Is Obama Really this Stupid?

[Quantum Windbag]

I'm disappointed to hear you say "Democrat party." You're generally above that sort of thing.

And my understanding is that it's a statement that "Catholic run institutions" are subject to the same regulation as other businesses if a certain amount of employees are not in fact Catholic.

It's also my understanding that churches are exempt.

If the party at large is against this, then I retract that line.

Are they?

Pelosi is behind it 100%, which probably means most Democrats oppose it.

 

[grunt11b]

There is at least one thread about it, but you are not wrong. The Bishops have written to their parishes about it. 36million Catholic registered voters in the US... and he decides it's a good thing to take us on. He's not only an idiot, he's crossing the fucking line between Church and State.

If this stands, Catholic institutions - including hospitals and schools - will be forced to close their doors to non-Catholics. Given that we fund services for Americas most poverty stricken.... I find it fucking outrageous.

Obama only did it because he and his lefty followers care so much about the poor and downtrodden. "See the Nanny STate thread for proof".

 

[grunt11b]

Real Simple... Catholic based Hospitals don't want to take part in the AHA? Fine... No Federal funds...saves the taxpayers money, I guess.

Let them cut the federal funds, I am sure when that goes public the donations will come flying in anyways. See, it's people like you that are firm believers that institutions and people in general cannot make it without big government help, which makes people like you the problem in this country.

 

[grunt11b]

I'm disappointed to hear you say "Democrat party." You're generally above that sort of thing.

And my understanding is that it's a statement that "Catholic run institutions" are subject to the same regulation as other businesses if a certain amount of employees are not in fact Catholic.

It's also my understanding that churches are exempt.

But their employer is the Catholic Church - and birth control is against our religion - particularly abortion - which is abhorrent to us. It is, to Catholics, murder.

really? and here i thought it was because of pancakes....

Just another day of adding absolutely no intellectual input to the topics eh plasma?

 

[grunt11b]

Real Simple... Catholic based Hospitals don't want to take part in the AHA? Fine... No Federal funds...saves the taxpayers money, I guess.

Beware the law of unintended consequences. Yes, they get medicare and medicaid... but the Church itself also provides vast amounts of funding - and they treat absolutely anyone, regardless for race, color or creed. If the government had to take up the slack left by this stupidity.... that money's gonna have to be found from somewhere. Don't you think this country is in enough shit without idiots creating more?

It's not gonna 'save' taxpayers money, you fucking idiot.... it's gonna cost even more. Does simple math elude you?

What's wrong with them having those birth control measures on hand, but discouraging their use?

Kind of like what PLANNED PARENTHOOD does with abortions. A woman comes in for an abortion, they educate her on her choices, provide viable alternatives, and if she still demands an abortion... they give her one.

But of course, you probably don't believe the last paragraph, because you've been told that all Planned Parenthood does is abort fetuses.

Mission creep is what's wrong with it.Most of you on here know exactly what I am talking about when that term is used.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I'm disappointed to hear you say "Democrat party." You're generally above that sort of thing.

And my understanding is that it's a statement that "Catholic run institutions" are subject to the same regulation as other businesses if a certain amount of employees are not in fact Catholic.

It's also my understanding that churches are exempt.

But their employer is the Catholic Church - and birth control is against our religion - particularly abortion - which is abhorrent to us. It is, to Catholics, murder.

I don't understand why birth control is against religion. Millions of sperm die whether one ever gets to fertilze an egg or not. And an egg gets wasted every month in the absence of pregnancy, whether birth control is utilized or not. Nothing is really happening any differently with contraception.

I don't understand why you don't understand, but it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

 

[grunt11b]

This just proves that Liberals aren't interested in "choice". It's their way or the highway. Obama will never win this fight with the Catholic Church. Obama, Pelosi and Reid sre such a joke.

Oh... we're all about CHOICE... it's the Conservatives that have an issue with Choice...especially when it pertains to OTHER people's sins.

So the left see the beautiful acts of making and conceiving a baby a sin? Some of you fuckers really do disgust me.
Which would be the more serious sin to you?
1) Creating a baby.
2) Murdering it because you did not want it or want the responsibility of having one.

 

[grunt11b]

But their employer is the Catholic Church - and birth control is against our religion - particularly abortion - which is abhorrent to us. It is, to Catholics, murder.

I don't understand why birth control is against religion. Millions of sperm die whether one ever gets to fertilze an egg or not. And an egg gets wasted every month in the absence of pregnancy, whether birth control is utilized or not. Nothing is really happening any differently with contraception.

Fact is, neither birth control or abortion is against any religion - until its convenient. Cafeteria Catholics ... The way it works is that they believe very strongly right up until they actually have to live their beliefs. Then, you'll see them using birth control and even having abortions. But, by gawd, don't even think about doing the same thing because THEN and ONLY then the Catholics will be all over you.

IOW, they don't live it but they demand that you do.

The way I see it is - they, and every one else, is more than welcome to their choice of religion but stay the hell out of my life.

You speak as if you have heard of or witnessed a cafeteria catholic doing this, can you give us an example, tell us who, or are you going to blow more smoke?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

This just proves that Liberals aren't interested in "choice". It's their way or the highway. Obama will never win this fight with the Catholic Church. Obama, Pelosi and Reid sre such a joke.

Oh... we're all about CHOICE... it's the Conservatives that have an issue with Choice...especially when it pertains to OTHER people's sins.

Try thinking for a change. If you give the government the power to dictate to Catholics that they have to accept birth control you also give the government the power to tell you that you cannot use an animated GIF as an avatar.

 

[grunt11b]

Hey I'm cool with this as long they smack down every mosque and demand Islam go for broke on abortion as well.

And I'm not going Islam vs Christianity. We are same on many levels.

Poor idiots out there, you know white liberal asswipes who don't have a clue don't understand they slam Christianity they are just mocking Islam. Think they are having a blast all while insulting the crap out of all good Muslims.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKGdkqfBICw]Obama: "My Muslim Faith" - YouTube[/ame]

He's a muslim brotherhood plant, or affiliated. Fact of the matter is, noone knows who the hell the man is, and it's kinda scary.

 

[Cuyo]

I'm disappointed to hear you say "Democrat party." You're generally above that sort of thing.

And my understanding is that it's a statement that "Catholic run institutions" are subject to the same regulation as other businesses if a certain amount of employees are not in fact Catholic.

It's also my understanding that churches are exempt.

If the party at large is against this, then I retract that line.

Are they?

'Democrat' is not an adjective. That's a snide, juvenile little thing right wingnuts do to express contempt and disrespect for the party in question, and you know it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I just read this, so if there is another thread on the topic, my apologies and would ask the mods to merge it. Also, if this is wrong, and any of the liberals / Dems want to refute it, please do so. Because, frankly, I find it stunning that this is true. I can't believe the Democrat party would do something this stupid. (Of course, the conservatives will replay "Why not?")

With gaffe-a-day-Romney and Barack Oncompetent the two candidates, it could be an interesting battle of two guys dueling to shoot themselves in the head faster than the other guy.


A Battle the President Can't Win - WSJ.com

So what's your problem with this. Why should ANY employer be dictate to an employee what his health care should be.

Most Catholics practice birth control, and a lot of employees of Catholic institutions are in fact not even Catholics.

And every single one of them knows that the health insurance provided by that institution does not cover the pill. Yet you have no problem with forcing gay men to purchase health insurance that covers something they will never need. I find that very strange, but I guess I think that people should have choices.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I too disagree that birth control is wrong. But they choose to make it one of their tenets and as such should be forced to go against them.

Obama is WRONG about this, plain and simple.

i agree.....many people are pretty dam serious about their Religious beliefs.....

and they are more than free to practice them. They just can't impose them on other people.

Excuse me genius, they are not imposing anything, they are being imposed upon. Why do you not see that as a problem? Is it because you actually don't believe people cannot impose their views on others?

 

[grunt11b]

This just proves that Liberals aren't interested in "choice". It's their way or the highway. Obama will never win this fight with the Catholic Church. Obama, Pelosi and Reid sre such a joke.

Oh... we're all about CHOICE... it's the Conservatives that have an issue with Choice...especially when it pertains to OTHER people's sins.

Try thinking for a change. If you give the government the power to dictate to Catholics that they have to accept birth control you also give the government the power to tell you that you cannot use an animated GIF as an avatar.

Like I said, mission creep. At first, some legislation might not seem too horrible, but it's the creep that follows that gets ya everytime.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Nobody is stopping you from practicing your backwards superstitions or letting the corrupt deviants who make up your clergy from running your life.

(Sorry, grew up Catholic. They aren't as evil as Mormons, but they are freakin' close.)

You just can'ti impose them on anyone else.

Only two people should be in on your medical decisions. You and your doctor. Not a bean-counter at an insurance company and not a church deciding they don't approve of your "lifestyle".

What if the church decided it wasn't going to approve AIDS drugs because they don't approve of homosexuality? Or if you boss who is a Jehovah's Witness decides that his insurance company isn't going to cover blood transfusions? Where does it stop?

Obamacare is going to impose on the Catholic church the mandate to fund things it vehemently opposes. Obamacare is all about imposing government power on others.

So if you actually believed in what you just wrote, you would oppose this.

I'm more worried about Church Tyranny than state tryanny. (Probalby because I grew up in a Church tyranny.) We can vote out a president, we can't vote out a Pope no matter how many pedophiles he hides under his dress.

The Church gave its right to bitch they minute it had its hand out for government funds.

There are none so blind...

 

[Annie]

I'm disappointed to hear you say "Democrat party." You're generally above that sort of thing.

And my understanding is that it's a statement that "Catholic run institutions" are subject to the same regulation as other businesses if a certain amount of employees are not in fact Catholic.

It's also my understanding that churches are exempt.

But their employer is the Catholic Church - and birth control is against our religion - particularly abortion - which is abhorrent to us. It is, to Catholics, murder.

Actually American Catholics believe in using birth control in about the same percentages as the rest of American population. However, when it comes to the morning-after pill and force coverages that are against church teachings, even those that in general are for birth control are drawing a line.

What this decision will result in is the schools, hospitals, clinics, other services provided by Catholic Charities, being staffed and serving only Catholics. Is that really what is wanted? The decision may be overturned by the courts, as it should be. The Church may cave, but in that case, the Church is no longer The Church.

 

[Annie]

Real Simple... Catholic based Hospitals don't want to take part in the AHA? Fine... No Federal funds...saves the taxpayers money, I guess.

I agree. The choice to take federal funds for hospitals, even the use of state approved school texts and bus services was a mistake, IMO. That is where it's gotten to this point. It can be reversed simply by becoming Catholic services ONLY. If the urban poor wish to send their kids to Catholic schools, they can convert to the faith. Catholics in general then should make their primary charity giving Catholic based.

 

[Cuyo]

I think you're all tied up in emotion and missing the point.

The Church itself remains exempt.

Essentially all this is is saying you can't slap a badge on a non-church-related business and claim an exemption from the law.

If that means you must offer healthcare which covers contraceptives, then that's what it means - And we're not here to debate the merit of the law, just this particular phenomenon.

You all seem to believe that he's making special laws for the Church and as I understand it, that's just not the case.

 

[francoHFW]

And the 98% of Catholics that use birth controlsome time in their lives? The church is out of touch, thanks for helping....LOL

 

[grunt11b]

And the 98% of Catholics that use birth controlsome time in their lives? The church is out of touch, thanks for helping....LOL

Out of touch with who? Mainstream America or Catholics themselves?