I've Never Seen a Stupider Person

[BluePhantom]

I have a simple question on energy and perhaps this not the place for it, first let me preface this by saying I'm one of those " all in" energy types" which means lets produce it all. That said, my question is on energy production , it would seem to me that if the goal is to produce more energy and do it in a manner that is environmentally friendly and promote jobs, the best place to start would be with putting solar panels on the roofs of everyones house as means to let , the "people" become their own energy producers. Maybe perhaps doing something like this might put some poor lobby group out of work on K Street? heaven forbid!! We sure do spend an awful lot of time regulating things that could be made cheaper to keep Washington employed.

Do you have any idea how expensive that would be? The problem with solar energy is that it's not cheap. It's ridiculously expensive. If it was cheaper than energy generated through fossil fuels everyone would be using it.

Think of hybrid cars. Yeah you save money on gas, but the cars itself, replacing the batteries, etc is so expensive that at the end of the day it costs more than a standard gas guzzler. Same concept with solar. And of course, how would that benefit people like me in Salem, Oregon where from October through March we get two...maybe three days of sun a month?

 

[edthecynic]

in the wh. or a downright meaner one either.



Obama’s Regulatory Burden




In the next few days, President Obama’s Environmental Protection Agency is expected to issue another final regulation directed at electricity utilities. This rule, known as the Utility MACT, will impose an estimated $11 billion each year in new costs on our economy. It will threaten electricity-generating capacity in many parts of the country. And it’s just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to this administration’s runaway rulemaking.
Obama

God damn that Obama for putting clean air over money!!! Doesn't he know that toxic air pollutants are good for you? Just ask any CON$ervative Republican! The American people would rather have cancer than deny Big Energy more profit, again just ask any CON$ervative self-anointed to speak for the American people.

The proposed toxics rule would reduce emissions of heavy metals, including mercury (Hg),
arsenic, chromium, and nickel, and acid gases, including hydrogen chloride (HCl) and
hydrogen fluoride (HF). These toxic air pollutants, also known as hazardous air pollutants or
air toxics, are known or suspected of causing cancer and other serious health effects.

 

[Navy1960]

I have a simple question on energy and perhaps this not the place for it, first let me preface this by saying I'm one of those " all in" energy types" which means lets produce it all. That said, my question is on energy production , it would seem to me that if the goal is to produce more energy and do it in a manner that is environmentally friendly and promote jobs, the best place to start would be with putting solar panels on the roofs of everyones house as means to let , the "people" become their own energy producers. Maybe perhaps doing something like this might put some poor lobby group out of work on K Street? heaven forbid!! We sure do spend an awful lot of time regulating things that could be made cheaper to keep Washington employed.

Do you have any idea how expensive that would be? The problem with solar energy is that it's not cheap. It's ridiculously expensive. If it was cheaper than energy generated through fossil fuels everyone would be using it.

Think of hybrid cars. Yeah you save money on gas, but the cars itself, replacing the batteries, etc is so expensive that at the end of the day it costs more than a standard gas guzzler. Same concept with solar. And of course, how would that benefit people like me in Salem, Oregon where from October through March we get two...maybe three days of sun a month?

The Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory yesterday released the latest figures in a multiyear study of price trends for solar photovoltaic equipment and installation. Overall, the study, commissioned by the Department of Energy and the Clean Energy States Alliances, paints a picture of a maturing industry and falling product prices.

From 2009 to 2010, the price of a residential solar electric system fell 17 percent to $6.20 per watt, or a $1.30 decline. Measured from 1998, the installed costs fell 43 percent. The data is garnered from more than 100,000 installations of commercial and grid-tied residential solar panels, which are usually under 10 kilowatts in capacity. The costs don't include a 30 percent federal tax rebate and state incentives.
Rooftop solar prices fall 'precipitously' | Green Tech - CNET News


Gov. John Kitzhaber visits Klamath Falls today to cut the ribbon on Oregon's largest-ever solar energy project, a constellation of more than 20,000 photovoltaic panels spread over 27 acres on three Oregon University System campuses.

Compared to California, where solar developers are looking to build arrays covering 1,000 acres, the OUS installation is fairly run of the mill. But by Oregon standards, the $25 million project is huge. Apart from one mega-project being installed in Yamhill County, it dwarfs any other solar array in the state.

The Oregon Institute of Technology campus alone will be home to more than 10,000 panels spread over a barren hillside the size of 12 football fields. At peak output, the panels will be capable of supplying 35 percent of OIT's electricity needs, carbon-free, at prices comparable to what the university's are paying for power today.

Oregon's largest solar project marks end of business tax credit era | OregonLive.com

Like any technology that is advancing, the more it is used and the more people produce it and use it then the cheaper it will become. I would rather imagine that if the same attitude was taken towards the first cell phone based on cost, then we would all still be speaking to one another on land lines and there would be no such thing as an iPhone and the same can be said for the PC, and any number of technologies that as they age and become more a part of daily life the cheaper they become. As for Hybrid vs. Gas. of course it is much cheaper to operate a hybrid than it is to operate a Gas vehicle, however from a cost standpoint, batteries are much more expensive to replace in the hybrid. One thing to consider here though, that as overall mpgs rise based on the number of these hybrids on the road that means less and less of our money going overseas to finance nations that do not like is so much. Each time you pull up into that Citgo station think fondly of Hugo Chavez or perhaps the number of organizations that are not so friendly to this nation that gas money we fill our guzzlers with goes too. Yes it's true that these technologies are not as cheap as conventional energy sources, however if more time were spent on finding ways to make these technologies cheaper so that we are less dependant on foreign sources of energy then perhaps its a win win for everyone.

 

[Caroljo]

I dunno Willow, I've seen you be a pretty big fucking idiot, on more than 100 occasions......tbh. No offense.

I'm not in the wh. so mine doesn't count. See how stupid ewe sound?

Hey, i'm just saying.

Retired old lady who types like a toddler on a message-board and pokes fun at people like a middle-schooler daily, and has the intelligence of a coughed up cat's furball.......


versus a guy who's become President of the United States..................



in reference to stupidity?






If you've never seen a stupider person, as your thread title suggests, try mirrors. Do you show up in them?

Well we all know you don't have to be smart to be President either....Obama's proven that.

 

[BluePhantom]

From 2009 to 2010, the price of a residential solar electric system fell 17 percent to $6.20 per watt, or a $1.30 decline.

Uh huh. My price from Portland General Electric is $0.13266 per kilowatt at peak hours. Get the picture?

Time Of Use: Pricing | PGE

 

[koshergrl]

Obama is just continuing to advance his plan of tossing us back in the dark ages. He wants the people to be warehoused, with no work except what the government dictates they must do, no food except what the government dictates they may eat, and no heat....which will effectively decimate the elderly, young, disabled, and diseased populations. And that is exactly what progressives want.

 

[The T]

I'm not in the wh. so mine doesn't count. See how stupid ewe sound?

Hey, i'm just saying.

Retired old lady who types like a toddler on a message-board and pokes fun at people like a middle-schooler daily, and has the intelligence of a coughed up cat's furball.......


versus a guy who's become President of the United States..................



in reference to stupidity?






If you've never seen a stupider person, as your thread title suggests, try mirrors. Do you show up in them?

Well we all know you don't have to be smart to be President either....Obama's proven that.

Indeed. he doesn't like the job...his indecision on tough issues bear it out as does the blame. What we are seeing is he likes the perks, and is trying to justify himself continuing to receive them.

He cannot and could ever fill the big shoes. He isn't and wasn't prepared for it...only in the task of advancing his ideology of bringing the Country down to something more to his liking/upbringing.

 

[koshergrl]

in the wh. or a downright meaner one either.



Obama’s Regulatory Burden




In the next few days, President Obama’s Environmental Protection Agency is expected to issue another final regulation directed at electricity utilities. This rule, known as the Utility MACT, will impose an estimated $11 billion each year in new costs on our economy. It will threaten electricity-generating capacity in many parts of the country. And it’s just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to this administration’s runaway rulemaking.
Obama

God damn that Obama for putting clean air over money!!! Doesn't he know that toxic air pollutants are good for you? Just ask any CON$ervative Republican! The American people would rather have cancer than deny Big Energy more profit, again just ask any CON$ervative self-anointed to speak for the American people.

The proposed toxics rule would reduce emissions of heavy metals, including mercury (Hg),
arsenic, chromium, and nickel, and acid gases, including hydrogen chloride (HCl) and
hydrogen fluoride (HF). These toxic air pollutants, also known as hazardous air pollutants or
air toxics, are known or suspected of causing cancer and other serious health effects.

bullshit.

All he's doing is destroying industry, impoverishing the population, and guaranteeing that people can't pay to heat their houses.

 

[Ernie S.]

the party which can find no candidate that doeasnt fall away after a months good scrutiny doesnt get to deside whats smart or not.

We'll talk a year from today as obama scrambles to pardon his whole cabinet before he's evicted from 1600.

 

[The T]

in the wh. or a downright meaner one either.



Obama’s Regulatory Burden




In the next few days, President Obama’s Environmental Protection Agency is expected to issue another final regulation directed at electricity utilities. This rule, known as the Utility MACT, will impose an estimated $11 billion each year in new costs on our economy. It will threaten electricity-generating capacity in many parts of the country. And it’s just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to this administration’s runaway rulemaking.
Obama

God damn that Obama for putting clean air over money!!! Doesn't he know that toxic air pollutants are good for you? Just ask any CON$ervative Republican! The American people would rather have cancer than deny Big Energy more profit, again just ask any CON$ervative self-anointed to speak for the American people.

The proposed toxics rule would reduce emissions of heavy metals, including mercury (Hg),
arsenic, chromium, and nickel, and acid gases, including hydrogen chloride (HCl) and
hydrogen fluoride (HF). These toxic air pollutants, also known as hazardous air pollutants or
air toxics, are known or suspected of causing cancer and other serious health effects.

bullshit.

All he's doing is destroying industry, impoverishing the population, and guaranteeing that people can't pay to heat their houses.

By design so that the unwashed will be more amiable/pliable to accept the Socialism he and the Statists are peddling.

 

[Navy1960]

From 2009 to 2010, the price of a residential solar electric system fell 17 percent to $6.20 per watt, or a $1.30 decline.

Uh huh. My price from Portland General Electric is $0.13266 per kilowatt at peak hours. Get the picture?

Time Of Use: Pricing | PGE

Monthly Savings Calculation: A south facing roof top solar system with no shading, and with a normal yearly dessert sunlight radiance of 2,400 per square meter would produce 1,840 kWh of electricity per year per nameplate kW capacity (assuming 23.3% losses for DC to AC conversion and other system losses). With a 5 kW system installed, the first year production would be 9,200 kWh (5 x 1,840). Assuming a system degradation of 0.5% per year times 25 years yields a net 8,050 kWh yearly average electricity savings (9,200 x .875). Assuming an average 2010 residential electricity price in AZ of $.11 per kWh yields a yearly savings of $886 (8,050 x $.11 not counting future inflation). The monthly savings would then be $73.79 ($886 divided by 12). This was then rounded to $74.00 even
Cost: Regular Electricity vs. Solar Electricity

HOUSTON – Today the total cost of oil being imported into the United States crossed $200 billion for 2011, according to data from the U.S. Energy Information Administration. In response to this unfortunate milestone, Consumer Energy Alliance (CEA) executive vice president Michael Whatley released the following statement:

“The fact that the United States has already spent $200 billion on oil imports in 2011 is beyond unfortunate, not only because of its impact on the American economy but also because it was an avoidable catastrophe. Granting the permits to explore and produce in the Beaufort and Chukchi Seas in Alaska would allow us to fill the TransAlaska Pipeline and bring more than 1.3 million barrels of American-produced oil to U.S. markets. Issuing the President Permit necessary to build the Keystone XL pipeline would deliver 700,000 barrels of oil every day to U.S. refineries from Oklahoma, Kansas, the Dakotas, Montana, and the Canadian province of Alberta. Finally, returning Gulf of Mexico offshore production to its pre-Macondo levels would add 130,000 barrels of domestically produced oil per day. All of these combined – which could be ushered in with a few pen strokes from the White House – would increase domestic supplies by 2.2 million barrels of oil per day, all while creating more than 114,000 much-needed American jobs.

CEA Statement on Oil Imports Surpassing $200 Billion for 2011 : Consumer Energy Alliance

I think I get it very well, in that our nation has all the resources it needs to produce energy including Solar, Wind, Natural Gas, Oil, Nuclear, the problem starts when we begin to limit ourselves to a single source or energy production or are so deeply addicted to one source of energy production that we are willing to sell this nation down the river to keep it.

 

[Navy1960]

Here's the problem I am speaking of in a much better light;

The Obama administration has voiced support for both creating jobs through green energy manufacturing and reducing energy costs by integrating green technology into America’s homes and businesses. The idea of creating jobs through manufacturing is great in theory, but while our government has provided some support for new manufacturers, it has failed to protect these fledgling industries from cheap foreign competition. For instance, Chinese firms routinely dump solar panels into the U.S. at less than cost, putting American manufacturers in an impossible position.
Solar Subsidies Going Overseas | Economy In Crisis

While these attempts at ending this need to send our nations money overseas for it's energy needs is a good one, it does appear that starting out with providing the incentives for cheap goods from overseas to come into this nation and then use taxpayer money to fund it is not a good way to promote it. These Solar cells are cheap as dirt to produce and in many nations around the world they cost little of anything, EXCEPT here. It would appear that if one wished to really end our need for foreign energy and also stimulate this economy they would start by giving American companies the the incentives to produce these products andsell them here to "end users" i.e. you and me rather than promote foreign imports.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Every critique of Obama says the same thing "threatens to kill jobs" then never says how. But when you live your life speaking in talkingpoint-enese you dont need things like...Context and...answers.

If you understand economics it shouldn't need to be explained to you. Needlessly burdening energy companies with an extra $11 billion raises the cost of energy production which then raises energy prices on business, increasing the cost of doing business, thus employing less people.

The EPA has gotten completely out of hand. They need to have their power taken away from them so that their regulations can only be implemented if approved by Congress first.

 

[The T]

Every critique of Obama says the same thing "threatens to kill jobs" then never says how. But when you live your life speaking in talkingpoint-enese you dont need things like...Context and...answers.

If you understand economics it shouldn't need to be explained to you. Needlessly burdening energy companies with an extra $11 billion raises the cost of energy production which then raises energy prices on business, increasing the cost of doing business, thus employing less people.

The EPA has gotten completely out of hand. They need to have their power taken away from them so that their regulations can only be implemented if approved by Congress first.

And Congress should defund them to accentuate the point.