It's the Prices, Stupid: Consumers Don't Drive High Health Care Costs

[Flaylo]

Richard Kirsch: It's the Prices, Stupid: Consumers Don't Drive High Health Care Costs

But the reason that health care costs so much in the United States is not that we consume too much health care; it's that we pay too much for what we consume. As Uwe Reinhardt and three other health economists summarized succinctly after comparing the prices we pay and the amount of health care we use in the United States with other developed countries, "It's the prices, stupid."For example, we make one-third fewer doctor visits a year than people in other countries but we pay an average of $59 for an office visit, compared with $31 in France. Our doctors make a lot more money than their colleagues in other countries. Adjusting pay across countries by purchasing power, U.S. doctors get paid about two times as much as in others. A Congressional Research Service analysis found that specialists in the United States are paid about $50,000 a year more than would be predicted, even considering the higher level of wealth in the United States.

 

[Avatar4321]

It's insurance. If we didn't have other people pay for our needs, rates would have to be reasonable to get paid. Add the cost of schooling to that too. If people didnt have to pay so much for their schooling, so that they have to take out loans, they wouldn't have to charge so much to pay off their debts.

 

[sparky]

lot's of factors involved here, but the overwieght middleman surely isn't helping.....

 

[CrusaderFrank]

1. I thought you were leaving?

2. The USA is the only nation that let's its lawyers feast on its health care system

3. Government is the biggest consumer of health Care and they never give a fuck about what anything costs

 

[CrusaderFrank]

4. Oh, thanks for posting yet another article from HuffPo, you always have so much to add to this Board.

 

[editec]

The theoretical laws regarding supply demand are tested when it comes to health care.

First, consumers do not decide their treatment in most cases, the doctors do.

Secondly, few consumers actually pay for their HC.

Now I am not saying that the supply demand plays no role in HC costs, but HC certainly isn't remotely like that widget market so many of read about in ECON 100

 

[rdean]

lot's of factors involved here, but the overwieght middleman surely isn't helping.....

You have the CEOs of some Health Care Companies making a hundred million dollar plus paychecks and people on this board want to blame "lawyers" and "doctors" for the high cost?

A single 100 million dollar check will pay the total medical insurance costs of 34,000 people. Imagine how many policies you actually have to skim to make a paycheck that large.

Add in private jets, stock options, administration costs, company retreats, all the other high level salaries, and you have to begin to ask yourself, "For every dollar paid into that policy, how much actually goes to the patient?" For the VA, it's around 96 cents on the dollar. Does anythone think it's close to that for market Health Care?

The number one cause of bankruptcy are medical bills.

All you have to do is "connect the dots".

 

[Bern80]

Richard Kirsch: It's the Prices, Stupid: Consumers Don't Drive High Health Care Costs

But the reason that health care costs so much in the United States is not that we consume too much health care; it's that we pay too much for what we consume. As Uwe Reinhardt and three other health economists summarized succinctly after comparing the prices we pay and the amount of health care we use in the United States with other developed countries, "It's the prices, stupid."For example, we make one-third fewer doctor visits a year than people in other countries but we pay an average of $59 for an office visit, compared with $31 in France. Our doctors make a lot more money than their colleagues in other countries. Adjusting pay across countries by purchasing power, U.S. doctors get paid about two times as much as in others. A Congressional Research Service analysis found that specialists in the United States are paid about $50,000 a year more than would be predicted, even considering the higher level of wealth in the United States.

Yeah you're right you liberal idiot. The fact that we are one of the unhealthiest industrialized nations in the world has NOTHING to do with what health care costs in this country.

 

[Zander]

The disconnection is pretty simple to understand. The average health care consumer doesn't actually pay for care- to them it is essentially "FREE". Their employer pays the lions share of the insurance premium, and they pay a small portion and possibly a co-payment. So, they over utilize services. Why not? To them health care is "FREE" or almost "FREE". So long as someone else is paying the tab, health care costs will continue to rise.

 

[WillowTree]

Richard Kirsch: It's the Prices, Stupid: Consumers Don't Drive High Health Care Costs

But the reason that health care costs so much in the United States is not that we consume too much health care; it's that we pay too much for what we consume. As Uwe Reinhardt and three other health economists summarized succinctly after comparing the prices we pay and the amount of health care we use in the United States with other developed countries, "It's the prices, stupid."For example, we make one-third fewer doctor visits a year than people in other countries but we pay an average of $59 for an office visit, compared with $31 in France. Our doctors make a lot more money than their colleagues in other countries. Adjusting pay across countries by purchasing power, U.S. doctors get paid about two times as much as in others. A Congressional Research Service analysis found that specialists in the United States are paid about $50,000 a year more than would be predicted, even considering the higher level of wealth in the United States.

so in a month or two obie doodle will issue an executive order decreasing the pay for our nations physicians... kool beans.

 

[sparky]

lot's of factors involved here, but the overwieght middleman surely isn't helping.....

You have the CEOs of some Health Care Companies making a hundred million dollar plus paychecks and people on this board want to blame "lawyers" and "doctors" for the high cost?

A single 100 million dollar check will pay the total medical insurance costs of 34,000 people. Imagine how many policies you actually have to skim to make a paycheck that large.

Add in private jets, stock options, administration costs, company retreats, all the other high level salaries, and you have to begin to ask yourself, "For every dollar paid into that policy, how much actually goes to the patient?" For the VA, it's around 96 cents on the dollar. Does anythone think it's close to that for market Health Care?

The number one cause of bankruptcy are medical bills.

All you have to do is "connect the dots".

Large insurance companies continue to press for higher premiums, even though their reserve coffers are flush with profits and shareholders have been rewarded with new dividends. Many defend proposed double-digit increases in the rates they charge, citing a need for protection against any sudden uptick in demand once people have more money to spend on their health, as well as the rising price of care. (PressTV file image)

Health Insurers Making Record Profits as Many Postpone Care | Common Dreams

 

[sparky]

The disconnection is pretty simple to understand. The average health care consumer doesn't actually pay for care- to them it is essentially "FREE". Their employer pays the lions share of the insurance premium, and they pay a small portion and possibly a co-payment. So, they over utilize services. Why not? To them health care is "FREE" or almost "FREE". So long as someone else is paying the tab, health care costs will continue to rise.

yeah but>



Significant increases in how much people have to pay for their medical care may prevent a solid rebound. In recent years, many employers have sharply reduced benefits, while raising deductibles and co-payments so people have to reach deeper into their pockets.

In 2010, about 10 percent of people covered by their employer had a deductible of at least $2,000, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation, a nonprofit research group, compared with just 5 percent of covered workers in 2008.

Doctors, for one, say patients’ attitudes are changing. “Because it’s from Dollar 1 to Dollar 2,000, they are being really conscious of how they spend their money,” said Dr. James Applegate, a family physician in Grand Rapids, Mich. For example, patients question the need for annual blood work.

 

[editec]

Higher deductables will have some SMALL effect (I think, don't have evidence to support this theory) on HC costs overall.

But overused HC is not generally the fault of the consumer.

If anything its the providers who make THAT happen since it is they who DECIDE what services will be provided.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

How much has everyone saved from switching to ObamaCare?

 

[Skull Pilot]

it's the insulation of medical prices from market forces that is mainly responsible for the cost.

Our insurance model has taken the power of the consumer away. No one knows what health care costs. Just call a Doctor and ask how much it would cost for an office visit, a physical and blood work and they won't tell you.

The consumer can't shop around for the best deal anymore.

 

[Care4all]

I will say one thing....it's not like the Insurance companies do not negotiate for the absolute best price they can get from the hospitals.....they DO NEGOTIATE for cheaper prices and they do get much lower prices and rates than the person who does not have insurance.

20-25% of the cost of medical care comes from all of the paperwork involved....i had read once that a hospital like John Hopkins has over 100 different payment plans because of all the different insurance companies that they deal with and have negotiated prices with.....

What a waste of money.....

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I will say one thing....it's not like the Insurance companies do not negotiate for the absolute best price they can get from the hospitals.....they DO NEGOTIATE for cheaper prices and they do get much lower prices and rates than the person who does not have insurance.

20-25% of the cost of medical care comes from all of the paperwork involved....i had read once that a hospital like John Hopkins has over 100 different payment plans because of all the different insurance companies that they deal with and have negotiated prices with.....

What a waste of money.....

There's hope yet!

 

[sparky]

How much has everyone saved from switching to ObamaCare?

Editorial: ObamaCare's Costs Just Keep Rising - Investors.com



CBO: Obamacare Would Cost Over $2 Trillion | The Weekly Standard


CBO confirms: ObamaCare with “doctor fix” will actually add billions to the deficit « Hot Air

 

[driveby]

Yet another faglo myth debunked !

 

[code1211]

Higher deductables will have some SMALL effect (I think, don't have evidence to support this theory) on HC costs overall.

But overused HC is not generally the fault of the consumer.

If anything its the providers who make THAT happen since it is they who DECIDE what services will be provided.

The plan where I work maintained the premium costs, but changed various features of the plan:

1) If you live a healthy life style(don't smoke, do exercise, weight and height are right), you get deductions in the premiums. I pay 20% of the toatl.
2) The first $2000 for family care of any type is covered 100%. This includes tests, drugs, preventative and anything else.
3) The next $3000 is not covered at all. 100% patient paid.
4) After $5000, all costs are split 80/20. It's interesting in that I immediately researched how to stay under $2000.

The goal of the premium/payment structure is to reduce the costs for those with a healthy life style. We'll know at the end of the year how it worked out.