Leftist fanatics' latest fib: "Our immigration laws need reform!"

Little-Acorn

Gold Member
Jun 20, 2006
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The last time the liberals (in both parties) tried this, they got a roaring "NO!" from the American people. So many called and wrote to their Congressmen that they had to drop their attempt to gin up a "reform" bill that would have eventually granted amnesty to the 15-million-plus illegal aliens who have crossed our borders against our current laws.

Apparently the liberals didn't take the hint. They are trying it again. Various leftists (in both parties) have announced that they will try to put together yet another "immigration reform" bill... as though there were something wrong with our present laws.

None of these people have ever pinpointed what it is they don't like about our present laws. Our laws allow:

* It's illegal for foreigners to come into the country without a visa.

* It's illegal for them to stay in the country longer than specified on their visa or resident-alien card.

* Foreigners who do any of the above, are to be deported unless unusual circumstances (political asylum, etc.) can be established.

* It's illegal for foreigners in this country to get paying jobs unless their immigration papers permit it.

* Foreigners can come here to work for a specified period if the employer can show that no domestic workers can or will take the job ("Guest Worker Program").

* Foreign spouses and/or immediate family members of American citizens can come into the country.

* Several other categories of immigration exist, to let foreigners immigrate.

* Congress decided many decades ago, that immigration into the U.S. must be limited, so that assimilation can take place and the immigrants can learn American ways, language etc.; and so that communities won't simply be overwhelmed and transformed into foreign colonies of the country the immigrants came from.

What about thse present rules, do the liberals (in both parties) not like? Why do they keep insisting these rules need some kind of "reform"?

The problem has been, of course, not the rules. It's been the enforcement of the rules. The Fed govt has been flatly failing in their Constitutional duty to enforce these rules. One result of this, is that literally millions of foreigners ("aliens") have entered the country illegally, with 15 million (or more) remaining to this day. They take jobs Americans need, work "off the books" without paying taxes, overload schools with their children till the schools can no longer provide decent education, overwhelm hospital emergency rooms until the hospitals can no longer provide good emergency treatment to those who need it, even to the point where the hospitals must close due to finanical insolvency; they bring in diseases that had formerly been eradicated in the U.S., etc. etc.

But why do the liberals keep jumping to the conclusion that it's "the Rules" that need changing, rather than the enforcement of those rules?

There is the additional problem of the huge numbers of illegal aliens within our borders. But if our present laws are enforced (for a change), then deporting the ones who came to the attention of law enforcement, would finally have an effect, as they won't be able to just turn around and walk back into the U.S.

Enforcing our present laws will take some resources, but far fewer than are presently being expended on various crackpot schemes. Four areas have to be worked on and fulfilled:

1.) Build a GOOD fence or wall along the entire border. Other countries have done this, with good results. No such wall is perfectly impenetrable. but a good one will reduce those who get through, to a small trickle instead of the present flood, and free up ICE personnel to concentrate on the relative few who do get through.

2.) Patrol the border adequately. This is necessary to keep people from cutting through etc. The longer time they need to cut through, must be denied to them. This will require hiring a LOT more border patrol personnel and providing support for them.

3.) Provide Federal personnel to work with state and local police, to quickly deport illegal aliens who come to the attention of the police in their normal duties (giving traffic tickets, answering calls for domestic violence, burglary, etc.)

4.) Provide criminal penalties for companies who knowingly hire illegal aliens, for hiring mangers, personnel managers, and even CEOs.

Some of these things are starting to be done. But "starting" isn't nearly enough. All four must be done and done WELL. If any one of them is not, then the whole thing will break down. But doing all four, is not extraordinarily difficult, and CAN be done. And the Federal government is Constitutionally REQUIRED to do them.

No "reform" of our present laws is needed.

In fact, the last time it was tried, it quickly became clear that the liberals (in both parties) were merely playing games, trying to buy the votes of the voting friends of the illegal aliens by offering them amnesty in various disguises (most often referred to as a "path to citizenship"), as though they didn't already have such a path open to them within the necessary restrictions defined by Congress.

Next time you hear about "immigration reform", keep in mind that no reform is needed... in fact, the next set of rules is no more likely to be obeyed by our politicians than the present ones are. It is far more likely that duplicitous politicians are trying once again, to buy more votes at the expense of our already-overrun communities, hospital, and schools.
 
The quota system is completely hosed. Have you ever bothered to see how quotas are apportioned? It's the stupidest system ever.

So that needs to be fixed.

Second, our immigrant labor demand is not being met with an equal immigrant labor supply. And as every God-loving, right wing, free market adoring, red-blooded American knows, if you don't meet the demand legally, an illegal supply will be provided by the black market.

So that needs to be fixed.

Third, our nation's lifeblood has always been immigrants. "About 40 percent of our Ph.D. scientists and engineers were born in another country." "25 percent of the technology and engineering companies launched in the U.S. in the past decade had at least one foreign-born founder." "Indeed, the more technically educated the group, the more likely immigrants are to be overrepresented in it."

2006 News Releases - Dallas Fed
Immigrants Become Founding Fathers
http://www.kauffman.org/uploadedFiles/WadhwaTBook09.pdf
As US nears milestone, a rising mix of immigrants - CSMonitor.com
 
But forget all about facts. Let's hate on darkie immigrants and call anyone who wants to make things better for America a "leftist".

That's a winning strategy for the GOP. Let's stick with that. Sieg Heil!
 
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AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?
 
Why not let them stay and pay taxes

Let me get this straight.

The people whose only qualification, is that they broke our laws, should be allowed to stay....

.... while the people who respected our laws, applied for visas, filled out all the right forms, and have been patiently waiting in their home coutries for permission to enter, should be kept out?

GREAT plan. :cuckoo:
 
Why not let them stay and pay taxes

Let me get this straight.

The people whose only qualification, is that they broke our laws, should be allowed to stay....

.... while the people who respected our laws, applied for visas, filled out all the right forms, and have been patiently waiting in their home coutries for permission to enter, should be kept out?

GREAT plan. :cuckoo:

So you favor mass deportation?
 
Why not let them stay and pay taxes

Let me get this straight.

The people whose only qualification, is that they broke our laws, should be allowed to stay....

.... while the people who respected our laws, applied for visas, filled out all the right forms, and have been patiently waiting in their home coutries for permission to enter, should be kept out?

GREAT plan. :cuckoo:

So you favor mass deportation?
Why do you suggest mass deportation?

That idea involves major problems, and is unnecessary as well.
 
Let me get this straight.

The people whose only qualification, is that they broke our laws, should be allowed to stay....

.... while the people who respected our laws, applied for visas, filled out all the right forms, and have been patiently waiting in their home coutries for permission to enter, should be kept out?

GREAT plan. :cuckoo:

So you favor mass deportation?
Why do you suggest mass deportation?

That idea involves major problems, and is unnecessary as well.

YOU are the one complaining that they are "allowed to stay," yet you fail to put forth an alternative. What, exactly, do you advocate? Maintaining the status quo?
 
AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?

To have them gain benefit over those who did it proper and waited in line??

Sorry.. no dice.. I don't like anything that rewards criminal behavior

granted, our system for processing someone to become a citizen is in need of serious revamping.. but those who do it illegally needs to be marked and gotten rid of... and our borders need to be secured
 
But forget all about facts. Let's hate on darkie immigrants and call anyone who wants to make things better for America a "leftist".

That's a winning strategy for the GOP. Let's stick with that. Sieg Heil!

The "strategy" is to enforce existing laws.
And that is not being done, obviously.
 
AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?

To have them gain benefit over those who did it proper and waited in line??

Sorry.. no dice.. I don't like anything that rewards criminal behavior

granted, our system for processing someone to become a citizen is in need of serious revamping.. but those who do it illegally needs to be marked and gotten rid of... and our borders need to be secured

Still avoiding the question of what to do with them. Why not have them pay taxes for OUR benefit?
 
So you favor mass deportation?
Why do you suggest mass deportation?

That idea involves major problems, and is unnecessary as well.

YOU are the one complaining that they are "allowed to stay," yet you fail to put forth an alternative. What, exactly, do you advocate? Maintaining the status quo?

Attacking their source of jobs is a good start. Add to that opening the floodgates on legal immigration to give the illegals real competition in their search for work. Remove benefit systems that illegals utilize. Cut down the process to get in this country legally and permanently. Such a process should not take more than a year TOPS. Hell, we should be able to complete it in a few months without issue. That is a good start at least. There is, of course more, but we need to start there.
 
AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?

I fail to understand why you think the deportation of illegal aliens isn't feasible? Every other developed country has no problem doing it.
 
AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?

To have them gain benefit over those who did it proper and waited in line??

Sorry.. no dice.. I don't like anything that rewards criminal behavior

granted, our system for processing someone to become a citizen is in need of serious revamping.. but those who do it illegally needs to be marked and gotten rid of... and our borders need to be secured

Still avoiding the question of what to do with them. Why not have them pay taxes for OUR benefit?

Because it is still rewarding CRIMINAL behavior over those who did things by the book... THAT is wrong, even if they are 'taxed'

Enforce the laws... deport those that are tried and convicted (they ain't all going to be caught, tried, and convicted at once)... start fixing the system for processing legal immigrants.. secure the borders... period
 
Why do you suggest mass deportation?

That idea involves major problems, and is unnecessary as well.

YOU are the one complaining that they are "allowed to stay," yet you fail to put forth an alternative. What, exactly, do you advocate? Maintaining the status quo?

Attacking their source of jobs is a good start. Add to that opening the floodgates on legal immigration to give the illegals real competition in their search for work. Remove benefit systems that illegals utilize. Cut down the process to get in this country legally and permanently. Such a process should not take more than a year TOPS. Hell, we should be able to complete it in a few months without issue. That is a good start at least. There is, of course more, but we need to start there.

You have to enforce the laws on those that employ them too.. yes... this, I thought, was a given
 
AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?

I fail to understand why you think the deportation of illegal aliens isn't feasible? Every other developed country has no problem doing it.

Is a little intellectual honesty too much to ask for? If you favor mass deportation, why not admit it and explain how you think it should be accomplished?
 
AFTER a secure border becomes a reality, we will still have 10+ million people here for whom deportation is not feasible. Current law says they must return to their home countries and wait 10 years before applying for visas to return to the U.S. Even then, they must show means of self support.

Why not let them stay and pay taxes for the same 10 years with NO benefits as a precondition to permanent status?

I fail to understand why you think the deportation of illegal aliens isn't feasible? Every other developed country has no problem doing it.

Is a little intellectual honesty too much to ask for? If you favor mass deportation, why not admit it and explain how you think it should be accomplished?

You act as if they would all be caught, tried, convicted at the same time
 
Why bother going to the time and expense of deporting 12 million Illegal Aliens?

Just make it illegal (and attach painful penalties to that illegality) to give an Illegal Alien a job or housing (sales or rentals) or educational services or medical services (beyond emergency life-saving measures as a modest humanitarian gesture) or social services or government benefits of any kind or to sell an Illegal Alien a car or to provide that Illegal with transportation or business or financial services and by barring them from sending or receiving money-wires/transfers or to obtain an American identity card of any kind, etc.

There would be such a stampede for the border that they would be tripping all over each other in the mad scramble to leave the country and go home.

No huge government or taxpayer expense... no massive manpower deployments to hunt them down and round them up and pack 'em on buses and planes... we just de-motivate them, with respect to their uninvited and unwelcome stay on American soil; creating conditions sufficiently unfavorable to Illegal Aliens so as to convince them to go home of their own volition, at their own expense, with all haste, and not to bother coming back afterwards.

And we can even be Good Sports about it and give 'em Six Months Advance Notice, just to make it easier for these Invaders to break-off and head-home at a reasonable pace, rather than forcing the issue the day after the legislation is passed.

"Self-deportation... the practical alternative to traditional deportation." :eusa_drool:
 
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Still avoiding the question of what to do with them. Why not have them pay taxes for OUR benefit?

By "our" benefit, you mean the DNC?

Because illegals as a whole are a major sump of tax dollars. Generally we spend about 3 times as much in health services, WIC, Food Stamps, Cash Aid, HEMP (utility assistance), and a thousand other programs, as is collected over a lifetime in taxes.

What you don't realize, or are ignoring, is that the average illegal is uneducated and suited only for the most menial jobs. Yes, they work at under market value - but that isn't a boon. In fact, it is a major contributor to the decline of the middle as wages fall due to non-market influence from illegals. In addition to the direct payments, the toll on infrastructure is immense. The need to print all government documents in several languages - despite the fact that the average Mexican illegal is illiterate - in Spanish. We have a whole industry of translators to assist those who shouldn't be here. In hot beds like California, the housing market is perverted by the demand from all the illegals.

There is ZERO net benefit from 22 million illegal Mexican peasants in this nation.

It's as if there were two businesses next door to each other, and one is doing poorly while the other does well. So the poor performer transfers 20% of their liabilities to the good performer, which the accounting firm of Deloit, Nagreany, and Combs tells the good performer that they benefit from the liabilities of their neighbor. AND the business FUCKING LISTENS to DNC, whilst gross margins decline and sales drop.
 
YOU are the one complaining that they are "allowed to stay," yet you fail to put forth an alternative. What, exactly, do you advocate? Maintaining the status quo?

Attacking their source of jobs is a good start. Add to that opening the floodgates on legal immigration to give the illegals real competition in their search for work. Remove benefit systems that illegals utilize. Cut down the process to get in this country legally and permanently. Such a process should not take more than a year TOPS. Hell, we should be able to complete it in a few months without issue. That is a good start at least. There is, of course more, but we need to start there.

You have to enforce the laws on those that employ them too.. yes... this, I thought, was a given

The problem there is that there are not really any laws against employing them that I know of. For the most part, you can employ illegal aliens without many repercussions. That is one thing that needs to change. Fines need to be assessed that make hiring illegals a bad business decision.
 

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