It’s time to start calling the current situation what it is

[samjones]

a depression.

Agree?

 

[gallantwarrior]

Now that's kind of racist, don't you think? Considering the current administration, and all.
But, yeah, I have to agree. You must not be paying much attention to the pundits, though. The current administration would rather you believe that we are in an economic upturn of their making.

 

[expat_panama]

it’s time to start calling the current situation what it is, a depression. Agree?

Unemployment rates:
1929 _3.2 ____ 2007 4.6 ____ 1979 5.8
1930 _8.7 ____ 2008 5.6 ____ 1980 7.1
1931 15.9 ____ 2009 8.7 ____ 1981 7.6
1932 23.6 ____ 2010 9.6 ____ 1982 9.7
1933 24.9 ____ 2011 9.0 ____ 1983 9.6​

Tell me if you want to call the '83 downturn a depression too.

 

[Mr Natural]

I'll believe it's a depression when I don't have to wait for a table in a restaurant.

 

[samjones]

it’s time to start calling the current situation what it is, a depression. Agree?

Unemployment rates:
1929 _3.2 ____ 2007 4.6 ____ 1979 5.8
1930 _8.7 ____ 2008 5.6 ____ 1980 7.1
1931 15.9 ____ 2009 8.7 ____ 1981 7.6
1932 23.6 ____ 2010 9.6 ____ 1982 9.7
1933 24.9 ____ 2011 9.0 ____ 1983 9.6​

Tell me if you want to call the '83 downturn a depression too.

Unemployment in both America and Europe remains disastrously high. Leaders and institutions are increasingly discredited. And democratic values are under siege.

Furthermore....

The crisis of the euro is killing the European dream. The shared currency, which was supposed to bind nations together, has instead created an atmosphere of bitter acrimony.

European demands for ever-harsher austerity, with no offsetting effort to foster growth, have done double damage. They have failed as economic policy, worsening unemployment without restoring confidence

 

[rightwinger]

Do you understand what a Depression is?


We are not even in a Recession

 

[jillian]

a depression.

Agree?

no.

 

[samjones]

Do you understand what a Depression is?


We are not even in a Recession

Not surprisingly, the loss of faith in democracy has been greatest in the countries that suffered the deepest economic slumps.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

a depression.

Agree?

No

 

[rightwinger]

Do you understand what a Depression is?


We are not even in a Recession

Not surprisingly, the loss of faith in democracy has been greatest in the countries that suffered the deepest economic slumps.

I never saw the US abandon democracy in the Great Depression. If anything, it was stronger

 

[American Horse]

My wife and I have visited the Florida east coast now for the last 5 years running, and we see strong signs of economic activity the first time this year. Some abandoned housing projects are seeing new construction action, and some new start-ups.

We had fewer motel room choices this year because there are fewer vacancies. We see lots of sprucing up of formerly forlorn and dilapidated properties.

Back at our home base (our business is real estate in Indiana) we saw a turning point about six months ago, when new construction began and buyers began making much fewer demands for price reductions from the sellers.

 

[gallantwarrior]

My wife and I have visited the Florida east coast now for the last 5 years running, and we see strong signs of economic activity the first time this year. Some abandoned housing projects are seeing new construction action, and some new start-ups.

We had fewer motel room choices this year because there are fewer vacancies. We see lots of sprucing up of formerly forlorn and dilapidated properties.

Back at our home base (our business is real estate in Indiana) we saw a turning point about six months ago, when new construction began and buyers began making much fewer demands for price reductions from the sellers.

That certainly is heartening news, and from someone other than a government wonk running for reelection.

 

[expat_panama]

it’s time to start calling the current situation what it is, a depression. Agree?

Unemployment rates:
1929 _3.2 ____ 2007 4.6 ____ 1979 5.8
1930 _8.7 ____ 2008 5.6 ____ 1980 7.1
1931 15.9 ____ 2009 8.7 ____ 1981 7.6
1932 23.6 ____ 2010 9.6 ____ 1982 9.7
1933 24.9 ____ 2011 9.0 ____ 1983 9.6​

Tell me if you want to call the '83 downturn a depression too.

...democratic values are under siege. Furthermore.... The crisis of the euro is killing the European dream...

Democratic values were more under siege when the communist Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan. Tell me if you want to call the '83 downturn a depression too.

 

[Two Thumbs]

a depression.

Agree?

No, and not even close.

My Dad lived during the last one, so unless people are jumping out of buildings, or have jobs to go through the parks very early every morning to pull down the people that hanged themselves.

I'd say we have a long way to go.

 

[pinqy]

a depression.

Agree?

Change in GDP (current dollars)
1929 to 1930: -12%
1930 to 1931: -16.1%
1931 to 1932: -23.2%
1932 to 1933: -3.9%

2007 to 2008: +1.9%
2008 to 2009: -2.5%
2009 to 2010: +4.2%
4Q 2010 to 1Q 2011: +3.1%
1Q 2011 to 2Q 2011: +4%
2Q 2011 to 3Q 2011: +4.6%
Source: BEA

The Unemployment rate has already been covered.

Now, the Central Valley of California, down to Arizona, is at Depression level Unemployment and other economic conditions (El Centro, CA has been at over 30% unemployment for a while), but Nationally???? Nowhere near Depression levels.

 

[Truthmatters]

Depression (economics) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

there is no agreed on definition of an economic depression.

There is no need to worry about this label.


The situation doesnt get worse or better because of a label.

 

[samjones]

there is no agreed on definition of an economic depression.

I agree. I think of "depression" as being an unresolved problem with basic monetary policy that requires dramatic government intervention (or some other incredibly significant event) and probably a rewrite of basic economic theory to correct the depressed state.

In my mind that sort-of describes the American Depressions.

We don't have to have a body count to have a depression now. It doesn't have to be worse than The Great Depression of '29 and no single statistic or chart would determine whether we are or are not in a capital D Depression.

It's hard to imagine that the US ability and willingness to borrow money won't change or hasn't changed since 8/08. That removes a basic store of wealth for all of us. It's hard to imagine that the Euro will not have a partial or even total collapse over the next 2 years.

There have been ups and downs over the last 3.5 years, but I don't see how you can see all the things that have happened as being unrelated to each other. We had an event that started as a sub-prime mortgage crisis and has had ripple effects into monetary policy, employment and finance in general. We're still not out of the woods, and if the Euro collapses then we still have years to go.

If we don't call this "a depression" then I don't know what would qualify as a depression - save Parks and Recreation picking hanged bodies like apples from trees every morning so the kids don't get upset when they come there to play.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Not even remotely close.
When you go to a grocery store and the shelves are 3/4 empty...when you see vast tent cities all across the nation...when you see "economic refugees" - people lined up and down the interstates trekking from town to town looking for work.

Then it is a depression.

 

[samjones]

Not even remotely close.
When you go to a grocery store and the shelves are 3/4 empty...

... means that the weather man predict a 10% chance of a quarter inch of snow.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

. The shared currency, which was supposed to bind nations together, has instead created an atmosphere of bitter acrimony.

actually it has fostered greater cooperation than ever plus a determination to fix the problems. Its been in all the papers. In the US, we can print money at will so there is little incentive to fix our problems. This means Europe may well come out ahead of us.