Israel Says Yes To Gaza Pullout

Bonnie

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Jun 30, 2004
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Israeli Lawmakers OK Gaza Withdrawal Plan
Sharon proposal passes easily despite fervent debate. It still requires Cabinet approval, and the government faces a budget test in March.




Israeli Lawmakers OK Gaza Withdrawal Plan











By Laura King, Times Staff Writer


JERUSALEM — Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's initiative to uproot the Jewish settlements in the Gaza Strip won final parliamentary approval Wednesday night after two days of acrimonious debate.

The measure, which authorized nearly $1 billion in compensation for the roughly 8,000 settlers to be evacuated, passed easily in a 59-40 vote despite furious protests from right-wing lawmakers who were once the prime minister's closest allies.







The plan still needs a final endorsement by Sharon's divided Cabinet, a showdown vote that is scheduled to take place Sunday. Several key members, including Finance Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, are said to be considering voting against the measure.

Opponents of the Gaza withdrawal, which is scheduled to begin in midsummer, could still derail the plan if they manage to muster enough votes in the parliament, or Knesset, next month to defeat Sharon's annual budget. That would effectively topple his government because, under Israeli law, failure to pass the spending plan by March 31 automatically triggers new elections.

Over the course of a marathon session that began Tuesday morning, lawmakers sifted through dozens of proposed amendments to the measure, including a bid to delay the pullout to allow for a nationwide referendum.

Sharon firmly opposed a referendum, maintaining that the approval of the Knesset and the Cabinet would sufficiently reflect the will of the people.

Wednesday's measure required the approval of only a majority of those voting. Many lawmakers in the 120-member Knesset abstained or were absent.

Since Sharon unveiled the plan last year, polls have consistently indicated that a solid majority of Israelis want to relinquish Gaza, a densely populated, impoverished enclave that has long been a hotbed of activity by Palestinian militant groups.

But settlers and their supporters have waged an increasingly strident campaign to block the withdrawal, including raucous street protests and even explicit threats aimed at Sharon and senior military and government officials involved in planning the evacuation. Some right-wing extremists have likened Sharon and his deputies to Nazis.

Deputy Premier Shimon Peres, one of Israel's leading doves, delivered an impassioned appeal before the Knesset vote, saying that no durable peace with the Palestinians would be possible as long as Israeli settlers remained in Gaza.

Halting the momentum toward a pullout now, he argued, would destroy the climate of reconciliation that has taken hold since the death in November of longtime Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and the election in January of Mahmoud Abbas as his successor.

"Let us get one thing clear: Gaza will never, ever be part of a Jewish state," Peres said. "What do you suggest we do with the 1.5 million Palestinians there? Never let them vote?… What will you offer them — an eternity of oppression and discrimination?"

Supporters of the settlers argued, with equal passion, that the prime minister lacked the authority to uproot Gaza's 21 heavily guarded Jewish settlements, which many of the residents believe are theirs by biblical mandate.

"The beliefs upon which I was raised, and in whose name I was elected to the Knesset, collapsed today," said Reuven Rivlin, a member of a faction in Sharon's conservative Likud Party that opposed the move.

"Today's decision serves as a dramatic turning point in the Zionist positions" of the party, he said.

Seeking to quell opposition to the plan, Sharon's government increased by about one-third the compensation package offered to settlers in Gaza and at four small settlements in the northern West Bank that also will be evacuated, to about $880 million. That works out to between $200,000 and $500,000 per settler family.

Many Palestinians fear, however, that Sharon will use the pullout as a pretext for permanently annexing large Jewish settlement blocks in the West Bank. The prime minister has said that the Gaza withdrawal will strengthen Israel's claim to those areas, which the Palestinians want for their future state.

Abbas is seeking to build internal support in advance of what may be unpopular concessions to Israel. The Palestinian leadership Wednesday approved a new Cabinet that is expected to put Abbas allies in several key posts.

Palestinian sources and news reports said the lineup would include Gen. Nasser Yousef as minister for internal security. The appointment is seen as an important step toward bringing the fractious Palestinian security forces under unified command.

Arafat's nephew, Nasser Kidwa, is expected to be named foreign minister. He served previously as the Palestinians' envoy to the United Nations.

The new Cabinet is to be presented to Palestinian lawmakers next week.

One unexpected wrinkle in the events surrounding the Gaza withdrawal emerged Wednesday when Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz cut short the tenure of the army's chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Moshe Yaalon. That means a new commander will take over this summer, just days before the pullout is to begin.


http://www.latimes.com/news/nationw...ry?coll=la-headlines-world&ctrack=2&cset=true

Is this a smart move?
 
Israel, like the US is in the uncomfortable position of having to attempt all means of peace, even when it seems obvious that they may be leaving themselves open to some attack. The important thing is that definate, verifiable criteria are put down that the Palestinians need to follow. If they do, in good faith, then I agree that this would be a good thing. Problem is, I would be surprised if it lasts 1 month.
 
Kathianne said:
Israel, like the US is in the uncomfortable position of having to attempt all means of peace, even when it seems obvious that they may be leaving themselves open to some attack. The important thing is that definate, verifiable criteria are put down that the Palestinians need to follow. If they do, in good faith, then I agree that this would be a good thing. Problem is, I would be surprised if it lasts 1 month.

That is so true, a country like Israel that just wants to live in peace on their 4 by 4 plot of land seems to be making all the concessions. I think a month is being generous.
 
1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. (NKJV)
 
freeandfun1 said:
1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. (NKJV)

Do you listen to Isreal National Radio? They think Sharon is going to be the last Prime Minister before the main event.
 
Said1 said:
Do you listen to Isreal National Radio? They think Sharon is going to be the last Prime Minister before the main event.

If you look at revelations it seems the end does start with Israel. Not a big surprise given the long tumultuos history there.
 
Bonnie said:
If you look at revelations it seems the end does start with Israel. Not a big surprise given the long tumultuos history there.
2 I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.
3 And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold a girl for wine, that they might drink.
9 Proclaim ye this among the Gentiles; Prepare war, wake up the mighty men, let all the men of war draw near; let them come up:
10 Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong.
19 Egypt shall be a desolation, and Edom shall be a desolate wilderness, for the violence against the children of Judah, because they have shed innocent blood in their land.
20 But Judah shall dwell for ever, and Jerusalem from generation to generation.
21 For I will cleanse their blood that I have not cleansed: for the LORD dwelleth in Zion.

Jerusalem Post: The peacemongers are back
Speaking with State Department personnel on Monday, US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice gave form to the Palestinian state that now stands at the center of American Middle East policy. "The Israelis," she said, "were going to have to recognize that there was going to have to be land for – contiguous land for the Palestinian state to exist on."

Contiguous land? Well, how can there be contiguity between Judea and Samaria on the east and the Gaza Strip on the west unless Israel is split in two? It's simple geography. Either Israel will separate two sections of the Palestinian state or the Palestinian state will divide Israel in two. And now we know where America stands on the issue.

If the peace agreements being put forth in Israel occur, a map of Israel, a land that is made up of Jews that come from all over the world after having been scattered by the Romans. An Israel that will be parted by the Gentiles..... might look like this - as prophecized in the Bible over 1,500 years ago before an Israel even existed.

46186_855-Israelmap1.jpg
 
Said1 said:
I know, and it's also one thing they say A LOT on that station.

It all starts with Israel being divided. Then Damascus is destroyed, then Russia and Iran attack Israel. It is all written but so many ignore it every day as it happens right before their very eyes.

They claim that people read the Bible and then make events "fit" what is happening today. What they don't get is; does it really matter?" No matter "how" it fits, it fits and either way, it keeps "fitting" and fits more and more everyday.
 
freeandfun1 said:
It all starts with Israel being divided. Then Damascus is destroyed, then Russia and Iran attack Israel. It is all written but so many ignore it every day as it happens right before their very eyes.

They claim that people read the Bible and then make events "fit" what is happening today. What they don't get is; does it really matter?" No matter "how" it fits, it fits and either way, it keeps "fitting" and fits more and more everyday.

Apparently we are also living in the times that the 3rd Secret of Fatima deatils. I agree it fits no matter how you look at it, or who's interpretation you chose to read. Scary, facinating stuff.
 
Said1 said:
Apparently we are also living in the times that the 3rd Secret of Fatima deatils. I agree it fits no matter how you look at it, or who's interpretation you chose to read. Scary, facinating stuff.

If Im not mistaken I think the last child of Fatima just recently died? Did she ever reveal the final secret or is the Pope keeping that one quiet? I understand that when he read it he wept.

Im not so sure the end has to be set in stone though, I have a sliver of hope that we will learn from past mistakes.
 
Bonnie said:
If Im not mistaken I think the last child of Fatima just recently died? Did she ever reveal the final secret or is the Pope keeping that one quiet? I understand that when he read it he wept.

Im not so sure the end has to be set in stone though, I have a sliver of hope that we will learn from past mistakes.

Regardless of if we learn from past mistakes, it will eventually occur. And according to Biblical Scholars, we are living in the "70th Week" of Daniel not only in world happenings but also in timing.
 
You know, if you said that was written by Nostradamus or that it appeared in this week's "Vouge", "Cosmo", "Glamour" or "Yoga" magazine's horoscope section, people would take it to the bank.
 
Said1 said:
What's that?

First off, a little correction, not YET in the 70th week, but very close. Did you know that for the first time in voer 400 years a special group of Rabbis has been assembled to discuss the rebuilding of the temple? It is likely that any land exchange deals with Palestine will allow for the rebuilding of the temple by the Jews in Jerusalem.

The seventy weeks of Daniel, was a message delivered to Daniel from God, through the angel Gabriel. The message contained a blueprint for world events, revolving around Daniel’s people, the Jews, and his holy city, Jerusalem. In Daniel 9:24, Gabriel informs Daniel with the completion of the 490-years on his people and city (70 Weeks), the Messianic Age[ will have begun. However, before the Messianic Age, Messiah the prince will be killed or “Cutoff”. According to the qualifiers, specified by Gabriel, the Messiah is cutoff on Passover, 33 A.D. (See Daniel’s Timeline. #1) This corresponds with the close of 69 weeks[2] (69x7) or 483 years. From the command of the King of Persia, Artexerxes, who gave word to Nehemiah (Neh. 2:8) to rebuild the walls and gates of Jerusalem (Daniel 9:25), to The killing of Messiah the prince, was 69 weeks or 483-years. In Daniel 9:26, Gabriel informs Daniel after the Messiah the prince is killed the Temple and Jerusalem would be destroyed by a group of people, descendents of The prince who is to come. The people who came were the Romans, linking the future prince or ruler to the Roman empire.
The 69th week closes with Messiah the prince being cutoff, but the 70 weeks are not yet complete. The killing of the Messiah, stopped the prophetic clock, before it was completed. There is one week or seven-year period remaining. This seven-year period begins with the confirming of a covenant with many regarding a future Jewish Temple.
 
freeandfun1 said:
You know, if you said that was written by Nostradamus or that it appeared in this week's "Vouge", "Cosmo", "Glamour" or "Yoga" magazine's horoscope section, people would take it to the bank.

Boy that is a whole lotta truth there!!!
 
Bonnie said:
Boy that is a whole lotta truth there!!!

New ageism... the melding of all the world's religions into one.

I read a book a while backwritten by I guess a Gnostic. It is titled "Beyond Belief: The Secret Gospel of Thomas". it is one of those, "we are all G-d" philosophies. We will be with him, but we are NOT him. New-ageism combines em all together to form one "within" us.

Just my take.
 
freeandfun1 said:
New ageism... the melding of all the world's religions into one.

I read a book a while backwritten by I guess a Gnostic. It is titled "Beyond Belief: The Secret Gospel of Thomas". it is one of those, "we are all G-d" philosophies. We will be with him, but we are NOT him. New-ageism combines em all together to form one "within" us.

Just my take.

Sounds a lot like Scientology.....we have the power within us etc......I think that's also called moral relativism.
 

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