Justice Roberts: It's A Tax

[Trajan]

its a tax penalty? Roberts said that? who's calling it that?

out of all of those tax hikes, the 2 that seem ridiculous to me is the excise tax on medical equipment, and the medicare tax increase on the highest incomes of the self employed...can't figure the 'justification' of such??? i suppose i need to read up on it...

I can save you time Care...revenue, pure and simple to make it work plain and simple. I don't think dante knows what an Excise tax is and why thats a particularly harsh tax, but itwill alter the device manuf. terrain, bet on it.


Now that the CLASS act is dead that boodles of money they thought they would get before having to spend it, to buy time for the ten year window is gone baby, gone....its under water, ( and really always was)

 

[Trajan]

judging by your 3 previous comments I suspect you're off your drip.

I'm guessing Romney cannot really run a good campaign against the President. He will have the bucks/dollars, but not a winning message. I'm guessing, but it's still early.

I'm hoping the GOP goes after the parts of the PPACA that are already in effect. That would allow Democrats to go after some seats. Burn a family that is staying above water financially with assistance from the PPACA, and you make fierce enemies who will come out and vote and more...

but like Dante always says, anyone who makes bets or predictions (Dante has not), this far out is an idiot, then again, the much hated Conservative Supreme Court with Citizens United, gave us Super PACs this election cycle


who knows?

why yes, those parents carrying their 26 year old on their insurance While, they are unemployed , sure do represent a huge block

egg, chicken etc.....

 

[PoliticalChic]

So what if they are calling it a tax? The right wingnuts had better come up with a replacement if they intend to attempt repeal and they're painting themselves into a corner pretending that the replacement will be free.

And remember Romney still has to debate the president. It might present a challenge discussing how his own healthcare reform went when he was governor.

Your party is one big talking point negative ad and you have no new ideas.

Now, Sarah....is it possible that your political acumen has all of the depth of wall paper?

Why do you suppose Obama and the Democrats avoided using the word "TAX"?


Guess?


Supporting a "Tax" is to the voters like holding a cross up to vampires.....
...you understand that, don't you?

for what PC? the penalty for those who can afford insurance but refused to buy it? yep, it's now called a tax penalty....so what?

all those other tax hikes you listed WERE ALWAYS called taxes or tax hikes, nothing to hide there? so i have no idea why you seem to be implying they have something to do with cj roberts decision? his decision relating to calling the mandate penalty a tax penalty has nada to do with the tax provisions you mentioned?

--------------------------------------------------------

out of all of those tax hikes, the 2 that seem ridiculous to me is the excise tax on medical equipment, and the medicare tax increase on the highest incomes of the self employed...can't figure the 'justification' of such??? i suppose i need to read up on it...

---------------------------------------------------------

IF memory serves, President obama promised not to raise INCOME taxes on those families below $250k a year in taxable income.

He made no promise on not raising other taxes. Almost immediately he signed a bill to raise cigarette taxes to pay for the health care costs of 'children' in need.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HE-rGGKksQ]President Obama s Pledge Never to Raise Taxes on Anyone Making Less Than 250 000 a Year - YouTube[/ame]

 

[PoliticalChic]

Have no fear....I checked the weather...sea change coming November 6th.

the GOP gonna lose more seats?

Now....see what you went and made me do???


I just put in a thread about the 2010 mid-term elections, the Tea Party, and the Supreme Court decision.

 

[Care4all]

its a tax penalty? Roberts said that? who's calling it that?

that's what it is Trajan...

As example, if you choose to pay your taxes late, they fine you a 'tax penalty' fee and add that to the taxes you already owe....

it's not a tax that i would have to pay due to my income, it's only a penalty that you would owe, due to ''not following the rules''....

if it's a tax i don't have to pay because i followed the rules, but as exampled above, you have to pay, because you did not follow the rules....

In my opinion, this penalty tax on those who can afford it, not following the rules by purchasing health insurance... is similar to my example above....a tax penalty for the rule breaker....and no one else.

It does stink....i agree....not crazy about the mandate, without other options being available to us, like the public option or nonprofit option....being coerced to buy insurance from only the private sector seems wrong to me.

 

[Trajan]

Now, Sarah....is it possible that your political acumen has all of the depth of wall paper?

Why do you suppose Obama and the Democrats avoided using the word "TAX"?


Guess?


Supporting a "Tax" is to the voters like holding a cross up to vampires.....
...you understand that, don't you?

for what PC? the penalty for those who can afford insurance but refused to buy it? yep, it's now called a tax penalty....so what?

all those other tax hikes you listed WERE ALWAYS called taxes or tax hikes, nothing to hide there? so i have no idea why you seem to be implying they have something to do with cj roberts decision? his decision relating to calling the mandate penalty a tax penalty has nada to do with the tax provisions you mentioned?

--------------------------------------------------------

out of all of those tax hikes, the 2 that seem ridiculous to me is the excise tax on medical equipment, and the medicare tax increase on the highest incomes of the self employed...can't figure the 'justification' of such??? i suppose i need to read up on it...

---------------------------------------------------------

IF memory serves, President obama promised not to raise INCOME taxes on those families below $250k a year in taxable income.

He made no promise on not raising other taxes. Almost immediately he signed a bill to raise cigarette taxes to pay for the health care costs of 'children' in need.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HE-rGGKksQ]President Obama s Pledge Never to Raise Taxes on Anyone Making Less Than 250 000 a Year - YouTube[/ame]

the tax issue is a dead letter, even the blokes over at the new republic are admitting it now.

there is a huge difference between a tax and a penalty even if the relative actions appears to be same same, that why obama fought like hell to prevent the word tax from being attached to the 'penalty' and why the dems never used the term either, they would never have gotten the votes.

 

[Care4all]

for what PC? the penalty for those who can afford insurance but refused to buy it? yep, it's now called a tax penalty....so what?

all those other tax hikes you listed WERE ALWAYS called taxes or tax hikes, nothing to hide there? so i have no idea why you seem to be implying they have something to do with cj roberts decision? his decision relating to calling the mandate penalty a tax penalty has nada to do with the tax provisions you mentioned?

--------------------------------------------------------

out of all of those tax hikes, the 2 that seem ridiculous to me is the excise tax on medical equipment, and the medicare tax increase on the highest incomes of the self employed...can't figure the 'justification' of such??? i suppose i need to read up on it...

---------------------------------------------------------

IF memory serves, President obama promised not to raise INCOME taxes on those families below $250k a year in taxable income.

He made no promise on not raising other taxes. Almost immediately he signed a bill to raise cigarette taxes to pay for the health care costs of 'children' in need.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HE-rGGKksQ"]President Obama s Pledge Never to Raise Taxes on Anyone Making Less Than 250 000 a Year - YouTube[/ame]

the tax issue is a dead letter, even the blokes over at the new republic are admitting it now.

there is a huge difference between a tax and a penalty even if the relative actions appears to be same same, that why obama fought like hell to prevent the word tax from being attached to the 'penalty' and why the dems never used the term either, they would never have gotten the votes.

seriously? you think people are that dumb? what's the difference....nada, nothing, niente imo....the penalty tax is the same amount and for the same reason....for not fulfilling the mandate requirements.

If people were upset with the mandate and penalty before, they still are upset with it....

and if people were not upset with it, they still aren't imho!

 

[daveman]

The law states the mandate is a penalty - Congress. For the purposes of Constitutionality, the Court said the penalty is a tax.

It's a penalty that's a tax.

see?

You right wingers have a difficult enough time getting headlines straight: FOX News: "Supreme Court Finds Health Care Individual Mandate Unconstitutional." the rest of us don't really expect you to comprehend the facts yet.

It's a penalty that's a tax.

you are apparently suffering a semantics/comprehension fail.

it is a Tax, NOT a "Penalty Tax" [sic].

Well, excuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuse me! I try to not be too condescending here, but speaking at a level people here can comprehend makes exacting language difficult if not impossible to put out there.

I stand corrected and I'l try harder to speak to the great unwashed wingnut nation

 

[Care4all]

Romney called his mandate in 2009 or romneycare a tax or tax assessment as penalty for those who did not follow the rules of the mandate...not certain what he called it in 2006....

In a 2009 interview with CNN, Romney explained how the Massachusetts health care mandate worked. If the state's residents decided to forgo health insurance when they could afford it, Romney said they would face the loss of a tax exemption. In other words, they would be assessed a tax.
"There are a number of ways to encourage people to get insurance and what we did, we said 'you're going to lose a tax exemption if you don't have insurance,'" Romney told CNN in the interview.
The former Massachusetts governor said the mandate was necessary to achieve universal coverage in the state. In order to qualify for the tax exemption, Romney added "...you gotta have health insurance because we want everybody in the system. No more free riders." During the interview Romney held up his health care law as a model that "could inform Washington on ways to improve health care for all Americans."

Romney’s health care mandate included tax penalty – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

 

[Quantum Windbag]

you people are demented. you actually think the best Constitutional law minds in the country haven't went over this with a fine tooth comb?

you're all demented and playing at being Constitutional scholars as a way of rallying the troops.



watching this because it's pathetically hilarious. better than a car chase in LA

Are these the same great minds that insisted that Obamacare was constitutional under both the commerce clause and the necessary and proper clause of the constitution?

No, they are the very same ones that said it was unConstitutional

see how easily you get spanked? now go away

I got spanked?

The people that argued that the mandate is not constitutional because the commerce clause could not be used to force people to buy something were proved right. The same people that argued that the necessary and proper clause could not be used to justify the mandate were proven right. Somehow, in your mind, that proves I am wrong.

 

[Care4all]

for what PC? the penalty for those who can afford insurance but refused to buy it? yep, it's now called a tax penalty....so what?

all those other tax hikes you listed WERE ALWAYS called taxes or tax hikes, nothing to hide there? so i have no idea why you seem to be implying they have something to do with cj roberts decision? his decision relating to calling the mandate penalty a tax penalty has nada to do with the tax provisions you mentioned?

--------------------------------------------------------

out of all of those tax hikes, the 2 that seem ridiculous to me is the excise tax on medical equipment, and the medicare tax increase on the highest incomes of the self employed...can't figure the 'justification' of such??? i suppose i need to read up on it...

---------------------------------------------------------

IF memory serves, President obama promised not to raise INCOME taxes on those families below $250k a year in taxable income.

He made no promise on not raising other taxes. Almost immediately he signed a bill to raise cigarette taxes to pay for the health care costs of 'children' in need.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HE-rGGKksQ"]President Obama s Pledge Never to Raise Taxes on Anyone Making Less Than 250 000 a Year - YouTube[/ame]

the tax issue is a dead letter, even the blokes over at the new republic are admitting it now.

there is a huge difference between a tax and a penalty even if the relative actions appears to be same same, that why obama fought like hell to prevent the word tax from being attached to the 'penalty' and why the dems never used the term either, they would never have gotten the votes.

would never have gotten the votes from whom? the senators and congressmen that voted yes? you think if the penalty for disregarding mandate rules, was called a tax penalty it would have made a difference with them? i dunno 'bout that....

 

[PoliticalChic]

President Obama s Pledge Never to Raise Taxes on Anyone Making Less Than 250 000 a Year - YouTube

the tax issue is a dead letter, even the blokes over at the new republic are admitting it now.

there is a huge difference between a tax and a penalty even if the relative actions appears to be same same, that why obama fought like hell to prevent the word tax from being attached to the 'penalty' and why the dems never used the term either, they would never have gotten the votes.

would never have gotten the votes from whom? the senators and congressmen that voted yes? you think if the penalty for disregarding mandate rules, was called a tax penalty it would have made a difference with them? i dunno 'bout that....

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

 

[Care4all]

the tax issue is a dead letter, even the blokes over at the new republic are admitting it now.

there is a huge difference between a tax and a penalty even if the relative actions appears to be same same, that why obama fought like hell to prevent the word tax from being attached to the 'penalty' and why the dems never used the term either, they would never have gotten the votes.

would never have gotten the votes from whom? the senators and congressmen that voted yes? you think if the penalty for disregarding mandate rules, was called a tax penalty it would have made a difference with them? i dunno 'bout that....

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

And if Obama wins, what will that tell you PC?

 

[Katzndogz]

It is a tax that will fall wholly upon tax payers. Those who don't pay taxes now, won't pay the health care tax either. They will have tax payers pay that tax for them and get "insurance" for which the tax payers will pay the premium.

 

[NYcarbineer]

the tax issue is a dead letter, even the blokes over at the new republic are admitting it now.

there is a huge difference between a tax and a penalty even if the relative actions appears to be same same, that why obama fought like hell to prevent the word tax from being attached to the 'penalty' and why the dems never used the term either, they would never have gotten the votes.

would never have gotten the votes from whom? the senators and congressmen that voted yes? you think if the penalty for disregarding mandate rules, was called a tax penalty it would have made a difference with them? i dunno 'bout that....

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

Scalia, Alito, Kennedy, and Thomas got it wrong too.

They insist it wasn't a tax. They apparently don't understand the Constitution, which makes it unsurprising that they are so beloved by conservatives.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Those for whom this is an issue weren’t going to vote for the president, anyway.

 

[PoliticalChic]

would never have gotten the votes from whom? the senators and congressmen that voted yes? you think if the penalty for disregarding mandate rules, was called a tax penalty it would have made a difference with them? i dunno 'bout that....

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

And if Obama wins, what will that tell you PC?

Well, then I'll have to admit that the people of the United States don't deserve to be on the pedestal on which I've always placed them....

 

[PoliticalChic]

would never have gotten the votes from whom? the senators and congressmen that voted yes? you think if the penalty for disregarding mandate rules, was called a tax penalty it would have made a difference with them? i dunno 'bout that....

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

Scalia, Alito, Kennedy, and Thomas got it wrong too.

They insist it wasn't a tax. They apparently don't understand the Constitution, which makes it unsurprising that they are so beloved by conservatives.

This is an opportunity for me to explain my understanding of the United States government.

In theory, when the Congress passes a bill into law, it is verifying that, in their view, the law will pass constitutional muster.
I understand that this is outside of party-line voting, but I said 'in theory.'

When the President signs same, he is certifying same....constitutionality.

Therefore, in order for the Supreme Court to find same bill unconstitutional, there should be some specific aspect of the Constitution infracted.


In general, the Court is not there to toss out bills, but to find them acceptable. This applies to the comity of the branches, as well.

The people are the actual determiners of their wishes...and the people will speak in November.
I believe that the above was on Justice Roberts' mind as well, the people caused the problem in putting this ill-equipped individual in office, and in giving one party both Houses.

Hopefully, it won't happen again.

I understand that you haven't the ability to learn from this...but the people do.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

Scalia, Alito, Kennedy, and Thomas got it wrong too.

They insist it wasn't a tax. They apparently don't understand the Constitution, which makes it unsurprising that they are so beloved by conservatives.

This is an opportunity for me to explain my understanding of the United States government.

In theory, when the Congress passes a bill into law, it is verifying that, in their view, the law will pass constitutional muster.
I understand that this is outside of party-line voting, but I said 'in theory.'

When the President signs same, he is certifying same....constitutionality.

Therefore, in order for the Supreme Court to find same bill unconstitutional, there should be some specific aspect of the Constitution infracted.


In general, the Court is not there to toss out bills, but to find them acceptable. This applies to the comity of the branches, as well.

The people are the actual determiners of their wishes...and the people will speak in November.
I believe that the above was on Justice Roberts' mind as well, the people caused the problem in putting this ill-equipped individual in office, and in giving one party both Houses.

Hopefully, it won't happen again.

I understand that you haven't the ability to learn from this...but the people do.

Nothing you said had anything to do with what I said.

The question was, why did the conservative wing of the Supreme Court get it wrong?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Hasn't the advertising industry taught you anything about marketing?

Why do you suppose pols use 'focus groups'?


The Left, the Democrats (is that redundant?) avoided the word 'tax' like the "L" word....

....wanna know why? Watch CAREfully in in November.

And if Obama wins, what will that tell you PC?

Well, then I'll have to admit that the people of the United States don't deserve to be on the pedestal on which I've always placed them....

The worst thing about ignorant people like yourself is that very ignorance makes them incapable of seeing how ignorant they are.