Joe B rates the Democratic Field

[Wry Catcher]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

 

[OldLady]

So OP, I never did get an answer to this:

Pete Buttigeig - Sorry, being mayor of the fourth biggest city in Indiana just doesn't qualify you.

Again ----- what does?
< 35 years old: Check. Natural born citizen: Check.
End of list.

There's another list?


For that matter, similar point:

Beto O'Rourke- I kind of like this guy. He's young, he's dynamic. He fought Ted Cruz to a draw in Texas with the GOP throwing everything they had at him. A pity he doesn't have more experience.

"Experience" at what?

Again, if this is supposed to be a wish-list of probabilities instead of the objective analysis it's disguised as, what "qualifications" did Big Orange ever have? The man has literally never held a job in his life.

Do you think maybe we have learned something from that experience?

 

[Papageorgio]

Biden probably has the best shot to beat trump, but now with the creepy stuff coming out (already been out but left is now acknowledging), I don’t see how he survives trump telling him to go sniff some girls hair in a debate. He could say go grab a pussy, but Biden’s stuff is on camera, all over the place. Bernie is probably gonna get the plurality of the vote, but dem establishment is planning on fighting. That fight alone is gonna piss off bernie bros who could very well choose to sit out for the actual election.

I can't see Commie Bernie getting much more than the 25% he's getting now. The real question is, do the Dems rally around Biden, or do they find someone else. Historically, the Democrats do pick that "Fresh new thing" at the back of the room - Carter, Clinton, Obama. this is kind of why I think Beto is the one to keep an eye on.

I do think Biden is another victim of the PoundMeToo insanity. I have nothing but contempt for the #MeToo movement, it reminds me of LBJ's remark that the difference between liberals and cannibals is cannibals don't eat their friends. Hopefully, we'll be over this insanity by the time next year rolls around.

By "fresh new thing" you mean like VP Gore, Senator Kerry and Hillary Clinton, and Dukakis. Really?

 

[Pogo]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Funny that you note gender and ethnicity yet say nothing about geography, yet they're all based on the same balancing dynamic.

 

[Meister]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

You're missing my point willfully or not, wry.
Why even bring up that one is a Latino and one is a woman?
That's unnecessary and IS playing identity politics. For political correctness?
That's on you dude, don't blame me....just a character flaw that
you can't admit to. Look on page 34 of that psychological manual of yours.

 

[Pogo]

So OP, I never did get an answer to this:

Pete Buttigeig - Sorry, being mayor of the fourth biggest city in Indiana just doesn't qualify you.

Again ----- what does?
< 35 years old: Check. Natural born citizen: Check.
End of list.

There's another list?


For that matter, similar point:

Beto O'Rourke- I kind of like this guy. He's young, he's dynamic. He fought Ted Cruz to a draw in Texas with the GOP throwing everything they had at him. A pity he doesn't have more experience.

"Experience" at what?

Again, if this is supposed to be a wish-list of probabilities instead of the objective analysis it's disguised as, what "qualifications" did Big Orange ever have? The man has literally never held a job in his life.

Do you think maybe we have learned something from that experience?

I think we've learned a lot about ourselves collectively for sure. But I'm at a loss to understand what some wags think "qualified" actually means given the Constitutional criteria. For example those who go "waaah, this Rep isn't 'qualified' to represent a district a thousand miles away because she was a bartender" --- as if one has to be an attorney working his/her way up through a party structure just because that's the way we've always done it, even if the COTUS makes no such demand. Seems to me being a bartender, plumber, construction worker, teacher, etc etc makes one more qualified with life experiences, not less -- far less insulated from the real world.

The most "experienced" POTUS we ever had --- before the White House he'd been an attorney, Senator, Congressman, Foreign minister to two countries, Secretary of State, offered and declined Supreme Court --- usually makes number one on the list of worst Presidents. Matter of fact today happens to be his birthday: James Buchanan. So I really have to question what somebody means when they're looking for "experience".

 

[Meister]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Funny that you note gender and ethnicity yet say nothing about geography, yet they're all based on the same balancing dynamic.

I would never have noted the gender and ethnicity of a qualified person. It's just not necessary.
Seems the left needs to point this out....identity politics is ingrained with the left, IMO.
As far as location....who cares?

 

[Pogo]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

You're missing my point willfully or not, wry.
Why even bring up that one is a Latino and one is a woman?
That's unnecessary and IS playing identity politics. For political correctness?
That's on you dude, don't blame me....just a character flaw that
you can't admit to. Look on page 34 of your psychological manual of yours.

Why pair one from Texas and one from Minnesota?
Why pair one who won't dine with a woman who is not his wife and one who says "you can do anything"?

Same thing. Balance. Broad appeal. It's not exactly a new idea. McCain/Palin: male/female. Kerry/Edwards: North/South. Bush/Quayle: Dumb/dumber. And so on.

As far as location....who cares?

Voters do. Rightly or wrongly. Are you new here?

Why do you think JFK picked a guy from Texas given the resistance in the South?
Nixon/Agnew: West/East. Reagan/Bush: same thing. Carter/Mondale: South/North. Johnson/Humphrey: same thing. And before Nixon/Agnew it was Nixon/Lodge. Again: West/East.

People vote for homeboyz, whether they 'should' or not. And if they can't have one from their own state, Minnesota will score more votes in Wisconsin that Texas will.

This all boils down to tribalism. "That person is a Texan" or "a midwesterner" or "a woman" or "a Latino" or whatever the measure, means "that person is more like me, therefore I can relate". It's marketing 101.

Where you go awry is in picking a co-runner only because they're an Easterner or a woman or a Latino.

 

[Meister]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

You're missing my point willfully or not, wry.
Why even bring up that one is a Latino and one is a woman?
That's unnecessary and IS playing identity politics. For political correctness?
That's on you dude, don't blame me....just a character flaw that
you can't admit to. Look on page 34 of your psychological manual of yours.

Why pair one from Texas and one from Minnesota?
Why pair one who won't dine with a woman who is not his wife and one who says "you can do anything"?

Same thing. Balance. Broad appeal. It's not exactly a new idea. McCain/Palin: male/female. Kerry/Edwards: North/South. Bush/Quayle: Dumb/dumber. And so on.

Why high lite it? If they are qualified and intelligent, doesn't that suffice on it's own merit?
Or, do you lefties (yes, you are a lefty) have to bring up the fact, one is a Latino and one is a woman?
It doesn't make any difference...unless to show identity politics.

 

[Pogo]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

You're missing my point willfully or not, wry.
Why even bring up that one is a Latino and one is a woman?
That's unnecessary and IS playing identity politics. For political correctness?
That's on you dude, don't blame me....just a character flaw that
you can't admit to. Look on page 34 of your psychological manual of yours.

Why pair one from Texas and one from Minnesota?
Why pair one who won't dine with a woman who is not his wife and one who says "you can do anything"?

Same thing. Balance. Broad appeal. It's not exactly a new idea. McCain/Palin: male/female. Kerry/Edwards: North/South. Bush/Quayle: Dumb/dumber. And so on.

Why high lite it? If they are qualified and intelligent, doesn't that suffice on it's own merit?
Or, do you lefties (yes, you are a lefty) have to bring up the fact, one is a Latino and one is a woman?
It doesn't make any difference...unless to show identity politics.

It's not my thread, I have no dog in the hunt. Actually this is somebody else's post we're analyzing the basis of.

"Qualified and intelligent" should be all there is to it. In the real world however you should know by now that a Presidential election is not so much an election of a chief executive as it is the marketing of a product. I'm just explaining how that marketing WORKS.

 

[Richard-H]

Okay, here's where I see them. Want to make a Caveat that any of these guys would be a vast improvement over Trump.

Joe Biden- My biggest concern about Biden is his age. He'll be 76 if sworn in 2021. I think we can already see the folly of electing Septuagenarians. Reagan was clearly senile at the end of his Presidency, and Trump shows all the signs of dementia. All that said, he's probably the most clearly qualified person the Democrats have in terms of resume.

Bernie Sanders - This guy is a waste. Yes, he has some okay ideas, like Medicare for All, but frankly, he's way too far off to the left. He'll scare the straights. Also- 78 if elected? Really?

Beto O'Rourke- I kind of like this guy. He's young, he's dynamic. He fought Ted Cruz to a draw in Texas with the GOP throwing everything they had at him. A pity he doesn't have more experience.

Kirstin Gillibrand- Can't really forgive her for throwing Al Franken under the bus the way she did.

Liz Warren - Lots of good ideas, but she pretty much self-immolated on that Native American thing.

Pete Buttigeig - Sorry, being mayor of the fourth biggest city in Indiana just doesn't qualify you.

If the most the Repugs have to throw against Warren is the 'native American' thing...say 'Hi' to President Warren.

So far I think Warren has shown the leadership qualities that we need in a President. She holds no punches. Say says what is right, not what's politically advantageous. Beside, Conservatives are scared shitless of her.

Beto would make a great VP candidate. He should be devoted to winning Texas. Because if Texas goes Dem in 2020, it's good night nurse for the Repugs!

Buttigeig should be dedicated to motivating the LGBTQ community.

I don't know much about Gillibrand or the Harris.

I agree that Biden & Sanders are too old.

 

[Richard-H]

I predict that 2020 will be Warren vs. Pence.

 

[Tumblin Tumbleweed]

Okay, here's where I see them. Want to make a Caveat that any of these guys would be a vast improvement over Trump.

Joe Biden- My biggest concern about Biden is his age. He'll be 76 if sworn in 2021. I think we can already see the folly of electing Septuagenarians. Reagan was clearly senile at the end of his Presidency, and Trump shows all the signs of dementia. All that said, he's probably the most clearly qualified person the Democrats have in terms of resume.

Bernie Sanders - This guy is a waste. Yes, he has some okay ideas, like Medicare for All, but frankly, he's way too far off to the left. He'll scare the straights. Also- 78 if elected? Really?

Beto O'Rourke- I kind of like this guy. He's young, he's dynamic. He fought Ted Cruz to a draw in Texas with the GOP throwing everything they had at him. A pity he doesn't have more experience.

Kirstin Gillibrand- Can't really forgive her for throwing Al Franken under the bus the way she did.

Liz Warren - Lots of good ideas, but she pretty much self-immolated on that Native American thing.

Pete Buttigeig - Sorry, being mayor of the fourth biggest city in Indiana just doesn't qualify you.

I predict Beto will be the golden boy for the Dems.

 

[Cellblock2429]

Okay, here's where I see them. Want to make a Caveat that any of these guys would be a vast improvement over Trump.

Joe Biden- My biggest concern about Biden is his age. He'll be 76 if sworn in 2021. I think we can already see the folly of electing Septuagenarians. Reagan was clearly senile at the end of his Presidency, and Trump shows all the signs of dementia. All that said, he's probably the most clearly qualified person the Democrats have in terms of resume.

Bernie Sanders - This guy is a waste. Yes, he has some okay ideas, like Medicare for All, but frankly, he's way too far off to the left. He'll scare the straights. Also- 78 if elected? Really?

Beto O'Rourke- I kind of like this guy. He's young, he's dynamic. He fought Ted Cruz to a draw in Texas with the GOP throwing everything they had at him. A pity he doesn't have more experience.

Kirstin Gillibrand- Can't really forgive her for throwing Al Franken under the bus the way she did.

Liz Warren - Lots of good ideas, but she pretty much self-immolated on that Native American thing.

Pete Buttigeig - Sorry, being mayor of the fourth biggest city in Indiana just doesn't qualify you.

/——/ All good choices but you forgot the guaranteed 100% winning ticket

 

[Wry Catcher]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Funny that you note gender and ethnicity yet say nothing about geography, yet they're all based on the same balancing dynamic.

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

You're missing my point willfully or not, wry.
Why even bring up that one is a Latino and one is a woman?
That's unnecessary and IS playing identity politics. For political correctness?
That's on you dude, don't blame me....just a character flaw that
you can't admit to. Look on page 34 of your psychological manual of yours.

Why pair one from Texas and one from Minnesota?
Why pair one who won't dine with a woman who is not his wife and one who says "you can do anything"?

Same thing. Balance. Broad appeal. It's not exactly a new idea. McCain/Palin: male/female. Kerry/Edwards: North/South. Bush/Quayle: Dumb/dumber. And so on.

As far as location....who cares?

Voters do. Rightly or wrongly. Are you new here?

Why do you think JFK picked a guy from Texas given the resistance in the South?
Nixon/Agnew: West/East. Reagan/Bush: same thing. Carter/Mondale: South/North. Johnson/Humphrey: same thing. And before Nixon/Agnew it was Nixon/Lodge. Again: West/East.

People vote for homeboyz, whether they 'should' or not. And if they can't have one from their own state, Minnesota will score more votes in Wisconsin that Texas will.

This all boils down to tribalism. "That person is a Texan" or "a midwesterner" or "a woman" or "a Latino" or whatever the measure, means "that person is more like me, therefore I can relate". It's marketing 101.

Where you go awry is in picking a co-runner only because they're an Easterner or a woman or a Latino.

They are that, and much more: One served in the Senate, the other in the H. of Rep., the former is a mother, a lawyer and pro-choice on abortion; supports LBGTQ rights; Obamacare; and was critical of the war of choice in Iraq. The later has been a mayor and a Secretary of housing and urban development.

Both are level headed, realistic, smart, well educated, and old enough to be respected by the aged, and young enough to be supported by first time voters, and those fed up with the do nothing Republicans.; a Party which does not support civil rights, and has proved to be incapable of governing a nation as diverse as ours.

All of this with an eye on women voters, Latino voters, urban and suburban voters, as well as the needs of rural communities, farm communities and by all accounts will seek to heal the wounds which continues to divide us by tweets, speeches and illegal and/or immoral policies.

 

[Wry Catcher]

At this point I think Sen. Amy Klobuchar for President, and Julian Castro for Vice President.

The Politics suggest a woman from the heartland and a Latino from Texas have the experience and the temperament to bring our country together.

Joe and Bernie's time has passed; Beto and Pete too young, too inexperienced; Liz to animated and too far left; Kirsten lacks the chops and was way to quick to toss Franken under the bus. Harris is from California which is a sure vote against Trump, but would make a fine A.G. and Cory seems to lack broad appeal. The rest seem to be in it just for name recognition.

'A woman and a Latino'? The left really is about identity politics.

Apparently it is you who lack the ability to look beyond your biases, and see only what you want to see. For those with an open mind, both Amy and Julian are experienced Pols and very successful ones.

They are not radical in word or deed, define the issues clearly and concisely without the drama we see daily from Trump and your side of the aisle, and bring a wide range of experience:

Amy Klobuchar - Wikipedia

Julian Castro - Wikipedia

You're missing my point willfully or not, wry.
Why even bring up that one is a Latino and one is a woman?
That's unnecessary and IS playing identity politics. For political correctness?
That's on you dude, don't blame me....just a character flaw that
you can't admit to. Look on page 34 of that psychological manual of yours.

Why bring it up?

Why not? It is a critical issue for the 2020 Election. We saw how well the D. Party did in 2018: more women, more members of color, more younger members and more fresh ideas in the Congress.

Why did trump and the Republican Members of the Senate fight so hard to support the two white guys to be the newest members of the Supreme Court?

Was that not "identity politics"? Why did trump pick the white, Christian, Conservative for his VP? Was that not identity politics? How about the AG pick, the one now under siege by many members of Congress and US Citizens. Was that not "identity Politics"?

Grow up. Stop with the idiot-grams, put your bigotry away and offer something of substance, thoughtful and possibly though provoking.

 

[JoeB131]

I don't have a political party so I have no "guys" to "run" anything --- none of us do --- but AGAIN whether they win or lose has ZERO to do with your false characterizations. Whether an entity wins or loses depends on how many votes they get, or how many runs or points they score. Not whether you get to mischaracterize them. This is not rocket surgery.

You run the Commie, you will lose. At worst, Trump gets a real majority and wins. At best, Howard Schultz suddenly looks a lot more appealing, but can't overcome the Electoral College, it gets thrown into Congress, and Trump STILL wins.

And AGAIN you're deliberately misstating "Democratic Socialism" as " Socialism" and then false-equating your own strawman to "Commie", which has no meaning. Apparently because you can't deal with the starting point, so you bury your head in the sand and pretend it's something else, and that's (AGAIN) -- dishonest. Your false associations don't magically come to life like Frankenstein just because you post it on a message board.

Democratic Socialism is an oxymoron. Bernie is kind of like the Socialists who ran the USSR, he has three mansions, but thinks that Joe needs to pay more taxes to subsidize the dumb-ass who put himself $60,000 in debt for a degree in Art History or some such shit. No thank you.

The scariest thing after how many on the right are willing to embrace fascism is how many on the left are willing to embrace communism. It's like not a one of you ever read a history book.

Again ----- what does?
< 35 years old: Check. Natural born citizen: Check.
End of list.

There's another list?

Not taking it up the ass from another man... No Check.

Sorry, we aren't ready for a gay president. Especially one whose name sound like "Butt-plug".

"Experience" at what?

Again, if this is supposed to be a wish-list of probabilities instead of the objective analysis it's disguised as, what "qualifications" did Big Orange ever have? The man has literally never held a job in his life.

Thing is, Trump spent 40 years self promoting... The image he had of this great businesman might not be accurate, but that's what existed in most people's minds.

Personally, I like Beto more than most of the clown car. But if you think that people will look at his thin resume and say, "Yup, that guys qualifies", it's a bit much.

 

[JoeB131]

By "fresh new thing" you mean like VP Gore, Senator Kerry and Hillary Clinton, and Dukakis. Really?

No, I said exactly what I meant. I'm sorry English Comprehension isn't your strong suit.

 

[JoeB131]

If the most the Repugs have to throw against Warren is the 'native American' thing...say 'Hi' to President Warren.

So far I think Warren has shown the leadership qualities that we need in a President. She holds no punches. Say says what is right, not what's politically advantageous. Beside, Conservatives are scared shitless of her.

Naw, Pocahontas lost me when she decided I need to pay more taxes for the dipshit who put himself $50,000 in debt to get a Bachelors in Multi-Cultural Studies, and either can't find a job or can't manage his money well enough to pay back what he borrowed.

I predict that 2020 will be Warren vs. Pence.

Pence would probably win, then. He's Trump's economy without Trump's crazy or corruption.

I do think that the Dem's ability to win will count on three factors.

1) Does the economy continue as it has. If it does, they really have very little argument for change. If you look at the four cases in the last century where an incumbent was shown the door, they all involved recessions/depressions.

2) How sensible a candidate do they run? If they appeal to the base like they did when they ran Kerry or Dukakis, but fail to reach beyond the base, they'll have a harder time. Nominate a far left loon like Bernie or Warren, and you create a case for Howard Schultz.

3) Trump's mental deterioration. I think it's obvious to all non-Trump cultists, Trump is losing it. I don't see him getting better over the next year. Of course, if he has to step aside for health reasons and Pence replaces him, he shoots down the logic of running a Septuagenarian who is even older.
.

 

[Olde Europe]

Okay, here's where I see them. Want to make a Caveat that any of these guys would be a vast improvement over Trump.

Joe Biden- My biggest concern about Biden is his age. He'll be 76 if sworn in 2021. I think we can already see the folly of electing Septuagenarians. Reagan was clearly senile at the end of his Presidency, and Trump shows all the signs of dementia. All that said, he's probably the most clearly qualified person the Democrats have in terms of resume.

Bernie Sanders - This guy is a waste. Yes, he has some okay ideas, like Medicare for All, but frankly, he's way too far off to the left. He'll scare the straights. Also- 78 if elected? Really?

Beto O'Rourke- I kind of like this guy. He's young, he's dynamic. He fought Ted Cruz to a draw in Texas with the GOP throwing everything they had at him. A pity he doesn't have more experience.

Kirstin Gillibrand- Can't really forgive her for throwing Al Franken under the bus the way she did.

Liz Warren - Lots of good ideas, but she pretty much self-immolated on that Native American thing.

Pete Buttigeig - Sorry, being mayor of the fourth biggest city in Indiana just doesn't qualify you.

Biden is a good guy. In case he so chooses, he'll be in with all his heart, and, if history is a guide, implode shortly thereafter. The latest missteps trying to addres his groping missteps seem to confirm that.

Sanders is showing increasing signs of fundamentalism. He's right, everyone else is wrong, and retreating into his corner, sulking, whenever he doesn't get his way.

Beto seems the biggest narcissist in the race not named "Trump". He appears not fit for the national spotlight.

I have next to nothing on Gillibrand, except for a very determined and very necessary focus on women's issues, which aligns effortlessly with kicking Franken to the curb. Can't fault her for that. She'd be a valuable addition to any Dem administration.

In Warren's case, you seem to be confirming that Trump's racist smear job is the kind of winning tactics in the 21st century. She may not have handled all that stuff artfully. All the while, she's the policy workshop in the field, and should be indispensable to the progressive crowd going forward.

Buttigieg (!) may well be the biggest political talent in the field. If you liked Bill's triangulation and Washington Consensus policies, Pete is your guy, neo-liberal to the core. Whether he can overcome the wild-eyed, utterly ludicrous fantasies about "buttplugs" remains to be seen.