Kobes' X rated trial

[dilloduck]

I thought for sure this guy would walk and still may but the news thats eeks out has made me wonder. Sounds like the victim is going to claim that she said NO to a particular "thing" Kobe did to her face. Rape may have to be redefined here.

 

[krisy]

I can't say I have been following this,but it's had not to know what is going on when you watch the news. Fromthe stuff I hear,I thought it would maybe be a difficult case to win. I guess she had other DNA on her underwear and that seemed really bad for the prosecution. I mean,who has sex with another guy after they have been raped? Some expert was on the other day and said that some victims have sex with another man after being raped. Doesn't make sense to me and I think she has some questions to answer. Don't get me wrong though,I definitley can't sya I think he is innocent...not sure what I think.

 

[dilloduck]

I can't say I have been following this,but it's had not to know what is going on when you watch the news. Fromthe stuff I hear,I thought it would maybe be a difficult case to win. I guess she had other DNA on her underwear and that seemed really bad for the prosecution. I mean,who has sex with another guy after they have been raped? Some expert was on the other day and said that some victims have sex with another man after being raped. Doesn't make sense to me and I think she has some questions to answer. Don't get me wrong though,I definitley can't sya I think he is innocent...not sure what I think.

It sounds like the prosecution will try to say that the woman said NO to only a certain part of the sex act. Now that's really splittin hairs !---(ooops) :halo:

 

[DKSuddeth]

It sounds like the prosecution will try to say that the woman said NO to only a certain part of the sex act. Now that's really splittin hairs !---(ooops) :halo:

well, no really does mean no. unless we're going to try to redefine no in this case. does consent to one act mean consent to any act? If thats the case, look out girls. :fifty:

 

[dilloduck]

well, no really does mean no. unless we're going to try to redefine no in this case. does consent to one act mean consent to any act? If thats the case, look out girls. :fifty:

Exactly--if this what the case turns out to be, it might actually be interesting.

" I agree to abc but xyz is a no go " Does the right to say no include the responsibilty to precisely define what "no" includes ?

 

[William Joyce]

It sounds like the prosecution will try to say that the woman said NO to only a certain part of the sex act. Now that's really splittin hairs !

Not under the criminal law, it isn't.

 

[dmp]

Women have all the power over men. A woman can decide 'after' the fact she didn't want it, and claim rape. A woman can moan..."yes..YES....no!! Yess!" and claim rape because during her activity she used 'no'.

(shrug). Kobe is a victim in this...

 

[Moi]

Women have all the power over men. A woman can decide 'after' the fact she didn't want it, and claim rape. A woman can moan..."yes..YES....no!! Yess!" and claim rape because during her activity she used 'no'.

(shrug). Kobe is a victim in this...

You have a very incorrect interpretation of the law. But I have the perfect solution though.

These powerless men should learn to keep it in their pants. That seems to me the best protection against false accusations. Especially for a married man.

 

[dilloduck]

You have a very incorrect interpretation of the law. But I have the perfect solution though.

These powerless men should learn to keep it in their pants. That seems to me the best protection against false accusations. Especially for a married man.

are you recommending that the poor females go without? :wank:

 

[Moi]

are you recommending that the poor females go without? :wank:

Not at all. I'm recommending that married men have sex with their wives after receiving consent. That unmarried men have sex with whatever women chooses to consent. That men stop using force and threats to get what they want.

Powerless means being forced to have a penis stuck either in your mouth, vagina or anus. Powerless means going on a date with someone and being violated by a penis or other object, through the use of force, into your mouth, vagina or anus.

If I seem particularly vulgar my apologies. But powerless isn't the rare occurrence of being accused of rape when you've not done so- that's what the legal system is for. One in four women, some 20 million if you count the national crime statistics, have either been raped or have had it attempted on them. I doubt, no actually I know, one in four men haven't been falsely accused.

Powerless is having such violations performed on you when you have no ability to stop them- no subsequent legal action can adjudicate that away.

 

[dilloduck]

Not at all. I'm recommending that married men have sex with their wives after receiving consent. That unmarried men have sex with whatever women chooses to consent. That men stop using force and threats to get what they want.

Powerless means being forced to have a penis stuck either in your mouth, vagina or anus. Powerless means going on a date with someone and being violated by a penis or other object, through the use of force, into your mouth, vagina or anus.

If I seem particularly vulgar my apologies. But powerless isn't the rare occurrence of being accused of rape when you've not done so- that's what the legal system is for. One in four women, some 20 million if you count the national crime statistics, have either been raped or have had it attempted on them. I doubt, no actually I know, one in four men haven't been falsely accused.

Powerless is having such violations performed on you when you have no ability to stop them- no subsequent legal action can adjudicate that away.

so by your definition, sexual acts other than forceful acts are not open for prosecution ( if the woman can stop it, it's not rape?)

 

[dmp]

You have a very incorrect interpretation of the law. But I have the perfect solution though.

These powerless men should learn to keep it in their pants. That seems to me the best protection against false accusations. Especially for a married man.

It's not interpretation - it's fact. (shrug)
But of COURSE you'd disagree...inspite of facts - just because that's what you do.

 

[Moi]

so by your definition, sexual acts other than forceful acts are not open for prosecution ( if the woman can stop it, it's not rape?)

well, if the woman CAN stop it it's not rape. It's attempted rape.

The definition I gave was of "Power" not of "rape". There may be all sorts of sexual situations where a woman does have power. A woman voluntarily consuming drugs and alcohol comes to mind. She chose to imbibe or inhale or whatever and then lacks the capacity to consent. That is not powerless in my book just unfortunate lack of common sense.

However, a woman who is in a bar with girlfriends and has a rhohypnol dropped in her glass, unbeknownst to her, who later goes home with a man and never says no---that's powerless.

Not exactly force but a clear example of power.

 

[Moi]

It's not interpretation - it's fact. (shrug)
But of COURSE you'd disagree...inspite of facts - just because that's what you do.

I only disagree with those who are wrong. Moreover, you are sarcastic, narrow-minded and rude. For your daughter's sake, I hope the rest of the people she comes into contact with are better equipped to deal with such a serious issue, especially the men.

 

[dilloduck]

well, if the woman CAN stop it it's not rape. It's attempted rape.

The definition I gave was of "Power" not of "rape". There may be all sorts of sexual situations where a woman does have power. A woman voluntarily consuming drugs and alcohol comes to mind. She chose to imbibe or inhale or whatever and then lacks the capacity to consent. That is not powerless in my book just unfortunate lack of common sense.

However, a woman who is in a bar with girlfriends and has a rhohypnol dropped in her glass, unbeknownst to her, who later goes home with a man and never says no---that's powerless.

Not exactly force but a clear example of power.

assuming that the woman is mentally competant, does she not in a sense define attempted rape minute by minute? ya gotta admit it gets a bit confusing for the male sometimes.

 

[Moi]

assuming that the woman is mentally competant, does she not in a sense define attempted rape minute by minute? ya gotta admit it gets a bit confusing for the male sometimes.

First of all, that's why there are so many degrees of rape. To allow for the possibility that there was no clear and decisive force/coercion/lack of consent.

The prosecution (and thus the woman) still bears the burden in this society as to whether or not a crime is commited. Just listening to the outrageous way women who do attempt prosecution are treated also leads me to believe that the burden of proof needs to be higher in rape cases than in any other criminal proceeding. The things said about OJ (often by those who did and still think he is guilty) weren't half as vitriolic as about women who claim rape.

Given that, if someone were having enough intimacy to have sex, they can certainly discuss the issue of what's acceptable at each stage of the game. A man honest enough to address the issue of consent in an open minded and uncoercive manner has very little to worry about.

 

[DKSuddeth]

assuming that the woman is mentally competant, does she not in a sense define attempted rape minute by minute? ya gotta admit it gets a bit confusing for the male sometimes.

I don't know about anyone else, but If I ever happened to be with a woman that couldn't define from one minute to the next whether she was being raped, or attempted, then for my own sanity I'd have to get the hell away from the partially insane and questionably stable individual. Anyone else that could even THINK of trying to deal with the instability could actually be said to have deserved his fate.

 

[Joz]

Here's my two cents worth,

Way to go MOI !!!

You tell 'em!

 

[Moi]

I don't know about anyone else, but If I ever happened to be with a woman that couldn't define from one minute to the next whether she was being raped, or attempted, then for my own sanity I'd have to get the hell away from the partially insane and questionably stable individual. Anyone else that could even THINK of trying to deal with the instability could actually be said to have deserved his fate.

A good argument for not having sex unless you really know the person with whom you are about to have it.

If I consent to making out or even a hand job, then say that I don't want intercourse are you saying that you would argue that I have no right?

If I entered your unlocked house because you said I could get myself a drink and I stole the TV, would that not still be theft? Or how about we agree to box for $1 million provided the gloves are the same ounces and are made of leather, etc. If I use a lead lined glove and beat the crap out of you, do I still get the prize?

Rape doesn't happen over hours or even minutes. It happens at one moment in time only. At that moment consent is the issue. Not whether she wanted to have sex one moment before or one moment after or if she wanted some type of sex versus another. No means no.

 

[Moi]

Here's my two cents worth,

Way to go MOI !!!

You tell 'em!

Thank you, m'lady!