Is Westboro Baptist Church a cult?

[Sky Dancer]

Yea... but Phelps doesn't get to decide who's going to hell. That's God's decision. Phelps is an evil man, I don't give a rats ass how polite he is.... and, I suspect, nor does God.

Al Capone was considered a gentlman, he made sure that orphanes got good milk, and was loved by a large number of people.

Anyone think he made it past the Pearly Gates?

Exactly, evil people are not always rude obnoxious and intolerance, they usually come to you with a smile on their face and greet you with a warm friendly hand shake. Fred Phelps is obviously good at what he does if hes got people viewing him as friendly.

Pema Chodron says when she walks into one of those kinds of groups and see all these smiles plastered on people's faces she says, hmm, lots of suppressed anger.

 

[Sky Dancer]

WBC and Fred Phelps seem like a cult of insanity. If I were a Christian, I would denounce them.

I don't know of any Christians who do not denounce them. You maybe need to work on your opinion of Christians. You seem a tad overly judgemental of us, Sky.

You're right, CG. I am. I give some of you on messageboards a rough time.

 

[Sky Dancer]

For the record, I consider WBC a cult. They are anti-socialists, who see any action as a justifiable mean to the end.

That said, I completely ignore their religious beliefs, and support their right to free speech. The recent response by PFA and other patriot groups is the right approach, IMO. Non-violent, keep them away, continue to show them how pathetic, egregious, and disrespectful their protests are.

Censuring them for their beliefs would be no different than censuring Buddhists for theirs, no matter how much we may all disagree with them.

I agree. They have a right to free speech, no matter how hateful. And the SPLC has a right to label some of these groups as hate groups when they spread false propaganda about groups they target--like lesbians and gays.

I appreciate your view.

 

[High_Gravity]

Al Capone was considered a gentlman, he made sure that orphanes got good milk, and was loved by a large number of people.

Anyone think he made it past the Pearly Gates?

Exactly, evil people are not always rude obnoxious and intolerance, they usually come to you with a smile on their face and greet you with a warm friendly hand shake. Fred Phelps is obviously good at what he does if hes got people viewing him as friendly.

Pema Chodron says when she walks into one of those kinds of groups and see all these smiles plastered on people's faces she says, hmm, lots of suppressed anger.

People like Phelps are good at manipulating people and making them believe what they want, you have to judge people by what they do, not what they say. The KKK says they don't hate blacks, they just want to live separate, but at night they used to go out and lynch and terrorize blacks. Hamas in the Gaza strip claim they want a country where Muslims, Jews and Christians live side by side, but on the ground in Gaza they live under Islamic law. I know I'm going off the subject a bit but the theory is the same, evil will always whisper sweet nothings in your ear to get you to listen. Phelps is getting his job done because posters on here swear up and down he is a swell fella.

 

[kwc57]

Extremist group or not?

Well, as a life long Southern Baptist, I can tell you for certain that they only use the name Baptist as they have no resemblence to ANY Baptist church I've ever known.

They are a bunch of extremist nutjobs. I wouldn't call them a cult as I don't think anyone can join them and I don't think they try to recruit. They are mainly family members. I could be wrong.

 

[Cuyo]

WBC and Fred Phelps seem like a cult of insanity. If I were a Christian, I would denounce them.

Rut-ro, call Peter King. Any Christian that doesn't denounce them might be a terrorist.

 

[Two Thumbs]

I actually met Fred Phelps when he was in town protesting some homo church. Honestly, I found him very polite, very intelligent and he showed me nothing but respect.

Do I agree with WBC and their protests? No, I dont. But I do support their right to do so 100%. And I also respect their conviction and faith. They simply take the Bible VERY SERIOUSLY and word for word. Which I dont think is really a bad thing. If you truly are a Christian, shouldnt you take what the Bible says very sersiously.

Yea... but Phelps doesn't get to decide who's going to hell. That's God's decision. Phelps is an evil man, I don't give a rats ass how polite he is.... and, I suspect, nor does God.

Surely you arent going to go into that crap that Christians arent supposed to judge. And pull out the most misunderstood verse in the Bible. "Judge not, lest ye be Judged" in Matthew. You can always tell the people who havent read the whole Bible, when they claim that verse means we arent supposed to judge. That verse wasnt telling us we arent supposed to judge. Its warning Cristians about hypocritical judgement. Its basically saying
"Go ahead and judge, but remember, you will also be judged by the same measure" We know this, because we read the rest of Matthew, and not just that one verse. Plus, since we have read the WHOLE Bible, we know there are many other verses in the Bible that tell us judging is fine. In fact, Christians are ordered to judge, but judge righteously. John 7:24 orders us to "Judge not by appearance, but judge with RIGHTEOUS JUDGEMENT". Or perhpaps my favorite verse in the Bible, 2 Timothy 4, where Christians are ordered to preach the word in all seasons and rebuke and reprove all sinners. << rebuke and reprove means to judge and criticize. 2 Timothy goes on to tell us we should judge all sinners because the time will come when men will be ruled by lusts, and the lessons of the Bible will be turned into fables. Now when you think about it, isnt that exactly what WBC is doing?

No.

the soldiers died for thier country, not for gay people.

the wbc is pissing on our Vets and thier families who are mourning and honoring their dead.

Still waiting on a link to where god or christ said they hate some one, and not a copy paste of a line. Cuz you just noted yourself that single lines are meaningless w/o the context.

 

[Two Thumbs]

WBC and Fred Phelps seem like a cult of insanity. If I were a Christian, I would denounce them.

Rut-ro, call Peter King. Any Christian that doesn't denounce them might be a terrorist.

Has wbc plotted the death of Americans?
Do the have the backing of a vast international organisation that will help them should they need it?

 

[God Guns Beer]

Yea... but Phelps doesn't get to decide who's going to hell. That's God's decision. Phelps is an evil man, I don't give a rats ass how polite he is.... and, I suspect, nor does God.

Surely you arent going to go into that crap that Christians arent supposed to judge. And pull out the most misunderstood verse in the Bible. "Judge not, lest ye be Judged" in Matthew. You can always tell the people who havent read the whole Bible, when they claim that verse means we arent supposed to judge. That verse wasnt telling us we arent supposed to judge. Its warning Cristians about hypocritical judgement. Its basically saying
"Go ahead and judge, but remember, you will also be judged by the same measure" We know this, because we read the rest of Matthew, and not just that one verse. Plus, since we have read the WHOLE Bible, we know there are many other verses in the Bible that tell us judging is fine. In fact, Christians are ordered to judge, but judge righteously. John 7:24 orders us to "Judge not by appearance, but judge with RIGHTEOUS JUDGEMENT". Or perhpaps my favorite verse in the Bible, 2 Timothy 4, where Christians are ordered to preach the word in all seasons and rebuke and reprove all sinners. << rebuke and reprove means to judge and criticize. 2 Timothy goes on to tell us we should judge all sinners because the time will come when men will be ruled by lusts, and the lessons of the Bible will be turned into fables. Now when you think about it, isnt that exactly what WBC is doing?

No.

the soldiers died for thier country, not for gay people.

the wbc is pissing on our Vets and thier families who are mourning and honoring their dead.

Still waiting on a link to where god or christ said they hate some one, and not a copy paste of a line. Cuz you just noted yourself that single lines are meaningless w/o the context.

WBC has the right to protest our military. They have the right to protest anything they want. You know any lazy moron can protect the rights of someone they agree with, but a true patriot protects the rights of who he disagrees with.
Romans 9 is Paul who said that, but he is simply repeating what GOD said in the OT. Which is why he said AS IT IS WRITTEN.

 

[High_Gravity]

Surely you arent going to go into that crap that Christians arent supposed to judge. And pull out the most misunderstood verse in the Bible. "Judge not, lest ye be Judged" in Matthew. You can always tell the people who havent read the whole Bible, when they claim that verse means we arent supposed to judge. That verse wasnt telling us we arent supposed to judge. Its warning Cristians about hypocritical judgement. Its basically saying
"Go ahead and judge, but remember, you will also be judged by the same measure" We know this, because we read the rest of Matthew, and not just that one verse. Plus, since we have read the WHOLE Bible, we know there are many other verses in the Bible that tell us judging is fine. In fact, Christians are ordered to judge, but judge righteously. John 7:24 orders us to "Judge not by appearance, but judge with RIGHTEOUS JUDGEMENT". Or perhpaps my favorite verse in the Bible, 2 Timothy 4, where Christians are ordered to preach the word in all seasons and rebuke and reprove all sinners. << rebuke and reprove means to judge and criticize. 2 Timothy goes on to tell us we should judge all sinners because the time will come when men will be ruled by lusts, and the lessons of the Bible will be turned into fables. Now when you think about it, isnt that exactly what WBC is doing?

No.

the soldiers died for thier country, not for gay people.

the wbc is pissing on our Vets and thier families who are mourning and honoring their dead.

Still waiting on a link to where god or christ said they hate some one, and not a copy paste of a line. Cuz you just noted yourself that single lines are meaningless w/o the context.

WBC has the right to protest our military. They have the right to protest anything they want. You know any lazy moron can protect the rights of someone they agree with, but a true patriot protects the rights of who he disagrees with.
Romans 9 is Paul who said that, but he is simply repeating what GOD said in the OT. Which is why he said AS IT IS WRITTEN.

It sounds like you have fallen for the song and dance, hook, line and sinker.

 

[God Guns Beer]

No.

the soldiers died for thier country, not for gay people.

the wbc is pissing on our Vets and thier families who are mourning and honoring their dead.

Still waiting on a link to where god or christ said they hate some one, and not a copy paste of a line. Cuz you just noted yourself that single lines are meaningless w/o the context.

WBC has the right to protest our military. They have the right to protest anything they want. You know any lazy moron can protect the rights of someone they agree with, but a true patriot protects the rights of who he disagrees with.
Romans 9 is Paul who said that, but he is simply repeating what GOD said in the OT. Which is why he said AS IT IS WRITTEN.

It sounds like you have fallen for the song and dance, hook, line and sinker.

Fallen for what? The Constitution?. Yep...Guilty.

 

[High_Gravity]

WBC has the right to protest our military. They have the right to protest anything they want. You know any lazy moron can protect the rights of someone they agree with, but a true patriot protects the rights of who he disagrees with.
Romans 9 is Paul who said that, but he is simply repeating what GOD said in the OT. Which is why he said AS IT IS WRITTEN.

It sounds like you have fallen for the song and dance, hook, line and sinker.

Fallen for what? The Constitution?. Yep...Guilty.

You are sitting here saying the Westboro Baptist Church is in the right and that Fred Phelps is a good guy, your saying you met Phelps yes? well I don't know what hes told you but you have been hoodwinked, I doubt very much you would be this supportive of them if they were protesting outside the funeral of one of your relatives.

 

[God Guns Beer]

It sounds like you have fallen for the song and dance, hook, line and sinker.

Fallen for what? The Constitution?. Yep...Guilty.

You are sitting here saying the Westboro Baptist Church is in the right and that Fred Phelps is a good guy, your saying you met Phelps yes? well I don't know what hes told you but you have been hoodwinked, I doubt very much you would be this supportive of them if they were protesting outside the funeral of one of your relatives.

I support WBCs right to protest, just like I would support the right for liberal drag queen homos to protest my church. I support the black panthers right to protest, even though Im a bit of a racist. I support radical muslims the right to protest everything about this country, while they are living here, even though I think all muslims are evil and I would never agree with them. I support the right for NEO Nazi skinheads to protest the jews, even though I support the jews and Im not a Nazi.
Again...Pay attention to these words once again:
ANY LAZY MORON CAN SAY THEY SUPPORT THE RIGHTS OF SOMEONE THEY AGREE WITH, BUT A TRUE PATRIOT PROTECTS THE RIGHTS OF THOSE HE DOESNT AGREE WITH.

 

[High_Gravity]

Fallen for what? The Constitution?. Yep...Guilty.

You are sitting here saying the Westboro Baptist Church is in the right and that Fred Phelps is a good guy, your saying you met Phelps yes? well I don't know what hes told you but you have been hoodwinked, I doubt very much you would be this supportive of them if they were protesting outside the funeral of one of your relatives.

I support WBCs right to protest, just like I would support the right for liberal drag queen homos to protest my church. I support the black panthers right to protest, even though Im a bit of a racist. I support radical muslims the right to protest everything about this country, while they are living here, even though I think all muslims are evil and I would never agree with them. I support the right for NEO Nazi skinheads to protest the jews, even though I support the jews and Im not a Nazi.
Again...Pay attention to these words once again:
ANY LAZY MORON CAN SAY THEY SUPPORT THE RIGHTS OF SOMEONE THEY AGREE WITH, BUT A TRUE PATRIOT PROTECTS THE RIGHTS OF THOSE HE DOESNT AGREE WITH.

Well at least your honest, more than I can say about alot of people on here.

 

[God Guns Beer]

It sounds like you have fallen for the song and dance, hook, line and sinker.

Fallen for what? The Constitution?. Yep...Guilty.

You are sitting here saying the Westboro Baptist Church is in the right and that Fred Phelps is a good guy, your saying you met Phelps yes? well I don't know what hes told you but you have been hoodwinked, I doubt very much you would be this supportive of them if they were protesting outside the funeral of one of your relatives.

Again, if WBC protested the the funeral of one of my family members, I might not like it, but I would still support their right to do so. Its kind of like if my kid was accidently hurt by a gun. I would most likely personally start disliking guns, and I most likely wouldnt want them in my house anymore. But I wouldnt want to push my beliefs on others and take away other peoples rights to have a gun.

It would be like that father of the 9 year old girl in Arizona that was shot and killed with Gabby. THe liberal media was asking him so many questions about gun control. Trying to use him for their own anti gun agenda, trying to get him to say he would support new gun control laws. He didnt budge from his beliefs, he said he wanted no more laws limiting the freedom of americans. He, my friend, is a TRUE PATRIOT.

 

[High_Gravity]

Fallen for what? The Constitution?. Yep...Guilty.

You are sitting here saying the Westboro Baptist Church is in the right and that Fred Phelps is a good guy, your saying you met Phelps yes? well I don't know what hes told you but you have been hoodwinked, I doubt very much you would be this supportive of them if they were protesting outside the funeral of one of your relatives.

Again, if WBC protested the the funeral of one of my family members, I might not like it, but I would still support their right to do so. Its kind of like if my kid was accidently hurt by a gun. I would most likely personally start disliking guns, and I most likely wouldnt want them in my house anymore. But I wouldnt want to push my beliefs on others and take away other peoples rights to have a gun.

It would be like that father of the 9 year old girl in Arizona that was shot and killed with Gabby. THe liberal media was asking him so many questions about gun control. Trying to use him for their own anti gun agenda, trying to get him to say he would support new gun control laws. He didnt budge from his beliefs, he said he wanted no more laws limiting the freedom of americans. He, my friend, is a TRUE PATRIOT.

Well your a more calmer person than me, if the WBC were protesting at my sons funeral and acting like jack asses I would lose my mind.

 

[God Guns Beer]

You are sitting here saying the Westboro Baptist Church is in the right and that Fred Phelps is a good guy, your saying you met Phelps yes? well I don't know what hes told you but you have been hoodwinked, I doubt very much you would be this supportive of them if they were protesting outside the funeral of one of your relatives.

I support WBCs right to protest, just like I would support the right for liberal drag queen homos to protest my church. I support the black panthers right to protest, even though Im a bit of a racist. I support radical muslims the right to protest everything about this country, while they are living here, even though I think all muslims are evil and I would never agree with them. I support the right for NEO Nazi skinheads to protest the jews, even though I support the jews and Im not a Nazi.
Again...Pay attention to these words once again:
ANY LAZY MORON CAN SAY THEY SUPPORT THE RIGHTS OF SOMEONE THEY AGREE WITH, BUT A TRUE PATRIOT PROTECTS THE RIGHTS OF THOSE HE DOESNT AGREE WITH.

Well at least your honest, more than I can say about alot of people on here.

Sure...why wouldnt I be honest about my ideology on a political message board? Yes, Im a bit of a racist. But let me make something perfectly clear for the liberals who are now drooling saying "We finally got a conservative who admits they are racist". My racism has NOTHING to do with my Conservatism. Im simply a conservative who has a little bit of racism in his ideology. Racism and Conservatism are two separate parts of who I am. There are just as many racist liberals as there are racist conservatives and I share racist beliefs with both people on the left and on the right. Now with that said, my "little bit" of racism isnt that big of deal. Its not like Im wearing sheets and out burning crosses. I dont hate anyone. I dont hate black people. Im simply more of a separatist. I dont especially like black people. I dont want them living around me, working with me or going to school with my kids. That is all.
I needed to edit and add something to the debate here, because it looks like Im a hypocrite when it comes the rights of blacks. Even though I would "prefer" that blacks didnt live around me, work with me, or go to school with my kids, I still support their right to. I cant stop them, nor would I try. But that still doesnt mean I would like it.

 

[High_Gravity]

I support WBCs right to protest, just like I would support the right for liberal drag queen homos to protest my church. I support the black panthers right to protest, even though Im a bit of a racist. I support radical muslims the right to protest everything about this country, while they are living here, even though I think all muslims are evil and I would never agree with them. I support the right for NEO Nazi skinheads to protest the jews, even though I support the jews and Im not a Nazi.
Again...Pay attention to these words once again:
ANY LAZY MORON CAN SAY THEY SUPPORT THE RIGHTS OF SOMEONE THEY AGREE WITH, BUT A TRUE PATRIOT PROTECTS THE RIGHTS OF THOSE HE DOESNT AGREE WITH.

Well at least your honest, more than I can say about alot of people on here.

Sure...why wouldnt I be honest about my ideology on a political message board? Yes, Im a bit of a racist. But let me make something perfectly clear for the liberals who are now drooling saying "We finally got a conservative who admits they are racist". My racism has NOTHING to do with my Conservatism. Im simply a conservative who has a little bit of racism in his ideology. Racism and Conservatism are two separate parts of who I am. There are just as many racist liberals as there are racist conservatives and I share racist beliefs with both people on the left and on the right. Now with that said, my "little bit" of racism isnt that big of deal. Its not like Im wearing sheets and out burning crosses. I dont hate anyone. I dont hate black people. Im simply more of a separatist. I dont especially like black people. I dont want them living around me, working with me or going to school with my kids. That is all.
I needed to edit and something to the debate here, but it looks like Im a hypocrite when it comes the rights of blacks. Even though I would "prefer" that blacks didnt live around me, work with me, or go to school with my kids, I still support their right to. I cant stop them, nor would I try. But that still doesnt mean I would like it.

Do you mind me asking why you feel this way?

 

[High_Gravity]

I support WBCs right to protest, just like I would support the right for liberal drag queen homos to protest my church. I support the black panthers right to protest, even though Im a bit of a racist. I support radical muslims the right to protest everything about this country, while they are living here, even though I think all muslims are evil and I would never agree with them. I support the right for NEO Nazi skinheads to protest the jews, even though I support the jews and Im not a Nazi.
Again...Pay attention to these words once again:
ANY LAZY MORON CAN SAY THEY SUPPORT THE RIGHTS OF SOMEONE THEY AGREE WITH, BUT A TRUE PATRIOT PROTECTS THE RIGHTS OF THOSE HE DOESNT AGREE WITH.

Well at least your honest, more than I can say about alot of people on here.

Sure...why wouldnt I be honest about my ideology on a political message board? Yes, Im a bit of a racist. But let me make something perfectly clear for the liberals who are now drooling saying "We finally got a conservative who admits they are racist". My racism has NOTHING to do with my Conservatism. Im simply a conservative who has a little bit of racism in his ideology. Racism and Conservatism are two separate parts of who I am. There are just as many racist liberals as there are racist conservatives and I share racist beliefs with both people on the left and on the right. Now with that said, my "little bit" of racism isnt that big of deal. Its not like Im wearing sheets and out burning crosses. I dont hate anyone. I dont hate black people. Im simply more of a separatist. I dont especially like black people. I dont want them living around me, working with me or going to school with my kids. That is all.
I needed to edit and add something to the debate here, because it looks like Im a hypocrite when it comes the rights of blacks. Even though I would "prefer" that blacks didnt live around me, work with me, or go to school with my kids, I still support their right to. I cant stop them, nor would I try. But that still doesnt mean I would like it.

Your relatively new here but there are posters on this board who basically hate black people and other minorities but refuse to admit they are racists.

 

[God Guns Beer]

Well at least your honest, more than I can say about alot of people on here.

Sure...why wouldnt I be honest about my ideology on a political message board? Yes, Im a bit of a racist. But let me make something perfectly clear for the liberals who are now drooling saying "We finally got a conservative who admits they are racist". My racism has NOTHING to do with my Conservatism. Im simply a conservative who has a little bit of racism in his ideology. Racism and Conservatism are two separate parts of who I am. There are just as many racist liberals as there are racist conservatives and I share racist beliefs with both people on the left and on the right. Now with that said, my "little bit" of racism isnt that big of deal. Its not like Im wearing sheets and out burning crosses. I dont hate anyone. I dont hate black people. Im simply more of a separatist. I dont especially like black people. I dont want them living around me, working with me or going to school with my kids. That is all.
I needed to edit and something to the debate here, but it looks like Im a hypocrite when it comes the rights of blacks. Even though I would "prefer" that blacks didnt live around me, work with me, or go to school with my kids, I still support their right to. I cant stop them, nor would I try. But that still doesnt mean I would like it.

Do you mind me asking why you feel this way?

Why dont I especially like black people? Well, I dont want to turn this thread into a "debate my racism" thread. I think I saw another thread just for race issues. But basically, as a whole I dont want black people around me because of common sense. As a whole, I dont think black peoples general behavour is conducive to a good neighborhood. Can you honesly say that my lilly white crime free nice neighborhood would be a better place to live if it was say 40% black people? Of course it wouldnt. The simple fact is, the more blacks you have in your area, the higher the crime rate. Neighborhood demographics and crime rates show that even when you move up the economic ladder, crime follows race. In other words, even in a successful upper middle class neighborhood, the one with more blacks will have a higher crime rate than the almost all white neighborhood.
Really, I wish I didnt have any reasons to be racist. I wish blacks didnt give me so many reasons. In all honesty, I hope blacks learn to stay in school and become better educated, I hope blacks make the choice to quit committing so many crimes. I hope blacks make the decision to quit squirting out so many bastard children. I hope blacks buy some pants that fit and learn to speak english better. But all those problems blacks have are due to their own choices in life, not mine. Those are the things that make me racist. And if the blacks want to change or stop racism, then they need to work on changing themselves for the better. Its not my job to change them or help them change.
In fact, statistics show that blacks arent getting better, they are getting worse. Graduation rates for blacks is going down fast, not up. While the crime rate throughout the country is going down, the crime rate for blacks is growing. Personally, I think that makes racism more justified.
I will give you another example, and then I better get to work..lol. And perhaps later we can move the race debate to the right thread.
My city doesnt have a lot of blacks, around 1%. So their crime isnt really a problem. However, we do have a lot of hispanics and they are 17% of the population. Crime rates show that even though hispanics are 17% of the population, they are responsible for 70% of the crime in this area. Think about this, when a group thats 17% of the population is responsible for 70% of the crime in an area, doesnt that say A LOT about that group of people, and doesnt common sense tell you that this would be a better place to live if that "group of people" wasnt here? Racism justified. The cause of my racism towards hispanics is THEIR OWN CHOICES AND BEHAVOUR.