It looks bad for the Obamacare mandate

Quantum Windbag

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May 9, 2010
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This is a bipartisan panel, and none of them like the mandate.

Judges on a federal appeals court panel on Wednesday repeatedly raised questions about President Barack Obama's health care overhaul, expressing unease with the requirement that virtually all Americans carry health insurance or face penalties.All three judges on the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals panel questioned whether upholding the landmark law could open the door to Congress adopting other sweeping economic mandates. The panel is made up of two Democratic appointees and one Republican appointee.
The Atlanta panel did not immediately rule on the lawsuit brought by 26 states, a coalition of small businesses and private individuals who urged the three to side with a Florida judge who struck down the law. And it's never easy to predict how an appeals panel will decide.
But during almost three hours of oral arguments, the judges asked pointed questions about the so-called individual mandate, which the federal government says is needed to expand coverage to tens of millions of uninsured Americans. With other challenges to the law before other federal appeals courts, lawyers expect that its fate will ultimately be decided by the U.S. Supreme Court.

The Associated Press: US judges seem receptive to health care challenge
 
Slanted article? When did the AP become anti Obamacare? How is reporting the fact that the court thought the mandate is stretching Congress' powers past the limit of common sense equal a slant in your world?
 
And by "the court", you and the author mean one member of panel (since that's the only one he ever quotes).
 
And by "the court", you and the author mean one member of panel (since that's the only one he ever quotes).

All there judges on the panel questioned the mandate.

By the way, the article mentions specifically that two of them asked about removing the mandate from the complete law. Thanks for showing your slant though.
 
What both you and the author of the article fail to realize is that asking a question about something doesn't equal agreeing with the premise of the question.
 
What both you and the author of the article fail to realize is that asking a question about something doesn't equal agreeing with the premise of the question.

Where did I say it did? The thing is that everyone that heard the arguments thinks the signs are bad, but feel free to live in Polkland if you like.
 
What both you and the author of the article fail to realize is that asking a question about something doesn't equal agreeing with the premise of the question.

Where did I say it did? The thing is that everyone that heard the arguments thinks the signs are bad, but feel free to live in Polkland if you like.

You said it in the title of the thread.
 
This is a bipartisan panel, and none of them like the mandate.

Judges on a federal appeals court panel on Wednesday repeatedly raised questions about President Barack Obama's health care overhaul, expressing unease with the requirement that virtually all Americans carry health insurance or face penalties.All three judges on the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals panel questioned whether upholding the landmark law could open the door to Congress adopting other sweeping economic mandates. The panel is made up of two Democratic appointees and one Republican appointee.
The Atlanta panel did not immediately rule on the lawsuit brought by 26 states, a coalition of small businesses and private individuals who urged the three to side with a Florida judge who struck down the law. And it's never easy to predict how an appeals panel will decide.
But during almost three hours of oral arguments, the judges asked pointed questions about the so-called individual mandate, which the federal government says is needed to expand coverage to tens of millions of uninsured Americans. With other challenges to the law before other federal appeals courts, lawyers expect that its fate will ultimately be decided by the U.S. Supreme Court.

The Associated Press: US judges seem receptive to health care challenge

the federal govt has NO constitutional authority to compulse us to buy insurance from a private company or face a government fine. /obamacare.

also the constitution does not give the federal govt the responsibility to insure us. All powers not expressly granted to the federal govt are reserved to the states. /obamacare.

either way it was just a stupid waste of time at this point......maybe i'll be wrong but i dont think so, its up to the courts.
 
What both you and the author of the article fail to realize is that asking a question about something doesn't equal agreeing with the premise of the question.

Where did I say it did? The thing is that everyone that heard the arguments thinks the signs are bad, but feel free to live in Polkland if you like.

You said it in the title of the thread.

It looks bad for the Obamacare mandate is saying that questions prove that they are going to rule a certain way?

:confused:
 
What both you and the author of the article fail to realize is that asking a question about something doesn't equal agreeing with the premise of the question.

Where did I say it did? The thing is that everyone that heard the arguments thinks the signs are bad, but feel free to live in Polkland if you like.

You said it in the title of the thread.

and what does the article title say?...if you're just gonna be contrary to be contrary then expect to get derision ...jesus christ ...
 
Where did I say it did? The thing is that everyone that heard the arguments thinks the signs are bad, but feel free to live in Polkland if you like.

You said it in the title of the thread.

It looks bad for the Obamacare mandate is saying that questions prove that they are going to rule a certain way?

:confused:

Yes. The implication of your statement was that the judges on this panel are leaning toward ruling against the law.
 
And by "the court", you and the author mean one member of panel (since that's the only one he ever quotes).

All there judges on the panel questioned the mandate.

By the way, the article mentions specifically that two of them asked about removing the mandate from the complete law. Thanks for showing your slant though.

yes I just read this a bit ago. naturally knowing that the mandate is the real crux of the matter here and the fact that some justices appeared to be thoughtfully wary, well humans like us and the author see it as a negative but well.....

anyway, this court has an eclectic mix ( hat tip hot air); 'Two of the three judges who heard arguments today were appointed to the district court by Reagan, but two of the three were elevated to the appellate court by Clinton''..... this could equal a bellwether.

oh, here another slanted piece :rolleyes:

Panel ponders striking individual mandate

Panel ponders striking individual mandate - Jennifer Haberkorn - POLITICO.com
 
You said it in the title of the thread.

It looks bad for the Obamacare mandate is saying that questions prove that they are going to rule a certain way?

:confused:

Yes. The implication of your statement was that the judges on this panel are leaning toward ruling against the law.

There was no such implication. I offered an opinion from what I have read. If I were trying to imply that they were going to strike down the mandate I would have said something like "Most conservative court ready to set limits on Congress."
Or even this.

http://www.latimes.com/health/la-na-healthcare-court-20110609,0,1457877.story

It is not my fault you see the world through partisanship.
 
It will go to the SCOTUS regardless and providing that none of the Republicans on the court die between now and when it gets heard it will get struck down as unconstitutional and that will finally be the end of it.
 
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To extrapolate an outcome predicated on one oral argument in one venue is naïve at best, ignorant at worst.

Yet you extrapolate an outcome based on district court decisions you like.

Go figure.

Maybe you should read what Time says about the 11th and why it might be a key decision.

The Affordable Care Act is back in court on Wednesday, with the government and a coalition of 26 states presenting arguments in an Atlanta courtroom for and against the constitutionality of the law. There are dozens of similar cases currently winding their way through federal courts, but the ruling that comes out of Atlanta could be the strongest indicator yet of whether the ACA will ultimately be allowed to stand.
So far, all of the federal district judges that have ruled on the constitutionality of the ACA's individual mandate — the centerpiece to most legal challenges — have matched the generally held opinion of the party of the President who appointed them. Democrat-appointed judges have ruled that the ACA is perfectly fine; Republican-appointed judges have ruled that it violates the constitution.
There haven't been any decisions yet at the appellate level, although most court watchers are expecting the Fourth Circuit in Virginia to say the law is constitutional. The reason: All three judges on the randomly selected panel chosen to rule on the case happened to have been appointed by Democrats. See the pattern? Until we see a ruling in which a Republican-appointed judge says the law is constitutional or a Democrat-appointed judge says it's not, we're left with little indication about the law's final fate. (We're also left with the impression that the supposed impartial jurists of the federal court system are far more political than we would sometimes like to believe.)

Health Care Lawsuits: Why the 11th Circuit Might Matter More - TIME
 
I am not a moral relativist.

I think the fact the richest nation on earth does not provide healthcare for all its citizens immoral.

I do not accept the argument that in any society class, privilege, and wealth are the only determinants of good healthcare.

I think that access to good healthcare is a good and a foundation for any arguments on individual freedom.

How can any American, any person, argue that something that hurts children is just the way it is and the alternatives too costly.

How can a America without healthcare claim to be a religious, caring, just, freedom loving nation.
 
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this issue of its constitutionality will most likely rest on the decision of health being determined to be interstate commerce or not. if it is determined to be interstate commerce, then under the commerce clause the federal government will have the authority to regulate it. there was also a judge who ruled for the mandate, finding that health insurance and health care not a voluntary product one chooses to use or not to choose, as every american at some point in their life will require medical care. this makes it unique in that by this definition it no longer a luxury but a necessity.

i think that there is an easy fix to this whole mandate problem, but its also a very fine line to walk and that is to offer medical waivers. this meaning that if you choose to not purchase health care insurance of any kind, you must a sign a waiver which states that you can and will be denied any and all medical care, even care during an emergency, without payment prior to treatment. and that you accept the risks associated with this even if this leads to permanent injury or even death. would you as an individual be willing to sign such a waiver knowing that you can denied care if you show up at a hospital? is this an acceptable solution to the problem?
 
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