2008. Offshoring causes job loss, job insecurity and holds down wages.
Just the fact that offshoring holds down wages and this has also been going on since the 1980's, consumerism has been weaken by the working classes lost of expendable income. Our economy is around 70% driven by consumer spending. Each recession we have experienced since the 80's has taken longer and longer to recover. In part flat wages have played a part.
That's just flat wages effect. Now think big, job losses.
And offshoring is good? For whom?

 

[Moonglow]

still trying to sell that "corporate tax rate too high" shit I see.

Topping out at 35 percent, America’s official corporate income tax rate trails that of only Japan, at 39.5 percent, which has said it plans to lower its rate. It is nearly triple Ireland’s and 10 percentage points higher than in Denmark, Austria or China. To help companies here stay competitive, many executives say, Congress should lower it.

But by taking advantage of myriad breaks and loopholes that other countries generally do not offer, United States corporations pay only slightly more on average than their counterparts in other industrial countries. And some American corporations use aggressive strategies to pay less — often far less — than their competitors abroad and at home. A Government Accountability Office study released in 2008 found that 55 percent of United States companies paid no federal income taxes during at least one year in a seven-year period it studied.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/03/business/economy/03rates.html

 

[boilermaker55]

Both parties are to blame but your statement to blame unions is so unfounded. Typical right wing anti worker stance.

Poor Rottie, realizing that people are getting wise to Outsourcing as a bad idea.

Of course it's a bad idea and always has been.

We have trade deficits of 500 billion dollars a year- every year. Our GDP would be 5 Trillion dollars stronger if we kept those jobs in the US.

But a few rich douchebags like Mitt Romney make a fortune, and that's good by you.

Both parties and all of Wall Street outsourced jobs. I put a lot of the blame on unions. If you are on a Board and the vote comes where to put the new plant, where do you vote? How about Boeing and NC for example? Its a $1-billion mistake thanks to the current admin.

 

[Moonglow]

LOL

It's too fucking hard for Liberals to buy American, he says.

When they don't tell you where it was made, yeah.

For 10 years, Walmart had a 'buy local, buy America' program where they would put the domestic manufacturers labels all around the store, and at point of purchase, they would highlight the products especially made in the State.

For example, in Ohio you would have on endcap a plasticware display they would feature Rubbermaid products right next to the imports.

Guess what the greedy, selfish liberals all purchased?


LOL

got any proof? nope, just more hate filled rhetoric your always spewing.

 

[Moonglow]

Both parties are to blame but your statement to blame unions is so unfounded. Typical right wing anti worker stance.

Poor Rottie, realizing that people are getting wise to Outsourcing as a bad idea.

Of course it's a bad idea and always has been.

We have trade deficits of 500 billion dollars a year- every year. Our GDP would be 5 Trillion dollars stronger if we kept those jobs in the US.

But a few rich douchebags like Mitt Romney make a fortune, and that's good by you.

Both parties and all of Wall Street outsourced jobs. I put a lot of the blame on unions. If you are on a Board and the vote comes where to put the new plant, where do you vote? How about Boeing and NC for example? Its a $1-billion mistake thanks to the current admin.

they are not against american workers, as long as they make less than min. wage.

 

[boilermaker55]

Yes. I stand corrected. How dare an American worker stand up for their rights of descent wake and working conditions. Seems some never have taken the time to study the plight of the real American workers.
Thank you for the correction.

Both parties are to blame but your statement to blame unions is so unfounded. Typical right wing anti worker stance.

Both parties and all of Wall Street outsourced jobs. I put a lot of the blame on unions. If you are on a Board and the vote comes where to put the new plant, where do you vote? How about Boeing and NC for example? Its a $1-billion mistake thanks to the current admin.

they are not against american workers, as long as they make less than min. wage.

 

[Steelplate]

You can blame unions all you want....and partially, you would be correct. SOME unions played hardball with companies instead of hitting a sacrifice fly. What I mean is, instead of working with a company that is struggling because of the payscale AND a large influx of imported competition....they were demanding too much.

The problem with blaming unions is that all of that competition has huge advantages over us......Their employees don't have to worry about paying for medical care, because most industrialized countries have universal health care....the employers don't have to worry about it either. Most industrialized countries also have a government subsidized education system that will pay for students to even come here to earn degrees and transfer those skills into their economy. There are other considerations, but I'm going out for the day with my family and have to hop in the shower....to be continued.....

Agreed its a complex problem, but people need good jobs or we'll become 3rd world. The unions need to realize that 1/2 loaf is better then no loaf. If they want a full loaf, then start a successful business.

the problem us that a half loaf isn't enough to even be comfortable in this country. You take a husband and wife.....both working full time at the current minimum wage($7.25/hr)....that's less than 30k/yr. Take away taxes and add even one child....Not to mention health insurance for the whole family($12k....on average).....then the everyday costs....rent, utilities,food,clothing.....and it becomes an unsustainable situation....then I hear conservatives saying that they want to even blow up the minimum wage.

That's what some of you really don't get when you talk about "class warfare"....it's not about jealousy......it's not about envy...it is truly about a fair day's pay for a fair day's work. I understand the concept of abolishing the minimum wage....high school kids don't necessarily need $7.25/hr....But people who have responsibilities need more than that. Especially if you are going to force women to have children that they don't want and can't afford(it's not a separate issue).

I just caught the end of your post....if you consider a full loaf the equivalent of running a successful business....then a half loaf is too much for a single employee. But I think there is an obligation for employers to pay their full time workers family sustaining wages.

This kind of stuff is the one and only reason that I wanted(and still do) a National Health Care Plan....or at least a Public Option added to the current system. It would allow employees to keep more of their wages and employers to not have to worry about providing it....it would make small businesses competitive with the big boys as far as finding and keeping good staff. Finally, it would allow mobility for employees and actually encourage individuals to take that risk and start a business without having to worry about someone in their family getting sick.

 

[Steelplate]

Oh, are we on about that again? Really....

Do you have like a rollette wheel of talking points...

You whine about outsourcing, but you and your Libtard friends won't buy American union made products and gobble up all the cheap slave-labor goods you can get your hands on.


Fucking hypocrites.

so....what are these cheap slave labor goods that compete with American union made goods?

 

[Steelplate]

Btw...kyzr....thanks for discussing things in a reasonable manner. Looking through page two of this thread....I see more of the bullshit "liberal" and "commie" crap...it gets old and is very counterproductive when it comes to working on a solution.