Islam - Tolerance and Peace

[Sky Dancer]

There are Christian terrorists, (think Northern Ireland, for example) but no one thinks all Christians are terrorist. Just like some passage in the Q'uran are violent, some Bible passages are violent too. Yet, we wouldn't say that those who study the bible are violent.

There are some horrible goings on in the world in the name of Islam. I read plenty of stories. The goings on in Somalia alone are chilling. I posit that just like most Christians are peaceful, the majority of practicing Muslims are peaceful too.

Do you think like Ann Coulter's view is right? "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity." 1.5 billion human beings? Luckily, Ann Coulter doesn't speak for many Christians.


Counter terrorism by not giving in to paranoia. Terrorism is real. Islamophobia is bigotry.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Yet we don't see Christians killing every day in the name of God as Muslims do. Comparing Christians and Muslims in this regard is completely dishonest.

You're talking about terrorists. Militant extremists/terrorist/fanatics who misuse the religion for harm doing are a small number relative to the 1.5 billion practicing Muslims in the world. If you want to talk about Muslims you have to decide which Muslims in what country? Women are 50% of all practicing Muslims but the number of women engaging in terrorism is very small. How about the children who are practicing Muslims? Are they evil too?
http://www.islamicweb.com/begin/population.htm

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Yet we don't see Christians killing every day in the name of God as Muslims do. Comparing Christians and Muslims in this regard is completely dishonest.

You're talking about terrorists. Militant extremists/terrorist/fanatics who misuse the religion for harm doing are a small number relative to the 1.5 billion practicing Muslims in the world. If you want to talk about Muslims you have to decide which Muslims in what country? Women are 50% of all practicing Muslims but the number of women engaging in terrorism is very small. How about the children who are practicing Muslims? Are they evil too?
Population of Muslims around the world

And yet Gaza ELECTED a terror organization as their elected Government. Lebanon has a sizable portion of their Government also elected from a terror organization. Iran is a terror supporting State. Syria is a terror supporting State. Saudi Arabia also supports terrorists. Libya, Algeria, Tunisia all support Muslim Terrorists. Malaysia supports terror as well. Every Muslim State supports terrorists. Millions of Muslims volunteer to fight with terrorists, millions more pay to support terrorism.

Religion of peace my ass. The Christian churches went through a reformation and denounced Church sponsored murder and mayhem. Islam has done no such thing and is based off the teachings of a pedophile warrior that believed murder and mayhem were not only acceptable but the only way.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Yet we don't see Christians killing every day in the name of God as Muslims do. Comparing Christians and Muslims in this regard is completely dishonest.

You're talking about terrorists. Militant extremists/terrorist/fanatics who misuse the religion for harm doing are a small number relative to the 1.5 billion practicing Muslims in the world. If you want to talk about Muslims you have to decide which Muslims in what country? Women are 50% of all practicing Muslims but the number of women engaging in terrorism is very small. How about the children who are practicing Muslims? Are they evil too?
Population of Muslims around the world

And yet Gaza ELECTED a terror organization as their elected Government. Lebanon has a sizable portion of their Government also elected from a terror organization. Iran is a terror supporting State. Syria is a terror supporting State. Saudi Arabia also supports terrorists. Libya, Algeria, Tunisia all support Muslim Terrorists. Malaysia supports terror as well. Every Muslim State supports terrorists. Millions of Muslims volunteer to fight with terrorists, millions more pay to support terrorism.

Religion of peace my ass. The Christian churches went through a reformation and denounced Church sponsored murder and mayhem. Islam has done no such thing and is based off the teachings of a pedophile warrior that believed murder and mayhem were not only acceptable but the only way.

Feel better now? I'm glad you got that off your chest.

You fault the 1.5 billion Muslims for the governments they have?

You're imposing American reality of democracy and freedom on the rest of the world. Wake up call. They're not democracies.

You are listening to the terrorists and they have won. They have you believing in their propaganda. It's the propaganda of terrorism.

They have caused you to fear and hate 1.5 billion people because of the religion they practice. They are winning the propaganda war. A couple of tiny groups have you thinking it's a 1.5 billion army. You're as deluded as Neubarth. Demons under the potted plants!

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You're talking about terrorists. Militant extremists/terrorist/fanatics who misuse the religion for harm doing are a small number relative to the 1.5 billion practicing Muslims in the world. If you want to talk about Muslims you have to decide which Muslims in what country? Women are 50% of all practicing Muslims but the number of women engaging in terrorism is very small. How about the children who are practicing Muslims? Are they evil too?
Population of Muslims around the world

And yet Gaza ELECTED a terror organization as their elected Government. Lebanon has a sizable portion of their Government also elected from a terror organization. Iran is a terror supporting State. Syria is a terror supporting State. Saudi Arabia also supports terrorists. Libya, Algeria, Tunisia all support Muslim Terrorists. Malaysia supports terror as well. Every Muslim State supports terrorists. Millions of Muslims volunteer to fight with terrorists, millions more pay to support terrorism.

Religion of peace my ass. The Christian churches went through a reformation and denounced Church sponsored murder and mayhem. Islam has done no such thing and is based off the teachings of a pedophile warrior that believed murder and mayhem were not only acceptable but the only way.

Feel better now? I'm glad you got that off your chest.

You fault the 1.5 billion Muslims for the governments they have?

You're imposing American reality of democracy and freedom on the rest of the world. Wake up call. They're not democracies.

You are listening to the terrorists and they have won. They have you believing in their propaganda. It's the propaganda of terrorism.

They have caused you to fear and hate 1.5 billion people because of the religion they practice. They are winning the propaganda war. A couple of tiny groups have you thinking it's a 1.5 billion army. You're as deluded as Neubarth. Demons under the potted plants!

Moron, the Muslim religion RUNS those Governments. You are the deluded one. The Muslim RELIGION authorizes the murder of non Muslims. In fact it orders it if they can not be bought or converted. You claim the religion is not to blame when the doctrine and religious teachings of the Islamic religion are EXACTLY the problem.

They have YOU deluded. They have you duped. Islam demands that the WORLD be ruled by ISLAM. And to obtain that goal every person living must be converted or killed. Islam believes that the religion should run the Government.

You are to stupid to even discuss much with. You ignore reality and pretend some liberals politically correct vision of what they want the world to be is truth.

We are at WAR with ISLAM. Not because we want to be, but because ISLAM has declared war on us. We believe in freedom of religion, they do not. We believe in turn the other cheek, they believe in death or conversion. We believe in love thy neighbor, they believe in subjugation, murder, forced conversion, servitude. It is perfectly all right with Islam to lie to get their ends met. A Muslim is instructed not to have none Muslim friends and to lie to non Muslims to further their goals.

There is no getting along with Islam. It believes that the World must be ruled by Islam. All you have are those fighting for that now and those willing to wait to out breed us. WAKE the fuck up.

 

[Sky Dancer]

RGS- I feel sorry for you. You hate 1.5 billion people. That's an inconceivable (to me) number of people to hate. I don't think its very smart or skillful to get stuck in rage and hate. It's possible to love and still hold people accountable for their misdeeds.

Consider the potential to cultivate loving kindness toward the world's people. We are not at war with Islam. We are at war with terrorists and insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan. Why don't you pray for them? Pray that these people who are so misguided have the causes and conditions to live in an open society. Pray that they not be influenced by terrorists. Don't culivate a holy war. There is nothing holy about death and destruction, anger and hatred. Why pick up your cue card from terrorists? They need to be stopped but wiping out innocent people isn't the answer. You're right that much harm is done in the name of Islam. Don't copy them and wage war in the name of Jesus.

You're a man of religion. Use that religion to open your mind and heart. Show others the way through your loving kindness. Both loving kindness and skillful means are necessary to combat terrorism. Pray we have both qualites in abundance.

There is much we could talk about. It's not necessary to get bogged down in name calling. I'm sorry that I insulted you. That was wrong of me.

We could discuss the actual conditions in the countries you named. We could look the specific crimes against humanity smack in the face and vow to end them. We could discuss the complexity of causes and conditions that foster terrorism. Neither of us are Muslims. It doesn't make sense to pretend we understand that religion without actually talking to any Muslims.

We can talk about all these things. You may choose not to. It may be more satisfying to you to call me names instead of discussing alternate ideas.

I see things differently from you. I disagree with you. No more, no less. It's just another point of view. You think your view is correct and you see things clearly. I think I'm seeing things clearly. We're at an impasse.

I read your post and welcome any links. I've even been known to concede a point (if I have to) and change my mind.

I know this from the depth of my being. Not all Muslim people are bad. Not all Muslims are terrorists. Muslims are human beings.

 

[HUGGY]

In debates in the past regarding the ability of Islam to co-exist peacefully along side other religions, Malaysia has been held up as an example of this. With that in mind, I have researched and put together this summary of facts about that country.

Islam is the state sanctioned official religion of Malaysia

Nine of the Malaysian states have constitutional Malay monarchs (most of them styled as Sultans). These Malay rulers still maintain authority over religious affairs in states.

The newest format of the Malaysian Identity Card (MyKad) divides Malaysians into various religious groups, i.e. Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Buddhist.

The building of non-Muslim religious structures is strictly controlled by the government. In addition to this, the government also funds the construction of mosques and suraus.

Often the government will disapprove the setting up of Churches outright. In some cases, they have even resorted to demolishing churches in Muslim-majority areas, and setting up mosques in Muslim-minority areas. The Malaysian government has also persecuted Christian groups who were perceived to be attempting to proselytize to Muslim audiences.

In 2004 and 2005, the Government caused an uproar within the Chinese community by closing down and demolishing some ancient Chinese temples in Chinese-majority areas. In as recent as June 2006, the Government has demolished more than 30 Hindu temples in Hindu majority areas.

The construction or setting-up of non-Muslim places of worship are financed privately by the devotees themselves. This is in stark contrast to Muslim places of worship, which are built with public funds. Therefore, tax paying non-Muslims are forced to financially support Islam while being limited from establishing their own places of worship at their own expense.

Local housing bylaws require that the housing developer construct mosques in every new housing area regardless of the racial and religious demographics.

As defined by the constitution of Malaysia, Malays must be Muslim, regardless of their ethnic heritage; otherwise, legally, they are not Malay.

It is legally possible to become a Malay if a non-Malay citizen with a Malaysian parent converts to Islam.

At certain Malaysian institutions such as the International Islamic University, wearing of the tudung is mandatory; however for non-Muslim students this usually amounts to a loosely worn piece of cloth draped over the back of the head.
The tudung , or the hijab, is a symbol of a Muslim woman. This is such because it represents the modesty of a woman's way, as described by the religion.
Some find the tudung to be an indication of Arabic influence in Malay Muslim culture, and point to other incidents such as the banning of the traditional Malay wayang kulit in the state of Kelantan (which is ruled by the Islamist PAS) for being "un-Islamic".
As required by Malaysian law and defined in the Constitution, a Malay would surrender his ethnic status if he were not Muslim.

The nation maintains two parallel justice systems in the country (see: Courts of Malaysia). One is the secular justice system based upon laws gazetted by Parliament. The other is sharia (syaria, Islamic law). Ostensibly syariah courts only have jurisdiction over persons who declare themselves to be Muslims. Consequently, this results in non-Muslims not having legal standing in syariah courts.

The rules of sharia are set by the various sultans of the states. Historically a sultan had absolute authority over the state.

On September 29, 2001, the then Prime Minister, Tun Dr. Mahathir bin Mohamad declared that the country was an Islamic state (negara Islam).

Government in general supports Islamic religious establishment and it is the official policy to "infuse Islamic values" into the administration of the country.

For Muslim children, religious education according to a government-approved curriculum is compulsory in public schools.

The state of Selangor passed a legal amendment in 1989 that if an adult converts to Islam, any infant children become converted at the same moment.
Muslims who wish to convert from Islam face severe obstacles. For Muslims, particularly ethnic Malays, the right to leave the Islamic faith and adhere to another religion is a controversial question, and in practice it is very difficult for Muslims to change religions.

In 1999 the High Court ruled that secular courts have no jurisdiction to hear applications by Muslims to change religions. According to the ruling, the religious conversion of Muslims lies solely within the jurisdiction of Islamic courts.

The issue of Muslim apostasy is very sensitive. In 1998 after a controversial incident of attempted conversion, the Government stated that apostates (i.e., Muslims who wish to leave or have left Islam for another religion) would not face government punishment so long as they did not defame Islam after their conversion. However, whether the very act of conversion was an "insult to Islam" was not clarified at the time.

In April 2000, the state of Perlis passed a Shari’a law subjecting Islamic "deviants" and apostates to 1 year of "rehabilitation" (under the Constitution, religion, including Shari’a law, is a state matter). Leaders of the opposition Islamic party, PAS, have stated the penalty for apostasy — after the apostates are given a period of time to repent and they do not repent — is death.

Statistics indicate that Negeri Sembilan has the largest number of converts, with 840 applications made to renounce Islam in 2005, 62 of which succeeded. An academic has suggested that this is because Negeri Sembilan is the only state which permits conversion. A convert must first apply to the Syariah Court for a declaration that he or she is no longer a Muslim; the convert will then be counseled for about a year by a Mufti. If, after this period, the convert still wants to convert, the judge may permit the application. This process is unique to the state; no other state allows Muslims to officially convert. In five states — Perak, Malacca, Sabah, Terengganu, and Pahang — conversion is a criminal offense which can be punished by a fine or jail term. In Pahang, convicted converts may also be punished with up to six strokes of the cane.
Proselytizing of Muslims by members of other religions is prohibited in most states and can lead to lengthy jail sentences and many strokes of the rotan (whipping). Most Christian and a few other religious groups in Malaysia put a standard disclaimer on literature and advertisements stating "For non-Muslims only".

In 2002 the government banned the Bible in Malay (Al-Kitab Mahasuci) and in Iban (Bup Kudus).

Some states have laws that prohibit the use of Malay-language religious terms such as usage of the term "Allah" for God by Christians.

Generally, the Malaysian practice of Islam frowns upon dogs; the rationale being that they are unclean. n 2004, the town council of Subang Jaya made it a pre-condition of dog ownership that anyone applying for a dog license having a Muslim neighbor would be required to seek their "approval" before applying for a license.

The sale of pork and pork products is very restricted in Malaysia. Traders wishing to sell pork in some areas require prior authorization, particularly in predominantly Muslim regions. In practice this causes difficulty for the large Chinese population in Malaysia for whom pork is a part of every-day cuisine. There is constant regulatory pressure upon pig farms which has lead to many being closed down.

In Malaysia, there is an income tax. Money paid to "zakat" or the obligatory alm Muslims must give to the poor reduces the tax to be paid while money paid to other religions under similar circumstances is not given similar treatment:

• it reduces tax only if the particular beneficiary has obtained such status from the government, which is difficult in practice.

• even then, if money is donated to a non-Muslim religion it is only deducted from the income on which the amount of tax is based, while zakat is deducted from the amount of tax itself. For example, suppose a person earning RM 50,000 owes a tax of RM 3,000, and donates RM 1,000 to his religion. If he were non-Muslim he would then adjust his assessed income to RM 49,000. If he were Muslim then he would only have to pay RM 2,000 as the RM 1,000 would be deducted from the amount owed.
Movies which depict people considered prophets in Islam are generally censored or banned as the depiction of prophets is considered "haraam" (not allowed) under Islam.

Clearly, if there is religious tolerance in Malaysia, it is from the other religions, not from Muslims, which shows itself as decidedly intolerant.

Islam is just another flavor of stupid. All religions that make up gods are bunk.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

RGS- I feel sorry for you. You hate 1.5 billion people. That's an inconceivable (to me) number of people to hate. I don't think its very smart or skillful to get stuck in rage and hate. It's possible to love and still hold people accountable for their misdeeds.

Consider the potential to cultivate loving kindness toward the world's people. We are not at war with Islam. We are at war with terrorists and insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan. Why don't you pray for them? Pray that these people who are so misguided have the causes and conditions to live in an open society. Pray that they not be influenced by terrorists. Don't culivate a holy war. There is nothing holy about death and destruction, anger and hatred. Why pick up your cue card from terrorists? They need to be stopped but wiping out innocent people isn't the answer. You're right that much harm is done in the name of Islam. Don't copy them and wage war in the name of Jesus.

You're a man of religion. Use that religion to open your mind and heart. Show others the way through your loving kindness. Both loving kindness and skillful means are necessary to combat terrorism. Pray we have both qualites in abundance.

There is much we could talk about. It's not necessary to get bogged down in name calling. I'm sorry that I insulted you. That was wrong of me.

We could discuss the actual conditions in the countries you named. We could look the specific crimes against humanity smack in the face and vow to end them. We could discuss the complexity of causes and conditions that foster terrorism. Neither of us are Muslims. It doesn't make sense to pretend we understand that religion without actually talking to any Muslims.

We can talk about all these things. You may choose not to. It may be more satisfying to you to call me names instead of discussing alternate ideas.

I see things differently from you. I disagree with you. No more, no less. It's just another point of view. You think your view is correct and you see things clearly. I think I'm seeing things clearly. We're at an impasse.

I read your post and welcome any links. I've even been known to concede a point (if I have to) and change my mind.

I know this from the depth of my being. Not all Muslim people are bad. Not all Muslims are terrorists. Muslims are human beings.

Not all Nazis were evil, not all Nazis were bad. Not all Nazis supported death camps. Getting the idea yet?

 

[Sky Dancer]

RGS- I feel sorry for you. You hate 1.5 billion people. That's an inconceivable (to me) number of people to hate. I don't think its very smart or skillful to get stuck in rage and hate. It's possible to love and still hold people accountable for their misdeeds.

Consider the potential to cultivate loving kindness toward the world's people. We are not at war with Islam. We are at war with terrorists and insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan. Why don't you pray for them? Pray that these people who are so misguided have the causes and conditions to live in an open society. Pray that they not be influenced by terrorists. Don't culivate a holy war. There is nothing holy about death and destruction, anger and hatred. Why pick up your cue card from terrorists? They need to be stopped but wiping out innocent people isn't the answer. You're right that much harm is done in the name of Islam. Don't copy them and wage war in the name of Jesus.

You're a man of religion. Use that religion to open your mind and heart. Show others the way through your loving kindness. Both loving kindness and skillful means are necessary to combat terrorism. Pray we have both qualites in abundance.

There is much we could talk about. It's not necessary to get bogged down in name calling. I'm sorry that I insulted you. That was wrong of me.

We could discuss the actual conditions in the countries you named. We could look the specific crimes against humanity smack in the face and vow to end them. We could discuss the complexity of causes and conditions that foster terrorism. Neither of us are Muslims. It doesn't make sense to pretend we understand that religion without actually talking to any Muslims.

We can talk about all these things. You may choose not to. It may be more satisfying to you to call me names instead of discussing alternate ideas.

I see things differently from you. I disagree with you. No more, no less. It's just another point of view. You think your view is correct and you see things clearly. I think I'm seeing things clearly. We're at an impasse.

I read your post and welcome any links. I've even been known to concede a point (if I have to) and change my mind.

I know this from the depth of my being. Not all Muslim people are bad. Not all Muslims are terrorists. Muslims are human beings.

Not all Nazis were evil, not all Nazis were bad. Not all Nazis supported death camps. Getting the idea yet?

Should we hate all Germans for all time because they once elected Hitler and the Nazi party? How do you actually do it? Hold that much rage and hatred in your heart for 1.5 billion people? 25-30% of the world's population and you would wipe them all out.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

RGS- I feel sorry for you. You hate 1.5 billion people. That's an inconceivable (to me) number of people to hate. I don't think its very smart or skillful to get stuck in rage and hate. It's possible to love and still hold people accountable for their misdeeds.

Consider the potential to cultivate loving kindness toward the world's people. We are not at war with Islam. We are at war with terrorists and insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan. Why don't you pray for them? Pray that these people who are so misguided have the causes and conditions to live in an open society. Pray that they not be influenced by terrorists. Don't culivate a holy war. There is nothing holy about death and destruction, anger and hatred. Why pick up your cue card from terrorists? They need to be stopped but wiping out innocent people isn't the answer. You're right that much harm is done in the name of Islam. Don't copy them and wage war in the name of Jesus.

You're a man of religion. Use that religion to open your mind and heart. Show others the way through your loving kindness. Both loving kindness and skillful means are necessary to combat terrorism. Pray we have both qualites in abundance.

There is much we could talk about. It's not necessary to get bogged down in name calling. I'm sorry that I insulted you. That was wrong of me.

We could discuss the actual conditions in the countries you named. We could look the specific crimes against humanity smack in the face and vow to end them. We could discuss the complexity of causes and conditions that foster terrorism. Neither of us are Muslims. It doesn't make sense to pretend we understand that religion without actually talking to any Muslims.

We can talk about all these things. You may choose not to. It may be more satisfying to you to call me names instead of discussing alternate ideas.

I see things differently from you. I disagree with you. No more, no less. It's just another point of view. You think your view is correct and you see things clearly. I think I'm seeing things clearly. We're at an impasse.

I read your post and welcome any links. I've even been known to concede a point (if I have to) and change my mind.

I know this from the depth of my being. Not all Muslim people are bad. Not all Muslims are terrorists. Muslims are human beings.

Not all Nazis were evil, not all Nazis were bad. Not all Nazis supported death camps. Getting the idea yet?

Should we hate all Germans because they once elected Hitler and the Nazi party?

YOU are the one making the claim I hate anyone. Recognizing ones enemies and taking appropriate actions does not equate to hate. Islam preaches hate, Islam preaches world domination, Islam preaches the destruction of all other religions. Islam preaches murder and mayhem. The religion is dangerous. Recognizing that does not mean I hate Muslims.

Using your logic, since all Nazis were not evil, were not bad, did not support death camps, we should have just left them to their conquests. Otherwise recognizing the danger and taking action might lead one to believe we hated everyone.

 

[GHook93]

Worthless leftist coward response. When Islam is attack, the left must come back and attack Christianity or the West. Why not address the thread instead of attacking Christianity? Mayalsia is setting government pograms against non-Muslims.

You are a leftist coward! Too afraid to take on Islam, so you attack Christian and Jews!

It just goes to show that theocracy may lead to peace but has its limitations. Let's not create one in America.

Here's an article by a writer I respect:

It would be as grave a mistake to see Osama bin Laden as an authentic representative of Islam as to consider James Kopp, the alleged killer of an abortion provider in Buffalo, N.Y., a typical Christian or Baruch Goldstein, who shot 29 worshipers in the Hebron mosque in 1994 and died in the attack, a true martyr of Israel. The vast majority of Muslims, who are horrified by the atrocity of Sept. 11, must reclaim their faith from those who have so violently hijacked it.

Karen Armstrong has written many books on religion, including Islam: A Short History, published last year by Modern Library



Read more: The True, Peaceful Face Of Islam - TIME

 

[GHook93]

Interesting a leftist coward like you mentions single outcasts in Christian and Jewish countries, while the OP mentions specific acts done by THE GOVERNMENT IN MUSLIM countries! Scary thing is we are discussing Mayalsia! Mayalsia is the most tolerant Muslim country by a LARGE margin and they are a very intolerant country!

So take you weak leftist attacks on Christiaity and shove them up your ass!

Jim Jones, David Koresh and Meir Kahane do not typify Christianity and Judaism in the eyes of the civilized West, but those same eyes are prone to see Osama bin Laden and Mullah Muhammad Omar as typifying Islam," Richard Bulliet.

Islam is not a homogenous religion. It is divided into many subgroups, including Sunni, Shi'ite, and Sufi. A very small, radical, hate-filled, extremist, Fundamentalist, terrorist wing does exist. So too does a much larger peaceful, moderate wing. Unfortunately, the former seem to capture all the media's attention, while the latter is rarely heard from.

This phenomenon is true of most religions. Consider the over 1,000 Christian groups in North America. They include some hate-filled groups as well:

The Christian Identity movement.
Various white supremacist organizations which usually consider themselves to be Christians.
The terrorists who blew up the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City.

The spread of terrorism within Islam appears to be due to the presence and interaction of a number of factors:

A general renaissance of the religion of Islam throughout North Africa, the Middle East and parts of Asia.
The after-effects of previous colonial oppression of Muslim countries
Authoritarian dictatorships in the Middle East -- many of which are artificially propped up with American foreign policy -- with their depressing record of corruption, civil rights violations, and low standard of living. This results in a loss of hope among their public.
The lack of separation between religion and the state in Muslim countries.
Two main conflicts: One of overwhelming importance in Palestine between Jews and Muslims; one in Kashmir between Hindus and Muslims.

The religion of Islam

 

[Sky Dancer]

Not all Nazis were evil, not all Nazis were bad. Not all Nazis supported death camps. Getting the idea yet?

Should we hate all Germans because they once elected Hitler and the Nazi party?

YOU are the one making the claim I hate anyone. Recognizing ones enemies and taking appropriate actions does not equate to hate. Islam preaches hate, Islam preaches world domination, Islam preaches the destruction of all other religions. Islam preaches murder and mayhem. The religion is dangerous. Recognizing that does not mean I hate Muslims.

Using your logic, since all Nazis were not evil, were not bad, did not support death camps, we should have just left them to their conquests. Otherwise recognizing the danger and taking action might lead one to believe we hated everyone.

Good I am glad you don't hate anyone. You have some serious bigotry going on when it comes to Muslims. You think they're all the same. You lump them all together. 1.5 billion men, women and children.

There is a vast difference between countering terrorism and waging a holy war. The militant extremists speak of jihad as a holy war. Other Muslims see it as a inner spiritual battle.

All religion is dangerous when it is misused. Terrorists preach hate and practice violence when they misuse religious texts. It's no different from Jim Jones or David Koresh.

Islamic-Buddhist Dialogue

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Should we hate all Germans because they once elected Hitler and the Nazi party?

YOU are the one making the claim I hate anyone. Recognizing ones enemies and taking appropriate actions does not equate to hate. Islam preaches hate, Islam preaches world domination, Islam preaches the destruction of all other religions. Islam preaches murder and mayhem. The religion is dangerous. Recognizing that does not mean I hate Muslims.

Using your logic, since all Nazis were not evil, were not bad, did not support death camps, we should have just left them to their conquests. Otherwise recognizing the danger and taking action might lead one to believe we hated everyone.

Good I am glad you don't hate anyone. You have some serious bigotry going on when it comes to Muslims. You think they're all the same. You lump them all together. 1.5 billion men, women and children.

There is a vast difference between countering terrorism and waging a holy war. The militant extremists speak of jihad as a holy war. Other Muslims see it as a inner spiritual battle.

All religion is dangerous when it is misused. Terrorists preach hate and practice violence when they misuse religious texts. It's no different from Jim Jones or David Koresh.

Islamic-Buddhist Dialogue

What part of Islam is our enemy do you not grasp? The RELIGION DEMANDS world wide subjugation of the entire HUMAN race. It DEMANDS that every living person be a Muslim. It states that to accomplish this goal all must be converted by any means possible.

You are shown examples of Muslim Countries and their total intolerance to all other religions and then make innane comments on some preacher somewhere.

You are Homosexual as I recall. Guess what happens to you when Islam takes over? Not only are you NOT a Muslim you are a homosexual, both are reasons to murder you. EVERY Muslim believes Homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. EVERY Muslim religious leader advocates the death of Homosexuals. The laws adopted by Muslim Countries as well as the Koran are clear on this.

Go live in a Muslim Country and announce you are gay and do not believe in Mohammad. And if you get out alive tell us all about how the average Muslim is just a tolerant peace loving individual.

 

[Sky Dancer]

YOU are the one making the claim I hate anyone. Recognizing ones enemies and taking appropriate actions does not equate to hate. Islam preaches hate, Islam preaches world domination, Islam preaches the destruction of all other religions. Islam preaches murder and mayhem. The religion is dangerous. Recognizing that does not mean I hate Muslims.

Using your logic, since all Nazis were not evil, were not bad, did not support death camps, we should have just left them to their conquests. Otherwise recognizing the danger and taking action might lead one to believe we hated everyone.

Good I am glad you don't hate anyone. You have some serious bigotry going on when it comes to Muslims. You think they're all the same. You lump them all together. 1.5 billion men, women and children.

There is a vast difference between countering terrorism and waging a holy war. The militant extremists speak of jihad as a holy war. Other Muslims see it as a inner spiritual battle.

All religion is dangerous when it is misused. Terrorists preach hate and practice violence when they misuse religious texts. It's no different from Jim Jones or David Koresh.

Islamic-Buddhist Dialogue

What part of Islam is our enemy do you not grasp? The RELIGION DEMANDS world wide subjugation of the entire HUMAN race. It DEMANDS that every living person be a Muslim. It states that to accomplish this goal all must be converted by any means possible.

You are shown examples of Muslim Countries and their total intolerance to all other religions and then make innane comments on some preacher somewhere.

You are Homosexual as I recall. Guess what happens to you when Islam takes over? Not only are you NOT a Muslim you are a homosexual, both are reasons to murder you. EVERY Muslim believes Homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. EVERY Muslim religious leader advocates the death of Homosexuals. The laws adopted by Muslim Countries as well as the Koran are clear on this.

Go live in a Muslim Country and announce you are gay and do not believe in Mohammad. And if you get out alive tell us all about how the average Muslim is just a tolerant peace loving individual.

We are fighting insurgents and terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan, NOT the entire population of Iraqi and Afghan Muslims. As for your irrelevant foray in discussing homosexuality, I would point out that plenty of Christians believe homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. As I recall, you're one of them. No wonder you advise me to move somewhere dangerous in hopes I will be killed. I live peacefully and freely here in the US which is my home. I co-exist peacefully with Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and all other religions here.

Lighten up RGS, this is a political message board, not a war zone.

I think you brought up an irrelvant topic because your arguments are so weak otherwise. Your argument is weak because you say ALL Muslims are the same. They're not. That's an arrogant and false claim. You cannot say ALL of anything and speak truthfully.

 

[Kalam]

It looks as if the OP wasted a great deal of time putting together a strawman argument. There are no truly Islamic societies in existence today, only apostate governments that masquerade as such while enacting policies that contradict the law of Allah (SWT).

When we begin recognizing God's sovereignty over us once again, our society will embody the Islamic principles set forth in this treatise, written by a "radical extremist":

Maulana Maududi - Human Rights in Islam

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Good I am glad you don't hate anyone. You have some serious bigotry going on when it comes to Muslims. You think they're all the same. You lump them all together. 1.5 billion men, women and children.

There is a vast difference between countering terrorism and waging a holy war. The militant extremists speak of jihad as a holy war. Other Muslims see it as a inner spiritual battle.

All religion is dangerous when it is misused. Terrorists preach hate and practice violence when they misuse religious texts. It's no different from Jim Jones or David Koresh.

Islamic-Buddhist Dialogue

What part of Islam is our enemy do you not grasp? The RELIGION DEMANDS world wide subjugation of the entire HUMAN race. It DEMANDS that every living person be a Muslim. It states that to accomplish this goal all must be converted by any means possible.

You are shown examples of Muslim Countries and their total intolerance to all other religions and then make innane comments on some preacher somewhere.

You are Homosexual as I recall. Guess what happens to you when Islam takes over? Not only are you NOT a Muslim you are a homosexual, both are reasons to murder you. EVERY Muslim believes Homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. EVERY Muslim religious leader advocates the death of Homosexuals. The laws adopted by Muslim Countries as well as the Koran are clear on this.

Go live in a Muslim Country and announce you are gay and do not believe in Mohammad. And if you get out alive tell us all about how the average Muslim is just a tolerant peace loving individual.

We are fighting insurgents and terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan, NOT the entire population of Iraqi and Afghan Muslims. As for your irrelevant foray in discussing homosexuality, I would point out that plenty of Christians believe homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. As I recall, you're one of them. No wonder you advise me to move somewhere dangerous in hopes I will be killed. I live peacefully and freely here in the US which is my home. I co-exist peacefully with Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and all other religions here.

Lighten up RGS, this is a political message board, not a war zone.

I think you brought up an irrelvant topic because your arguments are so weak otherwise. Your argument is weak because you say ALL Muslims are the same. They're not. That's an arrogant and false claim. You cannot say ALL of anything and speak truthfully.

Islamic controlled countries have laws on the book allowing them to KILL homosexuals and arrest them. Now be so kind as to list non Muslim nations with those laws.

Islam is our enemy. Until or unless there is a reformation THIS remains true. Islam DEMANDS that the ENTIRE EARTH be Muslim. It allows that in order to bring this about Islam may forcefully convert people, murder unbelievers and subjugate those that it can if that is favorable to the situation.

You are beyond stupid when you post that Islam is peaceful and tolerant. EVERY single Muslim run Country is INTOLERANT and supports worldwide TERROR in order to further the Islamic goals.

Every Muslim supports Islamic teachings that the ENTIRE earth must be Muslim. Some believe an open war is acceptable to accomplish that and some believe they should wait a while longer before conquering the world.

Your religion and your sexual preference are EXACTLY important to this discussion. YOU keep claiming that Islam is tolerant and peaceful. Prove it. Move to an Islamic Country and inform the Government of your sexuality and your religious beliefs. Then tell us just how Tolerant they are.

 

[Kalam]

Is that your view too? You and Neubarth are quite the pair.

I ask a simple question. Answer it or stop making generalizations. IS his History CORRECT? Yes or NO?

No. Your silly "convert or die" fantasies also have no basis in reality.

"This legal formulation is based on the principle that Islam -- that is, submission to God -- is a universal Message which the whole of mankind should accept or make peace with. No political system or material power should put hindrances in the way of preaching Islam. It should leave every individual free to accept or reject it, and if someone wants to accept it, it should not prevent him or fight against him." - Sayyid Qutb, Milestones, Ch. 4: Jihad in the Cause of Allah​

From the "father of modern Islamist fundamentalism."

 

[Sky Dancer]

What part of Islam is our enemy do you not grasp? The RELIGION DEMANDS world wide subjugation of the entire HUMAN race. It DEMANDS that every living person be a Muslim. It states that to accomplish this goal all must be converted by any means possible.

You are shown examples of Muslim Countries and their total intolerance to all other religions and then make innane comments on some preacher somewhere.

You are Homosexual as I recall. Guess what happens to you when Islam takes over? Not only are you NOT a Muslim you are a homosexual, both are reasons to murder you. EVERY Muslim believes Homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. EVERY Muslim religious leader advocates the death of Homosexuals. The laws adopted by Muslim Countries as well as the Koran are clear on this.

Go live in a Muslim Country and announce you are gay and do not believe in Mohammad. And if you get out alive tell us all about how the average Muslim is just a tolerant peace loving individual.

We are fighting insurgents and terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan, NOT the entire population of Iraqi and Afghan Muslims. As for your irrelevant foray in discussing homosexuality, I would point out that plenty of Christians believe homosexuality is evil and needs to be stamped out. As I recall, you're one of them. No wonder you advise me to move somewhere dangerous in hopes I will be killed. I live peacefully and freely here in the US which is my home. I co-exist peacefully with Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and all other religions here.

Lighten up RGS, this is a political message board, not a war zone.

I think you brought up an irrelvant topic because your arguments are so weak otherwise. Your argument is weak because you say ALL Muslims are the same. They're not. That's an arrogant and false claim. You cannot say ALL of anything and speak truthfully.

Islamic controlled countries have laws on the book allowing them to KILL homosexuals and arrest them. Now be so kind as to list non Muslim nations with those laws.

Islam is our enemy. Until or unless there is a reformation THIS remains true. Islam DEMANDS that the ENTIRE EARTH be Muslim. It allows that in order to bring this about Islam may forcefully convert people, murder unbelievers and subjugate those that it can if that is favorable to the situation.

You are beyond stupid when you post that Islam is peaceful and tolerant. EVERY single Muslim run Country is INTOLERANT and supports worldwide TERROR in order to further the Islamic goals.

Every Muslim supports Islamic teachings that the ENTIRE earth must be Muslim. Some believe an open war is acceptable to accomplish that and some believe they should wait a while longer before conquering the world.

Your religion and your sexual preference are EXACTLY important to this discussion. YOU keep claiming that Islam is tolerant and peaceful. Prove it. Move to an Islamic Country and inform the Government of your sexuality and your religious beliefs. Then tell us just how Tolerant they are.

Stop personalizing this debate. It's not about me, my religion or my sexuality. It's about your fear and loathing of all things Muslim and your willingness to use absolute language like ALL Muslims rather than the truth, which is SOME Muslims are like this and some are not.

How much do you know about the Sufi Muslims? They are peaceful. I've known some personally and hold them in high regard. What about the poets Rumi, Hafiz or Kabir?

I Have Been Thinking

I have been thinking ...
I have been thinking of the difference between water
and the waves on it. Rising,
water's still water, falling back,
it is water, will you give me a hint
how to tell them apart?

Because someone has made up the word
"wave," do I have to distinguish it
from water?

There is a Secret One inside us;
the planets in all the galaxies
pass through his hands like beads.

That is a string of beads one should look at with luminous eyes.

Kabir

 

[Kalam]

We'll now wait for RGS to either make more unsubstantiated claims or post some drivel from a propaganda website.