Lefties, you are pushing me rightwards.

[Caligirl]

That's why we're screwed---too bad.

Look I am happy to "move on" or whatever the word is, from bush, but there is also another expression 'those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.'

 

[DiveCon]

Why am I a lefty?

Bush drives me nuts as much as the left drives me nuts, take it or leave it, your choice, like it or not I'm your countryman (well, woman) too.

if you dont want to be seen as a lefty, dont spout their nonsense

 

[dilloduck]

Look I am happy to "move on" or whatever the word is, from bush, but there is also another expression 'those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.'

I don't think obsessing over the past is part of the learning process. I have more respect for someone who is willing to take responsibility starting NOW and I expect they would be more successful.

 

[driveby]

Look I am happy to "move on" or whatever the word is, from bush, but there is also another expression 'those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.'

Move on might be a bad choice of words......

 

[Caligirl]

you were only correct on one thing in that post
Bush DID appoint 2 solid conservatives to the SCOTUS
(well, Roberts is still not tested to know how solid, but i expect he will be)

the rest are all leftwing moonbat bullshit

Warrantless wiretapping:

ABC News: Exclusive: Inside Account of U.S. Eavesdropping on Americans

This is moonbat? You are OK with this? I am not.

 

[DiveCon]

Warrantless wiretapping:

ABC News: Exclusive: Inside Account of U.S. Eavesdropping on Americans

This is moonbat? You are OK with this? I am not.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

that IS moonbat and ABC is a moonbat network

 

[Caligirl]

if you dont want to be seen as a lefty, dont spout their nonsense

Look I will be seen as a lefty by you, as a righty by some others, as a centrist by the people whose opinion I care the most about (no offense), and i can't make my decisions based on that. I doubt you do either.

The single most important reason Bush was a failed president, was because he believes the end justifies the means. I *think* this is because he operates from a 'faith based' mentality. I don't really understand it.

But, faith is important, but you simply don't run a country on it. You don't invade Iraq because you *think* they have weapons and you ignore any evidence to the contrary. You don't go in on faith that an exit strategy will eventually occur to you. You don't surround yourself with yes men because it makes you feel stronger. You don't do things because you think God wants you too.

Instead, you use your freakin brain. Bush was a piece of work.

I am not anti-faith. Faith is central to living a meaningful life. But running a country requires facts, evidence, statistics, intelligence, and if faith is going to come into it at all it should only come in in the form of vision for the future, or maybe for helping smooth out working relationships or something, but not rationalization for policy. Which is what Bush does.

He was always about the end justifying the means, and that's nuts.

I want a president who "gets" science and evidence and all that shit. If you get that, you can put a man on the moon and make a bomb that is better than any other bomb on the planet.

You can understand why I couldn't support the McCain Palin ticket.

 

[Caligirl]

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

that IS moonbat and ABC is a moonbat network

Just out of curiosity ---

How many networks are moonbat? How many news sources? Which ones are not?

TIA,

 

[DiveCon]

Just out of curiosity ---

How many networks are moonbat? How many news sources? Which ones are not?

TIA,

ALL of them

they all lie

 

[DiveCon]

Look I will be seen as a lefty by you, as a righty by some others, as a centrist by the people whose opinion I care the most about (no offense), and i can't make my decisions based on that. I doubt you do either.

The single most important reason Bush was a failed president, was because he believes the end justifies the means. I *think* this is because he operates from a 'faith based' mentality. I don't really understand it.

But, faith is important, but you simply don't run a country on it. You don't invade Iraq because you *think* they have weapons and you ignore any evidence to the contrary. You don't go in on faith that an exit strategy will eventually occur to you. You don't surround yourself with yes men because it makes you feel stronger. You don't do things because you think God wants you too.

Instead, you use your freakin brain. Bush was a piece of work.

I am not anti-faith. Faith is central to living a meaningful life. But running a country requires facts, evidence, statistics, intelligence, and if faith is going to come into it at all it should only come in in the form of vision for the future, or maybe for helping smooth out working relationships or something, but not rationalization for policy. Which is what Bush does.

He was always about the end justifying the means, and that's nuts.

I want a president who "gets" science and evidence and all that shit. If you get that, you can put a man on the moon and make a bomb that is better than any other bomb on the planet.

You can understand why I couldn't support the McCain Palin ticket.

yeah, because WMD was the only reason for OIF
see, thats moonbat bullshit right there


personally, i'm sick of the bullshit, your asshole won
i hope he does EVERYTHING he promised to do
cause i know what will happen, you wont like it

 

[Caligirl]

The "imminent threat" of WMD was the reason going into Iraq had broad support from the public. Everything else had been status quo for some time.

I don't know if he could have gone in without it, but that is the reason it was 'sold' to the people.

I believe Clinton also thought there were WMD, and under other circumstances he might have made the same mistake Bush made.

 

[DiveCon]

The "imminent threat" of WMD was the reason going into Iraq had broad support from the public. Everything else had been status quo for some time.

I don't know if he could have gone in without it, but that is the reason it was 'sold' to the people.

I believe Clinton also thought there were WMD, and under other circumstances he might have made the same mistake Bush made.

the only one to call it an "imminent threat" was John Edwards
so how do you blame that on Bush?

i told you, its all moonbat bullshit

 

[Old Rocks]

Caligirl, if you are anywhere to the left of Goebel there are those on this board who will regard you as an extreme liberal.

 

[bk1983]

yeah, because WMD was the only reason for OIF
see, thats moonbat bullshit right there


personally, i'm sick of the bullshit, your asshole won
i hope he does EVERYTHING he promised to do
cause i know what will happen, you wont like it

Did you know what would happen when you voted for Bush? Please

tell us Miss cleo!

 

[DiveCon]

Did you know what would happen when you voted for Bush? Please

tell us Miss cleo!

pretty much, yes
i knew Bush wasnt a conservative but he was better than the alternative, same for McCain
but you guys believed what Obama said he was going to do
i know better
he said what he needed to say to get you to support him
i have no delusions that he will actually do what he said
unlike you

 

[Caligirl]

the only one to call it an "imminent threat" was John Edwards
so how do you blame that on Bush?

i told you, its all moonbat bullshit

Well, I guess i am misquoting him, and i apologize. His SOTU address is what got me so hot under the collar because I knew it was bullshit, and THIS is what he said which is the same in essence because it stokes fear and demands immediate action:

Some have said we must not act until the threat is imminent. Since when have terrorists and tyrants announced their intentions, politely putting us on notice before they strike?

He is saying we will strike them now (and remember the downing memo had him determined to go in already, it was clear) because we don't know when they will be an imminent threat.

That's insane. We don't know when Iran or China or Europe will be threat to us either. Let's just bomb the planet.

Then we can get rid of the other political party, bomb them too. Then everyone will be happy.

 

[Caligirl]

pretty much, yes
i knew Bush wasnt a conservative but he was better than the alternative, same for McCain
but you guys believed what Obama said he was going to do
i know better
he said what he needed to say to get you to support him
i have no delusions that he will actually do what he said
unlike you

I believe he will act on my number one issue, sustainablilty. I don't think it will be pretty, but I think it is necessary. FWIW. We'll see.

If we are still as 'addicted to oil' in four years, if cars don't get substantially better mileage, if there has been no development of greener energy, I will be ticked.

As far as the economy, that's someone else's issue. I know it is important, but that's not why I voted for him. Same on health care, education. I can take care of those things for myself and my family. BUt we're crapping in our own backyards so I feel pretty strongly that environmentally there need to be regulations and shifts, and I don't see why this can't be tied to growth. So that's what I expect of him.

 

[DiveCon]

I believe he will act on my number one issue, sustainablilty. I don't think it will be pretty, but I think it is necessary. FWIW. We'll see.

If we are still as 'addicted to oil' in four years, if cars don't get substantially better mileage, if there has been no development of greener energy, I will be ticked.

As far as the economy, that's someone else's issue. I know it is important, but that's not why I voted for him. Same on health care, education. I can take care of those things for myself and my family. BUt we're crapping in our own backyards so I feel pretty strongly that environmentally there need to be regulations and shifts, and I don't see why this can't be tied to growth. So that's what I expect of him.

cars WILL get better millage, its what the consumer wants now
Obama will have nothing to do with that, also, i dont expect anything major to change since he is basically surrounding himself with former Clinton admin people
there will be no real change

the change we really need is a return to conservative principles
the GOP didnt do it

 

[Caligirl]

They want it only because of their pocketbooks, not because of long term environmental health.

With gas falling, people will want big guzzlers again (when the economy turns around) and we need to quit crapping the planet.

I think Obama will insist on caps and that may hurt the economy but I still think it is necessary. There are 6.5 billiono f us and all of us wanting to live like americans and no one talking about population reduction, and understandably, but we only have one planet. We evolved to try to get ahead, and when there are 6.5 billion trying to get ahead that is a formula for disaster.

But yeah, the GOP returning to principles would be nice.

 

[WillowTree]

They want it only because of their pocketbooks, not because of long term environmental health.

With gas falling, people will want big guzzlers again (when the economy turns around) and we need to quit crapping the planet.

I think Obama will insist on caps and that may hurt the economy but I still think it is necessary. There are 6.5 billiono f us and all of us wanting to live like americans and no one talking about population reduction, and understandably, but we only have one planet. We evolved to try to get ahead, and when there are 6.5 billion trying to get ahead that is a formula for disaster.

But yeah, the GOP returning to principles would be nice.

I will lay you odds gas will be ten bucks a gallon before obamalamas first two years are up!