Killing The Goose

[Stephanie]

Thomas Sowell
Killing The Goose

SNIP:
Killing the goose that lays the golden egg is one of those old fairy tales for children which has a heavy message that a lot of adults should listen to. The labor unions which have driven the makers of Twinkies into bankruptcy, potentially destroying 18,500 jobs, could have learned a lot from that old children's fairy tale.

Many people think of labor unions as organizations to benefit workers, and think of employers who are opposed to unions as just people who don't want to pay their employees more money. But some employers have made it a point to pay their employees more than the union wages, just to keep them from joining a union.

Why would they do that, if it is just a question of not wanting to pay union wages? The Twinkies bankruptcy is a classic example of costs created by labor unions that are not confined to paychecks.

The work rules imposed in union contracts required the company that makes Twinkies, which also makes Wonder Bread, to deliver these two products to stores in separate trucks. Moreover, truck drivers were not allowed to load either of these products into their trucks. And the people who did load Twinkies into trucks were not allowed to load Wonder Bread, and vice versa.

All of this was obviously intended to create more jobs for the unions' members. But the needless additional costs that these make-work rules created ended up driving the company into bankruptcy, which can cost 18,500 jobs. The union is killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

Not only are there reasons for employers to pay their workers enough to keep them from joining unions, there are reasons why workers in the private sector have increasingly voted against joining unions. They have seen unions driving jobs away to non-union competitors at home or driving them overseas, whether with costly work rules or in other ways.

The old-time legendary labor leader John L. Lewis called so many strikes in the coal mines that many people switched to using oil instead, because they couldn't depend on coal deliveries. A professor of labor economics at the University of Chicago called John L. Lewis "the world's greatest oil salesman."

There is no question that Lewis' United Mine Workers Union raised the pay and other benefits for coal miners. But the higher costs of producing coal not only led many consumers to switch to oil, these costs also led coal companies to substitute machinery for labor, reducing the number of miners.

By the 1960s, many coal-mining towns were almost ghost towns. But few people connected the dots back to the glory years of John L. Lewis. The United Mine Workers Union did not kill the goose that laid the golden eggs, but it created a situation where fewer of those golden eggs reached the miners.

It was much the same story in the automobile industry and the steel industry, where large pensions and costly work rules drove up the prices of finished products and drove down the number of jobs. There is a reason why there was a major decline in the proportion of private sector employees who joined unions. It was not just the number of union workers who ended up losing their jobs. Other workers saw the handwriting on the wall and refused to join unions.

There is also a reason why labor unions are flourishing among people who work for government. No matter how much these public sector unions drive up costs, government agencies do not go out of business. They simply go back to the taxpayers for more money.

all of it here
http://www.creators.com/print/conservative/thomas-sowell/killing-the-goose.html

 

[eflatminor]

The work rules imposed in union contracts required the company that makes Twinkies, which also makes Wonder Bread, to deliver these two products to stores in separate trucks. Moreover, truck drivers were not allowed to load either of these products into their trucks. And the people who did load Twinkies into trucks were not allowed to load Wonder Bread, and vice versa.

Hard to believe that business model didn't work out...

There is also a reason why labor unions are flourishing among people who work for government. No matter how much these public sector unions drive up costs, government agencies do not go out of business. They simply go back to the taxpayers for more money.

Yep.

 

[jwoodie]

An elementary economics lesson that completely escapes the majority of voters.

 

[Cowman]

The workers, the little guys, are the geese that lay the golden eggs for the corporations.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The workers, the little guys, are the geese that lay the golden eggs for the corporations.

And the businesses provide warm dry place for the egg layers and pay them a salary to boot.

Here's a suggestion if you don't want a business to take your eggs then you can buy or lease some land, get all the permits and do all the regulatory bullshit then build your own hen house with your own money, heat it, cool it, pay the electric bills and taxes out of your own fucking pocket and then you can keep your own eggs.

 

[Cowman]

The workers, the little guys, are the geese that lay the golden eggs for the corporations.

And the businesses provide warm dry place for the egg layers and pay them a salary to boot.

Here's a suggestion if you don't want a business to take your egg then build your own hen house with your own money, heat it, cool it, pay the electric bills and taxes out of your own fucking pocket and then you can keep your own eggs.

Well sorry but it looks like the greedy ass business got fucked over for messing with the geese.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The workers, the little guys, are the geese that lay the golden eggs for the corporations.

And the businesses provide warm dry place for the egg layers and pay them a salary to boot.

Here's a suggestion if you don't want a business to take your egg then build your own hen house with your own money, heat it, cool it, pay the electric bills and taxes out of your own fucking pocket and then you can keep your own eggs.

Well sorry but it looks like the greedy ass business got fucked over for messing with the geese.

And now the geese have no place to lay their eggs and no salary while the business owners will sell off the assets of the company and retire.

Seems to me the geese fucked themselves.

 

[Staidhup]

The workers, the little guys, are the geese that lay the golden eggs for the corporations.

And the businesses provide warm dry place for the egg layers and pay them a salary to boot.

Here's a suggestion if you don't want a business to take your egg then build your own hen house with your own money, heat it, cool it, pay the electric bills and taxes out of your own fucking pocket and then you can keep your own eggs.

Well sorry but it looks like the greedy ass business got fucked over for messing with the geese.

Here we go again, another nut case that believes business's exist to employ workers and not produce a profit. Good luck with that concept, unless of course you work for GM.

 

[Cowman]

And the businesses provide warm dry place for the egg layers and pay them a salary to boot.

Here's a suggestion if you don't want a business to take your egg then build your own hen house with your own money, heat it, cool it, pay the electric bills and taxes out of your own fucking pocket and then you can keep your own eggs.

Well sorry but it looks like the greedy ass business got fucked over for messing with the geese.

And now the geese have no place to lay their eggs and no salary while the business owners will sell off the assets of the company and retire.

Seems to me the geese fucked themselves.

So you look at this as a net positive then. I mean, you're obviously on the side of the business owners who are retiring and living comfortably.

And you already stated essentially that you don't give a shit about the workers... so those unemployed numbers shouldn't bother you. After all, they fucked themselves, right?


http://globalgrind.com/news/hostess-bakers-union-mediation-prevent-shut-down-twinkie-details

According to Bankruptcy Judge Robert Drain, mediation is a better option to save the iconic Hostess brand, which produces Twinkies and Wonder Bread, rather than accommodating its original request to sell the company's assets and liquidate. The decision was made this afternoon at the U.S. Bankruptcy Court in White Plains, N.Y. As a result, there is more hope of preventing over 18,000 workers from losing their jobs.

The union workers are going to get a lot of what they want, and a lot less shaft that they were being given. That's my hope certainly.

 

[HUGGY]

Thomas Sowell
Killing The Goose

SNIP:
Killing the goose that lays the golden egg is one of those old fairy tales for children which has a heavy message that a lot of adults should listen to. The labor unions which have driven the makers of Twinkies into bankruptcy, potentially destroying 18,500 jobs, could have learned a lot from that old children's fairy tale.

Many people think of labor unions as organizations to benefit workers, and think of employers who are opposed to unions as just people who don't want to pay their employees more money. But some employers have made it a point to pay their employees more than the union wages, just to keep them from joining a union.

Why would they do that, if it is just a question of not wanting to pay union wages? The Twinkies bankruptcy is a classic example of costs created by labor unions that are not confined to paychecks.

The work rules imposed in union contracts required the company that makes Twinkies, which also makes Wonder Bread, to deliver these two products to stores in separate trucks. Moreover, truck drivers were not allowed to load either of these products into their trucks. And the people who did load Twinkies into trucks were not allowed to load Wonder Bread, and vice versa.

All of this was obviously intended to create more jobs for the unions' members. But the needless additional costs that these make-work rules created ended up driving the company into bankruptcy, which can cost 18,500 jobs. The union is killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

Not only are there reasons for employers to pay their workers enough to keep them from joining unions, there are reasons why workers in the private sector have increasingly voted against joining unions. They have seen unions driving jobs away to non-union competitors at home or driving them overseas, whether with costly work rules or in other ways.

The old-time legendary labor leader John L. Lewis called so many strikes in the coal mines that many people switched to using oil instead, because they couldn't depend on coal deliveries. A professor of labor economics at the University of Chicago called John L. Lewis "the world's greatest oil salesman."

There is no question that Lewis' United Mine Workers Union raised the pay and other benefits for coal miners. But the higher costs of producing coal not only led many consumers to switch to oil, these costs also led coal companies to substitute machinery for labor, reducing the number of miners.

By the 1960s, many coal-mining towns were almost ghost towns. But few people connected the dots back to the glory years of John L. Lewis. The United Mine Workers Union did not kill the goose that laid the golden eggs, but it created a situation where fewer of those golden eggs reached the miners.

It was much the same story in the automobile industry and the steel industry, where large pensions and costly work rules drove up the prices of finished products and drove down the number of jobs. There is a reason why there was a major decline in the proportion of private sector employees who joined unions. It was not just the number of union workers who ended up losing their jobs. Other workers saw the handwriting on the wall and refused to join unions.

There is also a reason why labor unions are flourishing among people who work for government. No matter how much these public sector unions drive up costs, government agencies do not go out of business. They simply go back to the taxpayers for more money.

all of it here
http://www.creators.com/print/conservative/thomas-sowell/killing-the-goose.html

Steffuny... you are a stooge. Did you bother to do any independant research or thinking about this matter before blessing USMB with another of your cut and paste wonders?

Companies survive on customers and sales you nitwit. Hostess products are taking a grand swan dive in the market. You think the executives at Hostess are giving themselves 300% raises because of the grand success of this company?

The unions have already given back to the company twice in the last two years.

Hostess is dead. You are stupid. Two facts you need to be aware of.

 

[JimH52]

Big Losses, Bigger Paychecks - The Daily Beast

Thoreau of Unqualified Offerings notes that as the firm headed into bankruptcy for the second time, Hostesss paid senior executives large amounts. Why does this happen? More to the point, why is so much of the outrage focused on the union whose strike pushed the firm into liquidation, rather than executives who paid themselves big bonuses while driving the company into the ground?

 

[Mustang]

Big Losses, Bigger Paychecks - The Daily Beast

Thoreau of Unqualified Offerings notes that as the firm headed into bankruptcy for the second time, Hostesss paid senior executives large amounts. Why does this happen? More to the point, why is so much of the outrage focused on the union whose strike pushed the firm into liquidation, rather than executives who paid themselves big bonuses while driving the company into the ground?

How much do you want to bet that, regardless of what else happens to the company and/or the multitude of Hostess brands, the executives of the company will walk away with a pile of money?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Well sorry but it looks like the greedy ass business got fucked over for messing with the geese.

And now the geese have no place to lay their eggs and no salary while the business owners will sell off the assets of the company and retire.

Seems to me the geese fucked themselves.

So you look at this as a net positive then. I mean, you're obviously on the side of the business owners who are retiring and living comfortably.

The owners didn't want to close shop they had no choice.

And you already stated essentially that you don't give a shit about the workers... so those unemployed numbers shouldn't bother you. After all, they fucked themselves, right?

Where did I say I didn't care about workers? I never said that. And anyone who works to shut down a business that employs them is fucking himself don't you think?

Hostess And Bakers Union Agree To Mediation To Prevent Shut Down (DETAILS) | Global Grind

According to Bankruptcy Judge Robert Drain, mediation is a better option to save the iconic Hostess brand, which produces Twinkies and Wonder Bread, rather than accommodating its original request to sell the company's assets and liquidate. The decision was made this afternoon at the U.S. Bankruptcy Court in White Plains, N.Y. As a result, there is more hope of preventing over 18,000 workers from losing their jobs.

The union workers are going to get a lot of what they want, and a lot less shaft that they were being given. That's my hope certainly.

[/QUOTE]

IMO anyone who walks off a job should be fired. There are plenty of people out there who would love to have a job at Hostess.

So if you don't want to work somewhere then be a big boy put in your notice and leave. You have no right to try to shut down a business because you don't want to work.

 

[Wiseacre]

Comes down to unions cooperating with management or going down the tubes. In Germany the relationship between the two is nowhere near as confrontational or difficult; both sides have a place at the table, and the unions have a voice in making decisions.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

1. As EVERYONE now knows, it was sugar prices and their own failed business plan that brought them to this.

2. Our obese and diabetic country will never let this garbage go where it should. Never fear, it will be right back at the 7/11 - just across from the Pepsi and cigarettes.

Chow down.

 

[Stephanie]

Thomas Sowell
Killing The Goose

SNIP:
Killing the goose that lays the golden egg is one of those old fairy tales for children which has a heavy message that a lot of adults should listen to. The labor unions which have driven the makers of Twinkies into bankruptcy, potentially destroying 18,500 jobs, could have learned a lot from that old children's fairy tale.

Many people think of labor unions as organizations to benefit workers, and think of employers who are opposed to unions as just people who don't want to pay their employees more money. But some employers have made it a point to pay their employees more than the union wages, just to keep them from joining a union.

Why would they do that, if it is just a question of not wanting to pay union wages? The Twinkies bankruptcy is a classic example of costs created by labor unions that are not confined to paychecks.

The work rules imposed in union contracts required the company that makes Twinkies, which also makes Wonder Bread, to deliver these two products to stores in separate trucks. Moreover, truck drivers were not allowed to load either of these products into their trucks. And the people who did load Twinkies into trucks were not allowed to load Wonder Bread, and vice versa.

All of this was obviously intended to create more jobs for the unions' members. But the needless additional costs that these make-work rules created ended up driving the company into bankruptcy, which can cost 18,500 jobs. The union is killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

Not only are there reasons for employers to pay their workers enough to keep them from joining unions, there are reasons why workers in the private sector have increasingly voted against joining unions. They have seen unions driving jobs away to non-union competitors at home or driving them overseas, whether with costly work rules or in other ways.

The old-time legendary labor leader John L. Lewis called so many strikes in the coal mines that many people switched to using oil instead, because they couldn't depend on coal deliveries. A professor of labor economics at the University of Chicago called John L. Lewis "the world's greatest oil salesman."

There is no question that Lewis' United Mine Workers Union raised the pay and other benefits for coal miners. But the higher costs of producing coal not only led many consumers to switch to oil, these costs also led coal companies to substitute machinery for labor, reducing the number of miners.

By the 1960s, many coal-mining towns were almost ghost towns. But few people connected the dots back to the glory years of John L. Lewis. The United Mine Workers Union did not kill the goose that laid the golden eggs, but it created a situation where fewer of those golden eggs reached the miners.

It was much the same story in the automobile industry and the steel industry, where large pensions and costly work rules drove up the prices of finished products and drove down the number of jobs. There is a reason why there was a major decline in the proportion of private sector employees who joined unions. It was not just the number of union workers who ended up losing their jobs. Other workers saw the handwriting on the wall and refused to join unions.

There is also a reason why labor unions are flourishing among people who work for government. No matter how much these public sector unions drive up costs, government agencies do not go out of business. They simply go back to the taxpayers for more money.

all of it here
http://www.creators.com/print/conservative/thomas-sowell/killing-the-goose.html

Steffuny... you are a stooge. Did you bother to do any independant research or thinking about this matter before blessing USMB with another of your cut and paste wonders?

Companies survive on customers and sales you nitwit. Hostess products are taking a grand swan dive in the market. You think the executives at Hostess are giving themselves 300% raises because of the grand success of this company?

The unions have already given back to the company twice in the last two years.

Hostess is dead. You are stupid. Two facts you need to be aware of.

You are the stooge
I'll take Thomas Sowell's word over YOURS

 

[HUGGY]

SOOOOOoooooo.....??????

Who here thinks the unions are asking for a 300% bigger slice of the Hostess cupake?

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Could anyone have saved the Twinkie, Wonder Bread extinction? | Alaska Dispatch

Did Congress kill the Twinkie? The tariff tale behind the Hostess demise.(+video) - CSMonitor.com

 

[Stephanie]

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Thomas Sowell



Chicago School of Economics



Born

June 30, 1930 (age 82)
Gastonia, North Carolina



Nationality

American



Institution

Hoover Institution (1980–present)
UCLA (1970–1972, 1974–1980)
Urban Institute (1972–1974)
Brandeis University (1969–1970)
Cornell University (1965–1969)



Field

Economics, Welfare economics, Education, Politics, History, Race relations, Child development



Influences

Milton Friedman, George Stigler, F. A. Hayek, Joseph Schumpeter



Influenced

Clarence Thomas, Milton Friedman, Steven Pinker, Walter E. Williams



Awards

Military Service: United States Marine Corps, Corporal, Francis Boyer Award, National Humanities Medal, Bradley Prize, getAbstract International Book Award


Thomas Sowell (born June 30, 1930) is an American economist, social theorist, political philosopher, and author. A National Humanities Medal winner, he advocates laissez-faire economics and writes from a conservative and libertarian perspective. He is currently the Rose and Milton Friedman Senior Fellow on Public Policy at the Hoover Institution, Stanford University. He is considered a leading representative of the Chicago school of economics.[1]

Sowell was born in North Carolina, but grew up in Harlem, New York. He dropped out of high school, and served in the United States Marine Corps during the Korean War. He received a bachelor's degree from Harvard University in 1958 and a master's degree from Columbia University in 1959. In 1968, he earned his doctorate degree in Economics from the University of Chicago.

Sowell has served on the faculties of several universities, including Cornell University and University of California, Los Angeles, and worked for think tanks such as the Urban Institute. Since 1980 he has worked at the Hoover Institution. He is the author of more than 30 books.

Thomas Sowell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[HUGGY]

Thomas Sowell
Killing The Goose

SNIP:
Killing the goose that lays the golden egg is one of those old fairy tales for children which has a heavy message that a lot of adults should listen to. The labor unions which have driven the makers of Twinkies into bankruptcy, potentially destroying 18,500 jobs, could have learned a lot from that old children's fairy tale.

Many people think of labor unions as organizations to benefit workers, and think of employers who are opposed to unions as just people who don't want to pay their employees more money. But some employers have made it a point to pay their employees more than the union wages, just to keep them from joining a union.

Why would they do that, if it is just a question of not wanting to pay union wages? The Twinkies bankruptcy is a classic example of costs created by labor unions that are not confined to paychecks.

The work rules imposed in union contracts required the company that makes Twinkies, which also makes Wonder Bread, to deliver these two products to stores in separate trucks. Moreover, truck drivers were not allowed to load either of these products into their trucks. And the people who did load Twinkies into trucks were not allowed to load Wonder Bread, and vice versa.

All of this was obviously intended to create more jobs for the unions' members. But the needless additional costs that these make-work rules created ended up driving the company into bankruptcy, which can cost 18,500 jobs. The union is killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

Not only are there reasons for employers to pay their workers enough to keep them from joining unions, there are reasons why workers in the private sector have increasingly voted against joining unions. They have seen unions driving jobs away to non-union competitors at home or driving them overseas, whether with costly work rules or in other ways.

The old-time legendary labor leader John L. Lewis called so many strikes in the coal mines that many people switched to using oil instead, because they couldn't depend on coal deliveries. A professor of labor economics at the University of Chicago called John L. Lewis "the world's greatest oil salesman."

There is no question that Lewis' United Mine Workers Union raised the pay and other benefits for coal miners. But the higher costs of producing coal not only led many consumers to switch to oil, these costs also led coal companies to substitute machinery for labor, reducing the number of miners.

By the 1960s, many coal-mining towns were almost ghost towns. But few people connected the dots back to the glory years of John L. Lewis. The United Mine Workers Union did not kill the goose that laid the golden eggs, but it created a situation where fewer of those golden eggs reached the miners.

It was much the same story in the automobile industry and the steel industry, where large pensions and costly work rules drove up the prices of finished products and drove down the number of jobs. There is a reason why there was a major decline in the proportion of private sector employees who joined unions. It was not just the number of union workers who ended up losing their jobs. Other workers saw the handwriting on the wall and refused to join unions.

There is also a reason why labor unions are flourishing among people who work for government. No matter how much these public sector unions drive up costs, government agencies do not go out of business. They simply go back to the taxpayers for more money.

all of it here
http://www.creators.com/print/conservative/thomas-sowell/killing-the-goose.html

Steffuny... you are a stooge. Did you bother to do any independant research or thinking about this matter before blessing USMB with another of your cut and paste wonders?

Companies survive on customers and sales you nitwit. Hostess products are taking a grand swan dive in the market. You think the executives at Hostess are giving themselves 300% raises because of the grand success of this company?

The unions have already given back to the company twice in the last two years.

Hostess is dead. You are stupid. Two facts you need to be aware of.

You are the stooge
I'll take Thomas Sowell's word over YOURS

Really? Why? What do you know about him that leads you to believe he would give you an honest and unbiased opinion of the Hostess situation?

You should stick to coloring by the numbers cupcake.