Israel caps Palestinians water: Amnesty

[Coyote]

This may explain a bit.




http://www.nyjtimes.com/cover/05-06-...raeliWater.htm

w]hen Gaza was turned over to the sole ruling authority of Arafat's PA, it received total control of the Gaza aquifer - which at the time was still functioning and producing potable water. Within less than two years under Palestinian Arab management, the Gaza Aquifer was ruined, contaminated beyond repair. If the PA is incapable of taking care of its own aquifer to supply water to its residents, how can Israel place its trust in the same Authority to care and conserve water sources that supply Israeli taps?"

This may explain a bit more (from a 2005 article):

How Occupation Affects Palestinians Access to Water

Palestinians access water from wells, but they also have water springs, tankers, roof tanks, cisterns, and reservoirs. Unfortunately, over 70 per cent of the people in Gaza live in poverty15, so most people cannot afford to replace damaged tankers, let alone have money to pay water bills. In fact, “numerous families suffer from a lack of funds to pay for wastewater evacuation tankers. The resulting pollution is having a direct negative effect on the state of sanitation and hygiene.”16

How much waste water is in the aquifer? More than 30 MCM returns to the aquifer without any prior treatment, therefore polluting it.17 When open waste water and water containing fertilizer for irrigating crops and pesticides has not been subjected to purification it drains into the ground water. Hence, it contaminates the existing water supply.

As a sidebar to the health ailments discussed in the previous section, human consumption of water with “…pesticides can lead to paralysis, heart failure, and gradual damage to the nervous system.”18 These problems illustrate the importance of ground, roof and wastewater tankers to people living with an archaic water network in the Mediterranean region.

Moreover, what compounds Palestinian health problems is the violence they are subjected to by Israeli forces and Israeli settlers. For example in December 2004, The Khan Younis and Rafah Governorates experienced an Israeli incursion that resulted in: “destruction of rainwater harvesting ponds and agricultural well near Morag settlement. This includes eight green houses and 24 dunums that were damaged…”19 and throughout the incursion “…four wells located near Gosh Katif settlement compound were maintained with difficulties by the maintenance team….were risking their lives since the Israeli forces were prohibiting any one from reaching the area.”20

This violence is not isolated to incursions because the field survey went on to explain that a municipal well in Al Naser that served two communities with a population of 13,000 had been closed for three months. As a result, “…the communities are forced to buy water from the nearby agricultural wells.”21 When Palestinians approached Israeli forces to arrange for access to the well “…Israeli forces forced them to go back after firing on them.”22

Since Israel transferred the Israeli settlers out of Gaza and into the West Bank during the Gaza Withdrawal in August 2005 some people may think that problems with violence between Israelis and Palestinians no longer exist in Gaza. However, Palestinians still live under occupation because Israeli forces still control all entry points (checkpoints), borders and border crossings, as well as sea and air space. In essence, Israeli soldiers decide who and what flows in and out of Gaza.

The other dimension of occupation that may not come to mind immediately is the fact that 38 years of occupation left a path of destruction in Gaza. A recent survey by a well-known Palestinian political figure and doctor explains there are “…charred and uprooted palm and fruit trees, acres of fields and dozens of kilometers of roads and infrastructure bulldozed, water mains ploughed out and electric lines torn down.”23 In addition, the tons of sand Israelis removed before leaving the settlements will intensify the sea water intrusion of the aquifer already taking place. Therefore the Gaza Withdrawal caused considerable environmental damage that Palestinians have to take into account when rebuilding the area.

By the way, the 7.9 MCM/yr of water the former Israeli settlers of Gaza were consuming consisted of 4.1 MCM from the aquifer and another 3.8 MCM transported by Mekorot at a subsidized price.24 Palestinians have the opportunity to purchase the 3.8 MCM at 3 NIS (.67 U.S. cents) per cubic meter. How much is the annual cost? The Palestinian Water Authority would have to spend NIS $11.4 M or U.S. $2.6 M for the transport of Mekorot water to Gaza’s borders.

With current, desperate conditions and the violence that has caused severe damage to Palestinian infrastructure why should Palestinians have to pay for a natural resource that should already be available to them?

The next and final section will explore briefly other, viable solutions to Gaza’s water crisis.

 

[Coyote]

Link, please.

I took that back a bit ago, Kalem is not an extremist, Kalem is weak and knows nothing of Moslem culture.

An Extremist I can respect, I do not agree with an Extremist but I can respect a man that fights for a cause.

Kalem on the other hand is a pretender, Kalem knows nothing of the Moslem culture nor the traditions, sure Kalem reads a bit but Kalem openly admits to being completely biased dismissing all Western works as "coloring books". With that kind of bigotry its no wonder kalem never strays from the Koran into reality of Moslem culture.

Kalem even stated that Russia of the USSR times was of the Western Countries and that the USSR was not of the Eastern Bloc, talk about being ignorant of simple history of only a decade or so ago.

So kalem, please continue to "cut and paste" the quran, the koran, the crayon, for "It is Allah's will you post as a fool".

So...yet again you are "attacking the messanger". Hmmm.
...for someone who whined long and loud about that, you seem to enjoy doing it.


Kalam did not say the USSR was not of the Eastern Bloc.

Russia and USSR is west and east and it has nothing to do with artificial Cold War constructs.

Aside from that....are you related to Publius?

 

[Coyote]

more *******! Lets KILL EM and be done with it! Israel's ******* should have known better than to be alive when a jew wants land. Clearly, gas chambers should be erected and palis, who don't exist anyway so who will miss them, should be exterminated WIDE SCALE. Fuck em, right? They are not as human as jews anyway and don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. We don't see any Geronimos out there bugging America, RIGHT? I wonder if there are any jews who can get a good deal on smallpox ridden blankets. Maybe some bottled water with anthrax in it. Anything less would CLEARLY be antisemitism and would convey that you just want to see dead jews floating in the sea. The burning bush LORD hath SPOKEN! Canaan didn't deserve to live when a jew wanted THAT land either so, given the precedence, what is the problem with killing off palis, and muslims, wholesale?


/sarcasm.

Just goes to show. Don't ever follow advice from a burning bush.

 

[mdn2000]

I took that back a bit ago, Kalem is not an extremist, Kalem is weak and knows nothing of Moslem culture.

If saying that I know nothing about "Muslim culture" makes you feel better about having your ass whipped raw with Qur'anic scripture and ahadith, you're welcome to do so. No, I don't know a great deal about Arab culture (the is no such thing as "Muslim" culture; Islam is an international religion.) I do know about Islam, and I will continue to smoke you in any argument you attempt to start about it.

edit: and I will keep your quote in my signature for a while as a testament to your unparalleled idiocy.

My ass ripped raw, why not go to the thread you speak of, you know the one where you stated the old USSR is a Western country.

That was also where you cut and pasted a list of references from wikipedia.

You ignored the "ahadith", before I brought the "ahadith" up you did not mention it once and even after the I brought up your ignoring the "ahadith" you still ignored it.

You also stated the western books on Islam were all biased and nothing more than coloring books.

You know nothing of Islamic culture hence your inability to relate the honor killing of young woman to Islamic culture.

Kalem, your post only showed Kalem to be completely ignorant of Islamic history, culture, tradition and how the works of Mohammed are interpetted by the people.

Kalem specifically demonstrated that Kalem has not read the Western worlds great unbiased books detailing history, culuture and tradition of Islam.

Hell, one book I was using was written by Majid Khadduri, an Iraqi, Kalem ignorantly labeled this book as a biased western coloring book.

So Kalem, how about that cut and paste list of sources straight from wikipedia.

Here are some books written by Muslims that you may want to read:

Qur'an - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sahih al-Bukhari - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sahih Muslim - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Al-Sunan al-Sughra - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sunan Abu Dawood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sunan al-Tirmidhi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sunan ibn Maja - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Mishkat al-Masabih - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Al-Muwatta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

What a fool, Kalem an expert on Islam? Yet Kalem is busy cutting and pasting from wikipedia. kalem could not site the books nor does kalem know Islam, Kalem just goes to wikipedia and comes up with an answer. Thank Allah for wikipedia.

Kalem has posted as fool who potrays himself as being all knowing. It is Allah's will that we look at kalem as a fool.

 

[mdn2000]

Coyote,

So...yet again you are "attacking the messanger". Hmmm.
...for someone who whined long and loud about that, you seem to enjoy doing it.

Yep, except in this case the attack is not merely a flame, it points out that this paticular messenger called a ambassador of the USSR a westerner, try as you might, the USSR and its people were never considered westerners. To call a book by the USSR's ambassador to Persia a "biased western book" was a very gross error showing Kalem does not know the subject in which Kalem pretends to be an expert of.

I am sure Kalem appreciates your support but you have not made the case that the USSR was a western country and that books written in the USSR were considered western works.

Further when Kalem can call a book written by an Iraqi citizen a biased western work, a coloring book, that shows kalem to be a bigot, a fool, and very ignorant.

The best non biased source of information about Islam is western works, indisputable. Kalem has demonstrated Kalem does not read these great works on Islam. Kalem cannot even describe the authors accurately, he simply calls them "travelers", very ignorant, the USSR ambassador to persia was a traveler, an Iraqi citizen was a traveler, Doughty was traveler? Very ignorant indeed.

Kalem never heard of the books I sourced, books I own. Kalem can search wikipedia all he likes and I am glad he does, what a joke, wikipedia and kalem.

Coyote can defend Kalem all Coyote wants, yet Kalem called an Eastern Bloc country a western country. Thats a mistake of an ignornant biased fool.

 

[Kalam]

My ass ripped raw, why not go to the thread you speak of, you know the one where you stated the old USSR is a Western country.

I stated that an author from Russia was "Western", which is absolutely true. "Western" denotes something from Europe, whose eastern border is defined by the Ural Mountains.

That was also where you cut and pasted a list of references from wikipedia.

I provided links to relevant articles on Wikipedia; the list was my own.

You ignored the "ahadith", before I brought the "ahadith" up you did not mention it once and even after the I brought up your ignoring the "ahadith" you still ignored it.

Are you still going to make this claim after I went through my posts to you and highlighted specific references I made to various ahadith? Gah, the stupid - it burns. "Ahadith" is plural, by the way.

Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah: A Bedouin gave the Pledge of allegiance to Allah's Apostle for Islam and the Bedouin got a fever where upon he said to the Prophet "Cancel my Pledge." But the Prophet refused. He came to him (again) saying, "Cancel my Pledge.' But the Prophet refused. Then (the Bedouin) left (Medina). Allah's Apostle said: "Medina is like a pair of bellows: It expels its impurities and brightens and clears its good."

- Sahih Bukhari, Ahkaam (Judgment), no. 316

Narrated Abu Huraira: The Prophet came across me in one of the streets of Medina and at that time I was Junub. So I slipped away from him and went to take a bath. On my return the Prophet said, "O Abu Huraira! Where have you been?" I replied, "I was Junub, so I disliked to sit in your company." The Prophet said, "Subhan Allah! A believer never becomes impure." - Sahih Bukhari, Ghusl, no. 281

• Sexual intercourse or any kind of sexual discharge (Sahih Muslim, Haid, no. 616 and others)
• Reaching puberty - full ablution is required every Friday (Sahih Bukhari, Characteristics of Prayer, no. 817)
• Dying (Sahih Bukhari, Janaaiz)

You also stated the western books on Islam were all biased

I stated that 19th-century European travel accounts were not reliable sources of information on Islam, not that everything produced in the West was "biased." I stand by what I actually said.

and nothing more than coloring books.

Actually, I suggested that most of your library consisted of coloring books. You misinterpreted that as a claim that "all Western books" are coloring books.

You know nothing of Islamic culture hence your inability to relate the honor killing of young woman to Islamic culture.

"Honor killing" cannot be linked to any teaching of the Islamic religion. There is no "Islamic culture," and the culture of the Arab Middle East isn't of particular concern to me.

Kalem, your post only showed Kalem to be completely ignorant of Islamic history,

This is absolutely untrue.

culture,

There is no such thing.

tradition

This couldn't be more untrue.

and how the works of Mohammed are interpetted by the people.

And I'm not exactly sure what you mean here. What do you consider to be Muhammad's "works" keeping in mind that he was an illiterate? The Qur'an is the word of Allah (SWT) and hadith collections are the works of their respective compilers.

Kalem specifically demonstrated that Kalem has not read the Western worlds great unbiased books detailing history, culuture and tradition of Islam.

I've read contemporary Western works on Islam and the Middle East; I simply tend to avoid 19th-century travel logs because I'm not an idiot.

Hell, one book I was using was written by Majid Khadduri, an Iraqi,

No reference was ever made to "Majid Khadduri."

Kalem ignorantly labeled this book as a biased western coloring book.

Please quote me describing the book you never cited as a "biased western coloring book." Thank you.

So Kalem, how about that cut and paste list of sources straight from wikipedia.

As I said, I thought of the list on my own. The works are extremely basic and are widely considered the defining texts of Sunni Islam. I provided links to Wikipedia so that you could read more about each, and now you claim that I took the list itself from that website. You're quite the moron.

What a fool, Kalem an expert on Islam? Yet Kalem is busy cutting and pasting from wikipedia. kalem could not site the books nor does kalem know Islam, Kalem just goes to wikipedia and comes up with an answer. Thank Allah for wikipedia.

Don't be ridiculous. You currently hold the distinction of being the only non-Muslim on USMB foolish enough to think he knows more about Islam than I do. I will gladly demonstrate that your beliefs are erroneous.

You would do well to carry on future exchanges with me knowing that I'm your superior as far as knowledge of Islam is concerned. I say this not an attempt to boast, but as a statement of fact that will prevent you from making a fool of yourself if you take it into consideration.

 

[mdn2000]

I stated that an author from Russia was "Western", which is absolutely true. "Western" denotes something from Europe, whose eastern border is defined by the Ural Mountains.

Russia is Asia, not Europe, hence wrong again, further Western culture, the Western world, and Western writers are what we spoke of, not geography, back pedal all you like but the Eastern Bloc is not Europe, the USSR is in Asia as in Continent, a tiny part is in Europe, either way the USSR is not of the western world, if you educated yourself you would know this.

Are you still going to make this claim after I went through my posts to you and highlighted specific references I made to various ahadith? Gah, the stupid - it burns. "Ahadith" is plural, by the way.

I will call it the Hadith, your obfuscation of the fact is immature, prior to me bringing up the Hadith you had not mentioned the Hadith in reference to the honor killings.

"Honor killing" cannot be linked to any teaching of the Islamic religion. There is no "Islamic culture," and the culture of the Arab Middle East isn't of particular concern to me.

Kalem, you do not know Islamic culture and tradition nor do you seem to grasp the different elements of the religion as practised by moslems, I am not the only one pointing this out. Further you have demonstrated you have not read any "biased western coloring books" (to use kalem's words)nwhich are the best sources on Islam.

Kalem completely dismissed and mischaracerized a book Kalem knew nothing about, that my freind is one sign of a bigot and is certainly demonstrating gross ignorance.

No reference was ever made to "Majid Khadduri

You are correct, you think I post as a fool, not so, I purposely quoted the book without referencing the author or the name to see if Kalem would dismiss the works of a man who was born an Iraqi in Iraq. You fell for my simple trick proving your ignorance and bigotry.

And again you fell for my taunts giving me the oppurtunity to "rip your ass to shreds", if I may borrow a quote from Kalem.

As I said, I thought of the list on my own. The works are extremely basic and are widely considered the defining texts of Sunni Islam. I provided links to Wikipedia so that you could read more about each, and now you claim that I took the list itself from that website. You're quite the moron.

Wikipedia is not a source, no scholar uses wikipedia, your list looked like a cut and paste I dont buy your explanation after the fact. The books I cite I own, I can hold them in my hands, if you provided me with a list of books I would find them on ebay or amazon and order the books and read them for myself. You use wikipedia and call me the moron. Nice try.

Please quote me describing the book you never cited as a "biased western coloring book." Thank you.

You never said "biased western", nor described my books as "coloring books", bullshit, quote yourself, you ridicule my books and now claim to be the victim. Very nice indeed.

Don't be ridiculous. You currently hold the distinction of being the only non-Muslim on USMB foolish enough to think he knows more about Islam than I do. I will gladly demonstrate that your beliefs are erroneous.

You have amply demonstrated you know nothing of Islam other than what is in wikipedia, you call the western books biased, you call the western books coloring books, you dismiss people as biased who have lived in places you have never set foot in. Sorry Kalem, you dont know more than me because you have not read the works of those who have lived where Kalem will never be, Arabia and the Middle East.

Kalem could not even recognize aspects of the murder that have been aspects of Islamic murders for centuries, you know why, because kalem does not read the hundreds of books that detail the culture, tradition, and religion of Islam.

And as we can all see, as a fanatic Kalem wishes to be an extremist, where the badge proudly, for its Allah's will that the non-moslems point out your ignorance and treat you like a dog, its Allah's will, is it not Kalem.

As Kalem cannot argue, its Allah will that I, a non-moslem show superior intellect and demonstrate Kalems narrow, bigoted, poor, education.

Allah has willed the western world superior to that of the world of Islam, all our great universities, even that great computer Kalem uses was invented and built by the non-moslems. Hell, since the Turkish-Moslem rule the world of Islam became a big cesspool that even the dogs avoided, it was the western world that built Islam into what it is today, the Arabs could not rise up and cannot stand up without the western world and this is what irks them the most. This is why they strap bombs onto children, its because they are simply too weak to stand and fight on their own. Imagine the greatest Moslems attacking woman and children.

go ahead, where the badge of extremists, shows you to be fool

I will be waiting for your great Islamic source, wikipedia, I imagine a true moslem would slap you for referencing wikipedia.

 

[Coyote]

Russia is Asia, not Europe, hence wrong again, further Western culture, the Western world, and Western writers are what we spoke of, not geography, back pedal all you like but the Eastern Bloc is not Europe, the USSR is in Asia as in Continent, a tiny part is in Europe, either way the USSR is not of the western world, if you educated yourself you would know this.

Umm...no.

Russia is Asia AND Europe - it's where East meets West. Simply doing a search on Russia, East, West brings up a startling array of book titles on Russia - East or West. That position has shaped it's cultural heritage and political structures.

Much of the Eastern Bloc, I might add is now referred to as Eastern Europe.

 

[mdn2000]

Russia is Asia, not Europe, hence wrong again, further Western culture, the Western world, and Western writers are what we spoke of, not geography, back pedal all you like but the Eastern Bloc is not Europe, the USSR is in Asia as in Continent, a tiny part is in Europe, either way the USSR is not of the western world, if you educated yourself you would know this.

Umm...no.

Russia is Asia AND Europe - it's where East meets West. Simply doing a search on Russia, East, West brings up a startling array of book titles on Russia - East or West. That position has shaped it's cultural heritage and political structures.

Much of the Eastern Bloc, I might add is now referred to as Eastern Europe.

You can speak of geography all you want, its still a fact that the USSR was never of the western world. You must be pretty young not to know this. Kalem as well as coyote do not know this simple fact, so how much can these two know about Islam, not much, anyone can cut and paste from wikipedia.

I agree Kalem was speaking of geography when Kalem called my books "biased, western, coloring books by western travelers (I paraphrased)." Pretty moronic. Let me explain and I will type slowly so you u n d e r s t a n d.

The Western world or Western Civilization as spoken and taught is spoken of Western Europe, not Eastern Europe, Eastern Europe was part of the Eastern block that included Russia.

Western Civilization to Include Western Culture differed greatly do to the simple reason we were divided politically. Communist countries of the East, Democratic countries of the West. Nato countries are always refered to as Western countries, Japan, Singapore, the Phillipines are considered Western civilization as well because they are or were allies of Western Europe as well as the United States.

So if Kalem wishes to speak of books as Western and Kalem than explains Kalem was speaking geographically than Kalem does not know the difference between the Western world and the Eastern Bloc.

Kalem does not know what its meant when he speaks of books as western this is because Kalem has a very narrow education if any education at all. I wonder how educated Kalem can be when he admits he does not read "western books on history" because Kalem calls all western books coloring books.

Kalem simply is cutting and pasting from wikipedia, I will quote Kalem's wiki source once again.

As I said, I thought of the list on my own. The works are extremely basic and are widely considered the defining texts of Sunni Islam. I provided links to Wikipedia so that you could read more about each, and now you claim that I took the list itself from that website. You're quite the moron.

You did not cut and paste you just felt it was proper to type Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia after each book you listed, bullshit Kalem, you cut and pasted and like a moron you refuse to admit even one mistake, just like you cannot admit you made a mistake when you called an Eastern Block country western

Here are some books written by Muslims that you may want to read:

Qur'an - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sahih al-Bukhari - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sahih Muslim - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Al-Sunan al-Sughra - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sunan Abu Dawood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sunan al-Tirmidhi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Sunan ibn Maja - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Mishkat al-Masabih - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Al-Muwatta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Kalem knows nothing of Islam history, culture, tradition, and most likely the religion. Any one can cut and paste and just about everything Kalem posts is a cut and paste, Kalem even cuts and pastes selective quotes from the Koran.

kalem who did not know the difference between the East and the West knows less about Islam.

I will wait for Kalem to find a response Kalem can cut and paste and post.

 

[Kalam]

We will continue our discussion when you either demonstrate that I've "copied and pasted" my arguments or admit that I haven't, and when you agree to never again state or imply that I'm not a "real" Muslim.

 

[Coyote]

Russia is Asia, not Europe, hence wrong again, further Western culture, the Western world, and Western writers are what we spoke of, not geography, back pedal all you like but the Eastern Bloc is not Europe, the USSR is in Asia as in Continent, a tiny part is in Europe, either way the USSR is not of the western world, if you educated yourself you would know this.

You are a bit confused here. You are the one talking about geography (in relation to the proportion of Russia that lies on the Asian continent). I'm not talking about geography - I'm talking about culture - a term of specified many times. Russia - culturally - is "Eurasian" - it has aspects of both Europe and Asia through out it.

The "Eastern Bloc" - is a mixture of Europe and Eurasian countries. The east and west demarkation was solely in relative to Communism and the "Free World" and has nothing to do with culture.

When you are looking at Islam through the lens of writers you are not looking at East and West in relation to communism but culture.

I'm not sure how much simpler it can be expressed.

Now educate yourself

You can speak of geography all you want, its still a fact that the USSR was never of the western world. You must be pretty young not to know this. Kalem as well as coyote do not know this simple fact, so how much can these two know about Islam, not much, anyone can cut and paste from wikipedia.

Again, when we are talking about Western and Eastern writers describing cultures we are not talking about cold war boundaries.

I agree Kalem was speaking of geography when Kalem called my books "biased, western, coloring books by western travelers (I paraphrased)." Pretty moronic. Let me explain and I will type slowly so you u n d e r s t a n d.

Please don't type slowly, I don't want to be responsible for you straining yourself or pulling a mental muscle or anything

The Western world or Western Civilization as spoken and taught is spoken of Western Europe, not Eastern Europe, Eastern Europe was part of the Eastern block that included Russia.

Not when you are talking about cultural viewpoints - and that is what matters here.

Western Civilization to Include Western Culture differed greatly do to the simple reason we were divided politically. Communist countries of the East, Democratic countries of the West. Nato countries are always refered to as Western countries, Japan, Singapore, the Phillipines are considered Western civilization as well because they are or were allies of Western Europe as well as the United States.

Of course. In relation to global politics, you are right - but NOT when you are talking about culture.

So if Kalem wishes to speak of books as Western and Kalem than explains Kalem was speaking geographically than Kalem does not know the difference between the Western world and the Eastern Bloc.

You are making a mishmash of political boundaries and geography in an attempt to make your point. It isn't working.

Kalem does not know what its meant when he speaks of books as western this is because Kalem has a very narrow education if any education at all. I wonder how educated Kalem can be when he admits he does not read "western books on history" because Kalem calls all western books coloring books.

I wonder how educated you are if you rely only on outside viewpoints to make judgements about another culture and religion. I suggest you read some Middle Eastern and other Islamic authors to provide a more balanced perspective. At this point, your perspective is no more "educated" than you think Kalam's is.

Kalem simply is cutting and pasting from wikipedia, I will quote Kalem's wiki source once again.

Kalam provided you with a list of books on Islam written by Islamic writers. He then found links to information about those books. Those links are Wikipedia. Wikipedia is a reasonable source for a synopsis of books. Short of providing the actual physical books to you, what is wrong with linking to Wiki for that sort of information? I suspect I could give you similar Wiki links to each of the books you claim to own and have read.

Rather than addressing those sources you are, instead, focusing on attacking the messenger's credability which does nothing to enhance your own

Kalem knows nothing of Islam history, culture, tradition, and most likely the religion. Any one can cut and paste and just about everything Kalem posts is a cut and paste, Kalem even cuts and pastes selective quotes from the Koran.

Kalam does more than "cut and paste" - he asks questions that indicate he has more than a passing knowledge of his religion and gives answers with context - not empty quotes or questionable claims of expert knowledge :shrug:

kalem who did not know the difference between the East and the West knows less about Islam.

I will wait for Kalem to find a response Kalem can cut and paste and post.

[/quote]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion...vociferous as it is

You sure you aren't related to Pubes?

 

[mdn2000]

We will continue our discussion when you either demonstrate that I've "copied and pasted" my arguments or admit that I haven't, and when you agree to never again state or imply that I'm not a "real" Muslim.

I could care less to continue any conversation with you Kalem, I have demonstred how Kalem is wrong, how kalem does not even understand the difference between the east and west. Kalem has shown us how kalem will refuse to acknowledge facts, kalem has shown how Kalem willl stereotype all books westerrn, kalem has shown how kalem speaks of thing kalem has no knowledge, kalem mischaracterized and stereotyped an Iraqi and Russina writer as "biased western travelers".

Kalem knows nothing and can demand nothing.

I taunted kalem into posting and responding to me, kalem does not wish to be confronted with my facts again, hence kalem makes a fool's demand,

I do not engage fools and the ignorant, I simply posts facts, if those facts make kalem feel the fool, so be it, if Kalem must use his stated excuse to hide from truths and facts, that dont bother me, I actually like when the fools and morons dont post.

Of course I also enjoy pointing out how Kalem cannot debate and does not know Islam, if Kalem wishes to hide with the dogs, that is kalem's character and I am glad to see kalem demonstrate Kalem's character.

I cant wait until kalem posts, such an easy mark. Go ahead Kalem, post something stupid, again.

 

[Kalam]

We will continue our discussion when you either demonstrate that I've "copied and pasted" my arguments or admit that I haven't, and when you agree to never again state or imply that I'm not a "real" Muslim.

 

[Kalam]

hence kalem makes a fool's demand,

Demanding that you prove that my arguments are "copied and pasted" seems entirely reasonable given that your posts are built entirely around that and similarly asinine claims. We will address this issue so that you'll be forced to post with a bit of substance for a change.

 

[Kalam]

Kalem cannot debate and does not know Islam

I am still very interested in hearing how studying the Qur'an and most of the major works of the Sunni canon on a daily basis makes one "unknowledgeable" concerning the Islamic religion. Remember, it is you who was not aware that Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim were hadith collections; they're easily the most famous and anyone the least bit familiar with the religion of Islam would be familiar with these works as well. Do you see why it's so difficult for me to take you seriously?

 

[Charles Stucker]

Biased source is biased.

This is what I hate about the Palestinian issue - every source has a side and the truth is obscured.
I recently looked up the Water situation in Israel and it is short, like the western States of the USA. Not enough water means someone does without. Happens everywhere, with every commodity.
Perhaps the Palestinians should move, en mass, somewhere with more water. I will happily donate the state of Maine, which has ample water, to house the displaced population.
If the Palestinians demand somewhere with an Islamic government, well there are several such nations through Africa and Asia.
Oddly, I cannot find another Jewish nation for all the Israeli's.

 

[Kalam]

This is a mostly unbiased source on the issue:
Middle East: MidEastWeb

It's based in Israel and operated by Christians, Muslims, and Jews.