Kerry's 4 months! military service

[ScreamingEagle]

I know the subject of Kerry's military service has been discussed ad nauseum but since Kerry is making it the centerpiece of his campaign I would like to address specifically the LENGTH of his term of service.

4 months (120 days) seems like a really, really, really, really short term of service! Just how many of those 120 days did he actually spend in Vietnam?

Were there a lot of other servicemen who got out in such a short time?
If not, why not?

Didn't most Vietnam volunteers have to serve at least 2 YEARS in the Army? Wasn't the Navy for 3 YEARS? Maybe somebody can confirm this.

I can see how a guy would leave after 4 months if they were severely injured - heck, even a broken arm - but Kerry's injuries were inconsequential. Does anybody think his injuries warranted his leaving the service after only 4 months?

Did many other servicemen use the "fine print" about Purple Hearts like Kerry did and leave the war in such a short time?

And do you think 4 months makes him a "real" experienced veteran?

 

[freeandfun1]

First off, since Kerry went to the Naval Academy, he had a six-year minimum commitment. I am not sure, but he may have only been a "reserve" officer, which means he WAS NOT selected for the possibility of being a "career" officer. Therefore, once he was finished with his tours in Vietnam, his only requirement was that he continue to serve as a "reserve" officer for the remaining time on his "commitment". I am not sure if the "three purple hearts rule" let him even forgo that commitment, but it is possible. Perhaps somebody more knowledgable than me on that point can answer it.

Secondly, I must be fair even though I don't want to be. From what I understand, he served 1 year on a carrier off the coast of Vietnam before he volunteered (as part of his overall scheme to eventually run for office one day I am sure) for the swift-boat duty.

Kerry used a little used (by Academy officers especially) rule about "injuries" to get out of the combat zone early. NONE of his injuries required even an overnight stay in the hospital and two of the three didn't even require a single stitch. The guy is a loser and no, his 16 months as an active duty officer does not give him any special advantage in the category of "military experience" but his Naval Academy attendance should help him some, but since he obviously did not care for the teachings of the academy, I am not even sure why he attended.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

First off, since Kerry went to the Naval Academy, he had a six-year minimum commitment. I am not sure, but he may have only been a "reserve" officer, which means he WAS NOT selected for the possibility of being a "career" officer. Therefore, once he was finished with his tours in Vietnam, his only requirement was that he continue to serve as a "reserve" officer for the remaining time on his "commitment". I am not sure if the "three purple hearts rule" let him even forgo that commitment, but it is possible. Perhaps somebody more knowledgable than me on that point can answer it.

Secondly, I must be fair even though I don't want to be. From what I understand, he served 1 year on a carrier off the coast of Vietnam before he volunteered (as part of his overall scheme to eventually run for office one day I am sure) for the swift-boat duty.

Kerry used a little used (by Academy officers especially) rule about "injuries" to get out of the combat zone early. NONE of his injuries required even an overnight stay in the hospital and two of the three didn't even require a single stitch. The guy is a loser and no, his 16 months as an active duty officer does not give him any special advantage in the category of "military experience" but his Naval Academy attendance should help him some, but since he obviously did not care for the teachings of the academy, I am not even sure why he attended.

Thanks Free for making clear that his total service time was 16 months. My respect for Kerry just went up a notch. Duty on a carrier outside Vietnam was no picnic I am sure.

Still, getting out in 16 months (if he was committed for 6 years) means he only served 22% of his committment. It still appears that he was avoiding duty.

 

[freeandfun1]

Still, getting out in 16 months (if he was committed for 6 years) means he only served 22% of his committment. It still appears that he was avoiding duty.

I totally agree.

 

[Annie]

I totally agree.

Oh Free! The Avatar! :dev1:

 

[freeandfun1]

Oh Free! The Avatar! :dev1:

Thanks to you! I got that from the John Kerry Sucks link on the "waffle" site.

 

[Annie]

Thanks to you! I got that from the John Kerry Sucks link on the "waffle" site.

That video was great too! Here's a chuckle on a related topic!

http://www.dailypundit.com/archives/014708.php#014708

 

[LoneVoice]

Thanks Free for making clear that his total service time was 16 months. My respect for Kerry just went up a notch. Duty on a carrier outside Vietnam was no picnic I am sure.

Still, getting out in 16 months (if he was committed for 6 years) means he only served 22% of his committment. It still appears that he was avoiding duty.

Are you really trying to formulate negative opinions of his tour of duty, without having any real facts? That wouldn't be a wise method of formulating opinions.

Isn't the real question that you're going for, which candidate John Kerry or George Bush served more admirably in the military?

Before answering that question, you'd really have to have the facts, in order to formulate a true decision.

Really and truly, as far as the whole issue goes, does it really make a difference either way? Will you change your opinion on who you're voting for in this year's election based on either of their military service?

 

[Annie]

Are you really trying to formulate negative opinions of his tour of duty, without having any real facts? That wouldn't be a wise method of formulating opinions.

Isn't the real question that you're going for, which candidate John Kerry or George Bush served more admirably in the military?

Before answering that question, you'd really have to have the facts, in order to formulate a true decision.

Really and truly, as far as the whole issue goes, does it really make a difference either way? Will you change your opinion on who you're voting for in this year's election based on either of their military service?

Kerry has chosen to make his service the centerpiece of his campaign. He gave a longer than normal acceptance speech, skipping over 20+ years since he left VIETNAM!

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Are you really trying to formulate negative opinions of his tour of duty, without having any real facts? That wouldn't be a wise method of formulating opinions.

Isn't the real question that you're going for, which candidate John Kerry or George Bush served more admirably in the military?

Before answering that question, you'd really have to have the facts, in order to formulate a true decision.

Really and truly, as far as the whole issue goes, does it really make a difference either way? Will you change your opinion on who you're voting for in this year's election based on either of their military service?

There seem to be many people who question the "admirable-ness" of Kerry's service.

Why is it he would leave the Swift boat after only 4 months and he wasn't really injured?

There are even some people who would go so far as to suggest he was AWOL.
http://www.crushkerry.com/modules.php?name=News&file=print&sid=124

It's a fact that there are many servicemen who do not find Kerry to be "admirable" and think him unfit to command.
http://www.swiftvets.com/
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2004/5/4/132751.shtml

 

[Annie]

TV Aid-by Swiftboat Vets:

http://humaneventsonline.com.edgesuite.net/unfit_video_wmv.html

 

[Merlin1047]

I know this has been done to death, but I guess I'm addicted. I just love to see someone hammering kerry and doing a good job of it too.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

JOHN KERRY, I AM TALKING TO YOU!

A few months ago on TV, Senator John Kerry, you angrily asked a detractor Are you questioning my patriotism? He responded that he was not, but I sure am. Rather than deciding which power tie you should wear each day, I feel you should be in an orange jumpsuit in a federal penitentiary for treason. You betrayed all my fellow Vietnam veterans, our POWs, our loyal Montagnard allies (at the cost of many of their lives), and you betrayed me. Your entire political career was launched when you spoke before Congress in 1971, using eloquent testimony written by Bobby Kennedy's head speechwriter, but based on outright lies from 7 men from the Detroit Winter Soldier Rally, who all claimed to be Vietnam veterans that committed atrocities such as those you described. As you well know, only 2 of those men were even in the military, and they were never in combat, and the other 5 all claimed to be Navy SEALS in the Top Secret Phoenix Program, but they were never even in the military. It did not matter to you. In fact, Congress investigated and discovered that most of the so-called highly-decorated veterans at the Detroit Rally were also not even in the military. You did not care. You were on your way towards the Presidency then, with no regards to who got hurt along the way, including all of us Vietnam veterans. John Kerry, like a chameleon, you change your appearance to fit the environment you are in at the time. You do only what is politically-expedient for you, no matter who gets hurt. You always have. You always will.

Now, 250 sailors who served with you in Vietnam, and who know what you are really like under the stresses of combat, have condemned you and declared you unfit to be commander in chief of our armed forces. Your boss in Vietnam and his boss are included in this list, and these men even started their own website http://www.swiftvets.com , but the liberal media flatly refuses to expose this to the American public. You publicly said that you witnessed atrocities, so you literally called these honorable, brave men, who served alongside you, war criminals. And you call yourself a man of honor?

The doctor who treated you for your first wound, for which you received your first Purple Heart, Dr. Louis Letson[ii], now a retired practitioner in Alabama, swore: I simply removed the piece of metal by lifting it out of the skin with forceps. I doubt that it penetrated more than 3 or 4 mm. It did not require probing to find it, did not require any anesthesia to remove it, and did not require any sutures to close the wound. The wound was covered with a band-aid.

It has been reported that you got that wound by firing an M-79 at rocks on shore nearby, after a boat-mate warned you not to, and a tiny sliver ricocheted and nicked you. 3 or 4mms? lifting it out of the skin? John Kerry, in fact, all three of your Purple Hearts in Vietnam were for wounds that only required a band-aid. Little wonder you do not wish those records released so those you have swayed can see the real you. And you call yourself a man of honor.

You were awarded the Silver Star for beaching your craft, chasing a wounded Viet Cong and dispatching him with a head-shot, but John Kerry, he had been already wounded by your boat-gunner employing twin .50s. In other words, you killed a man who had been wounded from less than a hundred yards away, by a pair of Browning M2 .50 caliber machine guns, which shoot 1,100 rounds per minute of six-inch by half-inch cartridges at a muzzle velocity of 2,930 feet per second, and a range of 4.22 miles. Do you have a clue what happens to a man who has been shot in the hand, foot, leg, arm, or anywhere by such a round, let alone torso or head? According to the USAF, an earlier version of the same machine gun in WWII fired on Japanese Zeros from B25 Mitchell Bombers, would cause the enemy plane to explode. I shot a 50-pound bag of rice hanging under a bamboo tripod from the same approximate distance with one round, center mass, and the whole bag exploded everywhere from the impact. You ran down a man wounded by such a weapon and dispatched him. No wonder you have publicly-stated that you committed war crimes. And you call yourself a man of honor.

Regarding your television ad showing you in Vietnam: Every guy I ever knew in Vietnam who was filmed was shot with a usually shaky hand-held 8mm camera and always looked at and joked for the camera, except for you, John Kerry, the patrolling actor, who cannot even carry an M-16 correctly, and you claim to be a man of honor.

The real JFK, John F. Kennedy, FDR, Harry Truman, LBJ, Richard Nixon, George H. W. Bush, Dwight Eisenhower, no other President, except Abraham Lincoln; during a time of war, has been so publicly chastised, slandered, and denigrated like you and your supporters have been doing to George W. Bush during this dangerous and critical time in US history. Have you tried to quash their attacks and cared about our country's security? Or did you encourage your attack machine to play right into the enemies hands and add fuel to their propaganda machine, and yours? And you claim to be a man of honor.

You are rated as the most liberal Senator in the US Senate, and your running mate as the 4th most liberal Senator, but you spin it for the American public to seem like you are middle of the road. You are rated as the wealthiest Senator in US history and you and your supporters have spun it like George W. Bush is the spoiled rich kid. And you claim to be a man of honor.

I receive tens of thousands of e-mails by veterans and active military serving in Iraq and Afghanistan, almost totally supportive of President Bush, for many reasons. For example, many have heard that George W. Bush and his wife privately and quietly go to military hospitals and visit wounded soldiers all the time and visit with families of KIAs, without cameras around, because they truly care. The only time you have ever visited them has been when there was a photo op, because you have never been into we, only me. And you claim to be a man of honor.

If President, you would have our brave young men and women risking their lives, not for the red, white, and blue, but for the powder blue of the United Nations, and would put their lives and safety under the command of foreign officers who are trained by people we have trained, with the hopes that particular commander is not one of the corrupt ones in the UN, a crap-shoot at best.

When you chaired the Senate Select Committee on MIA/POW Affairs and closed the books on it in 1992, [iii]at the same time that your first cousin, C. Stewart Forbes, was making a one billion dollar deep sea port deal with Hanoi and was also being awarded the exclusive real estate development rights for the entire country of Vietnam, [iv] you shredded documents, which absolutely proved the existence of living American POWs, ignored 42,00 pieces of evidence, and closed the books, saying there was no significant evidence proving any Americans still lived. And you call yourself a man of honor.
Why does what happened three decades ago pertain to today? You betrayed many in our country then, and if elected President, you will do it again. A leopard cannot change its spots, but a chameleon changes colors whenever its advantageous.

I ran into an orphaned, unsighted chameleon in the jungle, and he asked me what type of animal he was.

I said, You have beady eyes, you're slimy, very low, you change colors to blend into your environment, whenever you move you look crooked, and it doesn't look to me like you have any testicles.

The chameleon responded, Heaven help me. I must be John F. Kerry.

John Forbes Kerry, I do not hate you. My words are direct and strong, because I simply do not like you, respect you, or trust you, and do not want our country put in harms way by your Presidency, because, unlike you, I am a man of honor. You are not. Never will be. You are simply a chameleon. We are at war, and you have already proven the type of loyalty you display to Americans fighting men and women during war.

Permission is hereby granted to reprint, copy, or pass this on wherever and to whomever you choose. This is the 7th in a series of editorials about John F. Kerry, and is posted on my website with the other 6.

Blessings,

Don Bendell

Don Bendell served as an officer in four Special Forces Groups, including a tour on a green beret A-team (Dak Pek) in Vietnam in 1968-1969, and was in the Top Secret Phoenix Program, is a top-selling author of 21 books, with over 1,500,000 copies of his books in print worldwide, a 1995 inductee into the International Karate Hall of Fame, and owns karate schools in southern Colorado.

mailto:[email protected] web: www.donbendell.com .

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2004/7/2/212352.shtml

[ii] May 04, 2004, 4:26 p.m., Kerry Purple Heart Doc Speaks Out

The medical description of his first wound. By Byron York, NR White house Correspondent

[iii] Deal will build Vietnam port:[01 Edition]

MICHAEL E. KNELL. Boston Herald. Boston, Mass.: Jun 16, 1993. pg. 032
[iv] http://www.townhall.com/columnists/benshapiro/archive.shtml

 

[Annie]

As the newer member has said, we need to 'know' Kerry. Did you see the tv ad, it's devestating.

 

[Merlin1047]

As the newer member has said, we need to 'know' Kerry. Did you see the tv ad, it's devestating.

Watched it three times. But you know, those guys are paid off by the Bush administration to tell these heinous lies about kerry. The only Viet Nam vets who ever tell the truth are those that compliment kerry. You should know that by now.

 

[Annie]

Watched it three times. But you know, those guys are paid off by the Bush administration to tell these heinous lies about kerry. The only Viet Nam vets who ever tell the truth are those that compliment kerry. You should know that by now.

That should lose impact very quickly. Notice that the Kerry campaign just questions, 'Why they are saying it after all these years', not 'It's a lie?' Me thinks they have a problem.

 

[krisy]

I saw part of this on Hannity and Colmes tonight. Looks pretty bad for Kerry. Thank God someone has spoke out against this crap he has been pushing.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

I know this has been done to death, but I guess I'm addicted. I just love to see someone hammering kerry and doing a good job of it too.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

JOHN KERRY, I AM TALKING TO YOU!

A few months ago on TV, Senator John Kerry, you angrily asked a detractor Are you questioning my patriotism? He responded that he was not, but I sure am. Rather than deciding which power tie you should wear each day, I feel you should be in an orange jumpsuit in a federal penitentiary for treason. You betrayed all my fellow Vietnam veterans, our POWs, our loyal Montagnard allies (at the cost of many of their lives), and you betrayed me. Your entire political career was launched when you spoke before Congress in 1971, using eloquent testimony written by Bobby Kennedy's head speechwriter, but based on outright lies from 7 men from the Detroit Winter Soldier Rally, who all claimed to be Vietnam veterans that committed atrocities such as those you described. As you well know, only 2 of those men were even in the military, and they were never in combat, and the other 5 all claimed to be Navy SEALS in the Top Secret Phoenix Program, but they were never even in the military. It did not matter to you. In fact, Congress investigated and discovered that most of the so-called highly-decorated veterans at the Detroit Rally were also not even in the military. You did not care. You were on your way towards the Presidency then, with no regards to who got hurt along the way, including all of us Vietnam veterans. John Kerry, like a chameleon, you change your appearance to fit the environment you are in at the time. You do only what is politically-expedient for you, no matter who gets hurt. You always have. You always will.

Now, 250 sailors who served with you in Vietnam, and who know what you are really like under the stresses of combat, have condemned you and declared you unfit to be commander in chief of our armed forces. Your boss in Vietnam and his boss are included in this list, and these men even started their own website http://www.swiftvets.com , but the liberal media flatly refuses to expose this to the American public. You publicly said that you witnessed atrocities, so you literally called these honorable, brave men, who served alongside you, war criminals. And you call yourself a man of honor?

The doctor who treated you for your first wound, for which you received your first Purple Heart, Dr. Louis Letson[ii], now a retired practitioner in Alabama, swore: I simply removed the piece of metal by lifting it out of the skin with forceps. I doubt that it penetrated more than 3 or 4 mm. It did not require probing to find it, did not require any anesthesia to remove it, and did not require any sutures to close the wound. The wound was covered with a band-aid.

It has been reported that you got that wound by firing an M-79 at rocks on shore nearby, after a boat-mate warned you not to, and a tiny sliver ricocheted and nicked you. 3 or 4mms? lifting it out of the skin? John Kerry, in fact, all three of your Purple Hearts in Vietnam were for wounds that only required a band-aid. Little wonder you do not wish those records released so those you have swayed can see the real you. And you call yourself a man of honor.

You were awarded the Silver Star for beaching your craft, chasing a wounded Viet Cong and dispatching him with a head-shot, but John Kerry, he had been already wounded by your boat-gunner employing twin .50s. In other words, you killed a man who had been wounded from less than a hundred yards away, by a pair of Browning M2 .50 caliber machine guns, which shoot 1,100 rounds per minute of six-inch by half-inch cartridges at a muzzle velocity of 2,930 feet per second, and a range of 4.22 miles. Do you have a clue what happens to a man who has been shot in the hand, foot, leg, arm, or anywhere by such a round, let alone torso or head? According to the USAF, an earlier version of the same machine gun in WWII fired on Japanese Zeros from B25 Mitchell Bombers, would cause the enemy plane to explode. I shot a 50-pound bag of rice hanging under a bamboo tripod from the same approximate distance with one round, center mass, and the whole bag exploded everywhere from the impact. You ran down a man wounded by such a weapon and dispatched him. No wonder you have publicly-stated that you committed war crimes. And you call yourself a man of honor.

Regarding your television ad showing you in Vietnam: Every guy I ever knew in Vietnam who was filmed was shot with a usually shaky hand-held 8mm camera and always looked at and joked for the camera, except for you, John Kerry, the patrolling actor, who cannot even carry an M-16 correctly, and you claim to be a man of honor.

The real JFK, John F. Kennedy, FDR, Harry Truman, LBJ, Richard Nixon, George H. W. Bush, Dwight Eisenhower, no other President, except Abraham Lincoln; during a time of war, has been so publicly chastised, slandered, and denigrated like you and your supporters have been doing to George W. Bush during this dangerous and critical time in US history. Have you tried to quash their attacks and cared about our country's security? Or did you encourage your attack machine to play right into the enemies hands and add fuel to their propaganda machine, and yours? And you claim to be a man of honor.

You are rated as the most liberal Senator in the US Senate, and your running mate as the 4th most liberal Senator, but you spin it for the American public to seem like you are middle of the road. You are rated as the wealthiest Senator in US history and you and your supporters have spun it like George W. Bush is the spoiled rich kid. And you claim to be a man of honor.

I receive tens of thousands of e-mails by veterans and active military serving in Iraq and Afghanistan, almost totally supportive of President Bush, for many reasons. For example, many have heard that George W. Bush and his wife privately and quietly go to military hospitals and visit wounded soldiers all the time and visit with families of KIAs, without cameras around, because they truly care. The only time you have ever visited them has been when there was a photo op, because you have never been into we, only me. And you claim to be a man of honor.

If President, you would have our brave young men and women risking their lives, not for the red, white, and blue, but for the powder blue of the United Nations, and would put their lives and safety under the command of foreign officers who are trained by people we have trained, with the hopes that particular commander is not one of the corrupt ones in the UN, a crap-shoot at best.

When you chaired the Senate Select Committee on MIA/POW Affairs and closed the books on it in 1992, [iii]at the same time that your first cousin, C. Stewart Forbes, was making a one billion dollar deep sea port deal with Hanoi and was also being awarded the exclusive real estate development rights for the entire country of Vietnam, [iv] you shredded documents, which absolutely proved the existence of living American POWs, ignored 42,00 pieces of evidence, and closed the books, saying there was no significant evidence proving any Americans still lived. And you call yourself a man of honor.
Why does what happened three decades ago pertain to today? You betrayed many in our country then, and if elected President, you will do it again. A leopard cannot change its spots, but a chameleon changes colors whenever its advantageous.

I ran into an orphaned, unsighted chameleon in the jungle, and he asked me what type of animal he was.

I said, You have beady eyes, you're slimy, very low, you change colors to blend into your environment, whenever you move you look crooked, and it doesn't look to me like you have any testicles.

The chameleon responded, Heaven help me. I must be John F. Kerry.

John Forbes Kerry, I do not hate you. My words are direct and strong, because I simply do not like you, respect you, or trust you, and do not want our country put in harms way by your Presidency, because, unlike you, I am a man of honor. You are not. Never will be. You are simply a chameleon. We are at war, and you have already proven the type of loyalty you display to Americans fighting men and women during war.

Permission is hereby granted to reprint, copy, or pass this on wherever and to whomever you choose. This is the 7th in a series of editorials about John F. Kerry, and is posted on my website with the other 6.

Blessings,

Don Bendell

Don Bendell served as an officer in four Special Forces Groups, including a tour on a green beret A-team (Dak Pek) in Vietnam in 1968-1969, and was in the Top Secret Phoenix Program, is a top-selling author of 21 books, with over 1,500,000 copies of his books in print worldwide, a 1995 inductee into the International Karate Hall of Fame, and owns karate schools in southern Colorado.

mailto:[email protected] web: www.donbendell.com .

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2004/7/2/212352.shtml

[ii] May 04, 2004, 4:26 p.m., Kerry Purple Heart Doc Speaks Out

The medical description of his first wound. By Byron York, NR White house Correspondent

[iii] Deal will build Vietnam port:[01 Edition]

MICHAEL E. KNELL. Boston Herald. Boston, Mass.: Jun 16, 1993. pg. 032
[iv] http://www.townhall.com/columnists/benshapiro/archive.shtml

:firing: :fu2: :2guns: :dev1: :chains: :finger: :firing:

Wow, that Bendell guy does not pull any punches. Great post Merlin.

 

[gaffer]

enlistments for the army were 3 4 and 6 years.

Drafted was two years. with four years inactive reserve time.

Marines were 4 or 6 years unless drafted. Marines were drafted too.

Navy was four and 6 years, no draftees

Air Force was four or six years, no draftees

As for 120 days in vietnam, thats still rookie status.

 

[freeandfun1]

enlistments for the army were 3 4 and 6 years.

Drafted was two years. with four years inactive reserve time.

Marines were 4 or 6 years unless drafted. Marines were drafted too.

Navy was four and 6 years, no draftees

Air Force was four or six years, no draftees

As for 120 days in vietnam, thats still rookie status.

If you went to one of the service academies, the commitments are different. You are talking about voluntary enlistments and drafts.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

enlistments for the army were 3 4 and 6 years.

Drafted was two years. with four years inactive reserve time.

Marines were 4 or 6 years unless drafted. Marines were drafted too.

Navy was four and 6 years, no draftees

Air Force was four or six years, no draftees

As for 120 days in vietnam, thats still rookie status.

Thanks for the info Gaffer! That was 120 days just on the Swift boat. It appears he also spent a year off the coast of Vietnam on a carrier. But when he quit the war after the 4 month Swift boat stint and then got into politics there seems to be some question as to his military status and even if he served his remaining time per military regulations. Looks like he ducked the actual service he signed up for.

If a guy signed up in the Navy for 6 years, served some of it actively, then went on active or inactive reserve status, would he have to put in more than 6 years?