Israel's never-ending Holocaust

[Jos]

The Holocaust is the primary way Israel defines itself. And that definition is narrow and ailing in the extreme, because the Holocaust is remembered only in a very specific way, as are its lessons. It has long been used to justify the existence and the necessity of the state, and has been mentioned in the same breath as proof that the state is under a never-ending existential threat.

The Holocaust is the sole prism through which our leadership, followed by society at large, examines every situation. This prism distorts reality and leads inexorably to a forgone conclusion - to the point that former Chief Rabbi Israel Meir Lau announced at a Holocaust Remembrance Day ceremony three years ago that Moses was the first Holocaust survivor. In other words, all our lives are simply one long Shoah.

As a country, as a nation, Israel has never confronted the trauma of the Holocaust. The shock from the terrible tragedy and the guilt feelings of the pre-state Yishuv leadership for not being able to save the Jews of Europe - plus the presence of the men and women who survived and were constant reminders of both traumas - prompted Israel to repress the Holocaust at first, and then to turn it into a placard in the service of the national trauma, to reinforce the constant existential fear and the aggressiveness that comes with it.

The survivors themselves have never been treated right. Just yesterday it was reported, once again, that half of Israel's Holocaust survivors are dependent on welfare stipends and that the government has once again reduced its support of them.

At the same time, the "Hitlers" are always there: Just a week ago, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said for the nth time that there is no shortage of those who want to exterminate us completely. In other words, there is no lack of reasons to continue to reinforce the fear of the Holocaust - which, according to his father, historian Benzion Netanyahu, has never ended.

So it is that we don't have any rivals, adversaries or even enemies. Only Hitlers. This is how the Holocaust is taught in school, this how it is that Israeli students are taken to visit death camps - and how it came to be that, as Haaretz reported on Friday, just 2 percent of Israeli youth feel committed to democratic principles after studying the Holocaust and 2.5 percent identify with the suffering of other persecuted nations, but 12 percent feel committed to "significant" service in the Israel Defense Forces.

That's the way it is with traumas. Because of our human limitations, a trauma that is not dealt with make us constantly see yet another trauma approaching - even when whatever is coming has no connection to the previous trauma and may even be a good thing. Trauma leads to belligerence and a strong tendency to wreak havoc on one's surroundings, but first and foremost on oneself.

What we consider rational is actually a frightened, defensive, aggressive pattern. Our current leaders have made Israeli Judaism just a post-traumatic syndrome, while they lead us to self-destruction.

Haaretz.Com

 

[docmauser1]

The Holocaust is the primary way Israel defines itself. And that definition is narrow and ailing in the extreme, because the Holocaust is remembered only in a very specific way, as are its lessons. It has long been used to justify the existence and the necessity of the state, and has been mentioned in the same breath as proof that the state is under a never-ending existential threat.

Do we always need to affirm that jews are better?

 

[Urbanguerrilla]

The Holocaust is the primary way Israel defines itself. And that definition is narrow and ailing in the extreme, because the Holocaust is remembered only in a very specific way, as are its lessons. It has long been used to justify the existence and the necessity of the state, and has been mentioned in the same breath as proof that the state is under a never-ending existential threat.

Do we always need to affirm that jews are better?

Better at what..being Jews???

 

[docmauser1]

Do we always need to affirm that jews are better?

Better at what..being Jews???

Are arabs competing yet?

 

[Jos]

Israel’s Collective Psychosis: The Denial Syndrome | Dissident Voice

 

[peach174]

Israel was given back to the Jews because of persecution throughout history in Europe not just because of the the holocaust.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Israel was given back to the Jews because of persecution throughout history in Europe not just because of the the holocaust.

It was never theirs in the first place, Hebrews invaded the land a slaughtered the Canaaites but they could not defeat the Palestinians. And European Jews have no genealogical ties to Middle East.

 

[docmauser1]

Israel’s Collective Psychosis: The Denial Syndrome

• Khaled Amayreh reflects that palistanian psychosis real well, indeed.
• Poor Khaled babbles about Imad Al Hams too! We may never know the reasons behind sending her all the way up to a military post, quite opposite to her school. The arab "family honor" purification scam was most likely the driving force, a frivolous shifty uncle, a brotherly gangbang, some local boy, whom her family considered a dirty palistanian, the list may go on, of course.

 

[peach174]

Noah
|
Shem-->Eber-->Terah
|
--------------|----
| | |
Abram Nahor Haran
| |
|----------| Lot
Isaac Ishmael |-------------------
| | | |
|------| |--->Arabs<-----Moab Ammon
Jacob Esau |
| |------->Arabs<----------------
|
Israelites & Jews

Whether you like it or not, both claim Abraham as their father and they are related to one another.
And Jews have just as much as a right to be there as Palestinians.

 

[docmauser1]

It was never theirs in the first place, Hebrews invaded the land a slaughtered the Canaaites but they could not defeat the Palestinians.

Other drivel aside, how could "hebrews" not defeat palistanians, if the latter popped up out of the thick air out of Yassir Arafat's arse in 1964?

 

[Jos]

Noah
|
Shem-->Eber-->Terah
|
--------------|----
| | |
Abram Nahor Haran
| |
|----------| Lot
Isaac Ishmael |-------------------
| | | |
|------| |--->Arabs<-----Moab Ammon
Jacob Esau |
| |------->Arabs<----------------
|
Israelites & Jews

Whether you like it or not, both claim Abraham as their father and they are related to one another.
And Jews have just as much as a right to be there as Palestinians.

Are you saying the Palestinians have just as much as a right to be there as the immigrant jews?

 

[peach174]

Yes they do but certain Palestinians (like Hamas and others with like ideology) refuse to live in peace with their own relations.
They all get along in the old part of Jerusalem, Jews,Muslims and Christians.

 

[MikeK]

[...]And European Jews have no genealogical ties to Middle East.

I attended a seminar on Middle East affairs some years back. A young woman who rose to speak identified herself as a Palestinian whose family had been uprooted from land they had occupied for generations. She said she was fourteen years old when two Jewish men came to her door accompanied by two Israeli soldiers. They told her mother the land, including a productive date orchard, belonged to them according to the word of god and that her family had two weeks to vacate. She said the men were Ashkenazi (European) with very white skin and blue eyes and were American brothers who migrated to Israel.

I have no way of knowing if what she said was the unmitigated truth or not. But if it is I can well understand how virulent hatred can arise from such treatment. And it's important to note here that in a 1998 Frontline interview, Usama bin Laden told John Miller that Israel's treatment of the Palestinians would bring misery on the heads of Americans for supporting the Jewish state.

(Excerpt)

[...]

"I say to them that they have put themselves at the mercy of a disloyal government, and this is most evident in Clinton's administration ... . We believe that this administration represents Israel inside America. Take the sensitive ministries such as the Ministry of Exterior and the Ministry of Defense and the CIA, you will find that the Jews have the upper hand in them. They make use of America to further their plans for the world, especially the Islamic world. American presence in the Gulf provides support to the Jews and protects their rear. And while millions of Americans are homeless and destitute and live in abject poverty, their government is busy occupying our land and building new settlements and helping Israel build new settlements in the point of departure for our Prophet's midnight journey to the seven heavens. America throws her own sons in the land of the two Holy Mosques for the sake of protecting Jewish interests."

[...]

Read more: Who Is Bin Laden? - Interview With Osama Bin Laden (in May 1998) | Hunting Bin Laden | FRONTLINE | PBS

The 9/11 attack affirms that bin Laden wasn't making an idle threat.

 

[docmauser1]

I attended a seminar on Middle East affairs some years back. A young woman who rose to speak identified herself as a Palestinian whose family had been uprooted from land they had occupied for generations. She said she was fourteen years old when two Jewish men came to her door accompanied by two Israeli soldiers. They told her mother the land, including a productive date orchard, belonged to them according to the word of god and that her family had two weeks to vacate. She said the men were Ashkenazi (European) with very white skin and blue eyes and were American brothers who migrated to Israel. ! have no way of knowing if what she said was the unmitigated truth or not. But if it is I can well understand how virulent hatred can arise from such treatment. And it's important to note here that in a 1998 Frontline interview, Usama bin Laden told John Miller that Israel's treatment of the Palestinians would bring misery on the heads of Americans for supporting the Jewish state.
"I say to them that they have put themselves at the mercy of a disloyal government, and this is most evident in Clinton's administration ... . We believe that this administration represents Israel inside America. Take the sensitive ministries such as the Ministry of Exterior and the Ministry of Defense and the CIA, you will find that the Jews have the upper hand in them. They make use of America to further their plans for the world, especially the Islamic world. American presence in the Gulf provides support to the Jews and protects their rear. And while millions of Americans are homeless and destitute and live in abject poverty, their government is busy occupying our land and building new settlements and helping Israel build new settlements in the point of departure for our Prophet's midnight journey to the seven heavens. America throws her own sons in the land of the two Holy Mosques for the sake of protecting Jewish interests."
The 9/11 attack affirms that bin Laden wasn't making an idle threat.

And the moral of the story is exactly what?

 

[MikeK]

I attended a seminar on Middle East affairs some years back. A young woman who rose to speak identified herself as a Palestinian whose family had been uprooted from land they had occupied for generations. She said she was fourteen years old when two Jewish men came to her door accompanied by two Israeli soldiers. They told her mother the land, including a productive date orchard, belonged to them according to the word of god and that her family had two weeks to vacate. She said the men were Ashkenazi (European) with very white skin and blue eyes and were American brothers who migrated to Israel. ! have no way of knowing if what she said was the unmitigated truth or not. But if it is I can well understand how virulent hatred can arise from such treatment. And it's important to note here that in a 1998 Frontline interview, Usama bin Laden told John Miller that Israel's treatment of the Palestinians would bring misery on the heads of Americans for supporting the Jewish state.
"I say to them that they have put themselves at the mercy of a disloyal government, and this is most evident in Clinton's administration ... . We believe that this administration represents Israel inside America. Take the sensitive ministries such as the Ministry of Exterior and the Ministry of Defense and the CIA, you will find that the Jews have the upper hand in them. They make use of America to further their plans for the world, especially the Islamic world. American presence in the Gulf provides support to the Jews and protects their rear. And while millions of Americans are homeless and destitute and live in abject poverty, their government is busy occupying our land and building new settlements and helping Israel build new settlements in the point of departure for our Prophet's midnight journey to the seven heavens. America throws her own sons in the land of the two Holy Mosques for the sake of protecting Jewish interests."
The 9/11 attack affirms that bin Laden wasn't making an idle threat.

And the moral of the story is exactly what?

I'm surprised that the point of my comment evades your perception. It shouldn't because there is nothing obscure about it.

Israel's oppressive treatment of the Palestinians has engendered virulent hatred on the part of the Arab world. My essential feeling where that is concerned is it's none of America's business. But special interests within America's political power structure have made it America's business and if you would read what bin Laden has to say about that it will be clear to you that considerable provocation for the 9/11 attack was U.S. support of Israel.

Further, I believe the reason bin Laden was executed rather than taken prisoner, as he quite easily could have been, is these same special interests wanted him silenced. Because I can assure you that if he was allowed to speak his mind, as he would in a criminal trial, what he has to say would awaken a considerable percentage of the American People and their allies to the fact that our support of Israel is extremely counterproductive to our own interests.

 

[docmauser1]

And the moral of the story is exactly what?

I'm surprised that the point of my comment evades your perception. It shouldn't because there is nothing obscure about it.

Indeed, it wasn't some sublime musing, the "comment" is plain dumb, of course!

Israel's oppressive treatment of the Palestinians has engendered virulent hatred on the part of the Arab world. My essential feeling where that is concerned is it's none of America's business. But special interests within America's political power structure have made it America's business and if you would read what bin Laden has to say about that it will be clear to you that considerable provocation for the 9/11 attack was U.S. support of Israel.

Drivel.

 

[Urbanguerrilla]

And the moral of the story is exactly what?

I'm surprised that the point of my comment evades your perception. It shouldn't because there is nothing obscure about it.

Indeed, it wasn't some sublime musing, the "comment" is plain dumb, of course!

Israel's oppressive treatment of the Palestinians has engendered virulent hatred on the part of the Arab world. My essential feeling where that is concerned is it's none of America's business. But special interests within America's political power structure have made it America's business and if you would read what bin Laden has to say about that it will be clear to you that considerable provocation for the 9/11 attack was U.S. support of Israel.

Drivel.

"My country...eh, Israel, right or wrong"...

 

[Rocko]

Israel was given back to the Jews because of persecution throughout history in Europe not just because of the the holocaust.

It was never theirs in the first place, Hebrews invaded the land a slaughtered the Canaaites but they could not defeat the Palestinians. And European Jews have no genealogical ties to Middle East.

that is the dumbest thing I ever heard. Where the hell did you get that "Truthseeker"?

 

[Wolverine1984]

Israel was given back to the Jews because of persecution throughout history in Europe not just because of the the holocaust.

It was never theirs in the first place, Hebrews invaded the land a slaughtered the Canaaites but they could not defeat the Palestinians. And European Jews have no genealogical ties to Middle East.

You clearly have no clue of what you are talking about ...
I have already proven you wrong on both counts.

Palestinians and Philistines are two different people who have nothing in common, Philistines absorbed into the Babylonian and Persian empires, and disappear as a distinct group by the late 5th century BC.
Palestinians are Arabs who came during the Muslim conquests which were as early (The earliest possible time) 5th century CE ,when the Philistines were long gone ...

Philistines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

While DNA test of Palestininas says the following :

One DNA study by Nebel found genetic evidence in support of historical records that "part, or perhaps the majority" of Muslim Palestinians descend from "local inhabitants, mainly Christians and Jews, who had converted after the Islamic conquest in the seventh century AD".

Palestinian people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Your other claim about "And European Jews have no genealogical ties to Middle East." Is total rubbish as well

Genetic studies indicate various lineages found in modern Jewish populations; however, most of these populations share a lineage in common, traceable to an ancient population that underwent geographic branching and subsequent independent evolutions.[44] While DNA tests have demonstrated inter-marriage in all of the various Jewish ethnic divisions over the last 3,000 years, it was substantially less than in other populations.[45] The findings lend support to traditional Jewish accounts accrediting their founding to exiled Israelite populations, and counters theories that many or most of the world's Jewish populations were founded entirely by local populations that adopted the Jewish religion, devoid of any actual Israelite genetic input.[45]
DNA analysis further determined that modern Jews of the priesthood tribe—"Kohanim"—share an ancestor dating back about 3,000 years.[46] This result is consistent for all Jewish populations around the world.[46] The researchers estimated that the most recent common ancestor of modern Kohanim lived between 1000 BCE (roughly the time of the Biblical Exodus) and 586 BCE, when the Babylonians destroyed the First Temple.[47] They found similar results analyzing DNA from Ashkenazi and Sephardi Jews.[47] The scientists estimated the date of the original priest based on genetic mutations, which indicated that the priest lived roughly 106 generations ago, between 2,650 and 3,180 years ago depending whether one counts a generation as 25 or 30 years.[47] These Jews belong to the haplotypes J1e and J2a. However, more recent research has shown that many ethnic groups in the Middle East and Mediterranean area also share this genetic profile.[48]
Although individual and groups of converts to Judaism have historically been absorbed into contemporary Jewish populations, it is unlikely that they formed a large percentage of the ancestors of modern Jewish groups, and much less that they represented their genesis as Jewish communities.[44][49]

Your both claims are proven false again.

Jews - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As far as I'm concerned if you are proven wrong once and then use the same statements again knowing full well they are lies (as you do here) it gives me and anyone else the right to call you a
BIG,FAT liar.

Truth seeker indeed ...

 

[Jos]

?Russian jews killing Muslim Palestinians descend from "local inhabitants, mainly Christians and Jews, who had converted after the Islamic conquest in the seventh century AD?