Jewish and Liberal...?

[goldcatt]

Wow.. I can only apologize for posting it then. I am sorry.

I'm interested in a better understanding which obviously I have to have. What would you recommend I read..? I feel like shit..

I can assure you that when you see terms like "psychopathologies" and "assimilated self-hatred" in terms of Judaism, you've found yourself an anti-Semitic site.

I'm not Jewish, so I'll leave it to the experts who walk it every day to answer your question if they're so inclined. But I'll guarantee the answer will have nothing to do with Jews being crazy and being ashamed of themselves and their identity.

the author is a jewish right wing ideologue who hates leftists.

See, that's what I get for not reading more than the first sentence. I just saw the terminology and assumed it was more anti-Semitic garbage.

Still not gonna waste my time on it.

 

[L.K.Eder]

I can assure you that when you see terms like "psychopathologies" and "assimilated self-hatred" in terms of Judaism, you've found yourself an anti-Semitic site.

I'm not Jewish, so I'll leave it to the experts who walk it every day to answer your question if they're so inclined. But I'll guarantee the answer will have nothing to do with Jews being crazy and being ashamed of themselves and their identity.

the author is a jewish right wing ideologue who hates leftists.

See, that's what I get for not reading more than the first sentence. I just saw the terminology and assumed it was more anti-Semitic garbage.

Still not gonna waste my time on it.

it is garbage, just the target is different.

if he weren't jewish he'd make a good nazi, for sure.

 

[goldcatt]

the author is a jewish right wing ideologue who hates leftists.

See, that's what I get for not reading more than the first sentence. I just saw the terminology and assumed it was more anti-Semitic garbage.

Still not gonna waste my time on it.

it is garbage, just the target is different.

if he weren't jewish he'd make a good nazi, for sure.

Hate is hate. None of it is worth my time. That's all I really need to know.

 

[Lumpy 1]

I can assure you that when you see terms like "psychopathologies" and "assimilated self-hatred" in terms of Judaism, you've found yourself an anti-Semitic site.

I'm not Jewish, so I'll leave it to the experts who walk it every day to answer your question if they're so inclined. But I'll guarantee the answer will have nothing to do with Jews being crazy and being ashamed of themselves and their identity.

the author is a jewish right wing ideologue who hates leftists.

See, that's what I get for not reading more than the first sentence. I just saw the terminology and assumed it was more anti-Semitic garbage.

Still not gonna waste my time on it.

What.. you didn't even read the whole article and you passed a judgment..

 

[Lumpy 1]

Wow.. I can only apologize for posting it then. I am sorry.

I'm interested in a better understanding which obviously I have to have. What would you recommend I read..? I feel like shit..

I can assure you that when you see terms like "psychopathologies" and "assimilated self-hatred" in terms of Judaism, you've found yourself an anti-Semitic site.

I'm not Jewish, so I'll leave it to the experts who walk it every day to answer your question if they're so inclined. But I'll guarantee the answer will have nothing to do with Jews being crazy and being ashamed of themselves and their identity.

the author is a jewish right wing ideologue who hates leftists.

I'm tapped out on apologizes but I appreciate you opinion...

 

[Intense]

Nah, I don't think it works.

Rather than base relations directly with the diety to get into the reward section or avoid the penalty box, which is the Christian goal, the Jewish attitude is more community based than individual based. Since they don't do an afterlife, how they fit in the community and what they do for the community is how they judge adherence to the faith.

Also they are more into community regulation more intensely than protestent christianity. In christianity, your morals are pretty much between you and Gd. In judaism, it is more between you and those around you.

In Jewish circles, the more religious are more lefty, the less religious are more economically conservative. (in American terms)

And it is not a bit of 'self loathing.' It is part and parcel of religious expression for a long time. It is how the community survives, but taking care of each other.

You're wrong on almost every point

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

2) Some Protestant sects do not believe in personal god, and therefore do not believe in having a relationship with this personal god

3) Judaism is all about individual behavior and belief

4) Jews do believe in an afterlife

5) Jews beleive they are judged by God, and by God alone (not the community) and that the judgement is not based on how they fit in the community (which is just absurd), but how close to God they are

6) Both Jews and Christians get their moral code from the same source: The Bible. The only difference is that Jews are more likely to actually respect and observe that moral code. Christians rarely do

7) In Jewish circles, the Orthodox Jews tend to be hard-right in all matters both political and economic

How did you get to be so stupid?

Total mis-characterization.

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

You make this shit up in your basement or what? Pretty retarded, even for you.

 

[sangha]

Nah, I don't think it works.

Rather than base relations directly with the diety to get into the reward section or avoid the penalty box, which is the Christian goal, the Jewish attitude is more community based than individual based. Since they don't do an afterlife, how they fit in the community and what they do for the community is how they judge adherence to the faith.

Also they are more into community regulation more intensely than protestent christianity. In christianity, your morals are pretty much between you and Gd. In judaism, it is more between you and those around you.

In Jewish circles, the more religious are more lefty, the less religious are more economically conservative. (in American terms)

And it is not a bit of 'self loathing.' It is part and parcel of religious expression for a long time. It is how the community survives, but taking care of each other.

You're wrong on almost every point

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

2) Some Protestant sects do not believe in personal god, and therefore do not believe in having a relationship with this personal god

3) Judaism is all about individual behavior and belief

4) Jews do believe in an afterlife

5) Jews beleive they are judged by God, and by God alone (not the community) and that the judgement is not based on how they fit in the community (which is just absurd), but how close to God they are

6) Both Jews and Christians get their moral code from the same source: The Bible. The only difference is that Jews are more likely to actually respect and observe that moral code. Christians rarely do

7) In Jewish circles, the Orthodox Jews tend to be hard-right in all matters both political and economic

How did you get to be so stupid?

Total mis-characterization.

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

You make this shit up in your basement or what? Pretty retarded, even for you.

Another mindless one liner wingnut who can't actually show what was wrong with what I said.

Everything I said is true

 

[Intense]

You're wrong on almost every point

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

2) Some Protestant sects do not believe in personal god, and therefore do not believe in having a relationship with this personal god

3) Judaism is all about individual behavior and belief

4) Jews do believe in an afterlife

5) Jews beleive they are judged by God, and by God alone (not the community) and that the judgement is not based on how they fit in the community (which is just absurd), but how close to God they are

6) Both Jews and Christians get their moral code from the same source: The Bible. The only difference is that Jews are more likely to actually respect and observe that moral code. Christians rarely do

7) In Jewish circles, the Orthodox Jews tend to be hard-right in all matters both political and economic

How did you get to be so stupid?

Total mis-characterization.

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

You make this shit up in your basement or what? Pretty retarded, even for you.

Another mindless one liner wingnut who can't actually show what was wrong with what I said.

Everything I said is true

What alternate Universe are you from?

I am Catholic. I have a Personal Relationship with God. There is no one who doesn't, only denial and neglect.

Get educated.

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Home

 

[sangha]

Total mis-characterization.

1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.

You make this shit up in your basement or what? Pretty retarded, even for you.

Another mindless one liner wingnut who can't actually show what was wrong with what I said.

Everything I said is true

What alternate Universe are you from?

I am Catholic. I have a Personal Relationship with God. There is no one who doesn't, only denial and neglect.

Get educated.

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Home

From your own link

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sacramentals

In instituting the sacraments Christ did not determine the matter and form down to the slightest detail, leaving this task to the Church, which should determine what rites were suitable in the administration of the sacraments... Moreover the sacramentals help to distinguish the members of the Church from heretics, who have done away with the sacramentals or use them arbitrarily with little intelligence...Sacramental rites are dependent on the Church which established them, and which therefore has the right to maintain, develop, modify, or abrogate them.

Proof that laypersons can not determine which rites are suitable in the administration of sacraments without the assistance of The Church. Without the sacraments, laypersons cannot be baptized, etc

"If anyone say that grace is not conferred by the sacraments ex opere operato but that faith in God's promises is alone sufficient for obtaining grace, let him be anathema"

According to Catholic doctrine, no one can achieve grace without the sacraments, and it's the Church that controls the sacraments

 

[Intense]

Another mindless one liner wingnut who can't actually show what was wrong with what I said.

Everything I said is true

What alternate Universe are you from?

I am Catholic. I have a Personal Relationship with God. There is no one who doesn't, only denial and neglect.

Get educated.

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Home

From your own link

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sacramentals

In instituting the sacraments Christ did not determine the matter and form down to the slightest detail, leaving this task to the Church, which should determine what rites were suitable in the administration of the sacraments... Moreover the sacramentals help to distinguish the members of the Church from heretics, who have done away with the sacramentals or use them arbitrarily with little intelligence...Sacramental rites are dependent on the Church which established them, and which therefore has the right to maintain, develop, modify, or abrogate them.

Proof that laypersons can not determine which rites are suitable in the administration of sacraments without the assistance of The Church. Without the sacraments, laypersons cannot be baptized, etc

"If anyone say that grace is not conferred by the sacraments ex opere operato but that faith in God's promises is alone sufficient for obtaining grace, let him be anathema"

According to Catholic doctrine, no one can achieve grace without the sacraments, and it's the Church that controls the sacraments

That is a Catholic Belief, that you choose to either subscribe to or not as an Individual. Jew's teach Their way is the True Path, Muslim's teach their way is the True Path, Same Same with Every brand.
Scripture teaches too, contrary to what some may claim. Catholicism does not put a collar and chain on God, limiting and giving Him permission as to what He can and cannot decree. Neither does any other brand. The notion is absurd. Your claim was that Catholics can't have a personal relationship with God. That claim is as false now as it was then. You don't like the Dogma of the Catholic Church, don't subscribe to it, get past it. I'm not a Good Catholic, I'm more a Renegade Catholic, or a Post Denominational Christian. My best friend is a Priest, a Theologian, a Professor, My Wife is pretty Religious in relation to the Church, neither of them are targeting me for an inquisition, a boot in the ass, maybe. It still doesn't justify your claim. God can't bless you because the Church won't let him? Really?

We are All Human Beings created and Purposed by God. Try to understand the perspective, Heart to Heart, Soul to Soul, through Conscience, with your maker. No external Interference, no tangents, no expectations.

Scripture is loaded with references.

 

[sangha]

What alternate Universe are you from?

I am Catholic. I have a Personal Relationship with God. There is no one who doesn't, only denial and neglect.

Get educated.

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Home

From your own link

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sacramentals



Proof that laypersons can not determine which rites are suitable in the administration of sacraments without the assistance of The Church. Without the sacraments, laypersons cannot be baptized, etc

"If anyone say that grace is not conferred by the sacraments ex opere operato but that faith in God's promises is alone sufficient for obtaining grace, let him be anathema"

According to Catholic doctrine, no one can achieve grace without the sacraments, and it's the Church that controls the sacraments

That is a Catholic Belief, that you choose to either subscribe to or not as an Individual. Jew's teach Their way is the True Path, Muslim's teach their way is the True Path, Same Same with Every brand.
Scripture teaches too, contrary to what some may claim. Catholicism does not put a collar and chain on God, limiting and giving Him permission as to what He can and cannot decree. Neither does any other brand. The notion is absurd. Your claim was that Catholics can't have a personal relationship with God. That claim is as false now as it was then. You don't like the Dogma of the Catholic Church, don't subscribe to it, get past it. I'm not a Good Catholic, I'm more a Renegade Catholic, or a Post Denominational Christian. My best friend is a Priest, a Theologian, a Professor, My Wife is pretty Religious in relation to the Church, neither of them are targeting me for an inquisition, a boot in the ass, maybe. It still doesn't justify your claim. God can't bless you because the Church won't let him? Really?

We are All Human Beings created and Purposed by God. Try to understand the perspective, Heart to Heart, Soul to Soul, through Conscience, with your maker. No external Interference, no tangents, no expectations.

Scripture is loaded with references.

You are wrong on every point.

1) The Catholic Church considers its' rules concerning sacraments and salvation "inarguable"
2) The RC Church excommunicates people for heresy if they agree with you and they find out
3) Most religions do not consider their teaching The ONLY True Path. I know of only two that claim there way is the ONLY True Path, xtians and muslims
4) Your best friend and your wife are NOT The Pope.
5) The idea you claim as Catholicism is Protestantism
6) You are too cowardly to admit that I was about Catholicism, and you were wrong

 

[judyd]

What alternate Universe are you from?

I am Catholic. I have a Personal Relationship with God. There is no one who doesn't, only denial and neglect.

Get educated.

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Home

From your own link

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sacramentals



Proof that laypersons can not determine which rites are suitable in the administration of sacraments without the assistance of The Church. Without the sacraments, laypersons cannot be baptized, etc

"If anyone say that grace is not conferred by the sacraments ex opere operato but that faith in God's promises is alone sufficient for obtaining grace, let him be anathema"

According to Catholic doctrine, no one can achieve grace without the sacraments, and it's the Church that controls the sacraments

That is a Catholic Belief, that you choose to either subscribe to or not as an Individual. Jew's teach Their way is the True Path, Muslim's teach their way is the True Path, Same Same with Every brand.
Scripture teaches too, contrary to what some may claim. Catholicism does not put a collar and chain on God, limiting and giving Him permission as to what He can and cannot decree. Neither does any other brand. The notion is absurd. Your claim was that Catholics can't have a personal relationship with God. That claim is as false now as it was then. You don't like the Dogma of the Catholic Church, don't subscribe to it, get past it. I'm not a Good Catholic, I'm more a Renegade Catholic, or a Post Denominational Christian. My best friend is a Priest, a Theologian, a Professor, My Wife is pretty Religious in relation to the Church, neither of them are targeting me for an inquisition, a boot in the ass, maybe. It still doesn't justify your claim. God can't bless you because the Church won't let him? Really?

We are All Human Beings created and Purposed by God. Try to understand the perspective, Heart to Heart, Soul to Soul, through Conscience, with your maker. No external Interference, no tangents, no expectations.

Scripture is loaded with references.

I was brought up in catholic schools and know that anytime you point out direct discrepancies between the Bible and catholics, e.g., there is no other mediator between God and man besides Jesus; call no man your father, don't pray like the heathens with vain repetitions--among countless others, the catholic response has always been that only their scholars are qualified to correctly interpret the Bible. The Bible was written for the understanding of all without any "interpreters". Interesting enough, in all the years that I attended catholic schools, they never used a Bible for instruction. They used their catechism. They also tacked on a lot of church rules for salvation which have nothing to do with salvation through faith.

 

[sangha]

From your own link

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sacramentals



Proof that laypersons can not determine which rites are suitable in the administration of sacraments without the assistance of The Church. Without the sacraments, laypersons cannot be baptized, etc



According to Catholic doctrine, no one can achieve grace without the sacraments, and it's the Church that controls the sacraments

That is a Catholic Belief, that you choose to either subscribe to or not as an Individual. Jew's teach Their way is the True Path, Muslim's teach their way is the True Path, Same Same with Every brand.
Scripture teaches too, contrary to what some may claim. Catholicism does not put a collar and chain on God, limiting and giving Him permission as to what He can and cannot decree. Neither does any other brand. The notion is absurd. Your claim was that Catholics can't have a personal relationship with God. That claim is as false now as it was then. You don't like the Dogma of the Catholic Church, don't subscribe to it, get past it. I'm not a Good Catholic, I'm more a Renegade Catholic, or a Post Denominational Christian. My best friend is a Priest, a Theologian, a Professor, My Wife is pretty Religious in relation to the Church, neither of them are targeting me for an inquisition, a boot in the ass, maybe. It still doesn't justify your claim. God can't bless you because the Church won't let him? Really?

We are All Human Beings created and Purposed by God. Try to understand the perspective, Heart to Heart, Soul to Soul, through Conscience, with your maker. No external Interference, no tangents, no expectations.

Scripture is loaded with references.

I was brought up in catholic schools and know that anytime you point out direct discrepancies between the Bible and catholics, e.g., there is no other mediator between God and man besides Jesus; call no man your father, don't pray like the heathens with vain repetitions--among countless others, the catholic response has always been that only their scholars are qualified to correctly interpret the Bible. The Bible was written for the understanding of all without any "interpreters". Interesting enough, in all the years that I attended catholic schools, they never used a Bible for instruction. They used their catechism. They also tacked on a lot of church rules for salvation which have nothing to do with salvation through faith.

Catholics have a well-earned reputation for not reading the Bible. A recent poll found that atheists knew more about the Bible than Christians or Jews

 

[Intense]

Sangha Post#16 Page #2 :1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.



Sangha Post #51 Page #4: You are wrong on every point.

1) The Catholic Church considers its' rules concerning sacraments and salvation "inarguable"
2) The RC Church excommunicates people for heresy if they agree with you and they find out
3) Most religions do not consider their teaching The ONLY True Path. I know of only two that claim there way is the ONLY True Path, xtians and muslims
4) Your best friend and your wife are NOT The Pope.
5) The idea you claim as Catholicism is Protestantism
6) You are too cowardly to admit that I was about Catholicism, and you were wrong



1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.


Addressing Your first unsubstantiated claim, Your first Lie, that caught my attention, that I originally addressed. Prayer is exercising a relationship with God. The Church is not an intercessory between a being and their prayer. It is true that within the Government of the Catholic Church, there are Duties reserved to the Clergy, that the Church Itself does recognize, or condone, if not by it's prescription. Baptizing, Communion, Marriage, Death Rites, Sacraments, are in a sense, by consent, The Church is a Monarchy, it has it's established Rules, with good reason. That, is not what you claimed.

None of that has anything to do with your or my personal relationship with God. Should the Church choose to Excommunicate You or I, it still has no effect on Ones Personal relationship with God, only your relationship with the Church. That's it. The Church has the Power to cut you off from the Church, not God. The Church has no Authority outside the Church. The Church does not have a Copy Right on God.


1) The Catholic Church considers its' rules concerning sacraments and salvation "inarguable"

With good reason. People through the generations going off on tangents. The Church is slow to move, slow to redirect, without being surefooted. I applaud it for it's caution, it's skepticism, when challenging claims. Unlike Islam, The Catholic Church has one head, one final word , authority, on earth. It has alway's been that way, within the Church. The Church does not want You or I officially changing It's position without It's knowledge or consent. Neither does ir


2) The RC Church excommunicates people for heresy if they agree with you and they find out


Shit. I'm scared now! OMG! What shall I do?
It's a bit more relaxed on that than you give it credit for.

3) Most religions do not consider their teaching The ONLY True Path. I know of only two that claim there way is the ONLY True Path, xtians and muslims


You need to get out more.



4) Your best friend and your wife are NOT The Pope.

Not the last time I checked anyway. You got one right. Good for you.



5) The idea you claim as Catholicism is Protestantism

Actually It's my own Idea. It's neither Catholic or Protestant, It's simply Christian. I actually Refer to Myself as Renegade Catholic or Post Denominational Christian. Before that I was an "Anarchist For God". That is another whole different Thread though.
My Religion isn't that much constructed in stone, but I do have one Firm Nonnegotiable Rule, no Followers. No One is allowed to join. My Church (My Body) has room for only one. You are free to copy or glean anything you like, stay or go, what ever you choose is between you and your maker. See I too, have issues with Teachings of the Catholic Church, that from my perspective violate scripture, those are not things for you though, or this Thread.


6) You are too cowardly to admit that I was about Catholicism, and you were wrong

Your Attitude really sucks, it is really beneath you, and it is not flattering, to you. I realize that I need to be specific with you, or it is back to square one. Why do you think me a coward, or is this just about You throwing stones? Catholicism is a very deep Religion, with allot of diversity in it, I''m sure understanding 1% of it is beyond you, so I truly don't take you serious on the matter. You are far from being an Authority on Church or Scripture. In fact I find you dripping with antagonism, that's hardly virtuous. I'm wrong about things all the time. News Flash, that's hardly a Headline. Part of my Philosophy is perpetual surrender, from my perspective, when Our lip's move, when we stroke the key board, we generally corrupt honest witness, and fall from Grace. I will spend the rest of my life, trying to develop in the quality of relationship with my Maker, how about you? How important is Harmony and Communion, between You and Your Maker to You? Now, What is True Religion?

That's as far as we go for now. It is not a pissing contest. We can speak of value to each other or take it somewhere else. Life is too short.

 

[MaggieMae]

Just because one suffers from a persecution complex, doesn't mean that one isn't being persecuted. We are all human beings first and foremost, sometimes people need to be reminded or taught that. Running from Who and what you are is no solution, it's a symptom. Liberalism has become a disease, loss of Identity, loss of Free Will, Loss of Property, loss of Value and Ideal. Individual Perspective is the best we each have to offer the whole, it is a Treasure lost, when we are conditioned and controlled, sometimes, certain types of compromises are just not worth it. Blaming God, for our own mistakes, rather than adjusting course, compounds the difficulties ahead.

What gives you the right to make such carte blanche assessments of an entire group of people? Liberals are just as apt to have high moral values as conservatives, attend church just as often, feed their families, pay their bills, and save for the future of their children. It's people like you who keep this nation divided by spewing your insulting interpretations. You can have your political ideologies which vary from liberals, but to make such assinine all-inclusive assessments simpy proves you're an ignorant ass.

 

[sangha]

Sangha Post#16 Page #2 :1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.



Sangha Post #51 Page #4: You are wrong on every point.

1) The Catholic Church considers its' rules concerning sacraments and salvation "inarguable"
2) The RC Church excommunicates people for heresy if they agree with you and they find out
3) Most religions do not consider their teaching The ONLY True Path. I know of only two that claim there way is the ONLY True Path, xtians and muslims
4) Your best friend and your wife are NOT The Pope.
5) The idea you claim as Catholicism is Protestantism
6) You are too cowardly to admit that I was about Catholicism, and you were wrong



1) Catholics, who make up a large share of the worlds christians, believe that they require the clergy in order to have a relation with God and that individuals are incapable of having direct relation with Him.


Addressing Your first unsubstantiated claim, Your first Lie, that caught my attention, that I originally addressed. Prayer is exercising a relationship with God. The Church is not an intercessory between a being and their prayer. It is true that within the Government of the Catholic Church, there are Duties reserved to the Clergy, that the Church Itself does recognize, or condone, if not by it's prescription. Baptizing, Communion, Marriage, Death Rites, Sacraments, are in a sense, by consent, The Church is a Monarchy, it has it's established Rules, with good reason. That, is not what you claimed.

None of that has anything to do with your or my personal relationship with God. Should the Church choose to Excommunicate You or I, it still has no effect on Ones Personal relationship with God, only your relationship with the Church. That's it. The Church has the Power to cut you off from the Church, not God. The Church has no Authority outside the Church. The Church does not have a Copy Right on God.

According to Catholic theology, your prayers are meaningless mutterings if you have not obtained grace through the sacraments. Without the Church, and its' sacraments, you have absolutely no relationship to God.

However, you are right to say that has no bearing on your personal relationship with god. But I never said otherwise. You are free to hold whatever beliefs you want. You are even free to believe that non-Catholic beliefs are Catholic beliefs. But that doesn't change the fact that your beliefs and your claims are NOT Catholicism.

1) The Catholic Church considers its' rules concerning sacraments and salvation "inarguable"

With good reason. People through the generations going off on tangents. The Church is slow to move, slow to redirect, without being surefooted. I applaud it for it's caution, it's skepticism, when challenging claims. Unlike Islam, The Catholic Church has one head, one final word , authority, on earth. It has alway's been that way, within the Church. The Church does not want You or I officially changing It's position without It's knowledge or consent. Neither does ir

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth. Earlier you claimed catholics were free to choose their beliefs according to their conscience. Now you're claiming that they don't, and that's a good thing. Earlier you claimed that Muslims were free to choose their beliefs. Now, the muslims have "one final word, authority, on earth" (even though they don't)

2) The RC Church excommunicates people for heresy if they agree with you and they find out


Shit. I'm scared now! OMG! What shall I do?
It's a bit more relaxed on that than you give it credit for.

Your pithy one liner does not change the fact that what I said is true, and what you said is false. It doesn't even distract attention away from your inability to acknowledge that error.

3) Most religions do not consider their teaching The ONLY True Path. I know of only two that claim there way is the ONLY True Path, xtians and muslims


You need to get out more.

Name them. Here's a few that don't

Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, and Paganism

4) Your best friend and your wife are NOT The Pope.

Not the last time I checked anyway. You got one right. Good for you.

I got them all right

5) The idea you claim as Catholicism is Protestantism

Actually It's my own Idea. It's neither Catholic or Protestant, It's simply Christian. I actually Refer to Myself as Renegade Catholic or Post Denominational Christian. Before that I was an "Anarchist For God". That is another whole different Thread though.
My Religion isn't that much constructed in stone, but I do have one Firm Nonnegotiable Rule, no Followers. No One is allowed to join. My Church (My Body) has room for only one. You are free to copy or glean anything you like, stay or go, what ever you choose is between you and your maker. See I too, have issues with Teachings of the Catholic Church, that from my perspective violate scripture, those are not things for you though, or this Thread.

"Actually, it's my own idea" is one of the things that seperates the Protestants from the Catholics. Like most christians, you know little about your own faith.

6) You are too cowardly to admit that I was about Catholicism, and you were wrong

Your Attitude really sucks, it is really beneath you, and it is not flattering, to you. I realize that I need to be specific with you, or it is back to square one. Why do you think me a coward, or is this just about You throwing stones? Catholicism is a very deep Religion, with allot of diversity in it, I''m sure understanding 1% of it is beyond you, so I truly don't take you serious on the matter. You are far from being an Authority on Church or Scripture. In fact I find you dripping with antagonism, that's hardly virtuous. I'm wrong about things all the time. News Flash, that's hardly a Headline. Part of my Philosophy is perpetual surrender, from my perspective, when Our lip's move, when we stroke the key board, we generally corrupt honest witness, and fall from Grace. I will spend the rest of my life, trying to develop in the quality of relationship with my Maker, how about you? How important is Harmony and Communion, between You and Your Maker to You? Now, What is True Religion?

That's as far as we go for now. It is not a pissing contest. We can speak of value to each other or take it somewhere else. Life is too short.

If you think my attitude sucks, you really should go back and re-read the thread. Pay attention to the first post you made responding to me.

All Catholic theology states that individual laypersons require Church assistance in order to obtain Grace and Salvation. Various Catholics sects do disagree about many issues (is Jesus a man, a God, or both?) but they ALL AGREE on this issue. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE.

You can try and hide behind the "They don't agree on everything, so they must disagree about this" dodge, but the fact remains that Catholicism holds that laypeople need the Church in order to have a relationship to God.

 

[MaggieMae]

Before the Civil Rights Amendment, the Jews received the same treatment as the blacks in the US and worked hard to get the Amendment passed. I remember when they were banned from country clubs, public swimming pools, certain neighborhoods, etc. So it is very easy to understand why they felt more inclined to side with the liberals who were sympathetic to their plight.

Prejudice works both ways. It is a Human condition. We all have to work on it at one level or another. Liberalism is very intolerant to outside ideas. It places conformity much higher than it should and is very harsh on criticism. Not all criticism is harmful.

You're also another topnotch hypocrite. Or haven't you noticed that since Republicans won the House, it's once again an our-way-or-the-highway game, where the Republicans will be "very intolerant to outside ideas."

You need serious educating, bub, along with all the other conservative zealots here who ironically never, ever bother to look at themselves in the mirror and say "Gee, we do that too..."

 

[MaggieMae]

Prejudice works both ways. It is a Human condition. We all have to work on it at one level or another. Liberalism is very intolerant to outside ideas. It places conformity much higher than it should and is very harsh on criticism. Not all criticism is harmful.

Criticism? They suffered through more than that. They came over here to escape the hitler regime, and then they were treated like crap. Those that went to South America did not seem to be exposed to the prejudice that they received here. It was something that I didn't understand at all as a child--well actually I don't understand it now.

The US is all about helping others gain their freedom, but "don't come here". After the fall of Vietnam I was living in Pennsylvania and saw the Vietnamese refugees being treated the same way. I imagine they probably vote with the liberals too.

We should either live up to our reputation as a country of refuge or just stop the sham.

Life is Pain Judyd. We all Suffer. There is no excuse for treating others poorly. We are all Human Beings first. Learn to be impartial, it grows on you. You choose to either feed Justice or Injustice. It is not about Politics, but Individual Responsibility and decency.

You're such a self-righteous fool. I read shit by you almost every day that is completely counter to that holier-than-thou bullshit. I can't stand reading this stuff anymore.

 

[sangha]

Criticism? They suffered through more than that. They came over here to escape the hitler regime, and then they were treated like crap. Those that went to South America did not seem to be exposed to the prejudice that they received here. It was something that I didn't understand at all as a child--well actually I don't understand it now.

The US is all about helping others gain their freedom, but "don't come here". After the fall of Vietnam I was living in Pennsylvania and saw the Vietnamese refugees being treated the same way. I imagine they probably vote with the liberals too.

We should either live up to our reputation as a country of refuge or just stop the sham.

Life is Pain Judyd. We all Suffer. There is no excuse for treating others poorly. We are all Human Beings first. Learn to be impartial, it grows on you. You choose to either feed Justice or Injustice. It is not about Politics, but Individual Responsibility and decency.

You're such a self-righteous fool. I read shit by you almost every day that is completely counter to that holier-than-thou bullshit. I can't stand reading this stuff anymore.

He came onto this thread accusing me of making shit up (and never back it up) and then pretends that he's all about The Love

If wingnuts didn't lie, they'd have nothing to say

 

[Intense]

Just because one suffers from a persecution complex, doesn't mean that one isn't being persecuted. We are all human beings first and foremost, sometimes people need to be reminded or taught that. Running from Who and what you are is no solution, it's a symptom. Liberalism has become a disease, loss of Identity, loss of Free Will, Loss of Property, loss of Value and Ideal. Individual Perspective is the best we each have to offer the whole, it is a Treasure lost, when we are conditioned and controlled, sometimes, certain types of compromises are just not worth it. Blaming God, for our own mistakes, rather than adjusting course, compounds the difficulties ahead.

What gives you the right to make such carte blanche assessments of an entire group of people? Liberals are just as apt to have high moral values as conservatives, attend church just as often, feed their families, pay their bills, and save for the future of their children. It's people like you who keep this nation divided by spewing your insulting interpretations. You can have your political ideologies which vary from liberals, but to make such assinine all-inclusive assessments simpy proves you're an ignorant ass.

Like how you paint Conservatives Maggie? Progressivism has hijacked Liberalism Maggie. It has made you Totalitarian. It's either your way, or Fine's, Fee's , and Penalties. You have learned to use Mandate against the will of the people. It is your selfish interest you serve, blindly at that. I can make any assessment I want, this is not a Dictatorship yet. It is your attack on Federalism that has divided us Maggie. There is nothing polite about a systematic hostile take over of free will. Excuse us for complaining about the weight of your foot on the back of our necks, Dear.