Kruthammer On The Discussion of Torture

[William Joyce]

So the Jewy Standard and its team of Jewish neocon scribblers support torture. That's fucking hilarious. Of course they do. When Jewish goals are being advanced, you could slice up nuns and pour gas in the wounds. If Jewish goals are being opposed, you dare not even think in that general direction.

Bold idea:

What if Americans determined America policies?

What if you weren't a piece of shit scumbag?

What if you weren't a Jew?

 

[geauxtohell]

Good to see Krauthammer putting that M.D. to good use.

Thankfully he'll never be in charge of shit.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

The problem with this line of thinking is that it applies logic and common sense; neither of which is allowed to detract from the out-of-context crap dribbled out by the left.

Ah, yes.....logic and common sense....those hallmarks of allowing Corporate America & their lawyers to dispense with......

....American Exceptionalism.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

May 25, 2012

Reckoning With Torture​

LARRY SIEMS: Immediately after 9/11 a number of regimes launched crackdowns on the usual suspects in their countries. And when they were questioned by that, they just pointed to the United States and said, "Look what the United States is doing." You know, indefinite detention. The Patriot Act. You know, increase surveillance powers. "If the United States can do it, they certainly can't criticize us." And this happened in a number of countries.

So, you know, we knew we had to look to ourselves in order to speak to the world. So we began to work with the ACLU, PEN did, to put together these public readings from these documents.

DOUG LIMAN: You can't believe some of these documents that they've uncovered. And, you know, in a way it's a tribute to this country that the Freedom of Information Act actually works. That you don't actually need WikiLeaks. Like, there is an actual legal way that documents that are quite damaging to the people who committed these acts of atrocity.

LARRY SIEMS: That's something that the book really chronicles is that this was not a case where everybody agreed with these programs. On the--

BILL MOYERS: With the torture?

LARRY SIEMS: Right.

BILL MOYERS: You mean, people inside government?

LARRY SIEMS: Absolutely.

BILL MOYERS: There were dissenters?

LARRY SIEMS: In the military, and in all of the intelligence agencies. And in fact the reason we have these documents is because there were dissenters.

So many people said this is wrong, this is stupid. This violates our principals.

 

[whitehall]

Degrading? Did the US Senate vote that if a POW experiences conditions that he (the UN?) considers to be "degrading" it means the poor boy was tortured? Are we going crazy as a Nation?

 

[freedombecki]

May 25, 2012

Reckoning With Torture​

LARRY SIEMS: Immediately after 9/11 a number of regimes launched crackdowns on the usual suspects in their countries. And when they were questioned by that, they just pointed to the United States and said, "Look what the United States is doing." You know, indefinite detention. The Patriot Act. You know, increase surveillance powers. "If the United States can do it, they certainly can't criticize us." And this happened in a number of countries.

So, you know, we knew we had to look to ourselves in order to speak to the world. So we began to work with the ACLU, PEN did, to put together these public readings from these documents.

DOUG LIMAN: You can't believe some of these documents that they've uncovered. And, you know, in a way it's a tribute to this country that the Freedom of Information Act actually works. That you don't actually need WikiLeaks. Like, there is an actual legal way that documents that are quite damaging to the people who committed these acts of atrocity.

LARRY SIEMS: That's something that the book really chronicles is that this was not a case where everybody agreed with these programs. On the--

BILL MOYERS: With the torture?

LARRY SIEMS: Right.

BILL MOYERS: You mean, people inside government?

LARRY SIEMS: Absolutely.

BILL MOYERS: There were dissenters?

LARRY SIEMS: In the military, and in all of the intelligence agencies. And in fact the reason we have these documents is because there were dissenters.

So many people said this is wrong, this is stupid. This violates our principals.

<Link to irrelevant bush-bash photo>

The "you-oughta" lefties don't mind torturing taxpayers with burdensome taxes.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Degrading? Did the US Senate vote that if a POW experiences conditions that he (the UN?) considers to be "degrading" it means the poor boy was tortured? Are we going crazy as a Nation?

May 25, 2012

Reckoning With Torture​

LARRY SIEMS: Abu Zubaydah was, according to the Bush Administration, when he was first detained, the number three man in Al Qaeda. This is what their definition of him was. He was detained. He was shot, actually, during a raid in Pakistan. Treated by the U.S. and then flown to a secret C.I.A. prison in Thailand, where the C.I.A. sent a team of contractors who were the ones who would end up sort of driving this torture program. To do this experiment. To really try these new, enhanced interrogation techniques.

Techniques that had really by derived from techniques that the Communist Chinese and the Soviets used in the middle of the 20th Century. Sent them there, interrogated him. The memos are August 1st, 2002. Green lighting, saying that these techniques are not torture.

And green lighting their use on Abu Zubaydah. So throughout August of 2002 he's brutally tortured, including he's waterboarded 83 times. You know, kept nude, subjected to temperature extremes. Sleep deprivation. Dietary manipulation. Slaps. Wallings. Slamming him against the wall. And this reading, I think, that you're going to show is it juxtaposes the John Yoo memo describing the treatment, with one of the only documents that we have in which Abu Zubaydah speaks.

BILL MOYERS: John Yoo was?

LARRY SIEMS: A Justice Department Attorney in the Office of Legal Counsel. He is the architect of a number of the legal manipulations that declare these things legal. And this is Abu Zubaydah speaking to the Red Cross in 2006, four years after he'd been disappeared, literally disappeared, into secret prisons. He's been held in Thailand, and then in Poland. He's finally brought to Guantanamo with 14, with 13 other high-valued detainees in October or in September of 2006.

He finally gets to see the Red Cross. And he tells his story of what happens. And the amazing thing is his account of what happens to him, just by recollection to the International Committee on the Red Cross, matches exactly the instructions that are laid out in the Yoo Memo.

 

[rightwinger]

Degrading? Did the US Senate vote that if a POW experiences conditions that he (the UN?) considers to be "degrading" it means the poor boy was tortured? Are we going crazy as a Nation?

Actually, the international community has established guidelines of what constitutes torture. The US actually used to abide by those guidelines

 

[francoHFW]

Torture is un-American and doesn't work. Kraut is a totally bought off POS.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Torture is un-American and doesn't work. Kraut is a totally bought off POS.

Careful, now!!

I've heard he swings a mean studded-purse!!

 

[Old Rocks]

We hung people after WW2 for doing the kind of things that were done at Abu Ghariab. Bush and his administration shamed our nation.

 

[Mad Scientist]

What I don't get is that Krauthammer is a CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) guy but rails against the use of Defense Dept. Spy Drones over the US and says: "The first Person who shoots one down will be considered a Patriot!" When in reality what will happen is that person will be at best arrested and at worst "disappeared" to a country where they will experience "enhanced interrogation techniques" first hand. He's got to know that!

How does he resolve those two ideas in his own mind?

 

[Mad Scientist]

We hung people after WW2 for doing the kind of things that were done at Abu Ghariab. Bush and his administration shamed our nation.

Obama and his administration continued it. Obama re-authorized The Patriot Act.

Get off that Left/Right paradigm Old Rock, let's stop kidding ourselves.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

What I don't get is that Krauthammer is a CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) guy but rails against the use of Defense Dept. Spy Drones over the US and says: "The first Person who shoots one down will be considered a Patriot!" When in reality what will happen is that person will be at best arrested and at worst "disappeared" to a country where they will experience "enhanced interrogation techniques" first hand. He's got to know that!

How does he resolve those two ideas in his own mind?

I think it's still called.....

....Bi-Polarhttp://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2010/10/sarah-palin-201010?currentPage=1.

"Her anger kept boiling over, however, and eventually the fits of rage came every day. Then, just as suddenly, her temper would be gone. Palin would apologize and promise to be nicer. Within hours, she would be screaming again. At the end of one long day, when Palin was mid-tirade, a campaign aide remembers thinking, “You were an angel all night. Now you’re a devil. Where did this come from?”​

​

 

[whitehall]

Degrading? Did the US Senate vote that if a POW experiences conditions that he (the UN?) considers to be "degrading" it means the poor boy was tortured? Are we going crazy as a Nation?

Actually, the international community has established guidelines of what constitutes torture. The US actually used to abide by those guidelines

An "international community" aka the bar scene from Star Wars, some of which might be guilty of eating their POW's, has determined conditions equating "degrading" treatment of American POW's to torture and the left thinks that's just fine. Is it just me or has the American left gone crazy?

 

[rightwinger]

Degrading? Did the US Senate vote that if a POW experiences conditions that he (the UN?) considers to be "degrading" it means the poor boy was tortured? Are we going crazy as a Nation?

Actually, the international community has established guidelines of what constitutes torture. The US actually used to abide by those guidelines

An "international community" aka the bar scene from Star Wars, some of which might be guilty of eating their POW's, has determined conditions equating "degrading" treatment of American POW's to torture and the left thinks that's just fine. Is it just me or has the American left gone crazy?

If crazy means opposing the US engaging in torture, then yes, we have gone crazy

 

[francoHFW]

Obama ended waterboarding, back to psychological interogation. If you can't tell the diff between the parties, you're deaf, dumb, and blind...

 

[francoHFW]

Degrading? Did the US Senate vote that if a POW experiences conditions that he (the UN?) considers to be "degrading" it means the poor boy was tortured? Are we going crazy as a Nation?

Actually, the international community has established guidelines of what constitutes torture. The US actually used to abide by those guidelines

An "international community" aka the bar scene from Star Wars, some of which might be guilty of eating their POW's, has determined conditions equating "degrading" treatment of American POW's to torture and the left thinks that's just fine. Is it just me or has the American left gone crazy?

More Pubcrappe from another ignorant, xenophobic, arrogant, racist, chickenhawk moron.

 

[Mad Scientist]

Obama ended waterboarding, back to psychological interogation. If you can't tell the diff between the parties, you're deaf, dumb, and blind...

Obama said that WE would not torture. He is STILL sending suspects overseas (rendition) to be tortured:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/25/us/politics/25rendition.html

The Obama administration will continue the Bush administration&#8217;s practice of sending terrorism suspects to third countries for detention and interrogation, but pledges to closely monitor their treatment to ensure that they are not tortured, administration officials said Monday.

Human rights advocates condemned the decision, saying that continuing the practice, known as rendition, would still allow the transfer of prisoners to countries with a history of torture. They said that promises from other countries of humane treatment, called &#8220;diplomatic assurances,&#8221; were no protection against abuse.

Oh so it's still the same policy, but there will be "more oversight". Translation: "There will be no oversight".

Anyone who thinks the Parties are different must be Deaf, Dumb and Blind.

 

[Peach]

For the purpose of torture and prisoner maltreatment, there are three kinds of war prisoners:

There are not three types of human beings. Torture is still an assault against humanity. Not the humanity of the victim, but the humanity of the person doing the torture.

The US engaging in torture, regardless of how we classify the subject being tortured is degrading to all US citizens. They are torturing in our name and we all bear the responsibility

Agreed, and McCain knows of that which he speaks. An honorable man, I will remember him this Monday.