Judge rules for Kountze cheerleaders in Bible banner suit

[Quantum Windbag]

Its a public school. Religion has no place in a public school.

The Supreme Court of the United States disagrees with you.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

"The kids" are wearing their uniforms and representing their school (on all the taxpayers' money) as they hold religious signs for the football team at a game (on all the taxpayers' money) to run through. East Texans would go bezerk even if the Muslim teams were in North Dakota or Maine.

Most of you supporting the KHS cheerleaders here would go through the ceiling if they were Muslim and holding up religious signs with sayings from the Quran for the team to run through.

ps: as a Christian, my own opinion is that my Lord and Savior is not really concerned if KHS wins or loses.

if you can't avoid praying for the time you're in school, you should go to a parochial school and not to a public school which has rules about those things.

i'm pretty sure that if it were a school in michigan and the cheerleaders were muslim you'd be whining about creeping sha'ria

Stop telling me what I would be doing... If the cheerleaders wanted to do that in Michigan, I'd say nothing... are they inciting violence? If not, so what.... they can do what they want.

Why must you ALWAYS take the wrong side on the Constitution?

Plus, when did anyone say the school required prayer?

Stick to the topic... the signs are made by the kids. Leave them alone for Gods sake!!


Remember... it is freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

You've never been to East Texas, have you?

 

[Jimmy_Jam]

As long as the message is delivered by hot girls in cheerleader uniforms, bring it on. Oh, and hand me a beer while you're at it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

if you can't avoid praying for the time you're in school, you should go to a parochial school and not to a public school which has rules about those things.

i'm pretty sure that if it were a school in michigan and the cheerleaders were muslim you'd be whining about creeping sha'ria

Stop telling me what I would be doing... If the cheerleaders wanted to do that in Michigan, I'd say nothing... are they inciting violence? If not, so what.... they can do what they want.

Why must you ALWAYS take the wrong side on the Constitution?

Plus, when did anyone say the school required prayer?

Stick to the topic... the signs are made by the kids. Leave them alone for Gods sake!!


Remember... it is freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

bubbalah...one doesn't exist without the other.

if someone like me went to school where the cheerleading squad carried around jesus signs, it would have excluded someone like me or i'd have been forced to conform.

the whole POINT is that there is no government funded religion... and someone like me should be able to go to school without the SCHOOL sponsoring the G-d squad.

That is easily the dumbest thing that was ever posted on this board. Why don't you demonstrate your freedom from religion by showing me all the laws in this country that keep the Jehovah's Witnesses from knocking on people's doors?

 

[Jimmy_Jam]

Stop telling me what I would be doing... If the cheerleaders wanted to do that in Michigan, I'd say nothing... are they inciting violence? If not, so what.... they can do what they want.

Why must you ALWAYS take the wrong side on the Constitution?

Plus, when did anyone say the school required prayer?

Stick to the topic... the signs are made by the kids. Leave them alone for Gods sake!!


Remember... it is freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

bubbalah...one doesn't exist without the other.

if someone like me went to school where the cheerleading squad carried around jesus signs, it would have excluded someone like me or i'd have been forced to conform.

the whole POINT is that there is no government funded religion... and someone like me should be able to go to school without the SCHOOL sponsoring the G-d squad.

That is easily the dumbest thing that was ever posted on this board. Why don't you demonstrate your freedom from religion by showing me all the laws in this country that keep the Jehovah's Witnesses from knocking on people's doors?

Very true, Quantum. I don't need the government to keep Jehovah's Witnesses from knocking at my door. They know better by now.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Fact 1, the cheer leaders when wearing their uniforms are representing the tax-supported school.

Fact 2, SCOTUS has clearly stated when and when not such activities are permitted or not.

Fact 3, this will be the last year the KHS cheer leaders will be allowed to do this.

Real Fact 1. Cheerleaders buy their own uniforms. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/19/us-usa-texas-cheerleaders-idUSBRE89I01520121019 (Last paragraph)

Real Fact 2. SCOTUS has been anything but clear about when and how student sponsored religious speech is permissible.

Real Fact 3. A prediction is not a fact.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

"The kids" are wearing their uniforms and representing their school (on all the taxpayers' money) as they hold religious signs for the football team at a game (on all the taxpayers' money) to run through. East Texans would go bezerk even if the Muslim teams were in North Dakota or Maine.

Most of you supporting the KHS cheerleaders here would go through the ceiling if they were Muslim and holding up religious signs with sayings from the Quran for the team to run through.

ps: as a Christian, my own opinion is that my Lord and Savior is not really concerned if KHS wins or loses.

I really don't care that they choose to put religious messages on their signs, and I wouldn't care if Muslims did it either... The fact that some of you do care is what I find disturbing. Why can't you Libs let people live their own lives, instead of negatively involving yourselves in everything that others do who you disagree with?

And the same can be asked of conservatives regarding privacy rights concerning abortion and equal protection rights for same-sex couples.

The school district was correct to discontinue the practice, as it understands the case law of the issue. The judge has made no ruling as to the Constitutional merits of the case, he’s simply enjoined the school from enacting its policy

As already noted, this case is very similar to Santa Fe Independent School District v. Jane Doe (2000), where the Court held that prayer prior to football games was in violation of the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment:

The high court rejected the argument that the pre-football prayer was an example of "private speech" because the students, not school officials, decided the prayer matter.

But Stevens wrote that the students were able to deliver only religious messages deemed "appropriate" by the school district. That meant, he wrote, "that minority candidates will never prevail and that their views will be effectively silenced.

"Even if we regard every high school student's decision to attend a home football game as purely voluntary, we are nevertheless persuaded that the delivery of a pregame prayer has the improper effect of coercing those present to participate in an act of religious worship," he wrote.

CNN.com - Supreme Court bars student-led prayer at high school football games - June 19, 2000

Whether it’s prayers before a football game or prayer banners during a game, the fundamental Constitutional principle still applies, and the school district’s prohibition of the practice will be upheld as appropriate and not a violation of ‘free speech.’

Tell me something genius, how does a case about how a school district controlling the context of religious speech compare to a case of a school district banning it altogether?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

"The kids" are wearing their uniforms and representing their school (on all the taxpayers' money) as they hold religious signs for the football team at a game (on all the taxpayers' money) to run through. East Texans would go bezerk even if the Muslim teams were in North Dakota or Maine.

Most of you supporting the KHS cheerleaders here would go through the ceiling if they were Muslim and holding up religious signs with sayings from the Quran for the team to run through.

ps: as a Christian, my own opinion is that my Lord and Savior is not really concerned if KHS wins or loses.

That's one weak ass strawman.

False! Sweepingly false.

freedom OF religion is default, freedom FROM religion. It’s such a simple principle, I’m surprised you or anyone else is having such difficulty with it. Well, I’ll correct that statement and advise that I suspect you’re in agreement with Christian displays of religious invocations because those appeals to your partisan religious beliefs
.
What the issue here is, is the Constitution precludes the government from establishing any religion by law. Now say that part over to yourself very slowly:
Remember, freedom of religion is default freedom from religion, else there is a legal precedence to force you to adhere to the "majority religion" (i.e., Christians are free from believing in competitive religions.

That is an important point because we can see the results of that precept not in force.

Turkish book on Darwin sparks outrage - FT.com


Thank the gods I have freedom from religion.

Late edit - the link requires subscription. Here's the text:

A series of books for primary schoolchildren, describing Charles Darwin as a Jew with a big nose who kept the company of monkeys and other historical figures in anti-Semitic terms, has caused outrage in Turkey amid fears of rising religious intolerance.

A teachers’ union is taking legal action over the distribution of the books last week to about 1,000 schoolchildren in the Maltepe district of Istanbul. The local education authority, which approved the books and ultimately answers to the central government, has denied knowledge of their content.

But the incident has already made waves far beyond Maltepe. It follows previous attacks in Turkey on the theory of evolution; last year, an internet filter briefly restricted access to evolutionist websites.

It also comes in the wake of wide-ranging education reforms pushed through this year by the country’s Islamist-rooted government, which have increased the number of religious schools in Turkey and introduced optional lessons on the Prophet Mohammed in ordinary state schools.

Such changes are hailed by the government as increasing freedom of choice in a country that for decades excluded the religiously conservative majority. Opponents say the secular educational system is being threatened.

“The education system is becoming reactionary; imams are now teaching religion in schools,” said Mehmet Aydogan, an official in the union asking for the books to be impounded. “These books are discrediting worldwide accepted artists and scientists and forcing students to think unscientifically.”

Dayam, another idiot who thinks they understand the law.

 

[The Infidel]

if you can't avoid praying for the time you're in school, you should go to a parochial school and not to a public school which has rules about those things.

i'm pretty sure that if it were a school in michigan and the cheerleaders were muslim you'd be whining about creeping sha'ria

Stop telling me what I would be doing... If the cheerleaders wanted to do that in Michigan, I'd say nothing... are they inciting violence? If not, so what.... they can do what they want.

Why must you ALWAYS take the wrong side on the Constitution?

Plus, when did anyone say the school required prayer
Stick to the topic... the signs are made by the kids. Leave them alone for Gods sake!!


Remember... it is freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

bubbalah...one doesn't exist without the other.

if someone like me went to school where the cheerleading squad carried around jesus signs, it would have excluded someone like me or i'd have been forced to conform.

the whole POINT is that there is no government funded religion... and someone like me should be able to go to school without the SCHOOL sponsoring the G-d squad.

The gov't IS NOT FUNDING the cheerleaders... they supply their own supplies and uniforms.

This is the difference... this is not supported by the school. It is the girls freedom of expression.

If you feel left out, thats on you... stop being so whiney.

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

 

[Jimmy_Jam]

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

And I'm just sayin'. Bible verses delivered by hot girls in cheerleader uniforms. God Bless America!

 

[The Infidel]

"The kids" are wearing their uniforms and representing their school (on all the taxpayers' money) as they hold religious signs for the football team at a game (on all the taxpayers' money) to run through. East Texans would go bezerk even if the Muslim teams were in North Dakota or Maine.

Most of you supporting the KHS cheerleaders here would go through the ceiling if they were Muslim and holding up religious signs with sayings from the Quran for the team to run through.

ps: as a Christian, my own opinion is that my Lord and Savior is not really concerned if KHS wins or loses.

Stop telling me what I would be doing... If the cheerleaders wanted to do that in Michigan, I'd say nothing... are they inciting violence? If not, so what.... they can do what they want.

Why must you ALWAYS take the wrong side on the Constitution?

Plus, when did anyone say the school required prayer?

Stick to the topic... the signs are made by the kids. Leave them alone for Gods sake!!


Remember... it is freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

I really don't care that they choose to put religious messages on their signs, and I wouldn't care if Muslims did it either... The fact that some of you do care is what I find disturbing. Why can't you Libs let people live their own lives, instead of negatively involving yourselves in everything that others do who you disagree with?

True story.... the WISCONSIN atheist group is trying to find a local atheist to come forth saying they are offended.
They need this so it can take it to a higher court...

 

[jillian]

Stop telling me what I would be doing... If the cheerleaders wanted to do that in Michigan, I'd say nothing... are they inciting violence? If not, so what.... they can do what they want.

Why must you ALWAYS take the wrong side on the Constitution?

Plus, when did anyone say the school required prayer
Stick to the topic... the signs are made by the kids. Leave them alone for Gods sake!!


Remember... it is freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

bubbalah...one doesn't exist without the other.

if someone like me went to school where the cheerleading squad carried around jesus signs, it would have excluded someone like me or i'd have been forced to conform.

the whole POINT is that there is no government funded religion... and someone like me should be able to go to school without the SCHOOL sponsoring the G-d squad.

The gov't IS NOT FUNDING the cheerleaders... they supply their own supplies and uniforms.

This is the difference... this is not supported by the school. It is the girls freedom of expression.

If you feel left out, thats on you... stop being so whiney.

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

do you have the slightest understanding of the fact that what is good for one religion is good for every religion?

do you have the slightest concept that constitutional decisions set precedent for other decisions?

didn't think so.

you can't foster religion in school... no matter how much you think my son should be indoctrinated into your religion while in school.

great country america.

 

[The Infidel]

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

And I'm just sayin'. Bible verses delivered by hot girls in cheerleader uniforms. God Bless America!

 

[The Infidel]

bubbalah...one doesn't exist without the other.

if someone like me went to school where the cheerleading squad carried around jesus signs, it would have excluded someone like me or i'd have been forced to conform.

the whole POINT is that there is no government funded religion... and someone like me should be able to go to school without the SCHOOL sponsoring the G-d squad.

The gov't IS NOT FUNDING the cheerleaders... they supply their own supplies and uniforms.

This is the difference... this is not supported by the school. It is the girls freedom of expression.

If you feel left out, thats on you... stop being so whiney.

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

do you have the slightest understanding of the fact that what is good for one religion is good for every religion?

do you have the slightest concept that constitutional decisions set precedent for other decisions?

didn't think so.

you can't foster religion in school... no matter how much you think my son should be indoctrinated into your religion while in school.

great country america.

Boo frekking Hoo... lets see the Burkah cheerleaders.

They do not exist.... love the straw "girl" though.... pathetic as it is.

 

[Hollie]

That's one weak ass strawman.

False! Sweepingly false.

freedom OF religion is default, freedom FROM religion. It’s such a simple principle, I’m surprised you or anyone else is having such difficulty with it. Well, I’ll correct that statement and advise that I suspect you’re in agreement with Christian displays of religious invocations because those appeals to your partisan religious beliefs
.
What the issue here is, is the Constitution precludes the government from establishing any religion by law. Now say that part over to yourself very slowly:
Remember, freedom of religion is default freedom from religion, else there is a legal precedence to force you to adhere to the "majority religion" (i.e., Christians are free from believing in competitive religions.

That is an important point because we can see the results of that precept not in force.

Turkish book on Darwin sparks outrage - FT.com


Thank the gods I have freedom from religion.

Late edit - the link requires subscription. Here's the text:

A series of books for primary schoolchildren, describing Charles Darwin as a Jew with a big nose who kept the company of monkeys and other historical figures in anti-Semitic terms, has caused outrage in Turkey amid fears of rising religious intolerance.

A teachers’ union is taking legal action over the distribution of the books last week to about 1,000 schoolchildren in the Maltepe district of Istanbul. The local education authority, which approved the books and ultimately answers to the central government, has denied knowledge of their content.

But the incident has already made waves far beyond Maltepe. It follows previous attacks in Turkey on the theory of evolution; last year, an internet filter briefly restricted access to evolutionist websites.

It also comes in the wake of wide-ranging education reforms pushed through this year by the country’s Islamist-rooted government, which have increased the number of religious schools in Turkey and introduced optional lessons on the Prophet Mohammed in ordinary state schools.

Such changes are hailed by the government as increasing freedom of choice in a country that for decades excluded the religiously conservative majority. Opponents say the secular educational system is being threatened.

“The education system is becoming reactionary; imams are now teaching religion in schools,” said Mehmet Aydogan, an official in the union asking for the books to be impounded. “These books are discrediting worldwide accepted artists and scientists and forcing students to think unscientifically.”

Dayam, another idiot who thinks they understand the law.

I know enough to keep blowhards in their place. Your stuttering and mumbling tells me you know nothing of the law.

 

[The Infidel]

 

[Hollie]

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

And I'm just sayin'. Bible verses delivered by hot girls in cheerleader uniforms. God Bless America!

And they're probably 16 years old.

Young enough possibly to be your daughter?

 

[The Infidel]

I think some are getting this issue confused with this case...


Santa Fe Independent School District v. Doe (2000)
Students may not use a school's loudspeaker system to offer student-led, student-initiated prayer.
Before football games, members of the student body of a Texas high school elected one of their classmates to address the players and spectators. These addresses were conducted over the school's loudspeakers and usually involved a prayer. Attendance at these events was voluntary. Three students sued the school arguing that the prayers violated the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment. A majority of the Court rejected the school's argument that since the prayer was student initiated and student led, as opposed to officially sponsored by the school, it did not violate the First Amendment. The Court held that this action did constitute school-sponsored prayer because the loudspeakers that the students used for their invocations were owned by the school.


I agree with this too... Santa Fe ISD crossed the line.

 

[Jimmy_Jam]

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

And I'm just sayin'. Bible verses delivered by hot girls in cheerleader uniforms. God Bless America!

And they're probably 16 years old.

Young enough possibly to be your daughter?

An offering of levity in a thread begging for it.

 

[The Infidel]

BTW, lets cross the stupid straw man Muslim cheerleader bridge thingie when we get to it, and wonder if those Muslim cheerleaders be wearing burkas? Just askin...

And I'm just sayin'. Bible verses delivered by hot girls in cheerleader uniforms. God Bless America!

And they're probably 16 years old.

Young enough possibly to be your daughter?