Justice Sunday...?

Bullypulpit said:
<blockquote><center><b>American Religious Leaders and Supporters Opposed to “Justice Sunday’s” Manipulation of Faith</b></center>

April 21, 2005
The Honorable Bill Frist
509 Hart Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510

Dear Senator Frist:

We write as religious leaders who cherish America’s distinctive tradition of religious respect, tolerance, and pluralism. We write as members of religious traditions that revere truth and are guided by prophetic calls to seek justice. We are gravely disappointed that you have lent support to those who are trying to create confusion and sow division with false charges of religious discrimination and persecution. Good people can and do differ on policy questions like the filibuster. We emphatically reject claims that those who seek to uphold the country’s traditions of checks and balances are forcing Christians to choose between their faith and public service. It is simply not truthful to assert that supporting the filibuster amounts to an attack on people of faith. Most, perhaps all, of the 95% of the Bush nominees who have been approved, have been people of faith. They enjoyed support from both sides of the aisle. As Senate Majority Leader, you have a responsibility to defend your colleagues on both sides of the aisle, public servants whom you know to be deeply religious people, from shameful and divisive accusations that they are attacking people of faith. You have a responsibility to defend the nation from efforts utilizing deception and fear-mongering to manipulate Americans of faith. And, perhaps most importantly, as one of our nation’s highest elected officials, you have a responsibility to repudiate those who misuse religion for political purposes and who impugn the faith of any who disagree with them. Your participation in the “Justice Sunday” event gives your personal stamp of approval and legitimizes an event built on inflammatory falsehoods. We urge you either to withdraw your participation in this event or, if you participate, to use that opportunity to repudiate the message of divisiveness and religious manipulation that is at the core of the gathering. Sincerely,</blockquote>

For the complete list of signatories, 400+, to this letter, go <a href=http://www.americanprogress.org/atf/cf/%7bE9245FE4-9A2B-43C7-A521-5D6FF2E06E03%7d/ReligiousLeadersOpposedtoJusticeSunday.pdf>here</a>.

It's in PDF format...so you'll need Acrobat to read it.

As for ass kickings, OCA, no one stayed on the topic of the "nuclear option". Instead, they chose to drink the kool-aid and focused on the hot-button non-issues they have been instructed to raise.

Who wrote and circulated this petition,Bully ?
 
dilloduck said:
Who wrote and circulated this petition,Bully ?


Democrats. The site his link sends you to is the "American Progress".

Next to the title they have "Progressive Ideas for a strong, just and free America." Since we all know that Progressive is the new catchphrase for Liberal, it is clear that the petition is an example of what Bully attempts to call hypocrisy. The "Religious" entering politics and attempting to tell others what to believe while promoting an agenda of "Progressive" ideas. Only in Bully's mind this can't be hypocrisy as it is "progressive" ideas they are promoting, they are truly religious and good people because they agree with him.

His very source is so left it's lying on it's side, it certainly isn't a credible source for information unless you are part of the Liberal choir and want to be preached to by more of the same.

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/c.biJRJ8OVF/b.8473/
 
no1tovote4 said:
Democrats. The site his link sends you to is the "American Progress".

Next to the title they have "Progressive Ideas for a strong, just and free America." Since we all know that Progressive is the new catchphrase for Liberal, it is clear that the petition is an example of what Bully attempts to call hypocrisy. The "Religious" entering politics and attempting to tell others what to believe while promoting an agenda of "Progressive" ideas. Only in Bully's mind this can't be hypocrisy as it is "progressive" ideas they are promoting, they are truly religious and good people because they agree with him.

His very source is so left it's lying on it's side, it certainly isn't a credible source for information unless you are part of the Liberal choir and want to be preached to by more of the same.

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/c.biJRJ8OVF/b.8473/

surprise surprise
 
Bullypulpit said:
<blockquote><center><b>American Religious Leaders and Supporters Opposed to “Justice Sunday’s” Manipulation of Faith</b></center>

April 21, 2005
The Honorable Bill Frist
509 Hart Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510

Dear Senator Frist:

We write as religious leaders who cherish America’s distinctive tradition of religious respect, tolerance, and pluralism. We write as members of religious traditions that revere truth and are guided by prophetic calls to seek justice. We are gravely disappointed that you have lent support to those who are trying to create confusion and sow division with false charges of religious discrimination and persecution. Good people can and do differ on policy questions like the filibuster. We emphatically reject claims that those who seek to uphold the country’s traditions of checks and balances are forcing Christians to choose between their faith and public service. It is simply not truthful to assert that supporting the filibuster amounts to an attack on people of faith. Most, perhaps all, of the 95% of the Bush nominees who have been approved, have been people of faith. They enjoyed support from both sides of the aisle. As Senate Majority Leader, you have a responsibility to defend your colleagues on both sides of the aisle, public servants whom you know to be deeply religious people, from shameful and divisive accusations that they are attacking people of faith. You have a responsibility to defend the nation from efforts utilizing deception and fear-mongering to manipulate Americans of faith. And, perhaps most importantly, as one of our nation’s highest elected officials, you have a responsibility to repudiate those who misuse religion for political purposes and who impugn the faith of any who disagree with them. Your participation in the “Justice Sunday” event gives your personal stamp of approval and legitimizes an event built on inflammatory falsehoods. We urge you either to withdraw your participation in this event or, if you participate, to use that opportunity to repudiate the message of divisiveness and religious manipulation that is at the core of the gathering. Sincerely,</blockquote>

For the complete list of signatories, 400+, to this letter, go <a href=http://www.americanprogress.org/atf/cf/%7bE9245FE4-9A2B-43C7-A521-5D6FF2E06E03%7d/ReligiousLeadersOpposedtoJusticeSunday.pdf>here</a>.

It's in PDF format...so you'll need Acrobat to read it.

As for ass kickings, OCA, no one stayed on the topic of the "nuclear option". Instead, they chose to drink the kool-aid and focused on the hot-button non-issues they have been instructed to raise.

Bully you asked for bible quotes against homosexuality and abortion, they were provided. You then tried to claim that way back when Republicans fillibustered judicial nominations....that was proven wrong. Now you want to talk about the nuclear option(btw nice phrase), my question is this...isn't it the right of every president to put on the bench whoever he so chooses? Its like a perk of the job. In the end it all evens out, a Demo pres puts leftwingers on and a Repub. pres puts rightwingers. Demos should spend more time trying to get the oval office back instead of pitching fits about judicial nominations. Personally I don't see why all the jackoffs in the congress should have any friggin say at all, they are all worthless pieces of shit. I see no difference since Schiavo betwen congressional Republicans and Democrats.
 
no1tovote4 said:
Democrats. The site his link sends you to is the "American Progress".

Next to the title they have "Progressive Ideas for a strong, just and free America." Since we all know that Progressive is the new catchphrase for Liberal, it is clear that the petition is an example of what Bully attempts to call hypocrisy. The "Religious" entering politics and attempting to tell others what to believe while promoting an agenda of "Progressive" ideas. Only in Bully's mind this can't be hypocrisy as it is "progressive" ideas they are promoting, they are truly religious and good people because they agree with him.

His very source is so left it's lying on it's side, it certainly isn't a credible source for information unless you are part of the Liberal choir and want to be preached to by more of the same.

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/c.biJRJ8OVF/b.8473/

You see in purely realistic human terms Repubs are progressive and Demos are regressive since they seek to shackle the human spirit.
 
Bullypulpit said:
<blockquote> 1: Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
2: Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
3: But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth:
4: That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.
5: And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
6: But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
7: But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. - <i><a href=>Matthew</i> 6: 1-7</a></blockquote>

I'd never read this before. It stands in stark contradiction to the push for prayer in public school doesn't it?
 
Homosexuality is not a crime before the law in this country. It is objectionable only to those whose religious beliefs hold that it is a sin in the eyes of their favoriet deity. So long as the relationships between same-gender couples causes no objective demonstrable harm to themselves or anyone else, there is no reason before law to prohibit them from engaging in such relationships.

Bully, you are such a two-faced loser. No demonstrable harm, hmmm? How about AIDs and gonorrea doubling after 1980? If you care to look at the facts, AIDs first appeared in GAY MEN and would have stayed there if not for the rampant, out-of-control sex in this country. Wake up! Homosexuality has been shunned by most cultures for thousands of years for a reason...it's dangerous and sick! George Bush certainly isn't the first "Nazi" to oppose such behavior...many countries such as Cuba and Hungary throw homosexuals in jail for groping six-year-olds (but here, Bully does that in from of his computer to get off before he posts.) If you want to make out with gays and rapists and pedofiles all day, go ahead. But I'm not!!! :chains:
 
MissileMan said:
I'd never read this before. It stands in stark contradiction to the push for prayer in public school doesn't it?
This is in regards to personal prayer, when paying respect to and sharing the Glory of the Holy Spirit. This is NOT in regards to holding conversations and sharing our religion with others. Bully is taking a "piece" of the Gospels and applying entirely out of context. We are also told to witness and to profess our faith openly and NOT to hide.

Luke 9:26 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and [in his] Father's, and of the holy angels.
So see, we are told to pray in private when seeking guidance and insight from the Holy Spirit. Yet we are told to witness and not be ashamed of our faith even in public.
 
freeandfun1 said:
This is in regards to personal prayer, when paying respect to and sharing the Glory of the Holy Spirit. This is NOT in regards to holding conversations and sharing our religion with others. Bully is taking a "piece" of the Gospels and applying entirely out of context. We are also told to witness and to profess our faith openly and NOT to hide.

So see, we are told to pray in private when seeking guidance and insight from the Holy Spirit. Yet we are told to witness and not be ashamed of our faith even in public.

I believe that the issue has been about a moment of silence so that those who wish to can offer a personal prayer. If that's not correct, then by all means, set me straight.
 
MissileMan said:
I believe that the issue has been about a moment of silence so that those who wish to can offer a personal prayer. If that's not correct, then by all means, set me straight.
Sure, that may be what you are talking about, but in typical liberal double-speak, you are trying to make a comment which when evaluated properly, is entirely untrue.

Bully is taking scripture out of context to try and "demonstrate" that Christians are told that it is better to pray in private than to openly discuss one's faith.

But as demonstrated previously, that is not true.

Your comment:
I'd never read this before. It stands in stark contradiction to the push for prayer in public school doesn't it?

Is making an insinuation that Christians are being hypocrites on this issue because by pushing for prayer in school, they are going against the scriptures that tell us to pray in private, etc.

As mentioned, we are told that there are to be special times that we should set aside for prayer and meditation so that we can receive the Holy Spirit. We are also told to fast. Those are special occassions. But we are also instructed to witness every day. To tell our stories, but good and bad. Yes, are to do all we can to not be hypocrites, so that means we must openly recognize our sins and we must seek forgiveness. If you do all this together, well, "seek and yea shall find". Your relationship with Christ the Holy Spirit will grow and then when you die, you will be judged upon your sincere belief and acknowledgment of Christ weighed against your sins. We all sin.
 
freeandfun1 said:
Sure, that may be what you are talking about, but in typical liberal double-speak, you are trying to make a comment which when evaluated properly, is entirely untrue.
First, I am as much a liberal as you are an atheist...the devoutly religious hold no monopoly on being conservative. Second, when the verse clearly states that one should pray in private, how can you evaluate it to mean anything other than what it says?



freeandfun1 said:
Is making an insinuation that Christians are being hypocrites on this issue because by pushing for prayer in school, they are going against the scriptures that tell us to pray in private, etc.

Actually, what I find hypocritical is the practice of many on this board of quoting the bible to justify their positions on various matters, but when someone else uses a quote to refute an argument then they are accused of taking things out of context.

So please, explain exactly how I am misinterpreting this verse.
 
MissileMan said:
First, I am as much a liberal as you are an atheist...the devoutly religious hold no monopoly on being conservative. Second, when the verse clearly states that one should pray in private, how can you evaluate it to mean anything other than what it says?
Whether you are liberal or not is not the point. The point is you are using typical liberal double speak.

I evaluate it because I know that in that part of Matthew, Christ was instructing us about many issues. I have not denied that we are instructed to pray in private. But we are also instructed to pray openly. There are different styles of prayers for differing needs/occassions.

When one reads all the Gospels they have a better understanding of what we are to do when, where, how, etc. One cannot yank 5 or 6 sentences or verses out of the Bible and declare that as final. As mentioned, we are told to openly profess our faith. You confuse professing one's faith with praying. They are two different issues. Face it.

MissileMan said:
Actually, what I find hypocritical is the practice of many on this board of quoting the bible to justify their positions on various matters, but when someone else uses a quote to refute an argument then they are accused of taking things out of context.
Actually, Bully has been the only one (and you too to some extent now) that has been refuted by using the Bible. As mentioned, taking something out of context and applying it to a discussion where it is inappropriate or out of place does not make it the definitive point on the subject. I have stated that when we seek to pray we are to do that in private. But prayer and openly professing one's faith are two different issues. You and Bully act as if using scripture to support our positions is akin to praying. Furthermore, Christ gave public blessings and instructed us all to do so.

MissileMan said:
So please, explain exactly how I am misinterpreting this verse.
You're not misinterpreting as much as you are misapplying.
 
freeandfun1 said:
Whether you are liberal or not is not the point. The point is you are using typical liberal double speak.

Explain exactly how if you would, because all I see is an empty accusation.

freeandfun1 said:
I evaluate it because I know that in that part of Matthew, Christ was instructing us about many issues. I have not denied that we are instructed to pray in private. But we are also instructed to pray openly. There are different styles of prayers for differing needs/occassions.

It appeared to me that the entire point of that section was to instruct Christians to practice their religion with humility. Am I far off?

freeandfun1 said:
When one reads all the Gospels they have a better understanding of what we are to do when, where, how, etc. One cannot yank 5 or 6 sentences or verses out of the Bible and declare that as final. As mentioned, we are told to openly profess our faith. You confuse professing one's faith with praying. They are two different issues. Face it.
You are putting more words into my question than what I actually asked. I never said a word about professing faith.

freeandfun1 said:
Actually, Bully has been the only one (and you too to some extent now) that has been refuted by using the Bible. As mentioned, taking something out of context and applying it to a discussion where it is inappropriate or out of place does not make it the definitive point on the subject. I have stated that when we seek to pray we are to do that in private. But prayer and openly professing one's faith are two different issues. You and Bully act as if using scripture to support our positions is akin to praying. Furthermore, Christ gave public blessings and instructed us all to do so.

Again, you are misrepresenting my position totally. You are apparently getting my comments mixed up with Bully's. My point is that you are more than happy to take the bible literally when it suits your purpose, but accuse others of misinterpretation, misapplication, or taking things out of context when they point out a passage that doesn't jive with the way you think things ought to be.
 

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