Leave the Tax Rates Alone

[The Rabbi]

Your correct in as much as my Christianity clouds my eyes and I can clearly see the need and the suffering of the poor.

I also see the greed of the already wealthy and their enablers, people like yourself.

The soul of America is getting darker and darker.

Geezus, spare me, idiot. Or go get yourself to a monastery and leave the sapient beings alone.

Ok, so don't respond to my posts, deal?

I've read many of your posts and you have nothing to offer anyway so it won't be a loss to me.

I agree I have nothing to offer you. Your base of knowledge is miniscule. Your reading skills are sub-par. And your reasoning level is below dismal.

 

[Jarhead]

Yeah.... after the country has been raped by the corporate elite... now you call for a flat tax. Now that they have every damned advantage imaginable, you want things flat. Fuck that. Make them give the money they stole off the backs of Americans through Lobbying and outsourcing.... then we'll talk about flat taxes.

Please giove me an example of a company that stole off the backs of Americans.
Just one company.
Thanks.

Bank of America.

Bank of America near $8.5B settlement

Business & Technology | Bank of America near $8.5B settlement | Seattle Times Newspaper

lol.

Correct the statemnent then.

Companies that capitalized and in essence stole from those Americans that opted to try to have their money make easy money for them.

It is misleading to say:

Companies that stole off the backs of Americans.

And my thoughts?

I lost a lot of money with MBS's and in the market in general. I gambled and lost.
I hold no one responsible.

I bet those same folks would not have sued if they GAINED during the meltdown.

I bet they would have fought like hell if the courts made them give such gains back when the suit was settled.

 

[Steelplate]

Stole??... please cite the crime, press charges, or something of the sort

You have the freedom to succeed that goes hand in hand with the freedom to fail

You don't get to confiscate, or have confiscated for you for some equalized outcome bullshit

And show what legal or governmental advantage a person with 1MIL has over someone with 1K

Just the fact that you actually believe those first two sentences(and the last) speaks volumes about your third.

You still believe in Trickle Down economics, which died a horrible death a long time ago. Yet you continue to believe that there is a Free Market that wants competition.

Why should I bother to try to "Show" you anything? You are a true believer and there is nothing I can "Show" that would sway your opinion.

Do you disagree with the first 2 sentences??

If so... Show the charges, law citation, etc that shows the crime of theft... I'll be waiting

With the freedom to succeed comes the freedom to fail.... you don't get your little skinned financial or professional knee dabbed by a wet washcloth, kissed better, and have money given to you for the ice cream truck by mommy government.... that is not the purpose nor the place of government....

I believe in equal treatment by government... not some bullshit touchy-feely governing by subjective 'fairness' ... I believe that you live with the consequences of your choices, efforts, actions, studies, reputation, statements, successes, failures, etc...

You cannot show, because you have NOTHING TO SHOW THAT SUPPORTS YOUR IGNORANT BULLSHIT CLAIM...

idiot

No... Prove your assertions. You're the one that believes them. Kind of hard to show "charges" when our politicians are beholden to the rapists, isn't it? Law and political influence is on their side.

You have nothing to show other than to kneel down before your masters an beg for their table scraps. Which is MUCH more pitiful than fighting the good fight.

Face it... People like ARE the Redcoats. You are the Germans who rallied behind Hitler, You are the people that allowed Stalin his tyranny. Yes.... the Politics are different. But Tyranny is tyranny. Just because this tyranny is monetary instead of Political, doesn't make it any less.

The whole system is fucked, and it didn't start with Obama(it certainly didn't end with him, but that's a different argument, isn't it?). But you are too damned dumb to realize it.

Keep on sucking... eventually they might throw you a cookie. That's the whole Conservative Mantra.. The rich are our heroes and the working class sucks. Fuck them... let them work at Convenience stores and Walmart and let their kids lead lives of less.

That's the America you want. You want the downward spiral to continue... Yet you talk about freedom and opportunity... for who? For people who work with their hands and the strength of their backs? No... not for them... they don't deserve anything in your book, do they?

And you have the NERVE to call progressives "Elitists". People like you are why our country is going to shit...because you are so easily manipulated by those with the "Real" power in our country. Politicians are just puppets.... whores even...sold to the highest bidder. Guess who has all the money? Certainly not Working people.

 

[Steelplate]

The poor and downtrodden pay for nothing dufus. They never have and if people like you have any say in it they never will. You sure do waste a lot of pity on em.

Your correct in as much as my Christianity clouds my eyes and I can clearly see the need and the suffering of the poor.

I also see the greed of the already wealthy and their enablers, people like yourself.

The soul of America is getting darker and darker.

Geezus, spare me, idiot. Or go get yourself to a monastery and leave the sapient beings alone.

Yeah... don't you know that Jesus' only message that counts is queers are going to hell, the poor aren't worthy and welfare is the Devil's work? It's in the Bible...

 

[Claudette]

Yup and if your a Christian and feel the need to help by all means whip out your wallet and checkbook and help away.

I can press for a compassionate America instead of watching people like you push it down the drain.

So I'll note that you don't see the immorality of the Republican redistribution of wealth, the increase in the wealth gap.

Why then would you have a problem if the Democrats want to re-redistribute the wealth?

Compassion and charity should be given of a persons own free will my friend.

If you came to my house because a member of your family needed a heart transplant and you were taking up a collection then I would be the first to step up the the plate. Thats my choice. My free will.

Thats the difference.

I'm not in favor or coprorate charity, tax loopholes or subsidies either. If you can't make it on your own as a company then tough shit.

 

[Urkie]

I do not want anything eliminated on the subjective grounds of fairness... just as I do not want anything created on the subjective grounds of fairness... I want government out of things it should never have been in, I want complete equal treatment (I.E. flat tax, elimination of the government in the marriage business, etc)....

Government is not your nanny, your mommy, or your allowance giver... nor should it be

What impact the extra giving of Gates or whomever else would have is irrelevant...

Nobody should be paying any higher rate than anyone else.. PERIOD.... again, equal treatment by government.. not the subjective equal treatment championed by the likes of you in the subjective mantra of 'fairness'

Do I need to give you a history lesson on why flat tax won't work? Just look at what happened in the late 1800's and you'll see why. A progressive tax system is "fair" if it is used correctly. Just ask Teddy Roosevelt.

Who's saying the Government is one of those things? I sure as hell didn't. The government should protect the citizens living in that country. That's its job.

 

[Robert]

Well, we sure have a lot of talking points, but more and more real life economists are saying that taxes also must be raised,,,along with cutting spending.
That's what the Simpson-Bowles Commission recommended. Trouble is that the GOP is way too loyal to their benefactors. They are putting their ability to raise money for the party ahead of solving this country's financial mess. (the same goes for the Dems regarding cutting spending).
In order for this country to right it's ship, both parties must make concessions. Everyone must sacrifice, not just those who don't carry any financial weight regarding congresses decision making.
Personally, I think those who are whining about raising taxes along with budget cuts are putting their own self interest ahead of the United States of America.

Ya that's really cute and all.... but all I've thus far seen is whining to increase taxes haven't seen a damn thing mentioned on the massive spending cut's that need to take place....hmm must be missing something in the conversation

 

[Steelplate]

Yup and if your a Christian and feel the need to help by all means whip out your wallet and checkbook and help away.

I can press for a compassionate America instead of watching people like you push it down the drain.

So I'll note that you don't see the immorality of the Republican redistribution of wealth, the increase in the wealth gap.

Why then would you have a problem if the Democrats want to re-redistribute the wealth?

Compassion and charity should be given of a persons own free will my friend.

If you came to my house because a member of your family needed a heart transplant and you were taking up a collection then I would be the first to step up the the plate. Thats my choice. My free will.

Thats the difference.

I'm not in favor or coprorate charity, tax loopholes or subsidies either. If you can't make it on your own as a company then tough shit.

Yeah.... and if they refuse to do it of their own free will... fuck it, let them starve. Sounds eerily similar to the French Revolution, doesn't it, Marie Antoinette?

 

[saveliberty]

Yup and if your a Christian and feel the need to help by all means whip out your wallet and checkbook and help away.

I can press for a compassionate America instead of watching people like you push it down the drain.

So I'll note that you don't see the immorality of the Republican redistribution of wealth, the increase in the wealth gap.

Why then would you have a problem if the Democrats want to re-redistribute the wealth?

Compassion is what makes it charity. Taking by force of law is simple theft. We have many high profile Democrats that have failed to pay taxes until seeking public office. It is not a redistribution of wealth from the poor when the rich already have a higher tax rate. Every point you made is a myth.

 

[Steelplate]

Yup and if your a Christian and feel the need to help by all means whip out your wallet and checkbook and help away.

I can press for a compassionate America instead of watching people like you push it down the drain.

So I'll note that you don't see the immorality of the Republican redistribution of wealth, the increase in the wealth gap.

Why then would you have a problem if the Democrats want to re-redistribute the wealth?

Compassion is what makes it charity. Taking by force of law is simple theft. We have many high profile Democrats that have failed to pay taxes until seeking public office. It is not a redistribution of wealth from the poor when the rich already have a higher tax rate. Every point you made is a myth.

Higher tax rate? Riiiight. Maybe... once you eliminate all the deductions and Loopholes that the rich have at their disposal that the rest of us don't. Alan Simpson in an interview last night said that because of those things, he pays less than his secretary.

I wish all Republicans had his honesty and courage to say that.... but they don't do they? It's much easier for them to twist the truth to make idiots like you outraged.

 

[Jarhead]

I can press for a compassionate America instead of watching people like you push it down the drain.

So I'll note that you don't see the immorality of the Republican redistribution of wealth, the increase in the wealth gap.

Why then would you have a problem if the Democrats want to re-redistribute the wealth?

Compassion is what makes it charity. Taking by force of law is simple theft. We have many high profile Democrats that have failed to pay taxes until seeking public office. It is not a redistribution of wealth from the poor when the rich already have a higher tax rate. Every point you made is a myth.

Higher tax rate? Riiiight. Maybe... once you eliminate all the deductions and Loopholes that the rich have at their disposal that the rest of us don't. Alan Simpson in an interview last night said that because of those things, he pays less than his secretary.

I wish all Republicans had his honesty and courage to say that.... but they don't do they? It's much easier for them to twist the truth to make idiots like you outraged.

please enlighten me...

What loopholes are you referring to?

Interest on a mortgage?
Deductions for a child?
Healthcare deductions?
Tax credits for investing in lower developed neighborhoods?

What loopholes do I have access tro that you dont?

 

[Google]

"If they [the Republicans] said, look, that now is not the time for big tax increases to harm the recovery, they would be right," Clinton Former President Bill Clinton http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/bill...ses-debt-impasse-deal-fears/story?id=13963218

Clinton is out there with his own plan. Directly after uttering those words, which is a stunning statement from a Democrat, he says that cutting spending would also be detrimental.

But it is this fact, that raising taxes in this economy would be counter-productive, that has everything thing to do with the revenue problem that the government faces.

The public sector can not outgrow the private sector because the public sector is limited to its revenue ability. But even that is not enough to stop the greedy politicians that have spent this country into a $14,000,000,000,000 national debt.

Cutting spending is the answer, not raising taxes.

Not one liberal in here has explained how raising taxes would not be counter-productive.

 

[Steelplate]

Compassion is what makes it charity. Taking by force of law is simple theft. We have many high profile Democrats that have failed to pay taxes until seeking public office. It is not a redistribution of wealth from the poor when the rich already have a higher tax rate. Every point you made is a myth.

Higher tax rate? Riiiight. Maybe... once you eliminate all the deductions and Loopholes that the rich have at their disposal that the rest of us don't. Alan Simpson in an interview last night said that because of those things, he pays less than his secretary.

I wish all Republicans had his honesty and courage to say that.... but they don't do they? It's much easier for them to twist the truth to make idiots like you outraged.

please enlighten me...

What loopholes are you referring to?

Interest on a mortgage?
Deductions for a child?
Healthcare deductions?
Tax credits for investing in lower developed neighborhoods?

What loopholes do I have access tro that you dont?

1. Yes... Most of us don't have the mortgage interest that allows us to take anything other than the standard deduction. Geared towards the wealthy and away from most of us.

2. Nope we all have that... but does all need it?

3. Once again...Does it make a difference beyond the standard deduction? no.

Christ... I wish we had the money to Invest in lower developed neighborhoods. In fact... most of the people you hate so much live in lower developed neighborhoods.

 

[Google]

Higher tax rate? Riiiight. Maybe... once you eliminate all the deductions and Loopholes that the rich have at their disposal that the rest of us don't. Alan Simpson in an interview last night said that because of those things, he pays less than his secretary.

I wish all Republicans had his honesty and courage to say that.... but they don't do they? It's much easier for them to twist the truth to make idiots like you outraged.

please enlighten me...

What loopholes are you referring to?

Interest on a mortgage?
Deductions for a child?
Healthcare deductions?
Tax credits for investing in lower developed neighborhoods?

What loopholes do I have access tro that you dont?

1. Yes... Most of us don't have the mortgage interest that allows us to take anything other than the standard deduction. Geared towards the wealthy and away from most of us.

2. Nope we all have that... but does all need it?

3. Once again...Does it make a difference beyond the standard deduction? no.

Christ... I wish we had the money to Invest in lower developed neighborhoods. In fact... most of the people you hate so much live in lower developed neighborhoods.

How insulting. People that have a mortgage are not some elitist bunch of the upper-class. People that have a mortgage pay property taxes that fund local education; a mortgage you apparently don't have, and an education system that apparently has failed you.

Where do you get this sense of entitlement? I doubt you even pay taxes. What percentage of the country doesn't even pay any taxes, because of the deductions, ect. The tax system favors lower class, like yourself--but I doubt you have a job. Those making less than $30,000 pay virtually no taxes, I know from experience.

I worked as a independent contractor, a courier--hustling the delivery game--and paid ZERO in any federal or state taxes. I didn't file for three years. When I finally did I got a refund. Thank you deductions.

The only way it makes sense, and yes I know you believe it, that the tax system isn't outright hostile to upper income earners is that they pay more.

 

[Jarhead]

Higher tax rate? Riiiight. Maybe... once you eliminate all the deductions and Loopholes that the rich have at their disposal that the rest of us don't. Alan Simpson in an interview last night said that because of those things, he pays less than his secretary.

I wish all Republicans had his honesty and courage to say that.... but they don't do they? It's much easier for them to twist the truth to make idiots like you outraged.

please enlighten me...

What loopholes are you referring to?

Interest on a mortgage?
Deductions for a child?
Healthcare deductions?
Tax credits for investing in lower developed neighborhoods?

What loopholes do I have access tro that you dont?

1. Yes... Most of us don't have the mortgage interest that allows us to take anything other than the standard deduction. Geared towards the wealthy and away from most of us.
The standard deduction? There is no standard deduction. You get to deduct your interest no matter how much your interest is
2. Nope we all have that... but does all need it?
Why should ne get it and not another?
3. Once again...Does it make a difference beyond the standard deduction? no.
No one gets more thasn the standard...so whats the beef?Christ... I wish we had the money to Invest in lower developed neighborhoods. In fact... most of the people you hate so much live in lower developed neighborhoods.
You do realize that those that invest in those neighborhoods and get the deduction can most certainly make a better return if they invest in a better neighborhood....so understand what you criticize.
And I do not hate those people. I used to be one of them asshole.

I responded in red....above...but you did not support your statement and asnwer my question

What LOOPHOLES do I get that you dont get?

 

[kiwiman127]

Well, we sure have a lot of talking points, but more and more real life economists are saying that taxes also must be raised,,,along with cutting spending.
That's what the Simpson-Bowles Commission recommended. Trouble is that the GOP is way too loyal to their benefactors. They are putting their ability to raise money for the party ahead of solving this country's financial mess. (the same goes for the Dems regarding cutting spending).
In order for this country to right it's ship, both parties must make concessions. Everyone must sacrifice, not just those who don't carry any financial weight regarding congresses decision making.
Personally, I think those who are whining about raising taxes along with budget cuts are putting their own self interest ahead of the United States of America.

Ya that's really cute and all.... but all I've thus far seen is whining to increase taxes haven't seen a damn thing mentioned on the massive spending cut's that need to take place....hmm must be missing something in the conversation

I believe I mentioned spending cuts too. I think the cuts should be across the board that include all Americans, rich, middle class and poor. Where EVERYONE sacrifices. I also believe (which many economists across ideological lines also do) that taxes should be raised as purposed by the Simpson-Bowles Commission. If we are serious, we do both.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Can you tell me the top ten states for economic growth? Google it.

I'd rather BEA it. The top quintile in 2010 (in no specific order):

Oregon
New York
North Dakota
Illinois
Kentucky
Tennessee
West Virginia
North Carolina
Vermont
Massachusetts
New Jersey.

Not exactly a list of the 10 most red states.

What is your source?

Texas is number one in economic growth--fact--so I'm not sure where you got this. Perhaps you should Google it.

can you source that 'fact'?

 

[Steelplate]

please enlighten me...

What loopholes are you referring to?

Interest on a mortgage?
Deductions for a child?
Healthcare deductions?
Tax credits for investing in lower developed neighborhoods?

What loopholes do I have access tro that you dont?

1. Yes... Most of us don't have the mortgage interest that allows us to take anything other than the standard deduction. Geared towards the wealthy and away from most of us.

2. Nope we all have that... but does all need it?

3. Once again...Does it make a difference beyond the standard deduction? no.

Christ... I wish we had the money to Invest in lower developed neighborhoods. In fact... most of the people you hate so much live in lower developed neighborhoods.

How insulting. People that have a mortgage are not some elitist bunch of the upper-class. People that have a mortgage pay property taxes that fund local education; a mortgage you apparently don't have, and an education system that apparently has failed you.

Where do you get this sense of entitlement? I doubt you even pay taxes. What percentage of the country doesn't even pay any taxes, because of the deductions, ect. The tax system favors lower class, like yourself--but I doubt you have a job. Those making less than $30,000 pay virtually no taxes, I know from experience.

I worked as a independent contractor, a courier--hustling the delivery game--and paid ZERO in any federal or state taxes. I didn't file for three years. When I finally did I got a refund. Thank you deductions.

The only way it makes sense, and yes I know you believe it, that the tax system isn't outright hostile to upper income earners is that they pay more.

So do those of us who DON'T have enough mortgage to claim pay School Taxes and all the rest that you do. You just get the added benefit of living in a large house with a huge mortgage. Hope another Bank Crisis don't happen... or you might be the next generation of people being accused of "buying too much house".

I don't give a rat's ass what you do. Are you a multi-millionaire or a billionaire? Then STFU.

 

[saveliberty]

I live in the bluest state in the nation - one of our Senators is an avowed socialist, for Gods sake, and he won by a landslide.

our unemployment rates is 5%.

Can you tell me the top ten states for economic growth? Google it.

I'd rather BEA it. The top quintile in 2010 (in no specific order):

Oregon
New York
North Dakota
Illinois
Kentucky
Tennessee
West Virginia
North Carolina
Vermont
Massachusetts
New Jersey.

Not exactly a list of the 10 most red states.

A quintile would be 20% of something. You have 11 states oon your list which would mean we have 55 states. Try again math is not your friend.

Texas was number one in 2010.

News Headlines

 

[Steelplate]

please enlighten me...

What loopholes are you referring to?

Interest on a mortgage?
Deductions for a child?
Healthcare deductions?
Tax credits for investing in lower developed neighborhoods?

What loopholes do I have access tro that you dont?

1. Yes... Most of us don't have the mortgage interest that allows us to take anything other than the standard deduction. Geared towards the wealthy and away from most of us.
The standard deduction? There is no standard deduction. You get to deduct your interest no matter how much your interest is
2. Nope we all have that... but does all need it?
Why should ne get it and not another?
3. Once again...Does it make a difference beyond the standard deduction? no.
No one gets more thasn the standard...so whats the beef?Christ... I wish we had the money to Invest in lower developed neighborhoods. In fact... most of the people you hate so much live in lower developed neighborhoods.
You do realize that those that invest in those neighborhoods and get the deduction can most certainly make a better return if they invest in a better neighborhood....so understand what you criticize.
And I do not hate those people. I used to be one of them asshole.

I responded in red....above...but you did not support your statement and asnwer my question

What LOOPHOLES do I get that you dont get?

Do we? Funny... every time I try to add my mortgage interest, I find that I don't have enough to itemize.. so I have to take the standard deduction.

No one gets more than the Standard deduction? Do you pay taxes? Methinks you are talking out your ass. I'm calling you a poser. You live with mommy yet?

Let me clue you in on something for the next time you try to have a debate on something you know nothing about. If your itemized deductions are not greater than the standard deduction, you use the standard deduction. If your itemized deduction are greater, you itemize.

It didn't used to be that way. You used to be able to use not only your Mortgage interest... but also your car interest.. your boy Ronnie Ray Gun took that out of the hands of the working class and effectively made it a rich man's perk.