Just what IS conservativism?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Bfgrn, Oct 29, 2010.

  1. Bfgrn
    Offline

    Bfgrn Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2009
    Messages:
    16,829
    Thanks Received:
    2,480
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +3,060
    What is conservatism? In my opinion, it is respect for the past and the wisdom of our ancestors. Their lives were built on their ancestors and so it goes, from one generation to the next. You ultimately respect their lives and toil not by paying lip service to it or using empty rhetoric like 'family values'. You do it by embracing those values. You do it by making their hard earned lessons your easy learned lessons. You do it by respecting and fighting for the policies and programs they crafted that increased the benefits and lessened the losses to our communities and our society.

    How did our ancestors craft these policies and programs, were they based on some ideology? I believe they were based on common decency, respect for your neighbors, common sense, experience, trial and error and a strong sense of community.

    I was raised in the 1950's. My dad was the sole provider, and my mom was a housewife and mother. We didn't call it 'family values', we called it family. When I came home from school, no matter what kind of day I had, it became brighter as soon as I walked in the door to a 'hi honey' from my mom. It not only brightened my day, it built self worth and a positive self image. All my friends and school mates had a similar story...a father that worked and a mother that stayed home to raise and nurture their children. None of us kids ever knew or even cared what anyone else's father did for a living. None of us had to go without; food, clothing, pets, bikes, baseball gloves, doctor care (our doctor used to come to the house), a quality public education with all the extras; sports, arts, school run ice rink, summer swimming and sports programs etc. But none of us were pampered or spoiled either.

    THAT is exactly what I want for my kids and for my grand-kids.

    So...In a very real way I AM truly a conservative.

    So, what is conservatism? I don't hear people that call themselves conservatives talk that way or think that way. I don't hear talk of building, I hear talk of tearing down. I don't hear talk of a helping hand, I hear talk of letting them fail. I don't hear talk of the public good, I hear talk about me and mine. I don't hear compassion for fellow citizens, I hear disdain. I never hear them talk about human capital, just mammon. These so called conservatives are ideologues that want to dismantle any shred of community and replace it with SELF interest.

    That is not 'conservatism', that is called narcissism.

    "You shall rise in the presence of grey hairs, give honor to the aged, and fear God, I am the Lord"
    Leviticus 19:32
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  2. Revere
    Offline

    Revere BANNED

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2010
    Messages:
    7,427
    Thanks Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Watching you in my profile page
    Ratings:
    +415
    Your dad's interest was his self, or, in your case, his family. Same difference.
     
  3. Bfgrn
    Offline

    Bfgrn Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2009
    Messages:
    16,829
    Thanks Received:
    2,480
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +3,060
    I forgot to add: I don't hear logic, I hear 'spin'
     
  4. Revere
    Offline

    Revere BANNED

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2010
    Messages:
    7,427
    Thanks Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Watching you in my profile page
    Ratings:
    +415
    In the 1950s, what percent of your dad's income went to all taxes?
     
  5. Ozmar
    Offline

    Ozmar This tree will shoot you.

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,741
    Thanks Received:
    282
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Ratings:
    +282
    I don't know. What is conservativism? I've heard of "conservatism," but not the word you made up!
     
  6. WillowTree
    Offline

    WillowTree Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2008
    Messages:
    68,195
    Thanks Received:
    10,175
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Ratings:
    +14,773





    well, see there? the key to this conundrum is that back in the 50's there were families. Today what you have is a bunch of un wed people running around having babies, no dad's to raise them, feed them, clothe them, god knows where dad is at, just a single mom trying to make a living, she usually has more than one baby and she's usually on the dole. so you see your world has changed dramatically. and here's another thing. at the rate we're going the moochers are going to outnumber the producers, then you'll really have something to whine about.
     
  7. Bfgrn
    Offline

    Bfgrn Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2009
    Messages:
    16,829
    Thanks Received:
    2,480
    Trophy Points:
    245
    Ratings:
    +3,060
    How did we get there willow? We've had over 30 years of 'conservative' policies and governance.

    The Republicans and the right in America today believe the only way to solve our problems is through punishment. And if that doesn't work, the punishment is just not severe enough. I suggest you research the 1994 Crimes Bill and how Republicans and the right demonized the most constructive part of that bill that addressed the societal problems you point out.

    In the early to mid 90's Congress crafted a crimes bill. I will not not go into the many unintended consequences of the bill, but the original funding framework called for equal thirds of the money to go to 1) police enforcement 2) prisons 3) crime prevention

    The crime prevention part of the bill would go toward education, job training, community engagement by law enforcement, child-centered activities (money for arts and crafts, dance programs, recreational activities, nutrition training, and so forth), assorted inner city youth activity programs, urban parks and recreation, schools (money is to be used "to improve the academic and social development of youths by instituting a collaborative structure that trains and coordinates efforts of social workers, teachers, and principles."), youth development for such activities as "providing youth with life skills" , drug treatment programs in prisons. and facilities like community centers.

    Statistics showed that the majority of youth crimes are committed after school lets out and before dinner time. It is not difficult to see what is missing during that time period, adult supervision. So the idea was to provide a safe and supervised facility where these kids could go.

    It was during this period that Newt Gingrich and the 'Contract with America' Republicans took over Congress.

    The 'Contract with America' Republicans attacked and demonized this part of the bill. They even labeled it and added a racial slur, They called the prevention part of the bill paying for 'midnight basketball'

    The real irony of that debate; Police Chiefs from around the country ascended on Washington to lobby Congress FOR the prevention provisions, because they knew that the best way to help law enforcement was not more police or more punishment, it was through education, training and community activism.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2010
  8. Revere
    Offline

    Revere BANNED

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2010
    Messages:
    7,427
    Thanks Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Watching you in my profile page
    Ratings:
    +415
    Conservatism has been on the outside looking in since the Great Society.
     
  9. rightwinger
    Offline

    rightwinger Paid Messageboard Poster Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2009
    Messages:
    120,522
    Thanks Received:
    19,879
    Trophy Points:
    2,190
    Location:
    NJ & MD
    Ratings:
    +45,530
    The family structure of the 50s was not as Leave it to Beaver and Ozzie and Harriet as everyone remembers. I remember families where the husband was abusive and the wife was trapped in a marriage because she had no other options. Once womens lib took hold and opportunities for employment for women became available, many of these idyllic marriages ended.
    Once women entered the workforce, employers adjusted the salary structure to make it so families could not exist without two salaries. That is the true conservatism
     
  10. Revere
    Offline

    Revere BANNED

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2010
    Messages:
    7,427
    Thanks Received:
    415
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Watching you in my profile page
    Ratings:
    +415
    What percent of their income did families pay in taxes (all of them) in the 1950s?
     

Share This Page